3/22 Star AMPS=401 +6=42/38 ... PMPS=143 +2=275 +4=347
- Thread starter quilterkitty
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Lisa & Leo
Member Since 2012
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401
Rats on the AMPS. Just pretend that it's really just a pink with meter variance. :-( Come on Star, time to head down into unsweetened land (I just love that!)
Rats on the AMPS. Just pretend that it's really just a pink with meter variance. :-( Come on Star, time to head down into unsweetened land (I just love that!)
quilterkitty
Member Since 2013
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401
Thanks, Mary and Lisa. We'll see what the day holds. :smile:
Thanks, Mary and Lisa. We'll see what the day holds. :smile:
TheBowHuntress
Member Since 2012
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401
Don't let that 401 upset you. Star wants to keep you on your toes, that's all. A cat will be a cat will be a cat
Have a lovely day and keep up the purr-fect job that you're doing!
Don't let that 401 upset you. Star wants to keep you on your toes, that's all. A cat will be a cat will be a cat
Have a lovely day and keep up the purr-fect job that you're doing!
PeterDevonMocha
Member Since 2009
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401
Hi guys .. bummer on the high amps but don't feel discouraged .. you're doing great! have a great weekend!
Hi guys .. bummer on the high amps but don't feel discouraged .. you're doing great! have a great weekend!
quilterkitty
Member Since 2013
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401
Thanks, Kat and Peter. I wish you a beautiful Friday and a great weekend! More snow due in Iowa--say it isn't so . . .
Thanks, Kat and Peter. I wish you a beautiful Friday and a great weekend! More snow due in Iowa--say it isn't so . . .
Denise & Honey
Member Since 2012
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401
You are still going in the right direction though!
Hope Star comes down to a nice surf today
You are still going in the right direction though!
Hope Star comes down to a nice surf today
quilterkitty
Member Since 2013
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401 +6=42/38
Thanks, Denise!
I tested Star before lunch, and he had dropped to 42. Thinking I hadn't gotten quite enough blood, I tested again: 38. Yowza. Star is having a little bit of HC food, and I will test again in a few minutes. So this means I can reduce his evening dose by .25, to 1.25 units, right?
Related question: we are going out of town for four days (really two full and two partial) in two weeks. Now, I don't know what will happen with Star's numbers between now and then, but given the pattern he seems to be following, I predict at least one more dose reduction before we leave. Question: since I'm not sure I trust anyone other than myself to get the tiny dose right, especially since a care giver won't be around except at meal times, is it actually safer just not to dose him for that time period? His BG will rise, surely, but that's preferable to a potential hypo episode and possible death with nobody around to provide emergency care. Am I right, or am I crazy?
Thanks, Denise!
I tested Star before lunch, and he had dropped to 42. Thinking I hadn't gotten quite enough blood, I tested again: 38. Yowza. Star is having a little bit of HC food, and I will test again in a few minutes. So this means I can reduce his evening dose by .25, to 1.25 units, right?
Related question: we are going out of town for four days (really two full and two partial) in two weeks. Now, I don't know what will happen with Star's numbers between now and then, but given the pattern he seems to be following, I predict at least one more dose reduction before we leave. Question: since I'm not sure I trust anyone other than myself to get the tiny dose right, especially since a care giver won't be around except at meal times, is it actually safer just not to dose him for that time period? His BG will rise, surely, but that's preferable to a potential hypo episode and possible death with nobody around to provide emergency care. Am I right, or am I crazy?
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401 +6=42/38 +6.20=53 +7=70
Phyllis
Good job on the catch and on bringing numbers up. Yes...please reduce his dose to 1.25u although remember if he springs way back up like his history of doing, you can shoot through the bounce tonight with 1.5u and then reduce in the morning.
Also...just as an information and recommendation....Sienne and I are huge fans of getting a +2 test every single cycle that it is possible. The +2 will give you loads of info. If the +2 is much higher than the PS, it's likely to be a slow cycle; if it is about the same, it's likely to be a typical, active lantus cycle where numbers will come down; if it's much lower than the PS, you're probably going to see a very active cycle starting early....especially if they are clearing a bounce like today.
I know you'd like the answer to your question now but we really need to see how he's doing. I understand your concern but I'm not a big fan of skipping that many doses. Yes, numbers will go up but you have other issues; the depot totally drains and you have to get it refilled which can take more time so they spend longer at high numbers. Also, if there is any hidden infection lurking that you don't even know about, it can be a way to set them up for developing ketones. Ketones can then lead to diabetic ketoacidosis and it happens FAST and can be deadly. A better solution would be to have someone you trust that can shoot a half dose. Sienne has to travel for work and that's usually what she does.....she just has her petsitter shoot half the dose that Gabby is currently on. At least he'd be getting some insulin and his depot would not entirely drain.
