7/2 Tigger PMPS 458, Bad news from blood work!

Moms2Tigger&Blu

Moms2Tigger&Blu

Member Since 2018
Soooo, I guess I was wrong that the vet visit was boring. I forgot the universe loves to find new ways to pick on poor Tig. Doc thinks Tigger had stage 2 Kidney Disease. Levels (creatinine at 2.8) have increased significantly since last year (1.1). I will be adding bloodwork tabs to SS (soon but slowly) as I got 5 years worth from vet.

So I have a few things to discuss.
1. How the heck do I now feed him Rx renal diet with 27 CARBS!? His BG will be 1000! Please help - I KNOW there are other options, choices, people dealing with this, etc.

2. His levels have been all over the place the last 5 yrs. We even fed Hill's k/d about 2 yrs ago for a little while when level was 2.2. Then the liver #'s went up, then exactly a year ago the FD was diagnosed. How the heck was the creatinine 1.1 last year then when all this was starting?! I'm so upset, the vet made it sound like he could die in a week or a year, offered no other insight about treatments (vitamins, etc) aside from the diet change. Though she did mention pepcid to keep him from vomiting/dehydrating. Also his ALT liver levels are back up. AND she recommended further urine culture as he had RBC's . . . I'm overwhelmed again!

3. I immediately increased to 1.25 tonight - it was time anyway but if he's gonna be eating more carbs I figured I'd start now.

4. Effective immediately he is off the FF and on to the Blue Buffalo Wilderness. If I am reading the chart right it is a bit better balance for now. BB Wilderness (Chicken, turkey, duck) Protein is ~28% vs FF ~40% and BBW Phos is 291 vs FF ranged 355-498! (for chicken, chicken & liver, turkey & giblets, and chopped grill). I know its not as low as needed but the carbs are still apparently only 3.

5. Is there further testing to be done? Or other advice?
 
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A year or so ago Gizmo (my non-diabetic who eats low carb, canned food only) was diagnosed with Stage 2 kidney disease. My vet suggested I switch him to the lowest phosphorus, highest protein diet I could find. Check this info on Dr. Lisa's site. I'd suggest taking a look at Tiki Cat -- Puka Puka Chicken and Koolina Luau. Wereuva Steak Frites and Nature's Logic Beef are also included. (I rarely fed my guys beef since Gabby was allergic and never fed fish -- it's too high in phosphorus.) She also prescribed calcitriol. It's a form of vitamin D3 that can be used to treat CKD. Gizmo's kidney values are now in a totally normal range.

Frankly, shame on your vet. I'd also suggest taking a look at Tanya's site. It is an incredible resource on feline kidney disease. At the minimum, there are phosphorus binders that you can add to Tigger's food that do just what the name suggests -- bind the phosphorus -- and allow you to feed your kitty whatever you want to feed him.

Did the vet get an SDMA? This is a way to test for kidney disease, as well.

I really don't want to add to your stress but you have been holding on to doses for way too long. Getting Tigger below renal threshold (around 200) needs to be your goal!!
 
Sienne and Gabby (GA) said:

I really don't want to add to your stress but you have been holding on to doses for way too long. Getting Tigger below renal threshold (around 200) needs to be your goal!!
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I will research these sites immediately!!! Thank you.
Also, I'm so afraid to kill him with a low since we leave the house for 11 hours every day but it turns out I'm just stressing his kidneys more! So I'm just killing him slowly instead. I know I'm exaggerating and being very dark but it just feels that way.

I will check about SDMA.
 
You don’t have to feed prescription diet. You want low carb and low phosphorus. Neko ate mostly raw, but also some canned that fit that criteria. Some cats can be at stage two for years. You can do this! :bighug:
 
Sienne and Gabby (GA) said:
A year or so ago Gizmo (my non-diabetic who eats low carb, canned food only) was diagnosed with Stage 2 kidney disease. My vet suggested I switch him to the lowest phosphorus, highest protein diet I could find. Check this info on Dr. Lisa's site. I'd suggest taking a look at Tiki Cat -- Puka Puka Chicken and Koolina Luau. Wereuva Steak Frites and Nature's Logic Beef are also included. (I rarely fed my guys beef since Gabby was allergic and never fed fish -- it's too high in phosphorus.) She also prescribed calcitriol. It's a form of vitamin D3 that can be used to treat CKD. Gizmo's kidney values are now in a totally normal range.
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I thought kidney disease needed LOWER protein?
Also, that's amazing that Gizmo's values are better. Tig's also seem all over the place. As I said we once fed kidney diet before and then his levels dropped considerably. I am tempted to think something else is going on/also going on. I will read all the info and talk to the vet again about diet and those meds/supplements. This boy is a fighter!
 
Wendy&Neko said:
You don’t have to feed prescription diet. You want low carb and low phosphorus. Neko ate mostly raw, but also some canned that fit that criteria. Some cats can be at stage two for years. You can do this! :bighug:
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Thank you, I really need to hear all this!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Kidney kitties need lower phosphorus and high quality protein. Only in very late stages might lower protein be an issue, not now for Tigger. Your vet may be out of date with CKD.
 
