? 3/10 Belle, AMPS 284, PMPS 217 (AT2)

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Marje,

Hi, yes, Belle is being hospitalize now (while it arrived there at 2pm, they didn't get him on IV until 6pm)
I will cook some egg (white) and bring it to him later tonite (he has Dave's restricted diet pork which is low in phos)
While i was there, i hv been trying to get him to eat, but i don't know if they will do that when i m not there.
The vet did mention about phosphorous binder, but she said something about getting him to eat first b4 the phos binder.

I really can't afford the ultra sound, hosptialization itself is already out of my budget.



Marje and Gracie said:
I have to agree 100% with your vet. He does need to be in the hospital on IV fluids. That’s the only way you can get that creatinine down and, even then, it’s not 100% guaranteed. Subq fluids are not going to do it. I know this from experience.

But what worries me even more is that high phosphorus. That can cause him to have mouth and tummy ulcers. That and the calcium multiplied together puts him at high risk for tissue calcification. The P has to come down. If he isn’t eating, that will make it come down to a certain degree but that’s not the situation we want (him not eating). Adding cooked egg whites to his food might help but often when the P gets this high, it’s tough to get them to eat the renal diets which are really, really low in P and what he needs. Anything you do get in him should have the correct amount of phosphorus binder in it (as prescribed by the vet). In my experience, aluminum hydroxide is the best one but, again, the vet needs to work with you on how much to put in his food. It only works by breaking down the P in the food so it’s not something you give him orally.

Truly....the best chance for him is to be in the hospital on IV fluids. While he’s there, I’d have them ultrasound his kidneys and see if he has any infection. Kidney infections can really cause the creatinine to jump but not the P level.

I’m so sorry, Helena. :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
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icesnow said:
Marje,

Hi, yes, Belle is being hospitalize now (while it arrived there at 2pm, they didn't get him on IV until 6pm)
I will cook some egg (white) and bring it to him later tonite (he has Dave's restricted diet pork which is low in phos)
While i was there, i hv been trying to get him to eat, but i don't know if they will do that when i m not there.
The vet did mention about phosphorous binder, but she said something about getting him to eat first b4 the phos binder.

I really can't afford the ultra sound, hosptialization itself is already out of my budget.
Click to expand...
He doesn’t have to eat before the binder. If he’s not eating, you can’t give binder because it has to go into the food. And on giving him egg whites, it won’t bring the P down unless he’s eating. I didn’t explain it very well before.

Let’s say you are feeding a food that is 200 mgP/100 kcal and the egg white (I’m making this part up because I don’t member how much P is in an egg white but it’s low) is 20 mg P/100 kcal. If you replaced 1/4 of the higher P food with egg white, it would decrease the total amount of P he is getting since the egg is so low in P. Does that make sense?

I’m so glad he’s getting IV fluids. It’s worth a try. I did this with one of my CKD cats (her P was not high) and it really dropped her creatinine. But, there is a tipping point with CKD and for some cats, once they are past it, nothing helps. I’m hopeful Belle is one of the lucky ones.

Hugs and prayers.
 
I do have feeding syringe at home from previous crisis (of other pets)
This morning, I thought of how i feed him pills (with pill pocket), which I throw it in this mouth aiming this throat, he is used to it And i tried to roll the food in small balls and do the same, and it worked.
But now he's hosptialized, i can't control how's he's being feed.
The vet did mention about phosphorous binder, but she said something about getting him to eat first b4 the phos binder.

i dont have any anti-nausea meds (Cerenia nor Ondansteron)?



LizzieInTexas said:
Phosphorus level is way too high! wow! Are you using any type of phos binder? Bun and Creat are high but those you can work on. That phos level will make him feel yucky too.

You should be able to get a feeding syringe from the vets (like these: https://smile.amazon.com/dp/B00KIBYN4A/?tag=felinediabetesfdmb-20)

Do you have any anti-nausea meds (Cerenia, Ondansteron)?

Got to get her eating something.

:bighug::kiss:
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Yes, I am understand i am not replacing food with egg white, but food along with egg white

Yes, Vet said that too. Cat who will bend the corner will turn around really fast, if they don't improve significantly over the next 24-48 hrs, means it is not working out for them.

Marje and Gracie said:
He doesn’t have to eat before the binder. If he’s not eating, you can’t give binder because it has to go into the food. And on giving him egg whites, it won’t bring the P down unless he’s eating. I didn’t explain it very well before.

