7/17 Shasta: pmps 254; +1 - 222; +3 - 140; +4 - 89

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Deborah & Shasta

Deborah & Shasta

Member Since 2012
After coming off of our first known BG low last night (BG 39/34), we are doing ok...so far. Thus far, she has finished off her breakfast (2/3 can wet FF) and a tiny snack (small forkful of wet FF) w/ a side of Purebites at each poke.

Also, I have spent the entire morning figuring out/working on Shasta's profile. If I am missing anything, please let me know! :smile:

Thanks all, Deborah & Shasta
 
Re: 7/17 Shasta: amps 256; +1 - 232; +3 - 160

We just wanted to stop by and welcome you! What a night you had last night! Wow. Shasta looks like she is doing aok today. The profile looked good to me. Have a wonderful day and welcome again!
 
Re: 7/17 Shasta: amps 256; +1 - 232; +3 - 160

This is a GREAT cycle for Shasta, especially after those low numbers last night. She bounced a little but is coming down nicely. :-D Well done, Deborah! The profile is good. Another black cat, yay! :lol:
Liz
 
Re: 7/17 Shasta: amps 256; +1 - 232; +3 - 160; +6 - 190

Question/concern: In the past, Shasta has had a small bout with vomiting/regurg. and I have been able to contact my vet and they have suggested FortiFlora and she is typically fine. Last night (7/17) was a hairball due to excessive grooming with new calm collar. Within past 15 minutes, Shasta vomited/regurg. (yes, I have pictures...and yes, it is in a plastic bag now.)

My concern is over "what" is causing her to do this and they way she did it. Normally, she would do her typical "hacking" sounds and body "convulsions". This time, I swear I thought she was seizing, at first, but then she threw up, sat there for a second and walked over to her food bowl (empty) and looked at me for more. By the way, to my knowledge, she has never seized. (knocking on wood)

Because of this reaction, I just tested her AM +9 a bit early and it was 246. Am I crazy for being concerned? My suspicion is that the Purebites (which she loves) are not sitting well in her system; or she's not chewing them; or idk?!

Advice? Opinions?
 
Re: 7/17 Shasta: amps 256; +1 - 232; +3 - 160; +6 - 190

Hi Deborah!!!

Thank you for starting a new condo today (we do one per cat per day and all of your questions go in it....whether it's about food, Shasta's health issues....everything). Thanks also for the profile :-D :-D

Good job testing!! I like +1 tests because it tells you whether Shasta gets food spikes (if you fed her at PS). Today...doesn't look like she did. You're doing a super job.

Pumbaa said:
When Pumbaa has taken green dives, I've given him pure protein to eat, like chicken meat cooked for human consumption, and sardines (packed in water, no salt). I've found that when Pumbaa drops low, he instinctively eats more, to give the insulin something to work on. Don't hold back food at this point...give Shasta all the low carb, high protein food she can consume. And limit the amount of high carb foods you are feeding, to prevent huge bounces. Just use enough to bring her numbers up out of the dangerous level, quickly, then use the high protein, low carb foods to keep her out of the dangerous levels.
Click to expand...

I know Sienne corrected one aspect of this post but I also wanted to address another one....I have put it in bold. This is an ECID (every cat is different) issue. Some members here must control the dives with higher carb food or honey/karo. I am able to control Gracie's rare dives with LC (10%). You'll have to figure out what controls any dives that Shasta might do. You might want to start with a LC in the mid-range....say 6%....and see if it slows her down any. If not, try a little bit more on the LC side. Jill's cat, Alex, is very carb sensitive and one little freeze dried chicken piece brings her up. Others are not so lucky. So just experiment with her.

When I'm working with someone whose kitty's numbers are coming down, I like them to try LC when kitty first hits green. Or if kitty is in the high 40s but didn't race down there, I like them to try some LC and see if that will put the kitty up into the 50s (which we call "surfing" or "getting on a surfboard"). The other important thing to consider is when in the cycle the number occurs. If you get a 40 at +2, I'm probably going to recommend something totally different than if you get a 40 at +9 (unless she's clearing a bounce).

As far as today's vomiting....you know her best. Was she coughing? Did she just perhaps gag on a piece of chicken as you suggested? I'd keep an eye on her and document it if she does it again. If she seems to be ok and ate afterwards, then let's hope it was an isolated incident. Her BG does not make me think it was in response to a too high or too low number.
 
Re: 7/17 Shasta: amps 256; +1 - 232; +3 - 160; +6 - 190

After her vomiting episode, she ate some wet food and rested. Now, she is sitting next to her food bowl, staring at me, trying to summon me to feed her!! We're about 40 minutes out from PM shot, but I'm uncertain what to give her after last night's scare. Do I go back to 1u?
 
