18-year-old cat switching to ProZinc today; need advice on meters

Discussion in 'Feline Health - (Welcome & Main Forum)' started by Simon's human, Jul 13, 2021.

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  1. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Much has happened since my last posting and I have lots of questions. First, Simon's vet did another basic lab panel and fructosamine test July 8. His BG was 37 and the fructosamine was 286. We know that a trip to the vet can bring anxiety and higher BG readings so the vet had recommended Simon have a Gabapentin a couple hours ahead of testing. The test was done 4.5 hours after 1.5 U Vetsulin. He had had a "snack" 1 hour after injection. He showed no signs of having this extremely low BG. We are now giving him 1 U and today, July 13 are switching to ProZinc. I understand that it is a straight substitution so we will give him 1 U.

    We will start testing this week, as soon as I get the equipment. I have been doing some research and am befuddled. I know lots of you use Relion. But there are 4 kinds: Prime, Premier Compact, Premier Classic, etc. There are also lots of other brands. We got Simon's prescription at Costco, and they also have one. Some of the meters mention their lancets are more pain-free. I don't know what they're comparing them with, though. Some people have mentioned having to wait to get the control solution which I had never heard of before. I'm just not familiar with the ins and outs of all this.

    I think we've solved the eating issue. We start offering food about 40 minutes before the injection. He eats as much of that one choice as he wants. Then he gets the rest via syringe to make it 1/4 can (5.5 or 6 oz.) Then he has the injection 30 minutes later. Per some earlier advice, we give a "snack"- maybe 1-2 teaspoons - at 1 hour and 2 hours past and then another at 4 hours past. This seems to work. He doesn't like the same thing twice in a row.

    Since Simon was already down to just 1 Pred every 7 days, we have discontinued even that. He is still drinking and peeing a lot, so I know he is far from regulated. That low BG was a wake-up call that we really have to know what's going on with him.

    Your advice? Thanks!

    We had a long thread with 49 messages before and know I am suppose to link to it. How do I do that? I just copied my last message from my thread about "18-year-old cat diagnosed after long-time steroid use" onto here. Looks like I need to redo the signature too.


    Nancy & Simon; 18 y-o Balinese; dx 5/21; Vetsulin 6/12/21; IBD: Prednisolone 2.5 mg every 7 days/acid controller, Ashwagandha, Tylosin Tartrate once a day; LC: Merrick beef, turkey, chicken, L.I. Chicken & Turkey; FF classics; Wellness Core Chicken/Turkey/Chick Liver; Instinct Chick, L.I. Turk; more
     
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  2. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/thr...-long-time-steroids-help.248351/#post-2817758

    Previous post for continuity
    Just go to your previous post and all the way at the top above where you see the pic of the cat and tap it copy , then paste it on your new post.
    I just did it for you
    Most of us use the Relion Prime , or Relion Premier
    Get 26 or 28 gauge lancets any brand
    Cotton rounds to out behind the ear, when done testing fold it over the ear to stop the bleeding about 15- 20 seconds
    There are lancing devices but most of us just hold the lancet and poke, you can see better where you are poking
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2021
  3. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Always aim for the sweet spot warm the ears up first, you can put rice in a sock and put it in the microwave, test it on the inside of your wrist to be sure it's not to hot, like you would test a babies bottle. You can fill a pill bottle with warm water and roll it on the ears also.Just keep rubbing the ears with your fingers to warm them up
    [​IMG][​IMG]
    6. As the ears get used to bleeding and grow more capilares, it gets easier to get the amount of blood you need on the first try. If he won’t stand still, you can get the blood onto a clean finger nail and test from there.
    When you do get some blood you can try milking the ear.
    Get you finger and gently push up toward the blood , more will appear
    You will put the cotton round behind his ear in case you poke your finger, after you are done testing you will fold the cotton round over his ear to stop the bleeding , press gently for about 20 seconds until it stops
    Get 26 or 28 gauge lancets
    A lot of us use the lancets to test freehand
    I find it better to see where I'm aiming
     
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  4. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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  5. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Tagging @JanetNJ
    She is familiar with vetsulin and prozinc
    Thank you Janet
     
  6. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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  7. Red & Rover (GA)

    Red & Rover (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Some cats drop during a vet visit and especially after. My Rover was one of them.

