2/25 Ruby (AT) PMPS 367 +3 306 +6 213 +9 176

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Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 - dosing advice?

This is your second shot of Lantus? I just looked at your ss. Hold on, I'm going to try to find your yesterday's post (your link isn't working).
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 - dosing advice?

She's on her way up from that 130, and she's now at 189. It will be another 2 hours or so before the new Lantus you are about to inject takes affect, and you will be feeding her after you shoot, so yes, go ahead and shoot the 1.00 unit.
Get a +1 if you can, and at least a +2. The +2 really helps us to see where she is going with this cycle.

Here's your condo from yesterday: http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=64552

Oh, and Good Morning :-D
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 - dosing advice?

Sorry about that. The link should work now.

Yes, second shot of Lantus. I've shot PZI into lower numbers but not a full unit, only .5. With the path she took last night, I'm nervous about a whole unit into 189 even though I know she'll spike with food.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 - dosing advice?

Good morning!




Wow...how do you all handle the lack of sleep with the TR? I have insomnia as it is, but last night was a doozy.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 - dosing advice?

I sleep every chance I get. I went to sleep early last night because I could. I'm still making up for lack of sleep two nights ago. I also normally sleep in on the weekends, but decided to put on the coffee and log on this morning. Hopefully, I'll get a nap in later. I had to learn to sleep in and take naps (not something normal for me).
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 - dosing advice?

Ok, I'll go with the 1 unit and report back in an hour.

Just in case, for later, how low can she go before I start freaking out?
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 - dosing advice?

If the +2 is lower than the AMPS, then you might be going to have an active cycle. Usually Lantus takes about 5 to 7 days to build up a shed, so you might not see much action yet, since this is only your second shot of it.
You'll be fine. We are all here with you, to help you. I promise. :YMHUG:
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 - dosing advice?

Thank you. I'm sure I'm not the first one to come along and panic, but I do really really appreciate all of the time you all spend with those of us who do. I can't imagine flying blind and alone thru this madness.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 - dosing advice?

Most beans, who don't have this forum, and don't even home test, so they are really blind.
You have come to the best place to help you and Ruby.

You have all your supplies I assume (several cans of high carb cat food, a good supply of test strips, karo or honey, hypo instructions printed out), I am not saying anything will happen, but that is the "emergency kit" we all keep on hand.
I keep all my stuff together on a shelf in my pantry with the instructions lightly taped the inside of the door.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 - dosing advice?

As soon as I got the diagnosis, before she was even home from the vet (she stayed for a few days to get her re-hydrated and eating again) I went online and started searching for info. We brought her home on the 12/23 and I started home testing on 12/28 after some conflicting advice from our regular vet and the vet at the 24 clinic she was at the last night. (our regular vet was closing for the holiday and wanted to her to stay on fluids so they us transfer her. I reallly don't like the vets at the 24 hour place)

I've got FF Gravy Lover's, Karo, 150 test strips, a bunch of lancets, Rapid Glucose Spray and the instructions all on hand. We did have one night awhile back when she dipped down to the 40s so I do have a bit of an idea on what its like. At least I'm better prepared and won't have to send the husband out at 11:00 PM to get more food and strips. :smile:
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 - dosing advice?

Dyana gave you great advice & is very knowledgeable and gave you good advice. I am not a dosing expert & never comfortable giving dosing advice, and rarely do, I totally agree w/Dyana's advice this morning.

I looked at Ruby's SS and good for you for getting such good data overnight! Try to get some more mid-cycle data today, especially since Ruby is so new to Lantus.

I have no experience with anything but Lantus so don't know how PZI works but one important thing to remember is that with Lantus we shoot off nadir, not preshot, #s. Ruby hasn't been on Lantus long enough yet for you to know when that is, so as much mid-cycle data as you can get is very helpful right now. Most kitties will nadir (typical lowest point in the cycle) around +6, but ECID.

