nckitties3
Member Since 2013
Another rough night, for me, he's fine.
6/15 Lucian +10.5/334-R,PMPS 295,+3/110,+5.5/54,+6.5/92
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Scratchie'smom
Re: 6/15 Lucian AMPS 172
Wow, he's numbers are so good. Hope you can get some rest today! I wish I could stay home and do what you are doing with Scratchie. I have the 'R' but have only used it once and only dare do that on the weekends.
Take care of yourself and glad his numbers are down!
Jo
Wow, he's numbers are so good. Hope you can get some rest today! I wish I could stay home and do what you are doing with Scratchie. I have the 'R' but have only used it once and only dare do that on the weekends.
Take care of yourself and glad his numbers are down!
Jo
Jill & Alex (GA)
Member Since 2009
Re: 6/15 Lucian AMPS 172
good morning, debbie!
lucian looks great, but i'm worried about you not getting enough sleep. it's entirely up to you, but i would give some thought and serious consideration to skipping the R whenever you feel the need. i know you want to do what's best for lucian, but it's so important to take care of yourself, too. i know. i've been there and have "hit a wall" more than once. if you get sick, run down, and can't function... you'll have a hard time taking care of him anyway. just think about it, ok?
:YMHUG: :YMHUG: :YMHUG:
ETA: in case you missed the new announcements - http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=97645
good morning, debbie!
lucian looks great, but i'm worried about you not getting enough sleep. it's entirely up to you, but i would give some thought and serious consideration to skipping the R whenever you feel the need. i know you want to do what's best for lucian, but it's so important to take care of yourself, too. i know. i've been there and have "hit a wall" more than once. if you get sick, run down, and can't function... you'll have a hard time taking care of him anyway. just think about it, ok?
:YMHUG: :YMHUG: :YMHUG:
ETA: in case you missed the new announcements - http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=97645
nckitties3
Member Since 2013
Re: 6/15 Lucian AMPS 172,+2.25/167,+4/73
I really don't know what to think/do.
Controlling the spikes with the R helps keep him under control, but then I have to 'feed up' most of the cycle to keep him from going too low. If I don't use the R, he goes uber high and the Lantus can't control him. Is there a reason why I shouldn't reduce the Lantus slightly and continue to use the R for the spikes? I know you said that you want to eliminate the R first. I'm guessing that is the norm with cats that need R, but, then again, Lucian isn't the norm in any way.
The sleep or lack of, isn't really a problem. It's bothersome but nothing I can't deal with. It's not like I have to go to work. But between having to keep a hawk-eye on him and try to nap, it pretty much keeps me locked in. He has to be tested so much, it's hard for me to even go to the store when I need to. Like now, with him running lower, I don't dare leave when I have to test often and give him MC to keep him stable. Sleep isn't the issue, I've been sleep deprived since I was a child, haven't slept thru the night since I was 12, so that I'm used to.
None of this is really a big deal at the moment, but it will be a problem when I get back to my physical therapy appts, probably next week. There's got to be a way to get him a little more stable, not a lot, just enough so I can do what I have to, ya know? That's why I was wondering if I could drop him back to 1.75, maybe I wouldn't have to keep giving the MC to keep him up. I don't want to take away the R, knowing what those 600+ BG's are doing to his organs. How can we find a midway point? I know he's gonna spike, whether from a bounce or the insulin not lasting long enough, so he will need the R for now. But if he didn't drop so low, I could get to my appts, go to the store, etc. If I could jump out of bed and run do what I need to, that would help, but my own medical issues prevent that from happening. It takes time for me to 'get going' and by then, I can't leave.
I have a DR appt Monday, that I can't change. Being on Worker's Comp, I have to go when they tell me. I'll be gone from about +7 to +9 or +10. You would think that he'd be safe by then, but I didn't expect his +9.5 this morning to be 62 either. That's the kind of thing that keeps me in, never knowing what he's gonna do. Predictably unpredictable, that's my Lucian.
What do you think Jill?
I really don't know what to think/do.
Controlling the spikes with the R helps keep him under control, but then I have to 'feed up' most of the cycle to keep him from going too low. If I don't use the R, he goes uber high and the Lantus can't control him. Is there a reason why I shouldn't reduce the Lantus slightly and continue to use the R for the spikes? I know you said that you want to eliminate the R first. I'm guessing that is the norm with cats that need R, but, then again, Lucian isn't the norm in any way.
The sleep or lack of, isn't really a problem. It's bothersome but nothing I can't deal with. It's not like I have to go to work. But between having to keep a hawk-eye on him and try to nap, it pretty much keeps me locked in. He has to be tested so much, it's hard for me to even go to the store when I need to. Like now, with him running lower, I don't dare leave when I have to test often and give him MC to keep him stable. Sleep isn't the issue, I've been sleep deprived since I was a child, haven't slept thru the night since I was 12, so that I'm used to.
