7/17 Merlin PMPS 499

Merlin’sMama said:
Yes, but I wonder if we could try something between .75 and 1 unit. One unit has already proven too much for him, not too long ago.
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I think it would be fine to go back to one unit. Cats needs change all the time. We can be aware if he is coming off a bounce to make sure we give enough carbs to stop him dropping too low....but not too many as we don't want to abort the cycle inadvertently. It is trial and error. We need to get him down into green BGs.
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
Good morning Jill.
I think if Merlin doesn't see green this cycle, we can call it a failed reduction and I would go back up in dose to 1 unit
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I have been thinking that it seems like 1 unit is too much for Merlin and .75 units is not quite enough. I know it’s unconventional but do you think Jill can try a fat .75 (skinny 1 unit?). If you go with the 1 unit, Jill, I would be prepared to up the carbs in his diet. This is an option.
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
I have been thinking that it seems like 1 unit is too much for Merlin and .75 units is not quite enough. I know it’s unconventional but do you think Jill can try a fat .75 (skinny 1 unit?). If you go with the 1 unit, Jill, I would be prepared to up the carbs in his diet. This is an option.
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We usually use the fat doses to tweak a dose when the cats are close to best dose and I don’t really think Merlin is there just yet.
I would rather see him give the 1 unit but feed the curves if necessary. We need to get him into green BGs.
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
We usually use the fat doses to tweak a dose when the cats are close to best dose and I don’t really think Merlin is there just yet.
I would rather see him give the 1 unit but feed the curves if necessary. We need to get him into green BGs.
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Yes. I realize how the fat and skinnies are normally used. That’s why I never suggested this before. Merlin definitely hasn’t found his best dose yet and of course we want to see green. I don’t want to see him reduced back down to.75 again though(after one of two cycles on 1 unit!). We all pretty much knew that the .75 was going to be a failed reduction anyway. But Jill will be more ready this time to give higher carbs! Merlin can drop below 50 on low carb food very easily. He’s fooled us more than once. So I am okay with it, with the caveat that he’s most likely going to need the higher carb foods. I did have a faint hope that his needs might have changed and he would do better on .75. Now I hope it will go better on 1 with food modifications. This could give him time to get used to green.
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Yes. I realize how the fat and skinnies are normally used. That’s why I never suggested this before. Merlin definitely hasn’t found his best dose yet and of course we want to see green. I don’t want to see him reduced back down to.75 again though(after one of two cycles on 1 unit!). We all pretty much knew that the .75 was going to be a failed reduction anyway. But Jill will be more ready this time to give higher carbs! Merlin can drop below 50 on low carb food very easily. He’s fooled us more than once. So I am okay with it, with the caveat that he’s most likely going to need the higher carb foods. I did have a faint hope that his needs might have changed and he would do better on .75. Now I hope it will go better on 1 with food modifications. This could give him time to get used to green.
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Yes I hoped he might do OK on the reduced dose but its not to be. Lots of cats have failed reductions and go back up again with no trouble.
We just need to make sure that he doesn't get too high carbs that it aborts the cycle. Its all a balancing act of trial and error as you know!.
 
Suzanne & Darcy said:
Yes. I realize how the fat and skinnies are normally used. That’s why I never suggested this before. Merlin definitely hasn’t found his best dose yet and of course we want to see green. I don’t want to see him reduced back down to.75 again though(after one of two cycles on 1 unit!). We all pretty much knew that the .75 was going to be a failed reduction anyway. But Jill will be more ready this time to give higher carbs! Merlin can drop below 50 on low carb food very easily. He’s fooled us more than once. So I am okay with it, with the caveat that he’s most likely going to need the higher carb foods. I did have a faint hope that his needs might have changed and he would do better on .75. Now I hope it will go better on 1 with food modifications. This could give him time to get used to green.
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So we would need to be ready at +1.5 and +2 to give 30. I so dont like this idea.
 
Merlin’sMama said:
So we would need to be ready at +1.5 and +2 to give 30. I so dont like this idea.
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No you wouldn’t need to do that. You just need to be aware that when he drops into the greens (or the lower blues, it it’s early int he cycle), that you might have to slow the drop with some higher carb food. Otherwise you would keep doing what you have been doing.
Our aim is to stop him dropping below 50.

Look at this SS. This is a very new member whose cat had DKA and had a low pre shot last night, but we didn’t want to skip the dose because it’s not wise with DKA in the picture. So she gave the dose and we kept the BGs from dropping by feeding some medium carb foods for a few hours into the cycle. Click onto the world SS to see the numbers you understand.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...DuU2JgvLnBqEyX8EFW4el037BcrPsyQY-7Bp/pubhtml#
 
I will need lots of help and hand holding on 1 unit, Im afraid. I have been good at metering out the carbs to get down to blue, but it seems that Merlin has a bottomless pit when it comes to green. He doesnt know where to stop going down, just as he didnt in the beginning. Everything I know over the last two months about dosing out the carbs goes out the window when he hits green.
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
No you wouldn’t need to do that. You just need to be aware that when he drops into the greens (or the lower blues, it it’s early int he cycle), that you might have to slow the drop with some higher carb food. Otherwise you would keep doing what you have been doing.
Our aim is to stop him dropping below 50.

