4/7 Silver AMPS 202 - UPDATE

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Juliet

Member Since 2017
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...e-help-interpret-results.193727/#post-2166349

Hi
See last night's post re ER trip. I got up just now - I put his usual food down mixed with warm water. No interest. Tried Temptations treat when I tested him - no interest. Opened up a can of sardines - he ate about three bites.

Do I give him the shot?

How do I get him to eat?

Never done syringe feeding? What kind of syringe? Its too early for shops to be open, I have a syringe that I once had to use for a liquid antibiotic and its thicker - pic attached. How not to make him choke?

I don't have keto sticks but I did try using them before - Silver never ever pees when I am in the house unless I am asleep. When I am home for the whole day neither of my two cats use the litter tray until I go to bed. What do I do @Jill & Alex (GA)?

Waiting until someone tells me if I should give the shot despite him not having eaten.

Vet said to give the next fluids at around tea time today - 6pm ish.

Don't know how to handle a day of him lying under the table feeling miserable.
 

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I am so sorry Silver isn't well. With Ketones on board, it's important to not skip the shot. The recipe for DKA is
in appetence + not enough insulin + systemic infection

You can try using that syringe, it's a bit small, but until you can get another one that's larger, you could try it. Make the food really thin with water. And watch the video that Jill linked to your thread yesterday.


Here's some info Jill often posts when a kitty won't eat: Here are some things you can do do entice your cat to eat: ( I have always had luck with Baby food when Bubba gets off his feed)
-sometimes in order to get a cat to eat you even have to resort to dry it is more important that they eat. there are a couple low carb / grain free brands -- EVO and wellness core. * I have added Young Again Zero Carb
-making a buffet to give him choices
sprinkle food with :
- forta flora -- a probiotic you can get at vets or online. is very smelly and cats love the taste of it.
- heating food
- parm. cheese
- smashed crumbles of dry food
- bonito tuna flakes
- halo chicken treats -- crumble into dust over food
- poor a little water from tuna in water over food ( I use low sodium/no sodium added as other kinds in water has veg. broth in it and I assume that means onions, which are toxic to cats-- check labels)
-powdered oregano. yep sounds weird . but some cats like it and it will entice them to eat.
other ideas of foods to offer your kitty to stim appy:
- trader joe tuna for cats
-baby food -- beechnut turkey and broth or chicken and broth. they have no onions or other additives. some babyfoods have onions . please read labels if you can't find beechnut.
- kentucky fried chicken
- deli turkey /chicken
- plain cooked ( boiled or baked ) chicken breast
-canned chicken for people (watch the label that their are no onions)
- chicken broth -- low sodium

Cats that are not eating much for a few days are at risk for hepatic lipidosis
Last resort to eat give Medium or the high carb, wet food
 
Bobbie And Bubba said:
I am so sorry Silver isn't well. With Ketones on board, it's important to not skip the shot. The recipe for DKA is
in appetence + not enough insulin + systemic infection

You can try using that syringe, it's a bit small, but until you can get another one that's larger, you could try it. Make the food really thin with water. And watch the video that Jill linked to your thread yesterday.


Here's some info Jill often posts when a kitty won't eat: Here are some things you can do do entice your cat to eat: ( I have always had luck with Baby food when Bubba gets off his feed)
-sometimes in order to get a cat to eat you even have to resort to dry it is more important that they eat. there are a couple low carb / grain free brands -- EVO and wellness core. * I have added Young Again Zero Carb
-making a buffet to give him choices
sprinkle food with :
- forta flora -- a probiotic you can get at vets or online. is very smelly and cats love the taste of it.
- heating food
- parm. cheese
- smashed crumbles of dry food
- bonito tuna flakes
- halo chicken treats -- crumble into dust over food
- poor a little water from tuna in water over food ( I use low sodium/no sodium added as other kinds in water has veg. broth in it and I assume that means onions, which are toxic to cats-- check labels)
-powdered oregano. yep sounds weird . but some cats like it and it will entice them to eat.
other ideas of foods to offer your kitty to stim appy:
- trader joe tuna for cats
-baby food -- beechnut turkey and broth or chicken and broth. they have no onions or other additives. some babyfoods have onions . please read labels if you can't find beechnut.
- kentucky fried chicken
- deli turkey /chicken
- plain cooked ( boiled or baked ) chicken breast
-canned chicken for people (watch the label that their are no onions)
- chicken broth -- low sodium