But don't forget to bring it up to us again as you get closer to leaving.
If you gave HC to bring him up, please stay on top of the testing until you have two, rising, non food influenced numbers, k? Great job!!!
Phyllis
Good job on the catch and on bringing numbers up. Yes...please reduce his dose to 1.25u although remember if he springs way back up like his history of doing, you can shoot through the bounce tonight with 1.5u and then reduce in the morning.
Also...just as an information and recommendation....Sienne and I are huge fans of getting a +2 test every single cycle that it is possible. The +2 will give you loads of info. If the +2 is much higher than the PS, it's likely to be a slow cycle; if it is about the same, it's likely to be a typical, active lantus cycle where numbers will come down; if it's much lower than the PS, you're probably going to see a very active cycle starting early....especially if they are clearing a bounce like today.
I know you'd like the answer to your question now but we really need to see how he's doing. I understand your concern but I'm not a big fan of skipping that many doses. Yes, numbers will go up but you have other issues; the depot totally drains and you have to get it refilled which can take more time so they spend longer at high numbers. Also, if there is any hidden infection lurking that you don't even know about, it can be a way to set them up for developing ketones. Ketones can then lead to diabetic ketoacidosis and it happens FAST and can be deadly. A better solution would be to have someone you trust that can shoot a half dose. Sienne has to travel for work and that's usually what she does.....she just has her petsitter shoot half the dose that Gabby is currently on. At least he'd be getting some insulin and his depot would not entirely drain.
But don't forget to bring it up to us again as you get closer to leaving.
If you gave HC to bring him up, please stay on top of the testing until you have two, rising, non food influenced numbers, k? Great job!!!
quilterkitty
Member Since 2013
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401 +6=42/38 +6.20=53 +7=70 +9=66
Okay, I'll start getting a +2 as often as I can. And he's declined a tiny bit, so I'll recheck him in an hour. He isn't too much lower than his previous numbers, this morning's AMPS notwithstanding. He really does not like the ear pokes. His poor ears are looking pretty rugged, and I try to alternate but the right ear is harder to reach. I turned off the beeps on the monitor, but he still knows what's coming and tries to avoid it. I feel bad for him, but I just tell him I'll be as quick as I can and reassure him that it will all be fine. Poor baby. :cry:
Star would miss six cycles of insulin if my pet sitter didn't dose him (and the seventh would be late). But I know we'll need to wait until closer to travel time to evaluate his numbers. I wish he had been diagnosed before we committed to this conference. I know I'll worry about him the whole time! The vet said all his other blood work was fine when she first tested him March 1, the day of his diagnosis. That's reassuring, but I do understand that doesn't mean something sneaky isn't going on in his little body. I just have to find someone I trust.
Okay, I'll start getting a +2 as often as I can. And he's declined a tiny bit, so I'll recheck him in an hour. He isn't too much lower than his previous numbers, this morning's AMPS notwithstanding. He really does not like the ear pokes. His poor ears are looking pretty rugged, and I try to alternate but the right ear is harder to reach. I turned off the beeps on the monitor, but he still knows what's coming and tries to avoid it. I feel bad for him, but I just tell him I'll be as quick as I can and reassure him that it will all be fine. Poor baby. :cry:
Star would miss six cycles of insulin if my pet sitter didn't dose him (and the seventh would be late). But I know we'll need to wait until closer to travel time to evaluate his numbers. I wish he had been diagnosed before we committed to this conference. I know I'll worry about him the whole time! The vet said all his other blood work was fine when she first tested him March 1, the day of his diagnosis. That's reassuring, but I do understand that doesn't mean something sneaky isn't going on in his little body. I just have to find someone I trust.
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401 +6=42/38 +6.20=53 +7=70 +9=66
Looks like he's surfing...if he comes back down next test, you could give him a wee bit of LC just to be sure he stays on his surfboard. Even tho we usually don't feed after nadir (and he might start back up), if the HC wears off and he drops back into the 50s, you should give a little LC (tsp).
Looks like he's surfing...if he comes back down next test, you could give him a wee bit of LC just to be sure he stays on his surfboard. Even tho we usually don't feed after nadir (and he might start back up), if the HC wears off and he drops back into the 50s, you should give a little LC (tsp).
quilterkitty
Member Since 2013
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401 +6=42/38 +6.20=53 +7=70 +9=66 +10=122
Okay, he's back up to 122 and hasn't eaten anything in about three and a half hours. He's parked in front of the heating vent in my office and is snoozing. He was perky this morning, but frequent testing seems to make him depressed. Maybe I'm just projecting.
