6/11/2015 Dino AMPS=177/ PMPS=65 +5 =26 +.6=79 +6.25=88 + 7=96

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Anita and Dino

Anita and Dino

Member Since 2015
Hello! I have had Dino on 1U for 3 days now but can't seem to get him out of the 300's at PM. Should I be doing something different? Thank you.
 
You really need to start getting some mid-cycle tests in...if you can get a test in somewhere between +5 and +7 it may show him going a lot lower than you think he is and then his liver reacts by releasing stored sugar and hormones to bring him back up quickly (bouncing)

It's also important to get at least a "before bed" test on the PM cycle...most cats go lower at night (but not all!!)

We've seen cats go from 400 to 40 and back to 400 by the next shot time so those mid-cycle tests are really important to figure out what's going on. Think of the spreadsheet like it's a puzzle...if the only pieces you have are along the edges, it's impossible to tell what the picture is, but if you have pieces sprinkled throughout it, the picture becomes clearer
 
I like the puzzle analogy..
maybe you could set an alarm....
or as we were just saying elsewhere.... drink a big glass of water so you have to get up in the night .... and while you're up.... grab a test....

we need more data to determine if you need more juice.... or less.....
 
Okay, I was avoiding the mid-cycle tests because Dino's ear is so full of pricks. What you said makes complete sense. I'll try my best. Thanks
 
Breathe

Did you give high carb food and how much honey?

You'regoing to want to test again in 20 mins to make sure what you gave him is bringing him up
 
I gave about 1 tablespoon of honey in his regular food. I breathing. Thanks. Just before I tested him he had vomited all his dinner. I'll test again in 20..
 
A tablespoon of honey is likely to do the trick :) but it will likely bring him up fast and wear off fast. Do you have any high carb wet food available? I will stay with you while we manage this so don't panic :)
 
You're an angel. Thank you. I gave him his regular food because he has tendency for urine crystals and is not really allowed other food. But I guess this is an emergency. I will do another test in 20 than if he's low I'll give him other higher carb food.
 
Hi it's still me - I am a split personality :) I will be watching out for your test - don't forget to update subject line so I see it easily
 
That's too bad. I would be careful to feed him small amounts, slowly, to keep from upsetting his tummy again. Hopefully he vomited out whatever was making him ill - that's often the case - and will be just fine now.

Dino, please come back toward shore. There are sharks in the deep end of the lagoon and the lifeguards are off for the night.
 
much better but that will be the effects of the honey. No need to feed again but test again in another 20 mins
 
I've been looking at Dino's spreadsheet and it's giving me palpitations :nailbiting: you haven't been testing often enough to follow tight regulation which means that Dino should have been given reductions any time he dropped under 90 and then you've increased without enough data too, and to shoot so low tonight without testing again for so long... I'm not having a go at you, you are new to all of this and there's a lot to absorb but please please please don't go increasing again without advice and if you shoot a low number you need to be able to monitor it.

Dino has well and truely earned a reduction and if you can't monitor closely and given his drops into the 20s I'm thinking you should take a .5 unit reduction - so his new dose will be .50 units. You also need to be aware that because of the way Lantus works - the depot effect - that the reduction may not have an immediate effect, although chances are Dino will bounce after going so low.

With Dino having such a strong response to the lantus in such a short space of time and at a comparatively low dose I would have high hopes for him achieving remission if managed appropriately so hopefully your lack of sleeping will be intense but short lived :)
 
Vyktors Mum said:
I've been looking at Dino's spreadsheet and it's giving me palpitations :nailbiting: you haven't been testing often enough to follow tight regulation which means that Dino should have been given reductions any time he dropped under 90 and then you've increased without enough data too, and to shoot so low tonight without testing again for so long... I'm not having a go at you, you are new to all of this and there's a lot to absorb but please please please don't go increasing again without advice and if you shoot a low number you need to be able to monitor it.

Dino has well and truely earned a reduction and if you can't monitor closely and given his drops into the 20s I'm thinking you should take a .5 unit reduction - so his new dose will be .50 units. You also need to be aware that because of the way Lantus works - the depot effect - that the reduction may not have an immediate effect, although chances are Dino will bounce after going so low.

With Dino having such a strong response to the lantus in such a short space of time and at a comparatively low dose I would have high hopes for him achieving remission if managed appropriately so hopefully your lack of sleeping will be intense but short lived :)
Click to expand...
Yes, it's a bit overwhelming. I guess I thought I needed to keep him on the same dose for at least 3 cycles to see how he does. I will ask next time.
 