    Glad you are getting a meter. (I cannot help you with that as I'm in Canada.) And so glad you caught that 37 — that is far too low on any of the insulins but vetsulin especially. Get at least 200 strips. Some pred induced cats go racing down the dosing scale and into remission. If this is the case, you will be going through a lot of strips (even though prozinc is a gentler insulin).

    In the future, it would be a good idea to take a reading before you leave for the vet and as soon as you come home.
     
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  8. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Thanks for the advice! I still don't know what the difference is between a Relion Prime or Premier. I'll go shopping tomorrow for all this stuff, but I guess I have to order the control situation. Thanks, Diane, for posting my previous thread for me on this new one. I read on another thread that Neosporin is no longer advised for putting on cat's ears after poking, but coconut oil is. I have no idea how Simon will react to it but I'm not looking forward to it. We give him fluids sub-Q sometimes and he doesn't even flinch. I'm the holder, my husband is the injector. Simon's ears are always pretty warm as is but will have the suggestions of ear warming ready. We would all be so happy if he did race into remission!
     
  9. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Really no difference between both Relion Meters, the prime is more money, just seems we all use the prime
    I just googled the other Relion meters some have Bluetooth, alarms , you don't need all that
    Just get the prime meter
    You really don't have to put anything on the ears after poking, only if they start to look a little beat up.
    I never used the control solution, if I remember correctly you would just use that if you got a reading that was really way off.
    Even if you wanted to order the prime test strips Walmart ships pretty fast
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2021
  10. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Tagging @JanetNJ
    @Deb & Wink
    She is familiar with vetsulin and prozinc
    Thank you Janet and Deb
    She is going to buy a meter tomorrow and start testing
    Can you please read her post
    She's switching from vetsulin to Prozinc today
     
    Last edited: Jul 13, 2021
  11. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    Glad you lowered the dose and are switching insulins. The meter will come with lancets that are most likely too thin. Make sure you get 28 gauge ones. Be patient with testing... It can be tricky to get a drop until the capillaries grow in. Don't give up.
     
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  12. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Thanks @JanetNJ
     
  13. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    We are finally ready to start testing tonight and I have questions. Which setting do you use on a lancing device (if you use one)? Seems like it could go through Simon's ear if it sticks out too much. My husband tried it on himself first to see how it works. We got a Relion Premier Compact Kit which had the device and 10 #28 lancets and 50 strips. I also bought #26 lancets and more strips and cotton rounds. So...test before main 1/4 cup feeding which is 1/2 hour before the injection? And try the inner ear? Simon doesn't like messing with his ears - shakes his head if you do - but he'll just have to deal with it. I'll try warming one first tho his ears are usually warm. He has light ears and we tried looking with a flashlight to see if we could see veins. Also ordered some control solution today but it won't arrive for several days. I know I am very tardy with starting home testing. I hope this will get easier since I know most everyone here tests a lot every day.
     
  14. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Hi Nancy
    I'll tag @JanetNJ for you about Prozinc, I see she replied back to you in this post
    In have never used the lancing device, mist if us just hold the lancet and poke
    Janet made a video of her testing her kitty
    How to test your cat's blood sugar

    thanks Janet see #13
     
    Last edited: Jul 17, 2021
  15. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    Each lancet device is different. I will say though that going through the ear really isn't a big deal. I tried using a device the first week and quickly have it up. It was too hard to aim precisely.
    Test then feed then shoot. No need to wait a while half hour.
    Anywhere on the edge.
     
  16. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    I've watched several videos. It looks like both inside and outside of the ear is used by different people? I thought I was told to wait a half hour after eating before injecting in case the cat vomited.
     
  17. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Done! Device wasn't working so husband winged it. First time got error #4 which probably was low volume rather than viscosity. Second time got plenty of blood which Simon flung around when he shook his head. Was 132. I think that's pretty good. Will now test more frequently. Wound up testing on outside of ear. Did the sock with warm rice first and then used it to poke against. I'll add the device to my signature. Still need to get Simon's photo up here.
     