None of this is really a big deal at the moment, but it will be a problem when I get back to my physical therapy appts, probably next week. There's got to be a way to get him a little more stable, not a lot, just enough so I can do what I have to, ya know? That's why I was wondering if I could drop him back to 1.75, maybe I wouldn't have to keep giving the MC to keep him up. I don't want to take away the R, knowing what those 600+ BG's are doing to his organs. How can we find a midway point? I know he's gonna spike, whether from a bounce or the insulin not lasting long enough, so he will need the R for now. But if he didn't drop so low, I could get to my appts, go to the store, etc. If I could jump out of bed and run do what I need to, that would help, but my own medical issues prevent that from happening. It takes time for me to 'get going' and by then, I can't leave.
I have a DR appt Monday, that I can't change. Being on Worker's Comp, I have to go when they tell me. I'll be gone from about +7 to +9 or +10. You would think that he'd be safe by then, but I didn't expect his +9.5 this morning to be 62 either. That's the kind of thing that keeps me in, never knowing what he's gonna do. Predictably unpredictable, that's my Lucian.
What do you think Jill?
Jill & Alex (GA)
Member Since 2009
Re: 6/15 Lucian AMPS 172,+2.25/167,+4/73,+5/51
i definitely think it's worth trying because you have to be able to go about your business and you can't when chained to lucian's ear. try it, debbie. none of us have crystal balls... especially with kitties who like to be as unpredictable as lucian. we may be pleasantly surprised! :mrgreen:
i definitely think it's worth trying because you have to be able to go about your business and you can't when chained to lucian's ear. try it, debbie. none of us have crystal balls... especially with kitties who like to be as unpredictable as lucian. we may be pleasantly surprised! :mrgreen:
nckitties3
Member Since 2013
Re: 6/15 Lucian AMPS 172,+2.25/167,+4/73,+5/51
I figure, all I can do is try it. If the spiking becomes worse, do something else. Lucian being Lucian, all I can do is keep trying different things until I find what works.
Today is a perfect example. As seldom as I have to go somewhere, it's normally not an issue. But I do need to run errands maybe once a week and will be back to PT appts twice a week soon. It's not like I work every day. I've said many times, this is the only time in my life I'm glad to be unemployed. I am sure Lucian would no longer be with me if I was working. There's no way I'd be able to care for him, as unpredictable as he is. When I do have to go out, it's not usually more than a couple hours. Monday's DR appt is an exception, since it's quite a ways away. It's a WC thing, not my regular ortho.
I'm gonna try to run out later, when I don't think he needs the MC, but before he may need the R.
Small window there!
I figure, all I can do is try it. If the spiking becomes worse, do something else. Lucian being Lucian, all I can do is keep trying different things until I find what works.
Today is a perfect example. As seldom as I have to go somewhere, it's normally not an issue. But I do need to run errands maybe once a week and will be back to PT appts twice a week soon. It's not like I work every day. I've said many times, this is the only time in my life I'm glad to be unemployed. I am sure Lucian would no longer be with me if I was working. There's no way I'd be able to care for him, as unpredictable as he is. When I do have to go out, it's not usually more than a couple hours. Monday's DR appt is an exception, since it's quite a ways away. It's a WC thing, not my regular ortho.
I'm gonna try to run out later, when I don't think he needs the MC, but before he may need the R.
Small window there!
nckitties3
Member Since 2013
Re: 6/15 Lucian +2.25/167,+4/73,+5/51,+6/66,+7/59,+8/78
OK, run out before he sky rockets!
OK, run out before he sky rockets!
Alexis & Nikki (GA)
Member Since 2013
Re: 6/15 Lucian +2.25/167,+4/73,+5/51,+6/66,+7/59
I know I'm not experienced, so grain of salt and all that, but I think decreasing the Lantus makes sense. You use the R to lower his numbers, at which point the Lantus becomes more effective, right? So it stands to reason that if the Lantus is more effective, it's bringing Lucian a little lower than you'd like. A "regular" cat would have earned a decrease of Lantus at this point already right (which Lucian would have done if not steering with food)? And it's not like you are dropping the Lantus to just use R. IMO, it's worth a try to drop .25 and see if you can get him to hit a slightly higher nadir. You'll still have the R to keep him from those HI numbers and you'll know in a day or two if the nadir isn't getting low enough.
Whatever you do, good luck! :YMHUG:
I know I'm not experienced, so grain of salt and all that, but I think decreasing the Lantus makes sense. You use the R to lower his numbers, at which point the Lantus becomes more effective, right? So it stands to reason that if the Lantus is more effective, it's bringing Lucian a little lower than you'd like. A "regular" cat would have earned a decrease of Lantus at this point already right (which Lucian would have done if not steering with food)? And it's not like you are dropping the Lantus to just use R. IMO, it's worth a try to drop .25 and see if you can get him to hit a slightly higher nadir. You'll still have the R to keep him from those HI numbers and you'll know in a day or two if the nadir isn't getting low enough.