We're here for you. You did great this morning to ask. Welcome to the best place in the universe (you never wanted to be).
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189

Even after being on PZI for 2 months I don't know when her nadir is. I've seen it anywhere from +4 to +11. Ruby loves to defy expectations. She's kind of rotten that way. :smile:
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189

Amy & Ruby said:
Even after being on PZI for 2 months I don't know when her nadir is. I've seen it anywhere from +4 to +11. Ruby loves to defy expectations. She's kind of rotten that way.
Click to expand...
I don't know that I'd say that she's "rotten." She's a cat! That's their job.

FWIW, the nadir can move. It's not a fixed point. It may be that Ruby tends to have a later nadir -- somewhere past the middle of the cycle. Some cats have very late nadirs and others, not so much. Also, given that the duration of Lantus is different than PZI, you won't know where her Lantus nadir is until Ruby has spent more time on Lantus.

I know we were dumping a ton of information on you the last couple of days. I believe Jill mentioned that some cats will have more of a response than others to a switch in insulin. It looks like Ruby did have an initial response to Lantus. In many cases, this diminishes as your cat's body adjusts to the different insulin. Hopefully, it's a good indication that Ruby will like Lantus.

We usually suggest that if you are shooting your lowest number to date, that you get a +1 and +2 test. The +1 should reflect a food spike; the +2 should be approximately the same as your pre-shot value. If not, then it may be an active cycle.

I'm not sure which directions regarding low numbers you have. The information we rely on is in the Shooting & Handling Low Numbers sticky.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 +1 274

I take it an "active cycle" means she'll keep me on my toes?

Her +1 is 274, which is a pretty average food spike for her.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189 +1 274

That's why shooting for the pre-shot didn't make sense to me with the PZI. I knew she was going to jump pretty high within an hour so it seemed like I wouldn't have a good chance to get ahead of it.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby AMPS 189

Good morning Amy! Nice to see some blue on Ruby's ss overnight, and a nice PS this morning.

Regarding the link to yesterday's condo.....to make it active, you need to click on the URL button above the text box, then paste the link between the [/rul]. If that doesn't make sense...e road today, I'll peek in as often as I can.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274

You made sense! I fixed it. I got two blocks of about 90 minute each of sleep last night so I'm a tad foggy today. I'm better now than I was at 6:00 though. I got a good batch of coffee in me.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203

At +2 she's at 203 which is pretty close to her AMPS of 189.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125

Alrighty... at +3 she's at 125.

Is this going to be an active cycle or is it safe to catch a quick nap?
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125

you've got a start to an "ideal" lantus curve - we look at the +2 being about the same as the preshot.

but just because she's new to Lantus and we don't really know how fast she drops or what her patterns are going to be, i'd probably test again at +3.5.

and regarding the sleep - promise it isn't always like this. none of us stay up all night every night. as soon as we can decipher some patterns on her then it will (hopefully) become clear what she is most likely to do next. for now, i'd get another test 30 minutes from the last one and post again. some cats nadir as early as +2 or +3.

all is looking great this morning! thanks for putting the AT in your header - it really does help.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125

Sounds good. I'll test her again in 20 minutes or so.

She's still drinking a lot of water today but otherwise she's looking really good. She spent about 20 minutes chasing a packing peanut around the living room (no worries, I kept an eye on her so she didn't try to eat it). Now she's catching a snooze.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125 +3.5 96

+3.5 96

Do I need to break out my running shoes?
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125 +3.5 96

heehee no, but that's a 66 on a human meter - for now, test again in 30 more minutes. you're waiting til she gets below 50, if she does.

if you see a number under 50, it's not freak-worthy! just open a can of high carb, pull out about 1 teaspoon of the gravy and give it to her. then post. (although if you freak it's ok too! easier for me to say it than do it!) :lol:

has she had food since her preshot breakfast? do you have a "regular" feeding plan you're going with?
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125 +3.5 96

50 on my Alpha or on a human meter?