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  18. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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  19. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    It was about 45 minutes before the shot. This morning it was 172 in the same time frame. I'll try to set up a spreadsheet.
     
  20. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    At 3 hours past it was 91. Making me nervous. Will test again at 6 hours? For some reason I had thought that 90 was the magic number to decrease and that's why I wasn't worried about the 132 pre-shot number last night.
     
  21. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    I'd like some help setting up Simon's spreadsheet. Thanks!
     
  22. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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  23. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    Did it go down more? If it went under 90 I'd reduce that dose by 0.25
     
  24. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Hi Janet - I started a new thread - "testing low, new to testing, worried". At 6 hours past it went to 73. At 8 hours up to 102. Testing again in a couple of minutes pre shot which should be in less than an hour. We have 1 U syringes but husband says its easy to do .5. Not sure if recommendation is .25 lower how easy that would be.
     
  25. Chris & China (GA)

    Chris & China (GA) Well-Known Member

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    I sent her a PM several hours ago telling her I'd set it up for her. Haven't gotten a reply yet
     
  26. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    That I don't understand. I did send one right away. Don't know why you didn't get it. I really do appreciate your help. I think I sent it from my phone. I will resend in a little bit. Thanks! We decided not to dose Simon tonight. His pre-shot test was 132, same as last night same time.
     
  27. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Chris, I replied to your email via my phone and copied to my computer around 5:30 p.m. But it wasn't on this, so that is probably why you didn't get it. I'm still learning, obviously! I'm sorry you didn't get it. Here is the info:
    Simon, diagnosed May 2021, Vetsulin 6/12/21, ProZinc 7/12/21, ReliOn Premier Compact, U.S.

    I will put the spreadsheet on my computer. I think it'd be impossible to see on a phone! Thanks so much for helping with this.

    Simon was at 169 at 14 hours after. He had eaten 2 hours before this test. Will test again before any shot and may decide to lower from 1 U.
     
  28. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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  29. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Simon is 192 today pre-shot. No insulin for 24 hours. Give .5 U?
     
  30. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    Sounds good. Is that less than you used to give? Go for it and try to get mid cycle tests.
     
  31. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Yes. We have been giving 1 U. But he went down to 73 yesterday. The testing has been a revelation! Will definitely keep that up.
     
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  32. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    I think half a unit is a good plan. :)
     
  33. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    63 at 3 hours past .5 u. I know it will go lower. At this point yesterday after 1 u it was 30 points higher.
     
  34. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    I’d give a bit of mc or hc food to steer that up.
     
  35. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    Going forward looks like 0.25
     
  36. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Just gave him some of his old Natural Balance Pea and Duck dry food that he hasn't had since May because too many carbs. He is a happy cat. Hope we can stay that way. I'm nervous about the next test.
     
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  37. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Tested at 4.5 hours after shot after giving a little higher carb dry food and bit of FF gravy. 86. Now go back to low carbs, I guess. I am trying to keep track of 2 threads which can be confusing.
     
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  38. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Tested at 6.5 hours after shot, 113. Had thrown up some of the dry food. I may not have access to wi-fi till Thursday since we are going camping and taking Simon, of course, with all his equipment and also fluids and a list of the limited vet clinics in the area. Many thanks to Chris for doing Simon's spreadsheet! I should be able to get email via my phone with messages. Thank you, everyone!
     
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  39. Chris & China (GA)

    Chris & China (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Good job getting your spreadsheet link in your signature too! Your meter should have a memory and if you can go back and enter at least some of your test numbers, it'll really help.

    Here's "How to use the spreadsheet" if you need it

    Have a good time on your camping trip (if I don't see you before you leave!)
     
  40. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    We’re camping and so far don’t have wi-fi for laptop so haven’t entered numbers for spreadsheet. I thought you’d be interested in what’s happening with Simon’s testing, tho. Last night, at +10.5 after .5 u, BG was 174 so didn’t shoot. This morning at +23, it was 172. Didn’t shoot. At +27 it was 145. He hadn’t eaten since breakfast. He seems to feel better, moves better and eats better without so much coaxing. We’ll keep testing. I guess I don’t need to worry about hypo if he hasn’t had insulin.
     
