? 3/6 - Gen, AMPS 88, +2 77, barely eating

Allie & Gen

Allie & Gen

Member Since 2025
Yesterday

I'm really struggling right now.

Last night, I increased Gen's cerenia dose to 16mg, and gave him the full dose of (topical) mirataz. He ate a little before I went to bed, then apparently didn't get back up to eat any more on his own. When I woke up randomly around 3AM, I picked him up and carried him over to his food dishes, and he ate a bit more. Then he came back to bed, and I believe stayed there the rest of the night.

There was no litterbox use overnight at all, either. He's drinking water and he could have peed a little in the bathtub (not always easy to tell), though lately he seems to have been mostly (maybe even always) peeing in his litterbox, so I was surprised and concerned about that part too.

This morning he wouldn't touch anything but a chicken churu and a bit of freeze-dried tuna. He didn't show a lot of interest in the fact that I was getting food ready, and generally seemed more worried that I was going to start doing things he didn't like (presumably, administering various medications) when I came into the room, although he did go and sit expectantly next to the food dishes and was enthusiastic when I brought out the tuna. I was scared to shoot, and eventually gave him a very token dose (.5u).

His BG looks great, but he's not eating. I don't know whether to be patient and try to give the medication changes more time to work (I'll be giving him an additional ondansetron dose before I get home and then another at bedtime, so that's 3x/day instead of 2, though the intervals are a little wonky - and the cerenia dose has been doubled from what it was before last night). Should I ask my vet for an oral version of the mirataz, which could have negative side effects but also might be more effective for his appetite? Should I ask her for buprenorphine (as she suggested as one potential option) in case he's in too much pain to want to eat much (and hiding it surprisingly well)? Should I try syringe feeding? (I'm hesitant about the latter only because he will absolutely hate it, and he's already acting wary of me around mealtimes, and I'm afraid to potentially make things worse at a behavioral level.)

Performance review at work went fine, but in a very faking it/pretending to be on top of things kind of way.

Tomorrow I need to be out of the house for some important errands for at least a couple of hours.

I'm feeling almost paralyzed by anxiety.

I hope it's a much better Friday for the rest of you.
 
On another subject, would someone mind helping me understand the fructosamine results? I'm so tired and anxious and it feels like my brain has stopped working.

I get that this means he hasn't been in an extended hypoglycemic state (which was apparently what my vet wanted to check on? I guess?), but I don't understand if it tells me anything more specific about his overall BG. Which feels like something I should be able to understand, and yet.
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I’m so sorry there is no improvement. I’m going to make a suggestion and understand you may not be interested. I would consider taking him to an ER that is also a specialty center. That might expedite getting a biopsy quickly. You are right to be worried about the limited eating as cats can get fatty liver, a complication you do not want. I did that with my lymphoma kitty successfully.
 
Allie & Gen said:
On another subject, would someone mind helping me understand the fructosamine results? I'm so tired and anxious and it feels like my brain has stopped working.

I get that this means he hasn't been in an extended hypoglycemic state (which was apparently what my vet wanted to check on? I guess?), but I don't understand if it tells me anything more specific about his overall BG. Which feels like something I should be able to understand, and yet.
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It shows there is good control and what you are doing is keeping him safe and indecently threshold. Good news.
 
tiffmaxee said:
I’m so sorry there is no improvement. I’m going to make a suggestion and understand you may not be interested. I would consider taking him to an ER that is also a specialty center. That might expedite getting a biopsy quickly. You are right to be worried about the limited eating as cats can get fatty liver, a complication you do not want. I did that with my lymphoma kitty successfully.
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I'm not completely against it although I am really scared about the cost. My finances are ... not good, and I know he has multiple expensive procedures coming up. I think following your advice would mean taking him to the ER at the local animal hospital, rather than the Veterinary Emergency Group (VEG) 24-hour ER I've taken him to before.

Much as I want to get the biopsy, I'm also a little worried about rushing into it without a proper consult. My vet doesn't think Gen is safe to go under anesthesia right now. That's something I was hoping to discuss with the IM specialist to get their opinion on how to move forward.
 
One small positive: my roommate is home (this is the last time I'll have this resource on a work day for awhile, she departs on Sunday night), and I asked her to "encourage" Gen to get out of his bed in my room so she could close the door and keep him in an area where the Libre sensor is in range of the phone app (since asking her to move it around all day isn't really fair to her). I checked the camera after she did, and he was eating. It doesn't look like he ate a ton, but it's something, anyway.

He shouldn't need to be pushed around to eat, though ... and it's also not possible a lot of the time.
 