There is probably 1 tablespoon of breakfast left her bowl. That's pretty normal for her. I put out a can in the morning and in the evening. She never eats all of it at once. She usually comes back around lunchtime (or 11:00 PM-ish) for a snack. Yesterday afternoon and overnight we put the bowl up around 3:00 and she wasn't very happy about that. If you touch her bowl, in her mind, that means its time to eat again. Other than taking the bowl away, that's basically her pattern since we got her off the dry food. She only occasionally finishes an entire serving. Maybe once a week or so.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125 +3.5 96

sorry - 80 on your AT. 50 on a human meter. i'll try to keep my brain with you! :lol:
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125 +3.5 96

I was pretty sure you meant on a human one because if it was on an Alpha, that would have been crazy low on a human one.

I know its a pain for most of you to have keep track of the difference between the meters. I use it because that's what our Dr. K uses and it makes it easier for her and I to talk about the numbers and not have to keep doing the math.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125 +3.5 96

Amy --

I'd give Ruby a teaspoon of LC to encourage some surfing. I'd rather not see you put on your running shoes.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125 +3.5 96 +4

+4 80

Crazy girl! Think she'll end up doing a crazy bounce tonight or tomorrow?
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125 +3.5 96 +4

can't predict cats. they read our condos and whenever you try to predict, they do their best to make you wrong! :lol:

did you get her to eat a little bit as sienne suggested?
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125 +3.5 96 +4

That's my plan.
Should I change the subject in the original message because its getting so long or just leave it?
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +1 274 +2 203 +3 125 +3.5 96 +4

i edit out the intermediary numbers - the +1, 2, 3 or so - but people do different things. the most recent are the most important to show the current trend.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +3 125 +3.5 96 +4 80

+4.5 72

Should I crack open a can of HC and give her some gravy?
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +3 125 +3.5 96 +4 80 +4.5 72

You might want to look at Gabby's SS to see how I enter tests that aren't on the hour or multiple tests.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +3 125 +3.5 96 +4 80 +4.5 72

Exactly. We refer to this as "lather, rinse, repeat" -- test, feed, repeat.

Oh. And you'll want to reduce Ruby's dose tonight. I'd suggest dropping back to 0.75u.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +3 125 +4 80 +4.5 72 +5 92 +5.5

If you were feeding HC, it's hard to know. Based on how she spikes at +1, it could be the case.

You are handling this cycle beautifully.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +3 125 +4 80 +4.5 72 +5 92 +5.5

She ate maybe 1/2 of a tablespoon of the HC. That bowl is licked CLEAN. She just loves that stuff.

Can I wait an hour before the next test or should I stick with 30 min for a few more turns?

Thanks! I was kind of expecting it to happen at some point this weekend so I had mentally prepared myself for it. I'm glad it happened now rather than in the middle of the night, though!
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +3 125 +4 80 +4.5 72 +5 92 +5.5

You know Ruby best. If you think these numbers are reasonably stable, give her an hour between tests. If it were me, I might test and if she's in this number range, give a treat (not more food) and then re-test in another 30 min. so you know that the numbers aren't dropping again. I just don't know your cat and how she responds with low numbers and food so I'd always err on the side of caution.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +3 125 +4 80 +4.5 72 +5 92 +5.5

+6 104

In this situation, I really don't know her. Between her dipping this low only once before and the new insulin, I'm pretty much working with a blank slate.
I'll test in another 30.
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +3 125 +4 80 +4.5 72 +5.5 94 +6

Hi Amy!

Just checking in to see how your first day is going. Now this is what I call an interesting day! You are getting awesome advice and you're taking everything in stride...yay!! Great job :)
 
Re: 2/25 Ruby (AT) AMPS 189 +3 125 +4 80 +4.5 72 +5.5 94 +6

Welcome to Lantus Land. You are getting a bit of a trial by fire but it sure is nice to see such nice numbers for your fur baby. Well done!
Liz, Zener's other mom
 
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