15 Yr Old Bangal diagnosed with Diabetes

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simbasmama

Member Since 2013
Hi there! I am in need of some advice. Our 15 yr old bangle, Simba was diagnosed with Diabetes yesterday. His glucose was in the 400s. Vet said we need to do insulin and change his food. He has always been on wet (morning and night) and dry (open feeding) his whole life. Why they sell dry food that can contribute to diabetes is beyond me. I also have always bought him "high end" food from the pet food store...so I am lost on why he is so sick....but he is so I move on....

I do have a few questions:

1. Vet prescribed Lantus insulin. It is around $140 from King Soopers...is there any place that sells it cheaper? maybe an online company?
2. The vet also would like him to be on prescription food. Another huge expense. I read that Fancy Feast classics is good but she said it isn't and recommends the DM food. Thoughts?
3. Home testing???? So overwhelmed with all of this...what do I need to get and what is the easiest and least expensive way to do this?

Your help is greatly appreciated! I am a bit freaked out and not sure if it is even giving him a good quaility of life...of what is left.
 
Re: 15 Yr Old Bangle diagnosed with Diabetes

hi and welcome!

i'll try to address your questions as directly as i can :-)

1. i honestly don't know the answer to this one but i'm sure others will

2. fancy feast is just fine. as a matter of fact, the vet who holds the patent on the wet DM formula used to be our vet before she retired from veterinary care and she doesn't care for the quality of the ingredients in the DM but unfortunately doesn't get to control the choice of those so she has often said there are store bought varieties of wet food out there with as good or better quality ingredients. you know, my vet's office actually carries and sells Fancy Feast, EVO, and Wellness canned foods along with several raw varieties of cat food. no prescription food as far as i know at my vet's clinic.

3. testing. the most economical way to do it is to go to Walmart and get their Relion Prime meter (approx $16.50) and corresponding test strips ($9 for 50). that is their newest meter and several of us are using it now and it seems to work just fine. some people do feel it's a bit bulky or hard to get the test strip in but in all honesty, i've never had that problem with mine. If your Walmart doesn't have the Prime, they also have their slightly older meters which are the Confirm and Micro meters (approx. $9) and corresponding test strips (approx. $22 for 50) or the Ultima but I don't know the prices for that one. It's the older of the Walmart meters and although I still see it in our local walmart, I don't recall looking at the prices and such lately.

how's that? :-) any more questions, feel free to ask as that's what the board is here for. one little note just in case, this message board recently changed servers or something technical like that and there have been moments this morning where it was not working. if you find that sometime, and are on facebook, there is a facebook page for this group too. it is mainly for emergencies and advice and such is to be done here but in cases like the board being down, and you need help, you can use the facebook page. eta: fb page https://www.facebook.com/#!/groups/62167000201/
 
Re: 15 Yr Old Bangle diagnosed with Diabetes

Hello and welcome to the board!

Here are some answers to your questions

1. the $140 isnt bad - remember it lasts 6 months. (it says 1 month on the bottle but if you keep it in the fridge, and dont shake or roll it, it will last 6 months)

2. No need for prescription foods. You are looking for foods under 10% carbs. Many of us here use Fancy feast classic pates, friskies pates or Wellness grain free. the Wellness is a better quality of food but its also more expensive. (its got less by products and so on) Dont make the move to wet food unless you are testing at home as it may drop her insulin requirements.

3. Home testing is key. It will keep your kitty safe from hypos, save you money doing tests at the vet, and allow you to really see whats going on. If you live in the US you can get a Walmart Relion meter for $15 and 50 strips for $9. Or go here and see if there are any freebies . You should also test her urine for ketones.http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewforum.php?f=15

Here is more information on diabetes and home testing https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Rd6sMfsrNB41yQVEqpyjlHrJsDIbGEhbRIWR4QAwu3c/pub

Wendy
 
Re: 15 Yr Old Bangle diagnosed with Diabetes

Welcome to FDMB the best place to help you help Simba

Can't help with the Lantus my girl is a Levemir cat, but I'm sure others can.

There is nothing special about the prescription food, except the price..in fact if you look at the label the ingredients aren't all that great. Most of us feed just regular easy to find at the grocery store or pet store canned food. In fact all 14 of mine (only 2 are diabetic) eat Friskies Pate Style and on that diet my Maxwell has been in remission and off insulin for the last 2 years, and my other girl Autumn has gone from 1.5u to .25u and headed towards remission, plus not a single one of my 14 would touch the DM after the first few days. Fancy Feast Classics are fine too, just in my case I'm not opening that many 3oz cans.. :lol:

As far as testing supplies Walmart has a really nice little meter called the Relion, there are 4 styles the Prime, The Ultima, the Confirm and the Micro. I use the micro for my guy in remission and as a back up meter for my insulin dependent girl. The meter is about $16 and 50 strips are around $20. Any human meter that takes a small sample of blood and the strips fit into your budget will work great, you don't need a fancy pet only meter.

After a meter and strips to fit it, you will need lancets to poke the ear, and lancing device or you can free hand it.
Ketone strips to test his urine for ketones also with the human diabetic supplies at Walmart.
And something to back the ear like cotton balls or makeup sponges, and a little neosporin with pain relief and that is pretty much it.

Mel, Maxwell, Autumn & The Fur Gang
 
Re: 15 Yr Old Bangle diagnosed with Diabetes

Welcome, Simba's Mama! :YMHUG:

You've already gotten some good answers but I did want to add that you can also purchase the Lantus Pens instead of the vial. I believe the upfront cost is more for the pens, but they will last much longer if you use syringes instead of the cartridges. Each pen remains good until it is first used and then you get the 4-6 month expy that you see with the vial. So, with 5 pens, that's potentially a year and a half to two and a half years! Some places are even willing to sell the pens individually, so it's worth calling around.

