2/7 Tabitha PMPS 126 +2 98 +4 75 +6 90

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+4 101; she didn't eat between the tests; did to go out and run a few errands-is there a better time frame to go (what addition test might be needed)?
 
I was going to base it on when the tests need to be made. If a +6 is important then leave after that be bacycle.or leave after +8 then start up on next cycle.
 
if it's going to make you feel more comfortable, then yes, get the +6 and as long as she's surfing (which I feel she probably will be), take off...you can always leave a little low carb food down in case she decides she needs a snack
 
+6 89; didn't eat again; leaving food and will run my errands now

Will we get to the point when I might gave to go to one injection a day since we can't reduce any more?Could it be that that she is generating her own insulin and that could be what caused the 151 jump (along with eating 4% FF)?
 
No...you don't give once/day, but there is a smaller dose than you're giving now....believe it or not!!

What we'll want is for her to either earn the reduction, or stay in normal numbers on the .1 unit dose for a week (that's 50-120)

I think the 151 was just a food spike...even low carb food causes food spikes

I have errands too so I'll catch you later!
 
Ok she has to be @ 50-120 for a week @.10
1) there was the one cycle where I loaded a dud
2) yesterday I left a little bit more food out while I went to work
3) this morning she had in increase because she ate
Earn a reduction by going below 50
1) if I'm at work I can't test like I have to catch them
2) she could have earned that reduction at night but I was asleep and it happened between the 2 hour testing times

Do I reduce the amount I feed her and test more often, staying home from work and staying up at night like I was? I can only imagine what will happen when then insulin starts to work against Tabitha's body.

Please give me data to explain how this works at this last stage. I also need to keep in mind ECID.

Tabitha and I have worked real hard on this thanks to all of your help, experience and support.
 
When Tabitha's body is ready, you'll really know it

Will look for some really good spreadsheets for OTJ kitties for you to look at, but here's one to "encourage" you that you can do it! If Brian and Tyler can, so can you and Tabitha!

Brian worked 2 jobs and was a full time college student through much of Tyler's journey....As you can see, when he came to us, he was shooting insane amounts of insulin (he found the FDMB on 3/22/14)

Occasionally he held the dose a little longer than absolutely necessary, but he worked his way down to .1...and when Tyler had been in normal numbers every day for 14 cycles (I think he may have gone a little longer than 14) he started his OTJ trial...and he passed with flying colors!
 
Here's Norman's spreadsheet too. He's currently doing his OTJ trial and looking good!! If you look below the red line (when she started using a human meter) you'll see how Norman stayed in normal numbers on .5...then on .25....then on .1....then started his trial

She held her doses a little longer than 7 days (14 cycles) too, but if Tabitha can stay in those normal number pretty much continuously for 7 days on a dose, she'll "earn" a reduction down to the next lowest dose.

We don't "assume" they would have dropped below 50 ....we actually want to catch it!! There's good reason why we're so strict...Getting a cat OTJ is a real accomplishment, and we want them to STAY OTJ! It doesn't help to rush it because without a good strong remission, they're likely to just come back out, and getting a 2nd remission is really rare, so we want the first one to "Stick!"
 
PMPS It looks like I will be holding back on her food tonight and test more often. Not surecwahe else to do.

I can not open Brain & Tyler SS (tells me I don't have access). It looks like his cat was on insulin for 10 months.

Norman was on for only 4 months. Starting at .50 unit doses he was on for 52 days; .25-18 days; .10-8 days. At some point they didn't check that often so can't see the fluctuations that might have taken place. (Two people available to test) Being longer on each dose allowed the insulin to clear the depot.

TABITHA. .50 dose 3 days; .25 1 day; .10 currently on day 8 Total 12 days

My concern is how am I to know that the insulin isn't working against her. I currently don't have answer for this. Where is the data from a cat that has been on insulin for 12 days like Tabitha and what was the outcome? Forget what the protocol is. As far as I'm concerned that is meaningly right now ECID. (Sorry I'm not like Brian, since he works two jobs and goes to school, he probably doesn't need his 8 hours of sleep like I do)
 
Tabitha IS doing great!! I see a trial in her future very soon!

We like to see them getting mostly greens before dropping the dose and she's still throwing quite a bit of blue, but it's up to you in the end. She's your cat.

Since on the morning of 2/4, you have the ?, and she stayed a little higher that cycle, that looks like it may have been a furshot but it's something none of us can know for sure. She did stay a little higher, so I'd say it was very possible, so she may just not be quite ready to go totally off

Do you know when she's been fed over the last week or so? If you can add that info to her spreadsheet, it can be helpful. Some people put it in the remarks, and some put an * in the cell if they've been fed in that hour.

Sometimes it can help to feed a snack at about +9...if her pancreas is kicking in, it'll help bring down the Pre-shot numbers

I'm sorry I can't give you all the answers you're looking for. Unfortunately this dance isn't a science and there are no absolute "do this and this will happen" answers.

There is a dose smaller than .1 called "a drop". It's literally one drop of insulin and there are a couple of ways of getting it. The easiest way in my opinion is to push the plunger HARD into the syringe and then insert it into the insulin and just "let go". The vacuum in the syringe will pull up a tiny bit (but it's best to do this a few times first and then squirt it into a paper towel or something to make sure you're getting about the same amount)
 
That is what I have been doing, a drop, even before the AM cycle that was all or near 130s.

During the weekday +9 feeding is not feasible if I am at work. There is no one else.
 
Sharon do you have a timed feeder? that can really be your friend if you're at work. If you don't have a timed feeder, some people freeze cat food (mix with a little water first) in ice cube trays or muffin pans.

Yes, we have had cats that are just on insulin for a couple of weeks. If Tabitha's getting too much insulin, we'll be able to tell. Her curve will become inverted, meaning that instead of going down in the middle of the 12 hr cycle, it might rise and form a little hump instead.

At this point, the 0.1u dose looks good for her. We know that the longer a kitty's pancreas gets a little insulin support, the better the chances that remission will stick. For right now, I'd keep up what you're doing and figure out how to have food available for her during the day - either a feeder or frozen food left to thaw.

Everything looks on track - just hang in there.
 
At the phase you're in, I wouldn't worry so much about that. It matters most if you get a preshot number that's fairly low, like the 50's - then you wouldn't know if it would've been even lower if she hadn't eaten just before. When a kitty is close to OTJ, like Tabitha is, if the preshot number is the highest we often suggest giving one teaspoon of food at +9 or +10 in order to stimulate the pancreas to produce a little insulin and pull down the ps. I think you're ok letting her graze at this point. Just know if you get a low preshot that you have to consider that it might be food-influenced.
 
When the #s are low you give them little food to bring it up to a safer level (& surf). But then you give them food to bring it down (for ps)? Explain what is the difference?
 
when a cat with a working pancreas eats, the pancreas is stimulated to put out a little insulin and we can see the BGs come down about 3-4 hrs later.

giving food with low numbers will bring up the blood sugar.

i can see why that's confusing, but both of those things are true. i'm not sure how to explain the two, but i've seen it happen a zillion times.
 
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