Allie, so sorry the eating is still a problem. I'm hesitant to mention this because I'm a newbie when it comes to managing this stuff and it could be a dumb idea. But have you tried any bland foods? Earlier this week when I was having trouble some plain boiled chicken seemed to help calm things down. The vet was on about stomach acid from longer amounts of time without food making them feel yucky.
 
I'm so sorry Allie! I completely understand the paralyzing anxiety, it is one of the worst feelings in the world. I wish I had insight for you as to why he has no appetite.

As for his fructosamine results, it shows that he is doing well overall. It basically shows the average from the last 2 to 3 weeks. Similar to an a1c test for human diabetics.

Hang in there. *huge hugs*
 
You would not want the local vet but rather the ER. You would only do as I suggested if they have a radiologist or internist possibly to do a thorough ultrasound and then immediately proceed with endoscopy so as not to duplicate tests.

There is a chance this is all pancreatitis and eating small amounts more often like ge us doing is great. My vet always says when thi start to feel better if they eat too much at one time they feel yucky and then do not want to eat more later. I would feed whatever he wants right now. When pancreatitis reared its ugly head Max ate baby food and a higher carb pouch food in gravy he liked .
 
Tim & Pookey said:
Allie, so sorry the eating is still a problem. I'm hesitant to mention this because I'm a newbie when it comes to managing this stuff and it could be a dumb idea. But have you tried any bland foods? Earlier this week when I was having trouble some plain boiled chicken seemed to help calm things down. The vet was on about stomach acid from longer amounts of time without food making them feel yucky.
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I haven't tried anything outside his normal diet. I could boil some chicken for him. It obviously wouldn't give him everything he needs nutritionally, so I guess the goal would be to get him back to a point where he can eat his regular food?

tiffmaxee said:
You would not want the local vet but rather the ER. You would only do as I suggested if they have a radiologist or internist possibly to do a thorough ultrasound and then immediately proceed with endoscopy so as not to duplicate tests.

There is a chance this is all pancreatitis and eating small amounts more often like ge us doing is great. My vet always says when thi start to feel better if they eat too much at one time they feel yucky and then do not want to eat more later. I would feed whatever he wants right now. When pancreatitis reared its ugly head Max ate baby food and a higher carb pouch food in gravy he liked .
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I know, what I mean is that we have two ERs in my area - one is a chain called the Veterinary Emergency Group, and I don't think they have any specialists, although I know they can perform an ultrasound (he had one there once before). The other is part of a full-scale animal hospital, and definitely has all the resources, but is often very busy with huge wait times at the ER.

The things he wants right now seem to be freeze-dried tuna and churus, which isn't really enough food. I also can't be home until this evening so what I've left out (a little buffet, three kinds of wet food with some toppers) is what he's got until then.
 
Allie & Gen said:
I haven't tried anything outside his normal diet. I could boil some chicken for him. It obviously wouldn't give him everything he needs nutritionally, so I guess the goal would be to get him back to a point where he can eat his regular food?
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Yea! Maybe it would help settle whatever's going on in his system and get some calories in over the next day or so.
 
Tim & Pookey said:
Yea! Maybe it would help settle whatever's going on in his system and get some calories in over the next day or so.
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Well, I was planning to poach a couple of chicken breast fillets tonight to add to a meal of my own, so I could try giving him some (just the chicken of course) and see if he'll take it. Sigh. It feels weird trying all these foods on him when I'm supposed to be moving him towards an elimination diet. 😅
 
Well, now my vet is recommending taking him to the ER. I can't leave work early today, and I should probably make sure I eat dinner before going because we could be there a long time. I think after work I will call the hospital to make sure I know what's needed/if I should bring anything etc, then eat, and then get us a ride there.

I'm exhausted. I hope they can help.
 
As I was typing the following, I saw the recommendation for an ER visit. I hope they find a solution. They may suggest a feeding tube, which can be a great way to get meds and calories in him. In the SCL group I'm in, I see quite a few kitties need them to get over the hump. They are only temporary.Feeding Tubes For Cats

I am dealing at home with very similar appetite issues, though we might have turned the corner a bit. A couple things that worked for me. Definitely multiple small meals, not a lot at once. Small bits of boiled chicken have been a hit. I am putting food dishes right beside her bed so she doesn't have to go far. I also used hand feeding, feeding on a spoon, and holding the food dish up to her. Food gets topped with a sprinkle of Fortiflora then freeze dried meat. I also topped up with a little bit of syringe feeding - not her regular food or that can cause food aversion. I fostered a hepatic lipidosis (fatty liver disease) kitty from the shelter back to health, and that too was multiple small meals of syringing.

