4/14/2014 Georgie AMPS 440
- Thread starter ajsandbe
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MommaOfMuse
Member Since 2010
Abbey
He's dropping too fast too early in the cycle...his dose is still too high. Roll him back to .5u for a few days and see if that gives you less extremes.
Mel and The Fur Gang
He's dropping too fast too early in the cycle...his dose is still too high. Roll him back to .5u for a few days and see if that gives you less extremes.
Mel and The Fur Gang
IloveLarry
Member Since 2014
good luck georgie....hope u do better soon.
ajsandbe
Member Since 2014
Today and yesterday his numbers seemed more consistent. Should I still drop him down? Could it have been just a fluke? Maybe I was inaccurate with he syringe that day-sure hope not. Just curious because the last few days he has been pretty consistent in the yellows pinks and reds. I am also doing a curve today. Let me know your thoughts. If so should I drop that dose down this evening? Thanks and have a great day. Thanks for catching that drop.
MommaOfMuse
Member Since 2010
Yes I do think you need to dial him back. Because look at even last night he went from HI which is over 600 to the high 300s in an hour that is screaming fast of a drop and feels lousy to drop like that to him physically.
Yes he is getting a consistent pattern except that pattern is that of a roller coaster. Dive and bounce, dive and bounce. Simple physics...for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. So a fast hard drop in BGs triggers a reaction to fast hard bounce back up.
The dose is so high that its slamming him down and his body reacts and slams him back up. To stop that ping pong effect you need to drop the dose. Now granted you may end up going back up slowly again but right now his body is fighting against the insulin. You want him coming down slowly so his body gradually gets use to the ever lowering numbers.
Think of it like this:
You're on a road trip and have been driving 75mph for several hours. Your brain knows 75 is fast but your body has gotten use to that speed so it feels normal. Now you come to a town and have to slow down to 45mph. You again know intellectually that you're still speeding along but to your body it feels like you're crawling along and you really have to pay attention to the speedometer to maintain that 45 mph because your body wants to return to 75mph. Well the same sort of thing is going on in his body before he got sick enough for you to take him to a vet to find out he's diabetic his body got use to those reds and blacks that started feeling normal. So asking it to drop even into the 200s feels like a hypo setting in and his liver panics.
Now his liver doesn't have a brain to rationally figure out that he's safe there so you can't train it like a dog. All it feels is that things are dropping fast and that's not good. Then slamming him from red to blue or green is likedriving at 75 and slamming on the brakes. First if you don't put yourself through the windshield you slam forward then back into the seat hard. Your heartrate increases, you have butterflies in your stomach, you're shaking...in short you're STRESSED and stress raises BGs.
Now same road trip..you go from 75 to 65 then 55 mph over a long expanse of road by the time you need to be driving 45 to go through town it feels just fine and you're able to maintain that speed without constantly watching the speedometer.
So letting Georgie drop from red to pink then letting those pinks become yellows then blue then green over time doesn't make his liver panic as much and he'll bounce less and even what bounces he does have won't be as extreme.
Mel and The Fur Gang
Yes he is getting a consistent pattern except that pattern is that of a roller coaster. Dive and bounce, dive and bounce. Simple physics...for every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. So a fast hard drop in BGs triggers a reaction to fast hard bounce back up.
The dose is so high that its slamming him down and his body reacts and slams him back up. To stop that ping pong effect you need to drop the dose. Now granted you may end up going back up slowly again but right now his body is fighting against the insulin. You want him coming down slowly so his body gradually gets use to the ever lowering numbers.
Think of it like this:
You're on a road trip and have been driving 75mph for several hours. Your brain knows 75 is fast but your body has gotten use to that speed so it feels normal. Now you come to a town and have to slow down to 45mph. You again know intellectually that you're still speeding along but to your body it feels like you're crawling along and you really have to pay attention to the speedometer to maintain that 45 mph because your body wants to return to 75mph. Well the same sort of thing is going on in his body before he got sick enough for you to take him to a vet to find out he's diabetic his body got use to those reds and blacks that started feeling normal. So asking it to drop even into the 200s feels like a hypo setting in and his liver panics.