That is my view yes, particularly with the frequency that you're testing.

Are you able to test more frequently than you have been? We take a PreShot test to make sure it's safe to shoot but dose changes are decided based on nadir. If you can't get at least one additional test per cycle - not necessarily at nadir but sufficient so that we know where Dino is headed then you really need to do a curve at least once a week - hopefully that won't be when he's bouncing.

Best thing to do for the time being, at least until you know what you're doing is to post his numbers daily here so people can help you - and perhaps hassle you into testing more :woot:

Speaking of which...
 
Vyktors Mum said:
That is my view yes, particularly with the frequency that you're testing.

Are you able to test more frequently than you have been? We take a PreShot test to make sure it's safe to shoot but dose changes are decided based on nadir. If you can't get at least one additional test per cycle - not necessarily at nadir but sufficient so that we know where Dino is headed then you really need to do a curve at least once a week - hopefully that won't be when he's bouncing.

Best thing to do for the time being, at least until you know what you're doing is to post his numbers daily here so people can help you - and perhaps hassle you into testing more :woot:

Speaking of which...
Click to expand...
What does nadir mean?
 
Nadir is the lowest point in the cycle. On lantus that is usually somewhere between +4 and +6 hours after the shot.
 
Have you read the New to the Group? sticky? If not, I'd highly recommend it. Here is an explanation of a cycle from that post:

Learn how YOUR kitty is responding to insulin:
Onset - the length of time before insulin reaches the bloodstream & begins lowering blood glucose
Peak/Nadir - the lowest point in the cycle
Duration - the length of time insulin continues to lower blood glucose
How to do a Curve - a simple explanation

NOTE: Until kitty is pretty well regulated, the description below is NOT not what you'd consider a "typical" Lantus cycle. It takes time and patience for kitty to achieve a "typical" cycle! The example below is what you're working towards (a nice shallow curve). A relatively flat cycle is the ultimate goal.

Example of an ACTIVE, but NOT necessarily typical Lantus cycle:

+0 - PreShot number.
+1 - Usually higher than PreShot number because of the last shot wearing off. May see a food spike in this number.
+2 - Often similar to the PreShot number. You'll probably see an active cycle if the +2 is the same/similar or lower than the preshot number. Continue testing!
+3 - Lower than the PreShot number, onset has started.
+4 - Lower.
+5 - Lower.
+6 - Nadir/Peak (the lowest number of cycle. NOTE: ECID. Not every cat has a mid-cycle nadir. Adjust the hours on this example to fit your cat.)
+7 - Surf (hang around the nadir number).
+8 - Slight rise.
+9 - Slight rise.
+10 - Rising.
+11 - Rising (one of the quirks of Lantus/Levemir: some cat's blood glucose numbers dip around +10 or +11... not to be confused with nadir).
+12 - PreShot number.
Click to expand...
 
You can probably wait 30 mins now. It looks like he's left the danger levels and might be headed into a bounce.

If you get a test not on the hour you can report it as, eg +6.25 if it's on the quarter hour, +6.5 if its on the half hour etc. if someone reads your subject line/spreadsheet and thinks you didn't test until an hour after getting a 26 they're going to have palpitations too :)

You're doing great btw

ETA - in your spreadsheet you can put more than one reading in the same cell you will just need to enter the colour manually. Don't know how proficient you are with excel if you need help getting it right feel free to ask. It is important that it is right for people that are reading it to give advice.
 
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Please let us help you and Dino more. More posting (daily is good) and, if you can more testing, particularly if you shoot low or get a low test result. Dino looks like a good candidate for remission if handled correctly. We are here to help as much as you need, which at this stage of your 'diabetes dance' is probably more than you realise ;)

Dino is probably going to bounce up to high numbers from going so low tonight. Bounces can take up to 6 cycles to clear so don't be disheartened if he bounces up - and don't think that means he needs an increase - no more increases without advice! :)

P.S. I was showing his picture to some of my friends and we are unanimous - he's gorgeous!
 
OTJ=Off the Juice (insulin)
He's doing very well as your experienced fellow Lantus users have told you.
When Boomer was here he went OTJ and got a video made for him. Not sure if they still do that because I've not been around for a few years, but I'll bet there are other condos here with videos because someone is always going OTJ in Lantus Land!
 
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