Let’s say you are feeding a food that is 200 mgP/100 kcal and the egg white (I’m making this part up because I don’t member how much P is in an egg white but it’s low) is 20 mg P/100 kcal. If you replaced 1/4 of the higher P food with egg white, it would decrease the total amount of P he is getting since the egg is so low in P. Does that make sense?

I’m so glad he’s getting IV fluids. It’s worth a try. I did this with one of my CKD cats (her P was not high) and it really dropped her creatinine. But, there is a tipping point with CKD and for some cats, once they are past it, nothing helps. I’m hopeful Belle is one of the lucky ones.

Hugs and prayers.
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i offered him boiled chicken breast (torn down into small pieces with water), he drank the water, and didnt eat the chicken.

what is ondansetron ?




rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
have you tried other things such as a scrambled egg, or deli meat ( no sugar ham)
some cats love fried chicken, just peel the fried skin off.

I have some ondansetron if you can just syringe feed her for now.... I could get it in the mail.
Click to expand...
 
This morning, I thought of how i feed him pills (with pill pocket), which I throw it in this mouth aiming this throat, he is used to it And i tried to roll the food in small balls and do the same, and it worked.
But now he's hosptialized, i can't control how's he's being feed.
 
THanks!! i believe i still have some left over from crisis from my other cat (2.5 yrs ago)
it is a bit sticky, but it should still do the job
i will reach out to u if the ones i hv doesn't work out

Tanya and Ducia said:
@icesnow
If not - I have extra at home and can share. I am S Ca so it'll reach you fast in the Bay area. Let me know by PM.
Hopefully SQf for a week or so will help. Sending healing vines.
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@ hospital
they "claimed" (which i highly doubt) they tested his BG @ gave his insulin @ 9pm (which is way too early anyways)
(and i brought in his insulin bottle @ 10pm)
they "said" his BG was 217 and they gave him insulin (don't know how many units)
and i found no reading my meter, they said they used their meter (which i don't know what meter that is)
 
icesnow said:
what is ondansetron ?
Click to expand...
Ondansetron is an anti-nausea med that they give to humans who are having chemo. A lot of people give it to their cats when they won't eat because of nausea. Normally, you would need to ask for a prescription from the vet and then get it filled at a human pharmacy.

Sending major healing vines to Belle. I'm glad he's at the hospital getting treatment. Please make sure they know he's been on a teeny 1/2 unit dose of insulin. Some vets only think in whole units, for some reason.

I would take something from home that has his scent on it, so he feels a little more comfortable in the strange hospital setting. I hope he gets visits from you.
Come on Belle, fight.
 
I would definitely double check on what the hospital is dosing. Mistakes get made , even at the vet's. Their meter would likely be an alpha trak .

Sending prayers and vines for a turnaround.
 
icesnow said:
@ hospital
they "claimed" (which i highly doubt) they tested his BG @ gave his insulin @ 9pm (which is way too early anyways)
(and i brought in his insulin bottle @ 10pm)
they "said" his BG was 217 and they gave him insulin (don't know how many units)
and i found no reading my meter, they said they used their meter (which i don't know what meter that is)
Click to expand...

Yes, please be on top of that, the last thing he needs is an insulin OD. We very recently had another member with a cat in critical care and they gave the cat 5 units instead of .5! You would think they would be more careful, but like Rhiannon said, mistakes are made. Another member used to come in to administer the insulin shots herself when her cat was in hospital.

Healing vines to Belle, I hope he makes a fantastic turnaround. :bighug:
 
icesnow said:
@ hospital
they "claimed" (which i highly doubt) they tested his BG @ gave his insulin @ 9pm (which is way too early anyways)
(and i brought in his insulin bottle @ 10pm)
they "said" his BG was 217 and they gave him insulin (don't know how many units)
and i found no reading my meter, they said they used their meter (which i don't know what meter that is)
Click to expand...
They all have Alpha Trak meters so I’m certain that is what they used. So that’s likely a 217 on their AT2.

It’s tough when they are in the hospital. I controlled everything I could; for instance, I drew the insulin at home, took it over and give Gracie her shots myself testing her with my own meter. I’m not suggesting that you are able to do that; I had nothing else going on. But it’s just an example. I also made sure I fed her although I did have to rely on them somewhat for some of her meals since she got fed 8 times a day.
 