Look at this SS. This is a very new member whose cat had DKA and had a low pre shot last night, but we didn’t want to skip the dose because it’s not wise with DKA in the picture. So she gave the dose and we kept the BGs from dropping by feeding some medium carb foods for a few hours into the cycle. Click onto the world SS to see the numbers you understand.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...DuU2JgvLnBqEyX8EFW4el037BcrPsyQY-7Bp/pubhtml#
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In order to stop him dropping below 50, we will have to give higher carb before he hits 50. We have to see it coming, as opposed to getting close and then acting. Thats what happened when we got the reduction last time. You said that it’s not usual to give higher carbs when the BG is above 50. Sadly, I dont think Merlin is normal. Not yet, anyway.
 
Merlin’sMama said:
In order to stop him dropping below 50, we will have to give higher carb before he hits 50. We have to see it coming, as opposed to getting close and then acting. Thats what happened when we got the reduction last time. You said that it’s not usual to give higher carbs when the BG is above 50. Sadly, I dont think Merlin is normal. Not yet, anyway.
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It is not usual to give higher carb foods before they drop under 50, but if he is dropping lower early in the cycle, it is OK to give some higher carb food to slow the drop. It is all trial and error.
Everything you have learnt does not go out the window when he hits greens.
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
No you wouldn’t need to do that. You just need to be aware that when he drops into the greens (or the lower blues, it it’s early int he cycle), that you might have to slow the drop with some higher carb food. Otherwise you would keep doing what you have been doing.
Our aim is to stop him dropping below 50.

Look at this SS. This is a very new member whose cat had DKA and had a low pre shot last night, but we didn’t want to skip the dose because it’s not wise with DKA in the picture. So she gave the dose and we kept the BGs from dropping by feeding some medium carb foods for a few hours into the cycle. Click onto the world SS to see the numbers you understand.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...DuU2JgvLnBqEyX8EFW4el037BcrPsyQY-7Bp/pubhtml#
Click to expand...
This is exactly what we have been doing for so long now, metering out 10 or 5 g of medium to low carb food, every hour or so to keep him from dropping too fast. Often, not even that works and he bounces anyway. Or we guess wrong and give him 1 carb higher and keep him from dropping. This game has been going on for so long. If I were to leave him and not test him or feed him every hour or so, he would drop way too fast. I am struggling to see how he is getting used to insulin and it will all even out and be easier. It is not a matter of patience at this point, it is a matter of wondering if all of this is leading anywhere. Besides recovering from the overdose, his body doesnt seem to be reacting very differently to insulin than it did a month ago or more.
 
Merlin’sMama said:
This is exactly what we have been doing for so long now, metering out 10 or 5 g of medium to low carb food, every hour or so to keep him from dropping too fast. Often, not even that works and he bounces anyway. Or we guess wrong and give him 1 carb higher and keep him from dropping. This game has been going on for so long. If I were to leave him and not test him or feed him every hour or so, he would drop way too fast. I am struggling to see how he is getting used to insulin and it will all even out and be easier. It is not a matter of patience at this point, it is a matter of wondering if all of this is leading anywhere. Besides recovering from the overdose, his body doesnt seem to be reacting very differently to insulin than it did a month ago or more.
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I disagree. I think he is making progress and is getting used to insulin. He is no different to lots of other kitties on the forum who are still unregulated. They may not drop as fast as he does but they have other issues which stop them becoming regulated.
Remember it is a journey, not a race and Merlin calls the tune. Many cats take months before they even see blue or green BGs.
Bouncing is very common is newly diagnosed cats. They often give you a couple of nice cycles then freak out and bounce. That happened with my Sheba for a long time.
I know it is frustrating but try and take time out to relax so you feel fresh for the next cycle each day. He will pick up on your stres
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
I disagree. I think he is making progress and is getting used to insulin. He is no different to lots of other kitties on the forum who are still unregulated. They may not drop as fast as he does but they have other issues which stop them becoming regulated.
Remember it is a journey, not a race and Merlin calls the tune. Many cats take months before they even see blue or green BGs.
Bouncing is very common is newly diagnosed cats. They often give you a couple of nice cycles then freak out and bounce. That happened with my Sheba for a long time.
I know it is frustrating but try and take time out to relax so you feel fresh for the next cycle each day. He will pick up on your stres
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Ok, we will try again with the 1 unit tomorrow morning. I will be calling upon you once again for help and support. Thank you, Bron.
 
Jill, we can only make suggestions. At the end of the day, Merlin is your kitty and it is up to you whether you want to follow what we suggest or not. I know how frustrating it all is. I had Sheba in remission for over 2 1/2 years then she fell out of remission after a pancreatic flare and diarrhoea and it was very very hard to get her back into better numbers. So I do understand the frustration of it all. We want to fix them straight away but unfortunately it doesn’t work that way.:bighug:
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
Jill, we can only make suggestions. At the end of the day, Merlin is your kitty and it is up to you whether you want to follow what we suggest or not. I know how frustrating it all is. I had Sheba in remission for over 2 1/2 years then she fell out of remission after a pancreatic flare and diarrhoea and it was very very hard to get her back into better numbers. So I do understand the frustration of it all. We want to fix them straight away but unfortunately it doesn’t work that way.:bighug:
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:bighug:
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
Yes I hoped he might do OK on the reduced dose but its not to be. Lots of cats have failed reductions and go back up again with no trouble.
We just need to make sure that he doesn't get too high carbs that it aborts the cycle. Its all a balancing act of trial and error as you know!.
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Yes. I agree about the carbs. Such a balancing act. You’re good, Bron. We will see. Merlin and Jill will get there!
 
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