Cats that are not eating much for a few days are at risk for hepatic lipidosis
Last resort to eat give Medium or the high carb, wet food
Click to expand...
Thank you. I've tried the dry (I am in Canada and we dont get YA here). I just called vet and they said to give half his usual dose. Should I?
I've tried the Fortaflora as I had some in the house; tried sardines. Nothing. Not interested.

None of those other things I have in the house - its 6am and nothing is open. and I have no money - i just gave the last of what I had to the vet last night and my rent cheque will bounce on monday. I can just use what I have in house - Fancy Feast, dry food, sardines - all of which he said no to. I am scared. Should I give half or full dose?
 
I would give the full dose as you have a few hours before onset to get him to eat.

Do you have any oregano? I have had luck with sprinkling that on the food to get Bubba eating. Go to the grocery store and pick up some baby food. BeechNut brand doesn't use corn starch . Make sure it is all meat and broth, no vegetables.

ETA: I just saw where you can only use what's in the house due to $$
 
Bobbie And Bubba said:
I would give the full dose as you have a few hours before onset to get him to eat.

Do you have any oregano? I have had luck with sprinkling that on the food to get Bubba eating. Go to the grocery store and pick up some baby food. BeechNut brand doesn't use corn starch . Make sure it is all meat and broth, no vegetables.

ETA: I just saw where you can only use what's in the house due to $$
Click to expand...
I don't have any oregano. I just gave full shot.
Trying to reach DCIN as vet says he may need hospital stay. Silver growled when I gave shot. He's not happy.
 
Juliet said:
I don't have any oregano. I just gave full shot.
Trying to reach DCIN as vet says he may need hospital stay. Silver growled when I gave shot. He's not happy.
Click to expand...
Good luck Juliet. Keep us updated. Ketones and not eating is not a good scenario. Meantime, keep offering him food .
 
I'm glad you shot the full shot, even if he isn't eating yet, I think that was absolutely the right decision. You do have a couple of hours before onset of Lantus, and you are starting from a decent cushion of BG, so he's safe for now even if he's not interested in food yet. Maybe just spend some time hanging out with him and petting him-- he's probably a little stressed from the vet trip and feeling yucky, it will help calm him down. You may need to syringe feed if he keeps turning away from food, and that will go better the less stressed the two of you are.

Sending eating vines for Silver!

:bighug: :bighug: :bighug:
 
I dont know of this has ever came up in any of your previous threads.... But where in Canada are you? We do have a lot of members there and maybe more on the FB page. If anyone is nearby enough, they may some different supplies you can try.

ETA: i am surprised the vet had you take him home last night with ketones, but I understand if the money issue played into that. Hopefully you'll hear back from DCIN soon because it seems to me that he needs to go back.

@Chris & China (i know you may not be awake chris, but I wanted to bring your eyes here.
 
Have you tried to heat up the food a bit? Just microwave 6-8 seconds until it is warm. It helps bring out the aroma too and sometimes will help get them to eat.
 
CassAndGordy said:
I dont know of this has ever came up in any of your previous threads.... But where in Canada are you? We do have a lot of members there and maybe more on the FB page. If anyone is nearby enough, they may some different supplies you can try.

ETA: i am surprised the vet had you take him home last night with ketones, but I understand if the money issue played into that. Hopefully you'll hear back from DCIN soon because it seems to me that he needs to go back.

@Chris & China (i know you may not be awake chris, but I wanted to bring your eyes here.
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Juliet is located near Toronto, Ontario (for folks in the US). I'm in Ottawa, Ontario - too far away to help.
 
Juliet, as someone mentioned last night, it's more important that Silver eats than what he eats at the moment. Do you have any human food he may be interested in? Deli meat? Cheese? Ice cream? As long as it is non toxic to cats (no onions comes to mind), see if you can entice him with something he may not typically get.