Re: 7/17 Shasta: amps 256; +1 - 232; +3 - 160; +6 - 190

You should stay with the 0.75u for at least 6-10 shots (tonight will be her 2nd at this dose), unless she goes below 50 again. That 39 (since it is below 50) is telling you that 1u is too much.
Liz
 
Re: 7/17 Shasta: amps 256; +1 - 232; +3 - 160; +6 - 190

Liz is right....once you reduce the dose, we need to give her time to clear any bounces before we decide if she didn't "take" to the reduction. So hang tight!!
 
Re: 7/17 Shasta: amps 256; +1 - 232; +3 - 160; +6 - 190

Liz gave a good response to your question. One caveat -- Shasta is not a newly diagnosed diabetic. Once a cat is a year past initial diagnosis, they are no longer considered "newly" diagnosed. As such, we make it a bit harder for the cat to get a dose reduction. Shasta will need to drop below 40 or have three drops below 50 on separate days in order to lower the dose. Once the dose is lowered, you hold the dose for 3 - 5 days (6 - 10 cycles) unless the reduction is clearly not holding (and then you increase the dose). Both dose increases and reductions are usually held for several days:

"General" Guidelines:
  • Hold the initial starting dose for 5 - 7 days (10 - 14 consecutive cycles) unless the numbers tell you otherwise. Kitties experiencing high flat curves or prone to ketones may want to increase the starting dose after 3 days (6 consecutive cycles).
  • Each subsequent dose is held for a minimum of 3 days (6 consecutive cycles) unless kitty earns a reduction (See: Reducing the dose...).
  • Adjustments to dose are based on nadirs with only some consideration given to preshot numbers.

Increasing the dose:
  • Hold the dose for 3 - 5 days (6 - 10 consecutive cycles) if nadirs are less than 200 before increasing the dose by 0.25 unit.
  • After 3 days (6 consecutive cycles)... if nadirs are greater than 200, but less than 300 increase the dose by 0.25 unit.
  • After 3 days (6 consecutive cycles)... if nadirs are greater than 300 increase the dose by 0.5 unit.

Reducing the dose:
  • If kitty drops below 40 (long term diabetic) or 50 (newly diagnosed diabetic) reduce the dose by 0.25 unit. If kitty has a history of not holding reductions well or if reductions are close together... sneak the dose down by shaving the dose rather than reducing by a full quarter unit. Alternatively, at each newly reduced dose... try to make sure kitty maintains numbers in the normal range for seven days before reducing the dose further.
  • If an attempted reduction fails, go right back up to the last good dose.
Click to expand...

Regarding the vomiting, is it possible that Shasta is eating too fast?
 
Re: 7/17 Shasta: amps 256; +1 - 232; +3 - 160; +6 - 190

Sienne and Gabby said:
Shasta will need to drop below 40 in order to lower the dose. Once the dose is lowered, you hold the dose for 3 - 5 days (6 - 10 cycles) unless the reduction is clearly not holding (and then you increase the dose). Both dose increases and reductions are usually held for several days:

Regarding the vomiting, is it possible that Shasta is eating too fast?
Click to expand...

She dropped to 39 & 34 last night at +4; based on regulation protocol, I was advised to reduce her insulin to .75u, which I did. And that's where my concern/confusion came for tonight's injection. I used the .75u tonight and Shasta has eaten some and is grooming now!

As for the vomiting, there was a good bit of hair/fur and what looked like her freeze dried turkey treats. I think I am going to cut back on the turkey treats for a few days. I'm hoping that it was an isolated incident or hairball induced?!

Thank you all, again, for checking in on us and our questions and BG numbers. You all are amazing! I'll keep you posted on her BG numbers tonight. Any guidance is welcomed and appreciated!

Here are our latest #s: PMPS 254; (.75u); +1 222
 
Re: 7/17 Shasta: amps 256; +1 - 232; +3 - 160; +6 - 190

Should I be concerned with her numbers tonight?

PMPS - 254 (.75u injected)
+1 222
+3 140
+4 89

It is 12:40am, here, and I was getting ready to go to sleep, but I'm not sure if I should be alarmed with the fact that we haven't gotten to +6 and she's already at BG 89. I just put down a little more FF tender beef wet. She ate a little, but wasn't as interested as I would have liked. She's being a bit playful (attacking my hand...always a fun time!)

Thank you!
 
Deborah

You need to test her until you get two rising numbers that are not food induced. That's a pretty big drop between +3 and +4 so I would feed her at least two good tsp of LC and retest in 30 to see if she is still coming down fast.

I'm not going to be able to stay up with you tonight....I work on Wed only and was just going to go to bed. I'll see if I can find someone to check in on you but...you need to stay on top of this number.
 
Marjorie and Gracie said:
You need to test her until you get two rising numbers that are not food induced. That's a pretty big drop between +3 and +4 so I would feed her at least two good tsp of LC and retest in 30 to see if she is still coming down fast.

I'm not going to be able to stay up with you tonight....I work on Wed only and was just going to go to bed. I'll see if I can find someone to check in on you but...you need to stay on top of this number.
Click to expand...