TikiCat makes pouches of something called Silver Comfort. They are not a complete meal, but a small package is 25 calories. Two of those a day is almost a third of her required calories. They are soft and easy to eat. At this point I'm OK with some of her diet not being complete food.

For small pill meds like ondansetron, I'm putting them in half a pill pocket, then rolling it in Fortiflora and she eats it on her own. Powders like probiotics get put in a puddle of Churu. Nasty liquids, the strawberry flavoured antiobiotic is not a hit (only one that doesn't cause the runs), gets an appetizer of Churu and a chaser of Churu.
 
Right now, given my situation, I'm thinking I'd try to feed him what he usually ate before he got diabetes—something you think he'll eat regardless of his glucose levels. He needs to eat something, even if it's high in carbohydrates; he needs to have some food in his body. I'm quite worried about your cat; I hope he gets better. I'm sorry for what you're going through; when mine is sick, my heart breaks. I'm here to listen. ❤️
 
I'm so sorry, Allie 🖤 what a frightening experience, I hope both you and Gen are okay.

Not much to add to the advice above, but good luck if you do decide to go to the ER. We'll be thinking of you both and sending all the healing vines 🍃🍃🍃🍃
 
Gosh Allie, so sorry gens not eating.

I've had some luck with the liver shake.

It's very nutrient dense, if I recall they only need about 60ml a day.
When my Felix was very poorly I would give it to him a teaspoon at a time.


THE '~LIVER SHAKE~' FOR SICK CATS

This liquid food is appropriate for cats suffering from conditions where they are eating very little or not at all such as anemias, leukemias, deficiency states with symptoms of lethargy, listlessness, and weakness.

1 cup RAW LIVER (BEEF, or CHICKEN)
1 cup FRESH CARROT JUICE or V-8, or Tomato Juice
1/4 cup *FRESH FILTERED WATER
1 RAW EGG YOLK
1 tsp.KELP POWDER OR SPIRULINA


COMBINE AND MIX IN A BLENDER UNTIL LIQUEFIED. (Note: it will be frothy)
 
Gen and I are in the waiting room at the animal hospital. He mostly seems annoyed at being confined; as has been the case all week, he's not showing a whole lot of outward signs of pain or discomfort.

Even though it's not very crowded in here, though, it's rather loud and I am not enjoying that part. I get sensorily overstimulated very easily when stressed. Hopefully I'll be able to hear them call us with my earbuds in.

They're saying it'll be an hour or two wait.

Thanks folks for suggestions and good wishes! It's a lot to process right now, so I'm not going to respond to everything individually, but it is all appreciated. ❤️
 
Oh Allie I’m so sorry it’s been such a tough day for Gen and you 😫
I hope he feels much better quickly!
Do you have any of the rescue food at home (Hills A/D) from the vet?
It’s very palatable and nutrient dense and they seem to like it a lot.
Plus easy to syringe feed if needed.
I used a can of it when Ivy had P-Titis to help get her eating again.
I keep it in the house for an emergency.
The boiled chicken sounds like a good idea and maybe the Liver shake (I’ve never tried that). And those Silver Comfort sachets seem like a good idea too.

We are sending you lots of prayers, healing wishes and vines 🙏🙏🙏🙏🙏
🍀🍀🍀🍀🍀💝💝💝💝
 
Sending hugs and support, Allie. I’ve been silently following along and I’m so sorry you are at the ER with Gen. I sure hope they can give you some insight as to what is causing his lack of appetite and get him back on track very soon.

Keep us posted 🤗
 
You could have also gone to the ER's other location even thought it's a bit of an Uber ride for you. The wait time is generally way less.

Hope Gen feels better :bighug:
 
I'm hanging out in an exam room while the ER doc takes Gen for an exam/blood tests. She's been talking over options with me and it has become fairly clear to me that I really just can't afford the biopsy. It would give me a definitive answer about what kind of enteropathy he's experiencing, but it doesn't seem as though that would actually make much of a difference for Gen at this juncture, and I certainly can't put down those kinds of funds for my own peace of mind.

She has suggested that the best approach would be to start Gen on a steroid that would be the treatment for either IBD or SCL, and that if he wasn't responding, that's when we'd bring in the chemo drug (I am blanking on the name right now but it starts with a c).

Apart from that, she doesn't have a lot of suggestions about the food issue in the short term apart from admitting him and having them get calories into him intravenously. Admitting him is pretty damn expensive and I'm trying to figure out if it makes sense ... But it would probably give him the chance to be seen in more detail by the internal med folks tomorrow. The ER is pretty jammed tonight (unsurprisingly, as it's Friday).

