12/29 Sassy AMPS 162,+2 124,+4 88,+6 85, +10 77, PMPS 85

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mfrancis69

mfrancis69

Member Since 2013
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=110755

I don't think I posted the link to the past few days topic sand thread properly.
Could someone let me know if I did and give me better guidance if I didn't do it right.

It was requested of me to start a new thread.

I tested Sassy this morning and her number was a little higher than it has been for the last few days.
The question is do I give her shot? Her number this morning is 162.
She may have eaten this morning a little before the house was awake.

Her number still isn't bad but do I give the shot? If so should I reduce the dose from the 1.5?
How often should I test her after the shot if given?
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

I would re-test in 30 - 60 min. and see if her numbers are dropping. If she ate leftovers from last night, her numbers may come down. If not, you may want to try measuring a dose of 0.25u.

I think what you forgot in the link to your previous condo was to use the URL button. You have to encase the link from your browser in . This tells the computer that the information you're posting is a link that people can click on. So, copy the info from yesterday's thread from the top of your browser, click on the URL button above the text box, and paste the browser link between the brackets: browser link goes here
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

viewtopic.php?f=9&t=110755

Ok, I think I may have got it right this time, not totally sure though.

I am rapidly approaching the 1 hour mark so I will wait until then and test again, so I stay on the hour or half hour so not to get confused.

That is 10 minutes away, I will post her new number as soon as I have it.

Melissa
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

Thanks BJM, I still didn't do it right.

I am still learning, I will get there.
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

Ok, I just did another test at +1 and her number stayed exactly the same. Still at 162.

I will try giving her a .25, looking at the needle that is a hard one, but I will give that to her now and test in an hour.

Melissa
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

How do I mark my spreadsheet when I have given a shot after the AMPS time, when it has been given at the +1 stage.

If I put it in the usual unit slot after the AMPS, anyone looking at it would think the shot was given right after the AMPS instead of an hour later.

Melissa
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

It is funny, but having a cat for 13 years I have learned more about a cat and their eating habits and nutritional needs from one article (Feeding Your Cat: Know the Basics of Feline Nutrition) than I have ever known about a cat.
That is sad to say but true.

It also occurred to me, that Sassy's will sometimes eat some of the dry food that our small dog has, I have caught her many times eating out of the dog bowl, I stop her when I see it but what about when I don't see it.
I will have t make some adjustments and change the way I feed Sassy as well as the dog.

First off, feeding Sassy smaller portion more often through the day and keeping the dog food out of reach of Sassy all together. I think that may show a significant difference in her numbers.
After reading the material and reading her can of cat food that I have been feeding her, the brand and the flavor are just what she needs.

What I do find funny is that when the vet diagnosed her they were trying to get me to use both wet and dry DM food for her, being expensive I did research and also joined the forum and found that the Fancy Fest that I was giving her was fine.
They also mentioned high protein, never mentioned high carb or low carb, so I was reading labels based on protein content. I had no knowledge or guidance to water content etc.

With all that said, I do have another question "Does anyone experience a more sensitive back end near the tail region"
I will explain better, Sassy does not jump as much, she pulls herself up on things, and jumps only when necessary, this is something new.
She also gets upset with me when I pick her up, as if it is painful for me to hold her especially by her back end. Petting her is also the same, anywhere close to the chest or by the head is fine, she gets upset the closer I get to the tail region.
I addressed this with the vet over a year ago but was never given clarity of what might be causing it, or what to do to remedy it.

Any advice?
Melissa
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

Her +2 number has gone down with the .25 shot, her number is 124 now.

I will wait about two hours now and test again and see where she is.

Melissa
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

hi melissa,

the number you shot becomes the AMPS, so you put it in that column. then make a note in the notes column about what's happened. she's actually at +36 or +48 or something isn't she? You would count how many hours since the last shot and it would be helpful to have that in the notes column so if anyone's looking at it, they can see that she was only in the 160's so many days after her last shot.

the dog food could be totally responsible for her higher numbers this morning. it needs to be completely out of her reach. nom nom nom. :-D

if she gets to the point of being diet-controlled, you have to still think of her as diabetic. no high carb anything ever, unless it's to save her life. no steroids, no dry food, no sugar in meds, that kind of thing.

like you, i didn't know anything about what cats needed, really, until punkin became diabetic. kinda sorry thing! i put out bowls of dry food and my cats were fairly self-maintaining. little did i realize what they really needed. it's all one big learning adventure, isn't it!

glad to see she's come down with the shot. I'd keep a close eye on her til she passes the nadir. when the dry food clears her system she might or might not need more insulin.
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

You definitely would want to keep the high carb kibble, and whatever else that you feed other animals out of her reach. Doing that may make her #s go down, and I'm hoping that you'll be able to get her diet controlled. :-D
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

Thanks Julie, I have always done the same, I have had up to 5 cats at a time but only have Sassy now.
I always put out the bowls, filled them with dry food and went about my day.

