7/23- Lucky- only +8 and already up to 337

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all4mymarine

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Can someone please take a look at Lucky's SS? Does this look like a bounce from yesterday's AM cycle? I wasn't able to test between +4 and +7 so I don't know exactly how low he went.

It's only +8 and he's already at 337. I hate to see him in such high numbers for so long.
 
Lucky hasn't seen a green for a while and that was a bit of a steep drop but good information.

I wouldn't shoot this early, I would wait until closer to your normal shot time. You are still moving up your shot time to get back on schedule right? So keep moving it up.

I know it's hard to see these higher numbers but every time he sees a blue or green he will get more used to the lower numbers and will eventually stop reacting to them.

Hang in there.
 
I'm definitely going to wait, I just hate seeing these #'s after he was doing so well :(

I've been trying to move his shot time back but I haven't been able to. I will move it back by 15 mins today and tonight and hopefully by next week he'll be back on schedule. It's a 4 hour difference as of right now.
 
I think it would be ok to shoot a fat 0.9 or a skinny 1 if you want.

With cats that are getting a good response we often get this little fine-tuning dilemma where a drop less insulin has them running a little higher than ideal, a drop more gets into sometimes earlier drop or whatnot. It's kind of a dilemma and a trade-off - do you delay regulation potentially by taking a more conservative approach, or do you really push for the good numbers with a hair more risk of seeing lower numbers.

I have seen both approaches used, and I have seen both approaches work, and I have seen both approaches cause trouble :mrgreen: . The more aggressive approach does sometimes land people with scarier green #s, and sometimes pulling out at least medium carb to keep things safe. The more conservative approach sometimes lands people in a setback, with their cat getting further away from good numbers and then needing more insulin to get back there.

So I think what is important is that you (anyone) are aware of the risks, and know what to do to in the event of something unexpected. Everyone should be testing regularly for ketones, and everyone should have a hypo toolkit on hand, easy to access, and with a clear knowledge of what to do should they have to pull out the toolkit (some people write the # of carbs on the can labels for the mid & high carb standbys, which I think is an excellent idea!).

And then you do what you are most comfortable with, what makes the most sense to you, and what you can handle. If you are comfortable with the possibility of somewhat lower numbers, needing to monitor closely, etc., then I think it is ok to go with the higher doses. If you can't stomach that, or aren't around to monitor, then I think the slightly lower doses are better.

In Lucky's case, you haven't seen any numbers as low as 50, so from a hypo safety perspective, I don't think even 1u is too much insulin (though if you shoot that, I do think you need to monitor early/mid cycle to be sure). You did get some PSs below 150 though, so if that leads to missed shots, it kind of defeats the benefit of the good numbers, if then he sits higher the next cycle with no shot.

So the choices I see are:

- Try a fat 0.9 / skinny 1 and see if that gets the numbers right where you want them.
- Try TID or even shooting at +10s or whatnot like Kelly suggested (if you do shoot early, always be sure you are shooting on a rising number).
- Go back to 1u and monitor closely every cycle. One thing you can do too if he seems to drop early is feed some in the early part of the cycle to try to slow the drop, and see if that helps you keep the numbers right where you want them.

If it were me, I would try a fat 0.9, as to me that seems easiest. I would still monitor a lot for nadirs and early drops. I'm not particularly worried he will hypo, but I would still want to keep a close eye on things as he has had some pretty greens so far, and you want to keep them pretty but not too low.
 
If you are shooting early though to get back to your regular shot times, I wouldn't increase the dose until you are +12s. I think you can move faster than 15 minute increments though, especially with the higher PSs you are getting. I might even be tempted to shoot a couple hours early and maybe drop the dose to 0.8 and see if you can get better results with catching him at a lower PS. I'm not 100% sure on the dose or the timing there, so if you are thinking of doing that, maybe post for suggestions. Generally if you shoot at +11 or later you don't need to adjust the dose, although some cats want a reduction at +11. If you shoot at +10, then you want to drop the dose a little, and earlier than +10 definitely requires a dose reduction.
 
So do you think I would be okay to say, shoot now at +11or even +11.5 at a fat .9? I'll feed him an hour later and then again before we leave for a ball game but then we are coming home right after. I'm not afraid of him going hypo on a .9 with his #'s being so high today. I think he's ready for his insulin because he's already eaten and he's following me around the house and is even laying next to me right now (he hardly ever sits with me, so it's unusual).

I'm thinking shooting .9 at +11.5, which was my original plan to get back on schedule. When I got off schedule before, I just moved up in 30 min increments but someone here told me 15 mins would be better?

I have everything if he hypos. I have Karo syrup and some higher carb food ready in a tupperware bowl in the kitchen. I'd just give him a few pieces. I'll start marking the cans too, that's a good idea. I have a general idea of carb %'s of each one but not all of them, especially if I was frantic, don't think I would remember! As far as checking ketones, I never ever see him go to the litter box. The box is downstairs and I even have a video baby monitor right outside the bathroom where the box is so I can monitor the coming and going activity. Seriously, I never see him. He's upstairs with us most of the time. He must go at night or when we aren't home. I'll start paying closer attention I guess.

I'm going to see what this next cycle does at a fat .9 and then adjust back to a skinny 1u maybe tomorrow (wait, I can't do that tomorrow since we are getting back on schedule....or can I, since it will be 30 mins early?). I just can't stand him going through these pinks. I have a feeling before his AMPS today, he's going to be in the reds. If the skinny 1u fails, then I may start considering shooting early at a reduced dose if he's on the rise quickly. And then after that maybe consider TID.

Thanks for the ideas! Lots to think about!
 
kse said:
Are you at +11 now? Have you tested him again since the +8?

I'm almost at 11.5 right now. No, I haven't tested him because I know he's on the rise anyway and wanted to give him a bit of a break. We've just been waiting till it's time for the AMPS.
 
I haven't looked at your SS today---but, there is little difference there...either should be okay.
 
True, that's what I figured when I was looking at the syringe. I went with a skinny 1u. It doesn't look like that much difference when you are drawing it up.
 
He will be fine don't worry. It is just a learning curve of giving different doses and seeing what works. You have seen some really good results and numbers, he will get back there! Enjoy the game!
 
I see you hit BLUE again!!!

I was noticing in your SS, that recently your am cycle is getting much better numbers than your pm cycle on the same dose. Is there anything different going on during the two cycles?
 
yay for blue!! Weirdest thing...he hit blue at the +7.5 check and at +11.5, he was still in the blues at 185. I'm waiting 30 mins to see if he goes up any.

The only thing different is that I'm not feeding him during the night, I just leave a bowl out. Not sure what would have caused the difference in PS's, but there's not a huge difference anyway, I wouldn't think. I do think the morning PS's have been more in line with the evening PS's the past few days because of the food I've been leaving out. I don't know if he's gobbling it all up at one time or just grazing. He's a gobbler though!

I'll have to look back at previous advice to figure out what I'm going to do tonight since we're in the blues and I can't monitor him at night like I would during the day.
 
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