I'm sorry about Tigger's diagnosis and know nothing about kidney disease, but there's lots on here who know lots. It sounds like you're getting some good advice. I'll just give you some :bighug::bighug::bighug: and send scritches for Tigger.
 
I don't have any information regarding the DKA, but you're already in good hands here. I know your mind is racing right now, but stop, close your eyes, take a deep breath, and repeat a few times. I can't imagine how you're feeling, but remember this is not automatically the end. There are steps you can take here. You are a fantastic momma bean and I don't want you to forget that in all of this. You've got this. :bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Kidney kitties need lower phosphorus and high quality protein. Only in very late stages might lower protein be an issue, not now for Tigger. Your vet may be out of date with CKD.
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I'm starting to think they're all mostly out of date with all this feline stuff. :banghead:
 
You'll know your vet is out of date if s/he asks, "What's SDMA?" These days, it's included on many blood panels if your vet uses IDEXX for outside labs.
 
So I basically stayed up all night researching and reading. I'm confused as to why the vet made it sound like Tigger could worsen - BADLY- even with in a week, but called his stage 2. Most information shows stage 2 being serious but not THAT life threatening yet, and while there are meds/vits/etc I will be asking about today, everything suggest a slow transition to low phosphorus food. Sometimes taking 4-6 weeks to get the cat eating it. There doesnt seem to be a sense of urgency or atleast not the one I got from the vet. Lots of things online (not here or those awesome sites recommended above) indicate treatment may be needed in later stages but for stage 2 food switch is all thats recommended. I still want to see about binders as this Rx food info looks horrendous.
 
Bronx's dad said:
@LizzieInTexas knows all the low carb, low phos food.
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Take a look on Gizmo's SS (in my signature) and go to the food tab. I have several listed there, pricing, carbs, phos and protien. Wureva Fowl Ball and Whole Earth Farms Duck are great ones to start with and available at Petco.

How picky is Tigger? Will he eat both shreds and pate?

What was his phos level on the bloodwork?
 
Balancing FD and CKD can be challenging but is definitely doable. My Trixie actually straddled Stage III and IV for nearly 3 years! I didn't notice anyone mentioning this one issue: if you haven't had Tigger's blood pressure checked, I would do that now. CKD and high BP often go hand-in-hand, and sometimes when BP is brought under control, kidney values will improve (this initially happened for Trixie). Also, Trix was not a fan of low phos/low carb food, so I did end up using binders for her (Fancy Feast was her preference...talk about high phos food!)....the binders did work well for her on that.
 
LizzieInTexas said:
Take a look on Gizmo's SS (in my signature) and go to the food tab. I have several listed there, pricing, carbs, phos and protien. Wureva Fowl Ball and Whole Earth Farms Duck are great ones to start with and available at Petco.

How picky is Tigger? Will he eat both shreds and pate?

What was his phos level on the bloodwork?
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His Phos level was not actually raised.(im working on getting a labs tab set up with actual numbers) I called and spoke to another vet at the practice who reviewed the bloodwork with me. I was hesitant at first since he was new but I think he is younger and a little more up to date on stuff. He knew what SDMA was, he shared my concern about changing Tig's carb intake from 3g a can to 20+! He is going to do some research for us, he seemed well informed when i asked about phos binders (but doesnt think we need that yet) etc, sounds like hes our new vet there!
Tigger loves pate and will devour certain shreds, but he has no teeth, not even fangs, and sometimes scarfs and barfs the shreds so we limit them or put 1/3 over 2/3 pate. I am on the hunt for a petco near me for the whole earth farms duck. here in western mass Dave's Pet City is big local chain that carries an amazing assortment. yesterday they had every flavour BUT DUCK of course. I got the weruvas, but can't find the tiki cat cans anywhere. If i check a few more places and cant find a local store to buy a few cans to try out on Tigger, I will just buy a case online. Tig's little brother Blu eats most stuff and if he doesnt I'll just donate it.
 
Amy&TrixieCat said:
Balancing FD and CKD can be challenging but is definitely doable. My Trixie actually straddled Stage III and IV for nearly 3 years! I didn't notice anyone mentioning this one issue: if you haven't had Tigger's blood pressure checked, I would do that now. CKD and high BP often go hand-in-hand, and sometimes when BP is brought under control, kidney values will improve (this initially happened for Trixie). Also, Trix was not a fan of low phos/low carb food, so I did end up using binders for her (Fancy Feast was her preference...talk about high phos food!)....the binders did work well for her on that.
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Thats awesome about Trixie! All these "success stories" make me feel so much better. I felt much more helpless with this diagnosis than with the diabetes for some reason.
He is sched for blood pressure check next Wed 7/10. We will hold off on phos binders FOR NOW cause that number was actually in normal range. Right now we'll be maintaing staus quo and trying some non prescription lower phos food. I'm so glad i randomly tried him on Blue Buffalo Wilderness and he loved it. I couldnt believe the phos in FF Turkey & Giblets is listed as like 490 in the food chart! At least the BBW is only 291. I know its more fat but still only 3 carbs!
 
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