I hate leaving him overnight, but maybe it would be the best for him.

Will have to see what she says after the exam. I'm a bit worried that he's dehydrated as well; normally not an issue for him at all, but he hasn't peed today as far as I can tell.
 
squeem3 said:
You could have also gone to the ER's other location even thought it's a bit of an Uber ride for you. The wait time is generally way less.

Hope Gen feels better :bighug:
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Good to know about wait times for the future. This location is basically around the corner from me, and I came early enough that I was hoping it wouldn't be too bad of a wait ... but it IS Friday.
 
Ask if there are any financial aid plans or programs you might qualify for. Not sure if there is anyone still in the financial aid office at this time but you can call Monday to ask.

Allie & Gen said:
She has suggested that the best approach would be to start Gen on a steroid that would be the treatment for either IBD or SCL, and that if he wasn't responding, that's when we'd bring in the chemo drug (I am blanking on the name right now but it starts with a c).
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Cholrambucil. @Wendy&Neko has experience with this, I think. I have some on hand for Leroy but haven't needed to use it yet.

Too bad tomorrow is the weekend. There is one particularly good IM vet there but he doesn't work weekends.
 
Indy is on chlorambucil as well. Has been for the last two years. It helps him tremendously. He has never had the biopsy and he was diagnosed 10+ years ago, the meds work so I never felt the need to spend the money on the biopsy.

Don't do prednisolone as it negatively affects blood sugar (it is what made Indy diabetic in the first place). There is one that starts with a b that doesn't affect blood sugar as bad but I cannot remember the damn name. Ugh.

Sending more love and hugs your way Allie!
 
Jessica & Indy said:
Don't do prednisolone as it negatively affects blood sugar (it is what made Indy diabetic in the first place). There is one that starts with a b that doesn't affect blood sugar as bad but I cannot remember the damn name. Ugh.
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Budesonide. That's what Leroy takes and it does affect his bgs BUT Leroy is not a normal cat :blackeye:
 
Jessica & Indy said:
Indy is on chlorambucil as well. Has been for the last two years. It helps him tremendously. He has never had the biopsy and he was diagnosed 10+ years ago, the meds work so I never felt the need to spend the money on the biopsy.
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Diagnosed with what? I thought Indy was diagnosed with IBD. Chlorambucil is an anti-cancer med, isn't it? I didn't think it was given for such a long term (two years)? Sorry, just confused.

Jessica & Indy said:
Don't do prednisolone as it negatively affects blood sugar (it is what made Indy diabetic in the first place). There is one that starts with a b that doesn't affect blood sugar as bad but I cannot remember the damn name. Ugh.

Sending more love and hugs your way Allie!
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I mentioned the steroid/BG issue and the doctor clearly knew what she was talking about, but I'll make sure. (Though I'm getting a bit worried, she's been gone with him for an hour, which seems like a long time.)

Thank you. ❤️
 
Allie & Gen said:
Diagnosed with what? I thought Indy was diagnosed with IBD. Chlorambucil is an anti-cancer med, isn't it? I didn't think it was given for such a long term (two years)? Sorry, just confused.


I mentioned the steroid/BG issue and the doctor clearly knew what she was talking about, but I'll make sure. (Though I'm getting a bit worried, she's been gone with him for an hour, which seems like a long time.)

Thank you. ❤️
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He was diagnosed with IBD over 10 years ago. Tried the elimination diet when he was first diagnosed and it didn't work. So he went on prednisolone, which he was on for 8 years. Then he became diabetic and doc switched him to chlorambucil (daily, then every other day, then twice a week and finally once a week). Now he gets a small dose once a week as a maintenance dose which keeps his symptoms under control. Wendy hadn't heard of being on it long term either but it is working and he is a fairly healthy old man, so I won't argue with results.
 
Allie & Gen said:
She has suggested that the best approach would be to start Gen on a steroid that would be the treatment for either IBD or SCL, and that if he wasn't responding, that's when we'd bring in the chemo drug (I am blanking on the name right now but it starts with a c).
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There is a major problem with this logic. A steroid will likely work (at least for a while), regardless of what condition he has. But if SCL, at some point it will get serious enough that it will overwhelm what the steroid can do.