  41. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    We are back home. I've looked at the spreadsheet and don't see where to edit it so I can add numbers. I will spend time on this tomorrow. Simon has not had any insulin since before we left on Monday. His highest BG has been 193 which was yesterday morning before breakfast. This morning's was 189. We will test again later tonight so he has a 2-hour space with no food. As I said a couple of days ago, he seems to be feeling better. He was jumping some in the trailer as well as walking with more stability. His appetite has improved.
     
  42. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    If you're logged into Google that it was set up with, you just click on the box and type the numbers. I'm glad he seems to feel better!
     
  43. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Unfortunately he was 229 this morning so we plan to give .25. I will try to get this into the spreadsheet.
     
  44. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Spreadsheet is filled in! Testing again at 2 hours.
     
  45. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Dropped to 97 after 3 hours. Updated spreadsheet. Will keep testing. Simon's ear seems to bother him after this last test. Probably should get 28 lancets rather than 26? Should I start a new thread?
     
  46. JanetNJ

    JanetNJ Well-Known Member

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    I've always used 28 gauge. Move to a different part of the ear or the other ear.
     
  47. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    Hi just a suggestion I see you got a BG of 74 and above it you put 4.5

    You can do it this way in the +4 cell you would enter it like this 74 @+4.5 all in the same cell and then color it dark green manually, you would do the same for other ones when you want to enter 30 minutes :cat:
     
  48. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Thanks, Diane. I fixed it! Now the next thing is to figure out how to post a picture of Simon. His numbers stay mostly in the blues, and he's off Prednisolone, so maybe we're about done. Will keep testing. And Janet, bought a package of 28 and that seems to be better. Thanks!
     
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  49. Diane Tyler's Mom

    Diane Tyler's Mom Well-Known Member

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    You are welcome, good job, believe it or not I totally forgot how to post a pic of a kitty. I'll tag a few members
    One question your PMPS cells have no tests in them , and you have NS did you test Simon and forgot to enter it?

    I'll tag @Chris & China (GA)

    @JanetNJ


    @Panic
    about how to post his picture
    Maybe they can give you some advice also so you don't have to keep skipping shots
     
  50. Chris & China (GA)

    Chris & China (GA) Well-Known Member

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    upload_2021-7-24_15-28-25.png

    Go to "choose file" and find a picture in your computer's photo's that you want to use.
    upload_2021-7-24_15-30-14.png
     
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  51. Chris & China (GA)

    Chris & China (GA) Well-Known Member

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    Yes, this one's getting pretty long.
     
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  52. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Thanks, Chris, for info about posting Simon's photo. I will work on that next. And I'll start a new thread too. Simon's most recent numbers before PMPS were down to the point that I was pretty sure they would still be under 200 so didn't test again at what would be the 12 hour time. He has been on a 9:30-9:30 schedule. According to what I had read in dosing, I thought that 200 was the magic number. He is going back to the vet Monday afternoon. I don't think we will give him a gabapentin first again. It may have relied his stress but turned him into a zombie. I could test both before and after vet to get a comparison.
     
  53. Panic

    Panic Well-Known Member

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    I would drop him down to 0.10u, or barely a drop of insulin. Simon is still rising without insulin so he needs a little more help getting into a strong remission. He's on his way though!
     
  54. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    Well, i certainly messed up. I tried to get a photo of Simon - had the JPG number and everything. I honestly don't even remember who this couple is with the cute kids, but it obviously was in the photo file from when I actually used a camera to take photos. I have tried to delete it - kept clicking delete without any result - and was hoping it hadn't popped up here but it did. I had forwarded Simon's photo from phone to computer and was trying to figure out how to put it on here. It didn't seem to want to open in the designated avatar slot per Chris' directions. I am so sorry about this. There was even a message that seemed to say that this photo wasn't appropriate, and I agree. I will try to fix this one more time and then give up until tomorrow.
     
  55. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    At least i got rid of the photo of the couple with the cute kids, but still no Simon.
     
  56. Simon's human

    Simon's human Member

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    And here is Simon. I started a new thread - "18-year-old cat getting blue numbers".
     
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