Whatever you do, good luck! :YMHUG:
nckitties3
Member Since 2013
Re: 6/15 Lucian +2.25/167,+4/73,+5/51,+6/66,+7/59,+8/78
I believe that, 'normally,' using R, you would want the body to respond to the Lantus so that you didn't need the R anymore. I think that's the goal for a cat having to use R. R is not the norm and only used temporarily until the cat can stabilize and not need it to keep numbers down. At least I think I'm close on that understanding. Of course, with Lucian NOT being the NORM, it's trial and error. But for now, he isn't spiking over 600 and that's good, just have to adjust and see if a slight reduction in the Lantus will keep him from dropping so low, while still utilizing the R to prevent his uber high spikes. That's what I'm hoping for anyway.
My original intent with 'steering' was to try to keep him from dropping below 100, to ease the bounce. The more stable I can keep him, no highs, no lows, I feel he has a better chance of being regulated. just MHO. With using the R, the lows got lower and I was preventing him from reductions, while using the R to keep down the spikes. I may be wrong, but I think if I can keep him steady, like below 200, above 100, he'll level out eventually. Just a theory. Not a set number of course, just an example.
I wish I had a vet willing to document Lucian's struggle with FD, just to show that 'one size doesn't fit all', ya know? I think he'd be a great case study for the 'abnormal'. :lol:
I believe that, 'normally,' using R, you would want the body to respond to the Lantus so that you didn't need the R anymore. I think that's the goal for a cat having to use R. R is not the norm and only used temporarily until the cat can stabilize and not need it to keep numbers down. At least I think I'm close on that understanding. Of course, with Lucian NOT being the NORM, it's trial and error. But for now, he isn't spiking over 600 and that's good, just have to adjust and see if a slight reduction in the Lantus will keep him from dropping so low, while still utilizing the R to prevent his uber high spikes. That's what I'm hoping for anyway.
My original intent with 'steering' was to try to keep him from dropping below 100, to ease the bounce. The more stable I can keep him, no highs, no lows, I feel he has a better chance of being regulated. just MHO. With using the R, the lows got lower and I was preventing him from reductions, while using the R to keep down the spikes. I may be wrong, but I think if I can keep him steady, like below 200, above 100, he'll level out eventually. Just a theory. Not a set number of course, just an example.
I wish I had a vet willing to document Lucian's struggle with FD, just to show that 'one size doesn't fit all', ya know? I think he'd be a great case study for the 'abnormal'. :lol:
nckitties3
Member Since 2013
Re: 6/15 Lucian +4/73,+5/51,+6/66,+7/59,+8/78,+9.5/106,+10.5
He's an alien moving at Warp Speed!
He's an alien moving at Warp Speed! 
Deb & Wink
Member Since 2013
Re: 6/15 Lucian +4/73,+5/51,+6/66,+7/59,+8/78,+9.5/106,+10.5
Drop back on the Lantus to 1.75 and see what it does. You never know with Lucian.
:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:nckitties3 said:
Drop back on the Lantus to 1.75 and see what it does. You never know with Lucian.
Jill & Alex (GA)
Member Since 2009
Re: 6/15 Lucian +9.5/106,+10.5/334-R,PMPS 295,+3/110,+5.5/54
wow. i know you gave lucian R at AM+10.5, but he still cleared that bounce pretty darn quick. you'll have to consider experimenting with going without R real soon. he might be ready!
tonight you're still seeing the residual effect of the depot from the 2u dose. it'll be a few cycles before we can see what the 1.75u dose can do. with alex i'll usually have a good idea if the reduction has held around the 5th cycle after the reduction, but ECID. however, if i see her numbers trending upwards, i immediately take her right back up to the last good dose. there is no "settling time" with reductions like there is with dose increases. in the event of a failed reduction you don't want too much time to pass because you'll lose momentum.
i sure hope he doesn't keep you up all night...
wow. i know you gave lucian R at AM+10.5, but he still cleared that bounce pretty darn quick. you'll have to consider experimenting with going without R real soon. he might be ready!
tonight you're still seeing the residual effect of the depot from the 2u dose. it'll be a few cycles before we can see what the 1.75u dose can do. with alex i'll usually have a good idea if the reduction has held around the 5th cycle after the reduction, but ECID. however, if i see her numbers trending upwards, i immediately take her right back up to the last good dose. there is no "settling time" with reductions like there is with dose increases. in the event of a failed reduction you don't want too much time to pass because you'll lose momentum.
i sure hope he doesn't keep you up all night...
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