And there is the fact that the two conditions SCL and IBD are usually treated somewhat differently. For IBD cats, a steroid may be part of their lifelong treatment. For SCL, you can usually taper off the steroid once the GI symptoms have gone. Chlorambucil is a staple for SCL and sometimes for intractable IBD. With SCL, there is growing evidence that you can also remove it from the picture once kitty is in solid remission. My kitty with IBD and SCL, her SCL is in remission so she's only taking pred. Chlorambucil is a chemo drug and comes with risks. It is carcinogenic and can cause other cancers too.
 
Gen has been admitted, and tomorrow he'll get an internal workup (another ultrasound, a bunch of other tests, I have the whole list of course but it's on paper and I'm on a Lyft without much light). They're going to try a few thinga, see if they can get him eating. Tomorrow we will see where we are.

They did a bunch of basic blood tests, and he's in really good shape overall. Barely dehydrated, BG in the low 100s, various other values good. And he's 12.4lbs, so he hasn't lost the progress we were making there.

Regarding a treatment plan going forward, I am exhausted and fried and will do better at assessing all the information and having a careful chat with one of the internists after a good night's sleep. I appreciate everyone's input; I'm sorry I haven't responded to all of it directly, but I am spent.

I hate leaving him overnight. I miss him already. I think it's the best choice for him, though, especially as it gets us the consultation with the internal med team more than a week sooner.

Goodnight, friends.
 
Karolina & Nestle said:
Hi Allie and I'm sorry you've been dealing with all this. I hope Gen does well overnight and that you'll get some more answers tomorrow. Hopefully you're getting some much needed rest. We're sending PAWsitive vibes and healing vines
✨️🌿🌿🌿🌿🌿🌿🌿🌿🌿🌿🌿🌿🌿🌿✨️

Would you be able to set up a GoFund me account to help with some of the costs?
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Please consider this, Allie. And link the account here. You're doing your best to keep him healthy, and many of us would be glad to chip in a little to help precious Gen.
 
Hey guys. Thank you again.

Here's a quick update: apparently Gen is doing well over at the hospital, his values overall look good, and he's bright, curious and interactive (that's my boy). They'll be in touch in more detail with ultrasound results, and they're going to try the oral appetite stimulant after the ultrasound. We'll discuss whether I want to start him on budesonide. They're also going to test his T4 levels, and see about formally confirming his pancreatitis diagnosis. Apparently his abdomen seemed a bit tender - could be we're looking at a (bigger?) flare-up that's been resisting the meds I've been giving him, I guess?

If we can get him eating again I am inclined to go back to starting on that elimination diet before we touch steroids. I'd rather discuss with my own vet first, taking whatever findings and advice they give me into consideration. I'm still not feeling particularly motivated to try and do the biopsy. Right now, it is genuinely impossible for me to take on that cost on top of the others associated with this hospitalization. I just increased my CareCredit limit, but I can't keep taking on additional debt indefinitely.

Thank you for everyone who suggested a GoFundMe. ❤️ The fact is that I actually already have one, though I haven't posted it here and it's been relatively inactive for the last month or two. I originally started it to fund Gen's dental surgery (the very expensive planned one with the specialist that was canceled/postponed in November when his diabetes was re-diagnosed), which I could never have paid for on my own. I updated it in November or December to explain about the delay/diabetes, and left it open because I knew I would need more help. I need to sit down and calculate up the expenses Gen's care has accrued over the last few months, and then I intend to update the GoFundMe with information and an increased goal amount, and do the sharing/promotion stuff.

I find the whole thing deeply uncomfortable, but I genuinely, even desperately, need the help. When I'm ready to get it moving again, I'll be talking to the mods here about posting it in the appropriate forum. (I read up on the rules about this awhile ago but will give them a refresh.) I'm grateful for the encouragement. It's hard to look the cold, hard numbers in the face, but I'll find the cope to do it.

I am going out to run a few errands on my bike while I'm waiting to hear back about Gen. I really hope they don't want to keep him another night. Money troubles aside, it's so hard not having him home.
 
Oh, also Gen apparently tore off his Libre. Of course. (The one that I installed just a few days ago.) That's my boy. :rolleyes:

I have at least one, I think two, on hand. (I hope it's two.) After that, more fun expenses to add to the pile. Extra high because of my stupid, relatively great in terms of healthcare (for humans! but not for uninsured pets!) state. (Look, don't get me wrong ... in spite of these things I do really love it here, FYI. But.)
 
I'm thinking about you all day. I know how you feel. My financial resources aren't good either. I could get the cat tested more, but I could never afford it. But remember, you're doing what you can, which is already a lot. You don't have to feel guilty. Many animals don't have mothers like us, who invest time and money in their care. I hope everything gets better. Hugs, and don't get discouraged. ❤️ :bighug:
 
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