I hope there is another FDMB member that lives close to you. Hang in there. :bighug:
 
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:bighug::bighug::bighug: the vines are for Silver, the hugs are for you Juliet. I know exactly how it feels to need to help and save your baby from a position of no resources. Just keep loving on him. It's so important to keep the insulin on board, but he's got to have food. Syringe feeding is not as awful as it seems. But you have to be patient and do it slow and small amounts for safety. Hang in there. Hopefully you'll get back to vet soon. Please syringe water too. :bighug::bighug:
 
Can you try to put some food on your finger and put it into his gums?? If you can get some into his mouth, gently hold his mouth shut so he will swallow it, just give tiny amounts mixed with warm water as some suggested
 
I feel awful. I fell asleep. Am going to try food again but he is lying under the table so not a good sign and not expecting him to eat.
@LizzieInTexas i feed him FF fish varieties usually and nowbhe wouldn't even take sardines. Not dry food either. I don't know what to do. Vet mentioned meds to stimulate appetite. Should I go and get those from the vet?
 
Do you think he is nauseated? An appetite stimulant can help, but if there's nausea, it should be combined with something to counteract that (otherwise, he'll be hungry, but still won't want to eat :(). Good ones for cats are Cerenia and ondansetron-- others can probably tell you more about them.

The other thing to think about, if he is having a pancreatitis flare (did the test come back?), would be pain meds. If pain is part of the mix, it can make a world of difference to a cat's appetite and well-being.
 
Juliet said:
I feel awful. I fell asleep. Am going to try food again but he is lying under the table so not a good sign and not expecting him to eat.
@LizzieInTexas i feed him FF fish varieties usually and nowbhe wouldn't even take sardines. Not dry food either. I don't know what to do. Vet mentioned meds to stimulate appetite. Should I go and get those from the vet?
Click to expand...

I'm sure you're exhausted, hang in there.

Does he look like he wants to eat, but walks away or licks his lips (sign of nausea)? Or does he just seem not at all interested in food? There are medications that address nausea and sometimes that's enough, but it sounds like he may need an appetite stimulant. If you can get that and an oral feeding syringe from the vet, I would do.

Any luck getting him to eat any human foods?
 
Nan & Amber said:
Do you think he is nauseated? An appetite stimulant can help, but if there's nausea, it should be combined with something to counteract that (otherwise, he'll be hungry, but still won't want to eat :(). Good ones for cats are Cerenia and ondansetron-- others can probably tell you more about them.

The other thing to think about, if he is having a pancreatitis flare (did the test come back?), would be pain meds. If pain is part of the mix, it can make a world of difference to a cat's appetite and well-being.
Click to expand...
I don't know re nausea. I only have the tests i posted last night. I don't know how to interpret them.
 
Just want to copy and paste Jill's list here, so it's handy in today's condo and you don't have to swap back and forth:

Jill & Alex (GA) said:
Hi Juliet. I know you went to bed, but wanted to stop by to say how sorry I am that Silver is not well. I can't add much to what the others have said.

Here's a little reminder list:
  • Feed him whatever he'll eat even if it's higher carb food. Getting calories into him trumps the diabetes at this point. If you need to, syringe feed him: Assisted Feeding (Video and Tips). You want to shoot for about 1.5 times the amount he normally eats.

  • Syringe water, as much as he'll take.


  • You don't want to skip shots. If his PS number is low, ask for help. Someone will walk you through it.

  • Ketostix - cheaper than a ketone meter and they'll give you the information you'll need. You've said your place is small. That'll make it easier to watch for when he pees.
Try to keep as calm as you possibly can around Silver because he'll pick up on your upset. I know that part's hard, but we do what we gotta do for these little guys.

:bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
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You may need to force feed. See if you can get a feeding syringe from the vet and a couple of cans of Hills rx A/D food. I always gave Gizmo the opportunity to eat on his own before I forced fed so the association was there.

Mirtz is the appy stimulant that works for Gizmo (but ecid). Like Nan said above, if it is nausea got to get that controlled first.
 