Until sassy was diagnosed I had no idea that I was doing it all wrong.

I plan on another test in an hour, that will be 12:30 pm my time and two hours after the last test.
Thanks for the advice on the spreadsheet, I will make a note about the last time she was shot up until this morning.

Melissa
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

i'd also add a note today that she might've gotten into the doggy kibble. that kind of comment is very helpful for anyone looking at her ss too.
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

Sassy is looking great! :-D :-D :-D It could very well be that when she was on a lot more insulin she was going low and w/ no testing between shots you missed it and she bounced back up again by the next test. That's why we get so obsessed w/ lots of tests.

For the link you need the whole address from the http:/ ……………………… placed between the brackets. Some will look different because they use a program called tiny URL to make it shorter.

Sassy may have diabetic neuropathy or arthritis. W/ diabetes the nerves can be damaged that's neuropathy. Methyl B12 can help restore the nerve endings if it is neuropathy. Classically cats w/neuropathy are described as "walking on their hocks." Tess never did this but he rear hips were wobbly and she pulled herself up rather than jumped like Sassy. The Methyl B12 has helped her quite a bit. It will take a month or 2 to see results.

There is a Methyl B12 product made for cats called Xobaline which is flavored for cats (the same company makes another Methyl B12 called Zobaline which is for humans). It's actually made here in CA, in Grover Beach not far from me. Tess doesn't like it mixed w/ her food, but if we crush it and mix it in butter she laps it right up!

If it is arthritis there would be more pain involved and that may be why Sassy is sensitive near her back end. Often a glucosamine/ chondroitin supplement will help, if it is bad pain meds might be used too.

We have all been through the OMG of what we were feeding our cats. i did the same w/ Tess, I even asked the vet what to feed and they recommended dry even after dx. Very little attention is paid to nutrition in vet schools and too many come out of training not knowing what cats really need. Then there is the bombardment form companies like Hills w/ promoting their "prescription" products. Your dog would probably do better w/ canned food too. we feed Tess a raw food that is meant for both cats and dogs. Cats do need supplemental taurine so just dog food isn't good for them. Also dogs can digest carbs better than cats and I'm not sure where to look up carb % info for dog food. Unfortunately the law doesn't require carb info on labels and w/ the "min/max" jumble they are allowed to use it is next to impossible to figure it out. You'll need to do just as much research into the dog food. Fortunately, some of the better companies are including better nutrient info, especially on their websites.
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

Hi Melissa and extra sweet Sassy!!

You ALWAYS put the number you actually shot at in the AMPS/PMPS box, so if Sassy was at 162 when you actually shot, that's what should be there.

When we "stall", you have some options...you can put the original number(s) in the +11 cell from the cycle before and in the "Remarks" area (where you have all your times) add something like "stalled at AM for 1 hour" in today's "remarks" OR you can put the numbers all in the same cell (today's AMPS cell). To do that, you would do this:
Put 162 and hit space key, put 162 and hit space key. Hit "Enter". Now if you do it like this (or anytime you "stack" cells) you'll have to do the color coding manually. The spreadsheet won't do it for you, so you'd go up to the icon that looks like a little bucket of paint tipping over, click and choose the appropriate color that goes with that number. Personally, I use the first method and put them in the +11 for the previous cycle but add the notes to my "remarks" as to what's going on.

Since you did NOT shoot last night you don't have to worry about this, but for in the future, if you stall, remember that you have to push back your shot schedule so it's every 12 hours...so if you usually shoot at 9:30am but stalled for an hour, your PM shot wouldn't be given until 10:15pm at the earliest. (10:30 -15 minutes). If you're trying to get back on a schedule, you can move either 15 minutes per cycle, or 30 minutes per day until you are back at the shooting times you want.

For posting your previous condo link, find your previous post and "copy" everything in the address bar. Go to your new post and click on the URL tab. "Paste" the link there. (it goes between YOUR LINK HERE [url] Last thing.... here to help push you up the mountain!...LOL
 
12/29/13 Sassy - AMPS 162

Thanks Chris, that was a lot of good information.