Nadir is 5-7 hours after a dose, right? When you say you don't usually feed after nadir, do you mean in general or after a BG dip? What about cats that free feed? Star gets small meals at 6:30 a.m. (plus insulin), 12:30 p.m. (right at nadir), 6:30 p.m. (plus insulin), and 10:30 p.m. (snack at bedtime). I always test before meals/snacks and at other times depending on his numbers (and will begin testing at +2). Is this schedule unworkable? Maybe I've been doing this wrong all along. confused_cat
Okay, he's back up to 122 and hasn't eaten anything in about three and a half hours. He's parked in front of the heating vent in my office and is snoozing. He was perky this morning, but frequent testing seems to make him depressed. Maybe I'm just projecting.
Nadir is 5-7 hours after a dose, right? When you say you don't usually feed after nadir, do you mean in general or after a BG dip? What about cats that free feed? Star gets small meals at 6:30 a.m. (plus insulin), 12:30 p.m. (right at nadir), 6:30 p.m. (plus insulin), and 10:30 p.m. (snack at bedtime). I always test before meals/snacks and at other times depending on his numbers (and will begin testing at +2). Is this schedule unworkable? Maybe I've been doing this wrong all along. confused_cat
TheBowHuntress
Member Since 2012
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401 +6=42/38 +6.20=53 +7=70 +9=66 +10=122
And one thing about giving "treats" at test time (I don't know if you do, but thought this is worth passing on): It dawned on me recently that is not a good idea; and an expert told me she does not "treat for tests"--scritches are better, because if you run into a very low number situation, and you are stalling--you can't give treats with the testing...AND also, with low numbers, if you are feeding to get numbers up, you wouldn't want to treat after each test during these low moments because their belly might get full too soon and you may need room in that little belly for subsequent little meals to brings numbers up.....so therefore I would think a cat gets confused if "sometimes you treat" and "sometimes you can't treat".....
Just my opinions and personal experience: my cats free feed with the exception that I put the food up 2 hours before shooting (though I admit that once in a while there will be a morning I don't get up 2 hours prior to his AM shot, and therefore don't know when Gobbles last ate). I do believe, with Gobbles as least, that he does get somewhat depressed with constant testing (meaning more than 5 or 6 times in a 24 hour period--I know I would). Nadir is when the cat decides nadir to be. With Lantus, about +6 is average, but ECID. Gobbles' has had nadirs anywhere from +1 to +11; but his norm seems to be 5-8 hours after his shot. There is just too much going on in their little bodies to pinpoint nadir. I am sure there are probably cats out there who always nadir at +6. But not Gobbles to be sure! I hope this helps. I'm sure an expert will be along soon to answer your ?'s betterquilterkitty said:
And one thing about giving "treats" at test time (I don't know if you do, but thought this is worth passing on): It dawned on me recently that is not a good idea; and an expert told me she does not "treat for tests"--scritches are better, because if you run into a very low number situation, and you are stalling--you can't give treats with the testing...AND also, with low numbers, if you are feeding to get numbers up, you wouldn't want to treat after each test during these low moments because their belly might get full too soon and you may need room in that little belly for subsequent little meals to brings numbers up.....so therefore I would think a cat gets confused if "sometimes you treat" and "sometimes you can't treat".....quilterkitty
Member Since 2013
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401 +6=42/38 +6.20=53 +7=70 +9=66 +10=122
Okay, I can remove food and not feed two hours before shooting--that's a good suggestion; thanks, Kat! I haven't been very strict with food since switching both of my cats to a LC canned-only diet, but it's been long enough now that I can be a little more disciplined with the meal and snack times. My ultimate goal is remission, so anything that helps get us there is doable. I'm not up two hours before the morning shot, but I'm pretty sure that food from last night is long gone by then.
Like you, I don't give treats after testing, mostly because I just instinctively want to cuddle and love on Star and tell him how brave he is and how much I adore him. He's always been the cat that likes to be petted, unlike Maggie, who leaps away and yells "No touchie!!" in cat lingo. The treats I use mostly to entice him to eat if I'm serving a food he doesn't go ga-ga over. Priming the pump, as it were. :lol:
Okay, I can remove food and not feed two hours before shooting--that's a good suggestion; thanks, Kat! I haven't been very strict with food since switching both of my cats to a LC canned-only diet, but it's been long enough now that I can be a little more disciplined with the meal and snack times. My ultimate goal is remission, so anything that helps get us there is doable.
