4/26 Floyd AMPS Hi, +2.5 543, +5 Hi, PMPS 520

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Janine & Floyd (GA)

Janine & Floyd (GA)

Member Since 2018
Yesterday

Floyd vomited sone bile yesterday evening, which I was hoping was a one time thing. He ate his PM meals with normal gusto, but vomited 2 more times overnight.

This morning he didn't wake me up like normal, he let me test him (Hi again) and is not eating. He's smacking his lips, so I know he's nauseous. I'll have DH take him into work today and get some Cerenia into him, and run some blood work.

I shot the full 4 this morning since he's in a bounce (grrrrr) and DH can monitor him closely. Hopefully I made the right decision. :(

Vines needed! Thus kitty ALWAYS eats, so I'm very worried.:arghh:
 
Sending Vines, I can relate to being worried when a kitty who loves his fuds is off his food.

As long as he's eating now you have some time to get food into him before the Lev onsets, and you certainly have the tools to keep him safe if you need to.

Do you think he might be getting acid tummy, like some CKD cats are prone to?

I know some members, whose kitties suffer with acid tummy, find that if they don't feed for prolonged periods they have issues, so they give some low carb snacks just a few pieces at regular intervals, they try not to let them go for more than 3 hours without some food in their tummy. A couple of small pieces of poached chicken breast for example would probably be enough and most folk find it doesn't affect the duration or cause a spike in BG even if it's after nadir.

I hope you're feeling better too.
 
Thank you!

Yes, it certainly could be something like that. I have freeze-dried chicken treats that I use sometimes at testing. Maybe I need to give more of those between meals.

He's finished his breakfast, drank some water and did a big pee - and he keeps looking at me like "Why are you following me around, crazy hooman??"

I'm feeling about the same, hopefully I'll be able to get some rest and be better by tomorrow.
 
Janine & Floyd said:
I have freeze-dried chicken treats that I use sometimes at testing. Maybe I need to give more of those between meals.
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Sometimes that's enough. I hope it's just a one off for him.
Janine & Floyd said:
"Why are you following me around, crazy hooman??"
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LOL I keep prodding George every time I go past him, just to make sure he's still with us. I get a Mreeao from him and a sleepy look 'Can't you seez Izz sleeepin?'
 
Poor Floyd! :bighug:

I hope the Cerenia helps. Asia gets acid tummy and will vomit bile or just clear foamy liquid if she goes too long without food. This is likely from the CKD and started happening more than a year before diabetes. But...she will eat right away when I feed her after acid barf and I don’t think it typically makes her nauseated for any length of time. Hopefully it’s just that and he’s eating fine. The automatic feeder made a huge difference since I can give her food at regular intervals even if I’m sleeping or away.

Some things that did make her nauseated for a longer time: pancreatitis or having high phosphorous (even high end of “normal” p, as it’s meant to be normal for kittens, but not adult cats). We’ve had pretty great luck with SEB for nausea/acid tummy, but there was a good while there when she needed Cerenia every day until she got over the hump and her p came down.

I hope it’s easy enough to figure out the cause and that Floyd (and you) are both feeling a lot better soon. :bighug:
 
Stacy & Asia said:
Some things that did make her nauseated for a longer time: pancreatitis or having high phosphorous (even high end of “normal” p, as it’s meant to be normal for kittens, but not adult cats). We’ve had pretty great luck with SEB for nausea/acid tummy, but there was a good while there when she needed Cerenia every day until she got over the hump and her p came down.
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I'm worried about both pancreatitis and P, so that will be tested today.

I'll look into the SEB.
 
Another update: Floyd ate again, and still no vomiting. By now, the cerenia should have kicked in, so hopefully, his tummy is feeling better.

Labs are showing his BUN, creatinine & phos are up a bit more than last time but his urine specific gravity is also up from last time. That tells me he was most likely a bit dehydrated from the vomiting, rather than his kidneys worsening. DH is giving him some subQ fluids. I've entered some of his labs in the SS, but not everything yet.

We couldn't draw the blood for PLI because he had just eaten, so I'll have to figure out the timing on that (supposed to be 12 hr fast).

Either pancreatitis or general GI disease, most likely. I'm pretty much just treating the same either way.

And barring any further upsets, I'll likely increase to 4.5 for tonight.
 
Are all the labs in house? His creatinine is enviable! I bet dehydration threw off the BUN and urine concentration at least. Can dehydration give elevated phosphorous? I would think that p number could be one of the nausea culprits if not.