I am extremely appreciative for finding the forum and having the support system that I currently have.
Without the advice and guidance that I have gotten in the last few days I would have been very lost.
I have learned a lot of invaluable information and Sassy seems to be responding well to the changes that I have made based on that information.

I will be testing her in about 20 minutes to see what is happening.

Do I need to change the Subject each time I post a new number or only in the morning?

Melissa
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

We keep updaying the subject in the first post throughout the day. That changet how the subject appears on the list, but it does not move you up to the top of the list. You must post a reply to go to the top. So if you have a question that needs answering, change the subject in the first post and then add a reply w/ the question.
 
12/29/13 Sassy - +4 88

Looks like her number has come down nicely with only giving her .25

I will test her again in another two hours and see what we have then.

Melissa
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

Hey Melissa, what a great job you are doing with Sassy!

When you edit the subject, please edit the subject of the first post in this condo. This changes it so we can see it when we enter the Lantus forum. When you edit the subject of any posts that is not the first post, we can only see that subject when we go into your daily condo.

I hope that makes sense. :-D

(The subject line of your last post is great!! so if you enter that into the subject of your post first today - will be perfect!!)
 
12/29/13 Sassy - +4 88

you and she are both doing great and looks like you got the hang of how to write the subject line - good job

if you look at the other subject lines in this lantus forum, you will see how the numbers are listed and that is so anybody can quickly scroll through the subjects without opening the post and can see what it happening for the day.

Now if you have an emergency or need urgent help - you go back to your original post of this thread - click the 911 icon on the top and add the word HELP or URGENT or whatever it is in the subject line - this will easily allow others to see it and come running....

Don't feel bad about your knowledge or lack of knowledge regarding food and cats. As others stated, many of us, including me did the same thing - in my case, I fed very expensive dry food - filled the bowl as needed, had a bowl of water next to it and never thought differently.

Not until Maui got the dire beasties diagnosis. I found the board, read Dr. Lisa's site and printed and poured over the food chart like crazy. My biggest problem was teaching Maui how to eat wet food and then getting my others to eat it too. It was nerve wracking and I thought it would never happen, but it did.

So many of Maui's problems cleared up once the dry food was out of her system, skin irritation and itchiness, just to name one.

You asked about the hind area issue -as Ann & Tess suggested there could be two main reasons for this

Diabetic neuropathy - which is treated with Vitamin B12 - methylcolabamin version - yes you can go to GNC, Vitamin Shoppe, even your grocery store and buy it. Just be sure it is the correct type of B12 and doesn't contain sugar. If you get a tablet version, you can melt it in a little bit of water, the capsule can be emptied and mixed in with food. Ideally you want to give 3-5 mg daily.

Here is some information on what diabetic neuropathy is and what it looks like - Usually what happens is the cat stops walking on it's toes, and walks flat footed (on it's hocks) and may have to stop and rest while walking.

http://petdiabetes.wikia.com/wiki/Neuropathy

Arthritis This tends to happen in older cats, same as in people. You can purchase pet version of glucosamine, chrondroitin, MSM combination - such as Cosequin (can get coupons online) and purchase at Walmart, this is a pill version and you would mix in with food, or you can get a treat version - such as Pet Naturals of Vermont Joint & Hip Chews, Catswell Happy Hips (doesn't have MSM) or even this one that Sydney liked if I broke it into little pieces - http://www.vitacost.com/vitacost-arthro ... ets/?cas=1

If it is arthritis, depending on the severity, you could discuss with your vet adequan injections, that may help.
 
12/29/13 Sassy - +6 85

Hilary, Thanks for the inks I will check them out.

Her numbers are still holding strong. her new number is 85 at her +6 .

I have Sassy on the B12 Zobaline, she doesn't seem to mind it in her food.

I will look into the Glucosamine though, my dogs both get a hip and joint vitamin every morning one is older and the other has hip issues when they get older so I figured start now while he is young.