I'm not up two hours before the morning shot, but I'm pretty sure that food from last night is long gone by then.Like you, I don't give treats after testing, mostly because I just instinctively want to cuddle and love on Star and tell him how brave he is and how much I adore him. He's always been the cat that likes to be petted, unlike Maggie, who leaps away and yells "No touchie!!" in cat lingo. The treats I use mostly to entice him to eat if I'm serving a food he doesn't go ga-ga over. Priming the pump, as it were. :lol:
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401 +6=42/38 +6.20=53 +7=70 +9=66 +10=122
Phyllis
It's fine if you free feed but it is smart to pull up food two hours before shot time so you don't shoot a food influenced number.
The reason many/most of us do not feed past nadir (unless kitty's BG is low) is because it slows down the action of the insulin. Think of it like a car coming up to an intersection. If you race towards the stop sign (next PS) but slam on the brakes (feeding after nadir), then the car (insulin) comes to a screeching halt. But if you just take your foot off the brake (not feeding after nadir), then you glide into the stop sign (next PS) and the car (insulin) keeps gradually moving forward and comes to a slow stop.
Phyllis
It's fine if you free feed but it is smart to pull up food two hours before shot time so you don't shoot a food influenced number.
The reason many/most of us do not feed past nadir (unless kitty's BG is low) is because it slows down the action of the insulin. Think of it like a car coming up to an intersection. If you race towards the stop sign (next PS) but slam on the brakes (feeding after nadir), then the car (insulin) comes to a screeching halt. But if you just take your foot off the brake (not feeding after nadir), then you glide into the stop sign (next PS) and the car (insulin) keeps gradually moving forward and comes to a slow stop.
TheBowHuntress
Member Since 2012
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401 +6=42/38 +6.20=53 +7=70 +9=66 +10=122
OMGee...I never knew that, Marje! One of my fears is that he'll go low at night and may need something to eat and be hungry. But I can at least do this in the AM cycle...if only I knew when his nadir is...do you base this on a generic +6 nadir (that is, do you pull food at 6 hours past shot time)???Marje and Gracie said:
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401 +6=42/38 ... +9=66 +10=122 PMPS=143
It's hard to tell when Star's nadir is given when you've been testing. Not all cats have their nadir between +5 an +7. Gabby's typical nadir is at +3 or +4 -- except when it's not. She's had a nadir as early as +2 and as late as +7. The only way you'll be able to get a clearer sense of where Star's nadir falls is to get more tests.
FWIW, I use a vet tech as my pet sitter. There may be someone at your vet's office that does pet sitting on the side. How much I drop Gabby's dose has varied with what her dose is. I reduce usually between 1/3 to half of her dose since my pet sitter comes by only twice a day.
It's hard to tell when Star's nadir is given when you've been testing. Not all cats have their nadir between +5 an +7. Gabby's typical nadir is at +3 or +4 -- except when it's not. She's had a nadir as early as +2 and as late as +7. The only way you'll be able to get a clearer sense of where Star's nadir falls is to get more tests.
FWIW, I use a vet tech as my pet sitter. There may be someone at your vet's office that does pet sitting on the side. How much I drop Gabby's dose has varied with what her dose is. I reduce usually between 1/3 to half of her dose since my pet sitter comes by only twice a day.
quilterkitty
Member Since 2013
Re: 3/22 Star AMPS=401 +6=42/38 ... +10=122 PMPS=143 +2=275
I'm sure I can get a vet tech to feed the cats and dose Star. Just need to set that up. And I'll re-ask the question closer to travel time. A lot can change in two weeks, I've learned.
To be sure I understand: even if I test every two hours on a given day, whatever the nadir is for that day is not guaranteed to be the nadir every day. So to me the logical thing to do is feed on a schedule, test on a schedule, and keep up with the data on the spreadsheet, making adjustments to Star's insulin dose as needed based on the numbers. Even if this plan isn't ideal or even optimal, it is workable, and I have to believe Star will improve over time. He already has. Consistency on my part is the only thing in my control, it would appear. cat_pet_icon
I'm sure I can get a vet tech to feed the cats and dose Star. Just need to set that up. And I'll re-ask the question closer to travel time. A lot can change in two weeks, I've learned.
To be sure I understand: even if I test every two hours on a given day, whatever the nadir is for that day is not guaranteed to be the nadir every day. So to me the logical thing to do is feed on a schedule, test on a schedule, and keep up with the data on the spreadsheet, making adjustments to Star's insulin dose as needed based on the numbers. Even if this plan isn't ideal or even optimal, it is workable, and I have to believe Star will improve over time. He already has. Consistency on my part is the only thing in my control, it would appear. cat_pet_icon
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