Yes, i prepared a list this morning to collect the info, they do use Alpha track 2 as expected. although i gave them my meter and asked them to use my meter . but there are so many different ppl working on him, n it seems like they don't communicate very well with each other. i should have written everything down, which i thought they written down during the in-take process.
they also fed him the wrong food last night too.

i asked if i could test is BG and give the shots myself, but they won't let me do it (cos they charge it for everytime they do it)
they even gave his insulin 3 hrs early last night (cos they know i want to come in to give him his shot)


Marje and Gracie said:
They all have Alpha Trak meters so I’m certain that is what they used. So that’s likely a 217 on their AT2.

It’s tough when they are in the hospital. I controlled everything I could; for instance, I drew the insulin at home, took it over and give Gracie her shots myself testing her with my own meter. I’m not suggesting that you are able to do that; I had nothing else going on. But it’s just an example. I also made sure I fed her although I did have to rely on them somewhat for some of her meals since she got fed 8 times a day.
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I remember the vet did mention anti-nausea med , but unsure if it was Ondansetron
but Belle would love to get it, we will pay you back
our address is:
2538 West 133 Avenue
San Leandro, CA 94577

rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
have you tried other things such as a scrambled egg, or deli meat ( no sugar ham)
some cats love fried chicken, just peel the fried skin off.

I have some ondansetron if you can just syringe feed her for now.... I could get it in the mail.
Click to expand...

Dyana said:
Ondansetron is an anti-nausea med that they give to humans who are having chemo. A lot of people give it to their cats when they won't eat because of nausea. Normally, you would need to ask for a prescription from the vet and then get it filled at a human pharmacy.

Sending major healing vines to Belle. I'm glad he's at the hospital getting treatment. Please make sure they know he's been on a teeny 1/2 unit dose of insulin. Some vets only think in whole units, for some reason.

I would take something from home that has his scent on it, so he feels a little more comfortable in the strange hospital setting. I hope he gets visits from you.
Come on Belle, fight.
Click to expand...
 
Okay, tomorrow, I will send you some Cerenia (and I'll see if I have any Ondansetron (but it will be over 2 years old)), and some cans of Iams MaxCal, and some feeding syringes.
Did you go visit him today? I'm sure he would appreciate it.
 
thanks ! let me know your paypal ID and amount, i will pay u back

with the messages/comments these couple days, i got lost of who was saying about which of the anti-nausea med

Yes, i already visited him earlier today, waited in the lobby for almost an hour . then they unhook him from IV and put him in a room, so the visit was very brief, cos i dont want him to be off IV for too long. i was with him for about 5 minutes and feed him some boiled chicken breast (they were suppose to bring his other food, but it took forever)


Dyana said:
Okay, tomorrow, I will send you some Cerenia (and I'll see if I have any Ondansetron (but it will be over 2 years old)), and some cans of Iams MaxCal, and some feeding syringes.
Did you go visit him today? I'm sure he would appreciate it.
Click to expand...
 
thanks ! what is the difference between Cerenia and ondansetron ?
i do recall the name Cerenia, i believe one of my cats had it b4

Belle's last name is Ng
pls let me know ur Paypal ID and amount

rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
I can send you ondansetron ....
it's a prescription for me , they gave it to me after food poisoning in Feb. The dosage is the same.
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Dyana said:
Okay, tomorrow, I will send you some Cerenia (and I'll see if I have any Ondansetron (but it will be over 2 years old)), and some cans of Iams MaxCal, and some feeding syringes.
Did you go visit him today? I'm sure he would appreciate it.
Click to expand...
 
ondansetron is purely for nausea, works very well, it was created for cancer patients who can't eat.

cerenia also addresses nausea but differently than ondansetron.
It is okay to give both together..... that way you will hopefully eliminate Belle's nausea and she can eat.
 
Yes, that's my last name. My name is Helena (i don't remember if it's on the signature along with the other info)
some of the other members know my name. But i guess we never met on the forum here.
Official Hi to you and Shadow from me and Belle !!


rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
I'll add Belle NG to the address above....
I hope that's your last name.....

the post office may get confused....
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I found the Helena..... down in the fine print....:cool:

I've posted support off and on the last year . I've been away from home a lot since the snow season started. We ski.
 
i used to ski quite a few times each winter (resorts are like 3.5-4 hrs away)

but since Belle became diabetic, i hvn't gone skiing at all


rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
I found the Helena..... down in the fine print....:cool:

I've posted support off and on the last year . I've been away from home a lot since the snow season started. We ski.
Click to expand...
 
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