Melissa
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

Melissa...as you get tests during the day, you need to go back to that FIRST post and edit the subject to add the results, so today's Subject line for you would read

12/29 Sassy AMPS 162,+2 124,+4 88,+6 85 (this way we see where she started, and where she's going)

If you then did a +8 test and wanted to add that result, you'd go back to that first post and edit the subject line again and just add the +8 ###

On your spreadsheet, in the remarks you have "shot at +2"...remember, no matter when you actually shoot, that's the number that becomes your pre-shot number and the cycle clock starts over again. I realize this morning it was actually +74 though....(which is AWESOME!!)...You could even edit your remarks to say "back on insulin at +74"...that might be even clearer since Sassy hadn't had any insulin for that long

You normally shoot at 9:30? This morning you stalled for an hour? (or 2?)...so in the remarks you might want to just say "stalled shot for (how long)"

If, for example, you shoot at 9:30 and you end up stalling for an hour (so actually SHOT at 10:30 instead), the +2 would now have moved to 12:30, +4 would be 2:30, etc....10:30 plus 2 hours, 10:30 plus 4 hours, etc.

The time you actually shoot is when the 12 hour clock starts so if you shoot early or late, you're still showing how Sassy reacts at 2 hours after shot, 4 hours after shot, etc.

We're all scattered all over the world here, so we all use the same 12 hour clock per cycle so we can easily see (for example) that Sassy nadirs around +6...no matter what the actual time is since that doesn't really matter.

Hope that made sense!!
 
Re: Low number, no shots for a few days

Chris,

I made the suggested changes to the spreadsheet, I think I understand what you mean.
I hope I didn't royally screw it up worse and make it so that no one understands what is going on.

I also will make the changes to the original post.


Melissa
 
Re: 12/29 Sassy AMPS 162,+2 124,+4 88,+6 85

Looks great!!

I know it seems kind of crazy right now, but trust me, you'll get to the point where you'll be able to do it in your sleep!!
 
Re: 12/29 Sassy AMPS 162,+2 124,+4 88,+6 85

I'd like to suggest that you get Sassy's back checked by your vet. While this could be arthritis, it could also be a disk problem. X-rays will let you know what's going on.
 
Re: 12/29 Sassy AMPS 162,+2 124,+4 88,+6 85

Sienne,
I read the links about arthritis and there are things that don't match her symptoms.
She actually twitches or shakes when she is relaxed from her mid half to her toes.

She still walks on her feet but she walks slower, she doesn't like me to pet her by her tail or pick her up, I have tried different ways of doing it but she still wants down unless it is on her terms.
She walks slowly up the steps I built for the bed, instead of quickly moving up them like she used to.

The doctor mentioned in their notes the last time that it was diabetic neuropathy, but gave me no direction on how to help her.
She has been on the Zobaline for about maybe 2 months but I don't see signs of improvement.

Melissa
 
Re: 12/29 Sassy AMPS 162,+2 124,+4 88,+6 85

The methyl cobalamin helps slowly and requires the diabetes to be well regulated.

It may help to bump up the dose a smidge. It is a water soluble vitamin, excreted through the kidneys, and any excess basically gets peed out.
 
Re: 12/29 Sassy AMPS 162,+2 124,+4 88,+6 85

Great job today!

I do have another suggestion for her SSs which actually helps us more when we are looking at it. In the AMPS column today, you can put "162 @ +74"; that way, it gets our attention immediately. :-D
 
Re: 12/29 Sassy AMPS 162,+2 124,+4 88,+6 85, +10 77

BJM, I give her one tablet in her food in the morning, should i give it to her in her evening food too?

Her +10 is 77, looks like we are going to be smooth sailing tonight, I test again for her PMPS in two hours, i will be posting again then as well to be sure.

Getting ready to feed her again though so her number could come up.

Melissa
 
Well, it seems that the food monitoring has helped the situation.

Her PMPS number is 85, I am skipping the shot for the night.

I will post her AMPS in the morning before making any moves or giving her a shot.

Thanks for all those who helped out today. It is 10:30 pm here and I am headed to bed.

Have a good night
Melissa
 
Re: 12/29 Sassy AMPS 162,+2 124,+4 88,+6 85, +10 77

mfrancis69 said:
BJM, I give her one tablet in her food in the morning, should i give it to her in her evening food too?...
Click to expand...

It should be fine. You can ask your vet, too.
Zobaline is one product you can use, specifically for diabetic cats.

Edited to add: see Sienne's post below. Always good to rule out other issues with the vet!
 
Diabetic neuropathy typically involves a cat walking on its hocks (think ankles) vs. on her toes. I would really push your vet to get x-rays. This could easily be a degenerating disk and Sassy could be in considerable pain -- more than what she's showing you. Cats are very good at compartmentalizing their discomfort and the fact that she's telling you something hurts is significant.
 
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