2/6 Java AMPS 141 gave 1u? newbie question

[Steph and Java(GA)]

yesterdays post

Ok so we are on day three. AMPS this am was 141. I had a little trouble doing BG and ended up with an error the first time so I retook. I wasn't sure what to do my vet(through the tech) told me if it was consistently between 75-150 we needed to reexamine the dose. If it was below 75, call. Well honestlyhe wasn't even going to have me test at all so I am glad I found you all or I never would have known. we were 264 last night. Could this be the effect of the shed getting full?


ETA: +3 we are at 248.

 

[mybuddybinks]

Re: 2/6 Java AMPS 141 gave 1u

giving your post a bump so wiser folks can provide input...

if you don't get a response, you might want to add 'question' to your subject line.

Congrats on testing...makes a world of difference, doesnt it?

celi & binks

 

[Steph and Java(GA)]

Re: 2/6 Java AMPS 141 gave 1u

giving your post a bump so wiser folks can provide input...

if you don't get a response, you might want to add 'question' to your subject line.

Congrats on testing...makes a world of difference, doesnt it?

celi & binks

yes, thanks. I can't imagine not knowing what is going on. I can understand my vet not necessarily pushing home testing but I think if you are willing to do it they should support it.

 

[Michelle and Mannie (GA)]

Morning! And welcome to Lantus Land - nice to see a newbie. You're doing great - it does take a little time to get the testing thing down, for you, and for Java. Kudos to you for testing! I too am glad that you found this place - so that you did know. My vet never even mentioned home testing, we went a year and half without it - I simply knew no better. well anyways, a long story.....

I'd stay with the dose for now - it's hard to evaluate what's going on without more data, and that will come when you are more confident with testing and Java is more used to it. Hopefully one of the experts will be along shortly to answer your question, and they can guide you better than I.

Welcome abroad, and congrats on day 3.

 

[Steph and Java(GA)]

Morning! And welcome to Lantus Land - nice to see a newbie. You're doing great - it does take a little time to get the testing thing down, for you, and for Java. Kudos to you for testing! I too am glad that you found this place - so that you did know. My vet never even mentioned home testing, we went a year and half without it - I simply knew no better. well anyways, a long story.....

I'd stay with the dose for now - it's hard to evaluate what's going on without more data, and that will come when you are more confident with testing and Java is more used to it. Hopefully one of the experts will be along shortly to answer your question, and they can guide you better than I.

Welcome abroad, and congrats on day 3.

Thanks Michelle. Thats what I thought, I am going to call my vet tomorrow so I think we will just stay the course. He is eating really well so that helps. I just got kind of freaked about dropping so low.

 

[Michelle and Mannie (GA)]

oh I know on the freaked part - i remember when i got my first low green - panicville and we had just started to home test. It will get better. The more you can test, the better your data. When you do have a low number that you question or makes you nervous you can alwasy post here, and hopefully someone can help you. You can always get a +2 after the shot which will help you, and any advisers, know what to do.

And yes - food is your friend. I'm glad java is a good eater - it really helps. My Mannie is too.

 

[Sienne and Gabby (GA)]

Very nice job shooting this morning -- and testing. It would be great if you can get a +6 and a +9 test this cycle.

For the first several days, you want to try to test every 3 hours. This is particularly important given you are seeing a blue pre-shot. Also, you need to get at least a before bed spot check every night. Many cats have lower numbers during the PM cycle. If you don't get at least one test in, not only will you be missing half of your data, you may miss a dose reduction. In fact, given the blue pre-shot this morning, it's very likely that Java's numbers came down during the night.

Also, unless numbers drop below 50, you will be holding this dose for 5 - 7 days. This will allow the shed to fill.

Many vets take a very off hand approach to home testing. Some actually will actively discourage it and tell people they can't get accurate readings using a human glucometer, the cat will get stressed out, etc. I think there are several issues at play. If you test at home, there is no need to bring your cat to the vet for a curve or for fructosamine levels. So, if you test at home, you cost the vet money because you've got the data that allows you to make dose decisions and you don't need the vet for this. Because of liability issues, vets will tell people to not shoot if BG is below 200. Once we have the data, we shoot much lower than that. You'll also be able to manage a curve with food. Being able to get your cat into normal BG ranges maximizes your chance of Java going into remission or being tightly regulated. Most vets don't have the track record we have of doing this. Vets have to deal with so many other issues that it would be impossible for them to be experts at everything related to your cat's health and it's even more complex if it's not a feline specialty practice. All we deal with is diabetes.

 

[Steph and Java(GA)]

Very nice job shooting this morning -- and testing. It would be great if you can get a +6 and a +9 test this cycle.

For the first several days, you want to try to test every 3 hours. This is particularly important given you are seeing a blue pre-shot. Also, you need to get at least a before bed spot check every night. Many cats have lower numbers during the PM cycle. If you don't get at least one test in, not only will you be missing half of your data, you may miss a dose reduction. In fact, given the blue pre-shot this morning, it's very likely that Java's numbers came down during the night.

Also, unless numbers drop below 50, you will be holding this dose for 5 - 7 days. This will allow the shed to fill.