Do you give Floyd B vitamins/methyl b12? Look at Asia’s labs, I got her hematocrit up just from doing that. I got injectable methylcobalamin from diamondback pharmacy that I give her every other week and I give her a B multi every day as well. I was a bit skeptical that it could do much on the anemia front, but I’m a believer now! ;)

I’m glad he’s back to eating and hopefully the Cerenia is one and done and combined with the fluids, he’s got it from here.

Agree on the increase. :cat:
 
Stacy & Asia said:
Are all the labs in house?
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No. Some in-house, some sent out. I haven't had a chance to put everything in and note which is which or add references ranges.

Stacy & Asia said:
His creatinine is enviable! I bet dehydration threw off the BUN and urine concentration at least. Can dehydration give elevated phosphorous? I would think that p number could be one of the nausea culprits if not.
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Yes, it can. Dehydration will cause decreased clearance of phosphorus. And, it certainly can be the culprit for nausea, as well as the elevated BUN.

Stacy & Asia said:
Do you give Floyd B vitamins/methyl b12? Look at Asia’s labs, I got her hematocrit up just from doing that. I got injectable methylcobalamin from diamondback pharmacy that I give her every other week and I give her a B multi every day as well. I was a bit skeptical that it could do much on the anemia front, but I’m a believer now! ;)

I’m glad he’s back to eating and hopefully the Cerenia is one and done and combined with the fluids, he’s got it from here.

Agree on the increase. :cat:
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I have not given him B vitamins other than what I add to his homemade food. No methyl B12in there. I'll check it out. Thanks!
 
Janine & Floyd said:
Yes, it can. Dehydration will cause decreased clearance of phosphorus.
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Thanks, that’s really good to know! I knew it could affect a lot of the kidney values, but hadn’t heard that before regarding phosphorous. I wish I could say it was the case for Asia’s increase last time, but I doubt it.

Tanya’s site talks a lot about B vitamins, the methyl b12 is thought to be more effective for anemia and neuropathy (that’s the type of B12 in zobaline that is so popular around here for neuropathy):

https://www.felinecrf.org/vitamin_b.htm
 
Janine & Floyd said:
We couldn't draw the blood for PLI because he had just eaten, so I'll have to figure out the timing on that (supposed to be 12 hr fast).
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12 hours is ideal, but I've done Neko with less. Usually with diabetics you can do 8 hours and I've even done earlier. I used to have the blood draw done late in the day as possible.

His P is rather higher. Are you grinding chicken thighs including the bone for his meal? When Neko started CKD, I transitioned to raw with egg shell calcium. I also found some lower P manufactured ones made with buffalo bone pounder, though the egg shell calcium was better from the P point of view. I sometimes "cheated" and used raw premixes. One even had calcium carbonate so a bit of a P binder in it.

I third the increase. With blues in the picture normally we'd just increase by 0.25 units, but he's close to that 5 unit mark where we go to 0.5 unit increases. Plus we need to get rid of that black. And I know you test a lot. To any lurkers, this suggestion is just for Janine and Floyd.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
12 hours is ideal, but I've done Neko with less. Usually with diabetics you can do 8 hours and I've even done earlier. I used to have the blood draw done late in the day as possible.

His P is rather higher. Are you grinding chicken thighs including the bone for his meal? When Neko started CKD, I transitioned to raw with egg shell calcium. I also found some lower P manufactured ones made with buffalo bone pounder, though the egg shell calcium was better from the P point of view. I sometimes "cheated" and used raw premixes. One even had calcium carbonate so a bit of a P binder in it.

I third the increase. With blues in the picture normally we'd just increase by 0.25 units, but he's close to that 5 unit mark where we go to 0.5 unit increases. Plus we need to get rid of that black. And I know you test a lot. To any lurkers, this suggestion is just for Janine and Floyd.
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I'm thinking an 8 hour fast on the labs, I just have to figure out the timing and when I'll have help.

The chicken thighs are deboned, as Dr. Lisa and I were concerned about the phosphorus. I add calcium carbonate powder into the mix. My plan is to recheck his labs once he's back to eating, maybe next Tuesday or so, to see how much is dehydration Also need to check the reference ranges as the blood 2 mos ago was sent out and today was in house.

I'm picking him up in an hour or so. I missed him today. :)
 
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