Now his liver doesn't have a brain to rationally figure out that he's safe there so you can't train it like a dog. All it feels is that things are dropping fast and that's not good. Then slamming him from red to blue or green is likedriving at 75 and slamming on the brakes. First if you don't put yourself through the windshield you slam forward then back into the seat hard. Your heartrate increases, you have butterflies in your stomach, you're shaking...in short you're STRESSED and stress raises BGs.
Now same road trip..you go from 75 to 65 then 55 mph over a long expanse of road by the time you need to be driving 45 to go through town it feels just fine and you're able to maintain that speed without constantly watching the speedometer.
So letting Georgie drop from red to pink then letting those pinks become yellows then blue then green over time doesn't make his liver panic as much and he'll bounce less and even what bounces he does have won't be as extreme.
Mel and The Fur Gang
hollyall
Member Since 2011
You're asking the right questions Abbey. It's a lot to take in and understand, and you were at a higher dose before the diet change. The diet change made a huge difference in dose for my kitty Max way back when he was first diagnosed, so you may still need some adjusting for Georgie. I agree with the others on trying out a lower dose, keep testing and monitoring, and, depending on how it goes, slowly walking the dose back up, if needed. Hopefully, that'll give Georgie a chance to get used to better numbers and less bouncing, and then you can slowly increase. I know you've already been working it pretty slowly, waiting 3-5 days before increases, but it may be that Georgie's body needs more time.
The following is just an example and not meant that you should do Georgie the same... When my Max relapsed in December and went back on insulin, I started at .5u, even though my vet recommended 1u, just cause I wasn't sure if Max would really need 1u. So far, he hasn't ever made up to 1u yet, so I feel good that I was more conservative than the vet. The vet used the weight formula to calculate the dose, so she wasn't wrong either. It was a gut feeling on my part and because I had been testing Max even before he started on the insulin. Even with starting at .5u, I dropped it down to just a little less (.4u) cause there was a teeny tiny bit of bouncing and I felt I needed to learn better how the insulin was working on Max. Max dropped into the 50's a couple times at first, and, with being so new on the insulin, I wasn't comfortable with that yet. Anyway, we went from .5u, to .4u, back up to .5u, to .6u, to .65u, to .75u, over a 2-3 month period. You don't have to take it as slow as that as it will depend on the BG's that Georgie gives you. Just an example of taking it slow. Every cat is different and even a slight change makes a big difference for Max. You may not see as big a difference on slight changes. This is more an example of patience, and the very kind folks here have needed to remind me more than once to be patient. ;-)
The following is just an example and not meant that you should do Georgie the same... When my Max relapsed in December and went back on insulin, I started at .5u, even though my vet recommended 1u, just cause I wasn't sure if Max would really need 1u. So far, he hasn't ever made up to 1u yet, so I feel good that I was more conservative than the vet. The vet used the weight formula to calculate the dose, so she wasn't wrong either. It was a gut feeling on my part and because I had been testing Max even before he started on the insulin. Even with starting at .5u, I dropped it down to just a little less (.4u) cause there was a teeny tiny bit of bouncing and I felt I needed to learn better how the insulin was working on Max. Max dropped into the 50's a couple times at first, and, with being so new on the insulin, I wasn't comfortable with that yet. Anyway, we went from .5u, to .4u, back up to .5u, to .6u, to .65u, to .75u, over a 2-3 month period. You don't have to take it as slow as that as it will depend on the BG's that Georgie gives you. Just an example of taking it slow. Every cat is different and even a slight change makes a big difference for Max. You may not see as big a difference on slight changes. This is more an example of patience, and the very kind folks here have needed to remind me more than once to be patient. ;-)
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