Thank you. LC wet is available, but she's busy sleeping! (I take it back...she's awake and eating.) I will retest her and post. Thank you for your vigilance! Sleep well!
 
You're welcome. It's always a good idea when they come down into green to feed them a couple tsp of LC and then rest in 30. If they are still coming down, do it again.

Julie(Punkin) is going to pop on and keep an eye out for you and Shasta. She's super....she will be a great help.....you'll love her :-D

Have a great night....Thanks Julie my most awesome gal pal. :-D
 
hi deborah!

marje asked if i could stay up with you tonight. i'm on the west coast and will be up with punkin for at least 2 or more hours longer.

looking at those numbers, i'd get a +4.5. what time would that be for you, ie how many minutes after the hour :45 or :30? i'll check in with you then. just seems like shasta's moving fairly quickly tonight and we don't want to miss anything.
 
heehee nighty night marje! sleep well & work hard tomorrow!

deborah, i've read today's post but i want to look at shasta's profile too - check back with ya in a couple.
 
Hi Julie!

Thank you so much for checking in on us tonight. Shasta just ate a little FF wet (LC) and I just took her +5 BG...60. I will retest in 20 minutes (which will put it at +5.5). Be back then.

Thanks, again! Deborah
 
first post on main health board

i'm getting the picture - so shasta has been on lantus but also on dry food, and you've dropped from 1.5u to 1u and changed to low carb canned. was she on lantus since diagnosis, just not being tested? i saw that she's testy (hahaha little pun) but am just a little confused as to what the insulin story was in the time between diagnosis in april 2011 and when you arrived here.

are you nearing on +5 at :45?
 
some cats have a dramatic change from switching from dry food, which is all high carb and stays a long time in the system, to low carb. it looks like shasta could be one of them.

i just saw your most recent post. i'll check in with you at :00 after your next test.
 
Shasta has been on Lantus since her diagnosis (April 2011). She was at 1u until March 2012, where my "new" vet upped her to 1.5u...and no home testing until this past Friday (7-13-12). "Testy" is a good description for her. Jekyl/Hyde!!!

I can't tell if she's just sleepy or if she is lethargic. I will retest her at 2am EST.
 
well, the good thing is that the dry food probably kept her high and therefore safe while she wasn't being tested.

i've read through all of your previous posts, i think, and all of the advice. talk about baptism by fire - nothing like getting a 39 the first day you're testing! oy!

here's your other first post on Lantus Land TR ISG
 
you want 2 rising numbers, probably 20-30 minutes apart, but you also want them to be not food-influenced. the reason is that carbs from food can wear off and the cat can wobble back down.

i'm uncertain about the treats you're using with her and don't know how they are carb-wise. so i would stop feeding her, other than a lowcarb very tiny treat after the poke, and test again in 30 minutes. if she's up over 100, you're probably ok. it's always ok to leave some low carb food out for her to graze on if you need to sleep. the way she just rose quickly makes me think there might be lots of carbs in the treats.

edited - did you only give her low carb food since the 60 at +5?
 
julie & punkin said:
well, the good thing is that the dry food probably kept her high and therefore safe while she wasn't being tested.
talk about baptism by fire - nothing like getting a 39 the first day you're testing! oy!
Click to expand...

She liked the dry SO MUCH MORE than the wet m/d. :? I can only imagine what her numbers would have been! ugh!

definitely not the way I saw my first night going!!!

The LC wet has been out since PM shot. She snacked on it a little after the 60 (+5). As for the treats, they are bits of freeze dried turkey breasts 100%.
 
ok, well those sound fine. could just be the way her body works.

yeah, mine liked the dry too. i think most of us fed our cats dry food before we got here. kinda a shame, now that we know so much more. wish i'd done it differently.
 
...could also be because I don't think she CHEWS her food! Shasta = vacuum!

I wish I convince my sister to take her cat off of dry food. You're so right, I wish I had done things so differently. Getting ready for our +6 test. Will post in >5 minutes.
 
Up for Hershey's +7, so I thought I'd drop in and welcome y'all! Was reading all of the excitement from your first condo. Good job!!

i look forward to getting to know you -

Libby (& Hershey, too!)
 
i think you're ok to call it a night. i would. if you are feeling nervous, you could set your cell phone alarm for another 30 minutes and check her once more. it's up to you - but over 100 at this stage of the cycle would make me think she's on the rise.
 
@ Libby - HI! and Thank you! I could have dealt without all of this excitement!!! But I love that little girl! Good to meet you! Sleep well!

@ Jane - Thank you! My little sassy cat sure does know how to spice up my life! ;-) And thank you for being another pair of eyes...from across the world!

@ Julie - I'll take it! I'll put down a bit more LC wet in case she needs a midnight (4am) snack. Thank you soooo much for waiting up with us.

This forum is truly a life-saver and "neighborhood" watch! Thank you all! Good night from Central FL. We will be back tomorrow to post more BG #s! Look forward to talking to everyone later.

G'night
 
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