Many vets take a very off hand approach to home testing. Some actually will actively discourage it and tell people they can't get accurate readings using a human glucometer, the cat will get stressed out, etc. I think there are several issues at play. If you test at home, there is no need to bring your cat to the vet for a curve or for fructosamine levels. So, if you test at home, you cost the vet money because you've got the data that allows you to make dose decisions and you don't need the vet for this. Because of liability issues, vets will tell people to not shoot if BG is below 200. Once we have the data, we shoot much lower than that. You'll also be able to manage a curve with food. Being able to get your cat into normal BG ranges maximizes your chance of Java going into remission or being tightly regulated. Most vets don't have the track record we have of doing this. Vets have to deal with so many other issues that it would be impossible for them to be experts at everything related to your cat's health and it's even more complex if it's not a feline specialty practice. All we deal with is diabetes.

Thanks the timing and the way he eats is kind of throwing me. I tried to meal feed and that went over like a lead balloon. He grazes all day but he def. gets a good sized meal over the course of the day. what do you consider bedtime? I am kind of an insomniac but I can check it anytime. Sometimes we don't go to bed until 1 or 2 am.

 

[Kathy and Kitty]

Dropping by to say happy day 3, and you're doing great!

We measure bedtime the same way we measure BG time -- in + hours. It's highly recommended to get at least a +2 after the PM shot, and later if your sleep schedule (or alarm clock) allows.

As for feeding, we free-feed Kitty. Before he went into remission, we fed a snack at +2 (Early Snacks Rule!). It can help create a nice smooth surf, because it's timed for when Lantus generally kicks in, more or less(ECID = Every Cat Is Different). Many people also find that a snack at +8 or +9 (if you're awake) helps manage cycles.

It's very important to know where the night cycle is going, because for some reason, a lot of cats get "action" at night. You want to know that Java is at a safe BG before you go to bed -- especially when you're just beginning to collect data, but really always.

I want to chime in to agree with Sienne. I've had vets tell me that they would just stop insulin if the cat is consistently below 120. Oh, but by the way, those cats frequently go back on insulin! Duh. THe more time you give Java's pancreas to heal, the better the long-term picture will be.

 

[Steph and Java(GA)]

Dropping by to say happy day 3, and you're doing great!

We measure bedtime the same way we measure BG time -- in + hours. It's highly recommended to get at least a +2 after the PM shot, and later if your sleep schedule (or alarm clock) allows.

As for feeding, we free-feed Kitty. Before he went into remission, we fed a snack at +2 (Early Snacks Rule!). It can help create a nice smooth surf, because it's timed for when Lantus generally kicks in, more or less(ECID = Every Cat Is Different). Many people also find that a snack at +8 or +9 (if you're awake) helps manage cycles.

It's very important to know where the night cycle is going, because for some reason, a lot of cats get "action" at night. You want to know that Java is at a safe BG before you go to bed -- especially when you're just beginning to collect data, but really always.

I want to chime in to agree with Sienne. I've had vets tell me that they would just stop insulin if the cat is consistently below 120. Oh, but by the way, those cats frequently go back on insulin! Duh. THe more time you give Java's pancreas to heal, the better the long-term picture will be.

Thanks Kathy, I will definitely do that. I am up almost all night so it won't be a problem. I guess I am just trying to let his little ears get used to all the pokes, I still feel so guilty. But i know it is for his own good, just doesn't feel that way when he lets out a little yelp!

 

[Kathy and Kitty]

Steph, are you freestyling, or using a lancet pen?

Try getting some neosporin pain relief, if you haven't already. We use a dot on the ear after we test, and that seems to help prevent too much soreness. You can also try to move the test site up or down the ear a smidge.

 

[Kathy and Kitty]

And don't forget treats. They have a wonderful way of turning yelps into purrs. :mrgreen:

 

[Steph and Java(GA)]

Thanks today went better but I will start using neosporin. I have been giving many full body massages and I think I am forgiven. He loves the freezedried chicken also.

 

[Marje and Gracie]

Doing great and good shooting!!! Remember the neosporin will cause the blood to do this weird smeary kind of thing and it's hard to draw into the meter so I always make sure I use a warm cloth and wash AND dry Gracie's ears before I pokey so I get all the neosporin off. We move the test site up and down and also alternate ears.

 

[Sienne and Gabby (GA)]

For now, if you can pick up the food bowl no later than +10, that would be great. You don't want to feed within 2 hours of shot time in order to insure the test you're getting at pre-shot time isn't influenced by food. If Java is free feeding, does he clean up the bowl by +6? One thing to watch out for is that if he's still grazing during the latter part of the cycle, it may be harder for him to bring the numbers down since the insulin has less of an influence on BG as it's action is waning (i.e., during the later parts of the cycle). Getting more spot checks will tell you this.

Right now, you need to be working at collecting data. I know it seems you you may be torturing Java, but you're not. Having the data now means you'll know when you need to test aggressively and when you can back off. Knowing how the Lantus cycle typically works for your cat is essential to managing Java's diabetes.

If you're awake during the night, I'd work a spot check or two in. A before bed check is literally that -- get a test in before you turn off the lights.