Also, here is a food list that contains the nutritional information of most commercial cat foods. What you want to look for is anything under 10% carbs (the lower the better). Some foods are better than others, but for now, I would just worry about the carbs to start with. A lot of people here (including myself) use Friskies and Fancy Feast. Wellness and Merricks are another couple of brands that I see a lot of people use. (My cat is allergic to beef so he can only have one of the flavors of Merricks and I haven't been able to find Wellness in any of the stores around me).

simbasmama said:
I also have always bought him "high end" food from the pet food store...so I am lost on why he is so sick....but he is so I move on....
Click to expand...

Hey, I completely understand! I bought my last two cats the super-duper expensive dry Hills Prescription from the vet for around 10 years...they both died at 11 and 12 from kidney failure, which I was told is common in "older" cats. Here's a great website that explains why we're being fooled by the pet food companies (same website that provides the food list above).
 
I wanted to thank all of you so so much for your help!!! I really appreciate it very much! I do have a couple more questions:

1. How often do I home test him?
2. Should I take all the hard food away and just feed him soft?
3. How much soft food do I feed him daily?

Thank you soooo much for all of your help! :-D
 
simbasmama said:
1. How often do I home test him?
Click to expand...
You test before every shot, and about halfway between shots when possible, to see how low he is going. Testing before bedtime is good too.

simbasmama said:
2. Should I take all the hard food away and just feed him soft?
Click to expand...
If you are not on insulin, do this now, but transition so he doesn't get digestive upsets.
If you are already giving insulin, master testing first. Then you can see how much you may need to alter the insulin dose as you change the food safely.

simbasmama said:
3. How much soft food do I feed him daily?
Click to expand...
How much does he weigh and how much should he weigh? How active is he? Pop over to Cat Info to read more about safe weight management and low carb, canned or raw diets. Plus, there is a food list there you can print out and take shopping. You want canned food that is 10% calories from carbohydrates or less, plus you want a few cans of high carb foods in gravy in case he ever goes too low.
 
Thank you for your help! Doesn't the testing hurt him? Being pricked 2-3 times a day? This just sounds awful for these kitties! :( My father in law is sending me his old meter (he is diabetic himself). What is a normal range a cat's blood sugar should be at? Sorry about all the questions but my vet is out until Monday and I am trying to have all my ducks in a row when I see her for the instructions on how to give the insulin.

Thank you again!
Gina
 
Its more of an annoyance and dislike of being restrained.

You can pick up a tube of Neosporin Ointment (not cream) with pain relief, apply a dab a few minutes before testing, wipe off, then test. The ointment will help the blood bead up and help the little poke heal.

Always use a low carb treat to reward the cat for allowing the testing, even if you are unsuccessful. Associating something positive with the procedure will encourage the cat to come voluntarily to be tested. I never had to go searching for Spitzer and usually had to fend off my other cats, who wanted a treat, too.

Normal is from 40-120 in a non-diabetic cat. The level you are aiming for is no lower than 50 when on insulin.

If you use insulin, starting out, never give it below a glucose of 200. As you get LOTS more test data, that number may gradually be lowered.

A note on glucometers: the FDA allows glucometers to be sold if they will give a test value within 20% of a lab value, ie they are not perfect, just good enough.
This means that a test value of:
50 = somewhere in the range of 40-60
100 = somewhere in the range of 80-120
200 = somewhere in the range of 160-240
300 = somewhere in the range of 240-360
400 = somewhere in the range of 320-480

This won't affect your decision about what to do - high is high, low is low. It does mean that you can look to see if 2 test value ranges overlap
ex.Are 55 and 68 different? 55 +20% vs 68-20% = 66 vs 54.4. They overlap, so they may be considered the same.

If you ever get an unusual number, re-test, especially if low (below 50). Test strips can go bad, or have a faulty lot.
 
After a cat gets used to the testing- treats are a great way to encourage this- freeze dried treats or boiled chicken- the testing really isn't an annoyance. My cat got used to it within a week- and we test AT LEAST 3 times but AS MUCH AS 5-7 times, depending on if it is a school night or not. You can either use the lancet pen or free hand, depending on the cats tolerance. As I work all day my testing is done at night after I get home and through the night when I wake up.

Think of it this way- the more tests you get the better you can read the cat-
How much does eating effect him?
What is the lowest he goes on that dose of insulin?
Did he get into some forbidden food (one here likes egg noodles)?
The more data you have the better we are able to advise you on dosing or food or problems that might crop up.

This place is a wealth of information on FD and other problems- thyroid issues, UI's, ckd, p-titis, asthma, allergies- SOMEONE has had a cat with it, tried something, and knows how it reacts to an FD cat.

You can get most everything from Walmart or (using the SHOP link above) ADW that ships it to your door. You don't need express shipping- most of my regular shipping gets here in 2-3 days. Syringes, lancets, strips, meters (we have a Relion Micro and order the strips from ADW- purchase 4 boxes and get the 5th free- wally world doesn't do that :lol: ).

Insulin- if you can get a prescription for the pens that would be more economical in the long-run. Higher upfront cost but at 3ml/pen if a pen:
1) goes bad there is very little waste and you still have another to use
2) just as soon as you stick a needle in it is 'opened' and the clock ticks down. A pen, having less in it, will be viable for for the same time as a vial that has 10 ml in it (yes, you can use both well past 45 days (months and months past)) but with the vial it might become contaminated and you would have to throw out the rest of the bottle and buy another one.
3) you could drop the vial and break it, the pen is a little more sturdy
4) if you have a .5u or 1u kitty a 5 pen set will last you a LONG time.
5) if your cat goes OTJ selling an unused pen will be easier than selling a partially used vial
 
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