Stacy & Asia said:
I'm sure you're exhausted, hang in there.

Does he look like he wants to eat, but walks away or licks his lips (sign of nausea)? Or does he just seem not at all interested in food? There are medications that address nausea and sometimes that's enough, but it sounds like he may need an appetite stimulant. If you can get that and an oral feeding syringe from the vet, I would do.

Any luck getting him to eat any human foods?
Click to expand...
Not interested in ANY food. Put some on my fingers. Opened his mouth. Took first bit off me then wised up and clamped his mouth shut.

I guess I must phone vet and have him taken in for hospital visit but no one answering my message from DCIN and I can't pay for the visit. What should I do.
 
Stacy & Asia said:
Just want to copy and paste Jill's list here, so it's handy in today's condo and you don't have to swap back and forth:
Click to expand...
Him not eating is biggest issue. I can't force him. It's not happening.
LizzieInTexas said:
You may need to force feed. See if you can get a feeding syringe from the vet and a couple of cans of Hills rx A/D food. I always gave Gizmo the opportunity to eat on his own before I forced fed so the association was there.

Mirtz is the appy stimulant that works for Gizmo (but ecid). Like Nan said above, if it is nausea got to get that controlled first.
Click to expand...
i just tried. didnt work. losing my mind. dont know what to do.
 
Juliet said:
Not interested in ANY food. Put some on my fingers. Opened his mouth. Took first bit off me then wised up and clamped his mouth shut.

I guess I must phone vet and have him taken in for hospital visit but no one answering my message from DCIN and I can't pay for the visit. What should I do.
Click to expand...

If he took the first bit and then refused, it could be nausea. A cerenia shot should help. He may or may not need an appetite stimulant after that.

I think Chris mentioned an emergency number last night? Any luck finding it, I will see if I can dig it up for you.
 
Here is the blurb from DCIN website - Not sure if this is what Chris was talking about

Phone
Call or text [deleted]. Please note that this line is not continuously monitored, and it may take several days to get back to you.

For emergencies only, call our Executive Director, Jenna, at [deleted]. Please note that this is a personal cell phone number. Jenna is happy to help in an emergency, but we ask that you reserve phone calls to her for emergency situations – e.g. your cat is in dire condition and needs to go to an emergency vet clinic right away, but you can’t afford the deposit.​
 
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Juliet, if you end up back at the vet today, bring both of your meters and extra strips. Tell the vet you are concerned with one of them reading low and ask the vet if you can have some of the veinous blood leftover in the tubing to test both of your meters at the same time as their lab value (assuming they would take more blood).

I know you took a reading at home yesterday after the vet, but stress at the vet can elevate numbers and it would be ideal to test your meters at the same time, and if possible with the same blood, that they use.
 
CassAndGordy said:
Here is the blurb from DCIN website - Not sure if this is what Chris was talking about

Phone
Call or text [deleted]. Please note that this line is not continuously monitored, and it may take several days to get back to you.

For emergencies only, call our Executive Director, Jenna, at [deleted]. Please note that this is a personal cell phone number. Jenna is happy to help in an emergency, but we ask that you reserve phone calls to her for emergency situations – e.g. your cat is in dire condition and needs to go to an emergency vet clinic right away, but you can’t afford the deposit.​
Click to expand...
Jenna called me back. That you for this!
 
Stacy & Asia said:
Juliet, if you end up back at the vet today, bring both of your meters and extra strips. Tell the vet you are concerned with one of them reading low and ask the vet if you can have some of the veinous blood leftover in the tubing to test both of your meters at the same time as their lab value (assuming they would take more blood).

I know you took a reading at home yesterday after the vet, but stress at the vet can elevate numbers and it would be ideal to test your meters at the same time, and if possible with the same blood, that they use.
Click to expand...
Just saw this after being at vet. Accuchekc measures same as vet so that's good. I always knew freestyle measured low but as you guys say - with the lower numbers it's not such a big gap. So I know in my mind that when I see yellow it's "vet pink". Blue - "vet yellow".
 
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