12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +4/142 +5/120 +6/153 +7/307 AMPS 497

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Re: 12/1 Mikey +10/311 AMPS 239 +2/185

Great news. I'd also be vigilant due to that +2.......it's quite a bit lower than his AMPS. Looks like he is clearing his bounces quickly.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey +10/311 AMPS 239 +2/185

Hi guys .. yes definitely a drop at that +2 .. hoping it's a smooth ride down to the lower levels for you .. I hope the new feeding schedule works out for you guys .. have a great evening!
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey +10/311 AMPS 239 +2/185

I have to leave Mikey for about 5 hours. I know his #'s are dropping. With the suggestion of Marje a few days ago, I did go out and purchase a timed feeder. Any other suggestions? I am leaving Saturday and SUnday for a longer time period also.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey +10/311 AMPS 239 +2/185

BG +5 155. Should he be alright to leave with just regular food in the timer or add some HC?
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey +10/311 AMPS 239 +2/185

You definitely need to leave food as long as you know he will eat it.

If he were my cat, I'd be nervous about leaving for five hours when he's coming down.....
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey +10/311 AMPS 239 +2/185

Jenn
I think you could leave food out and go.
Not HC. On my phone so can't type and drive!
Carl
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey +10/311 AMPS 239 +2/185

miso00 said:
I am leaving Saturday and SUnday for a longer time period also.

How long on each day? I understood it was only going to be all day Sunday. Please let us know and we'll try to figure something out.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey +10/311 AMPS 239 +2/185

Jenn pm'd me these questions:

Can you either exlplain or direct me to where I find out what a bounce, clearing, surfing, curve are and what the difference is between them? Most importantly how do I know which is which when I look on the SS

A bounce is when a kitty gets into lower numbers than it used to and the liver reacts by releasing counterregulatory hormones and glucagon to get the numbers up to what it feels is safe. Let's say your kitty has been running in the 300s and then comes down to 185. That is a lower number than the liver is used to and so it does what the liver is supposed to do and it brings the BG up back to where it "knows" it is safe. Kitties bounce until they don't....it depends on the cat. I always recommend people look at Mocha's SS (under "members" look up PeterDevonMocha). She bounce for 21 months and then stopped and went OTJ in three weeks. We call this bouncing "liver training school". On the SS, a bounce is usually depicted by a low number the cat doesn't usually get to followed by high numbers. Look at Gracie's SS. She got a 53 on the a.m. cycle 11/30. She started bouncing late in the same cycle and continues to do so.

It can take up to 72 hours (6 cycles) to clear a bounce. Some cats take longer. Check out Tess's SS....she just bounced for 11 cycles and then came down with a vengeance. But we typically say wait six cycles after lower numbers followed by high ones before you change the dose. The bounce clears when the liver quits releasing the counterregulatory hormones and glucagon and the BG starts to come back down. When a cat clears a bounce, it looks like Mikey's SS on the a.m. cycle 11/27. He started high and then did a little dive into lower numbers but then his liver panicked and back he went into a bounce.

Surfing is usually in reference to a cat that is in nice, green numbers without any food management. So if Mikey gets into the low 50s and just stays there and you don't have to intervene in any way, that is surfing. Sometimes we do say "surfing blue" but I think that might be a habit of mine. Mikey was surfing on the day he got the greens. Also, check out Gracie's SS the pm cycle of 11/27....once she got into green...she just surfed there all night without any food.

A curve is what the insulin does in a 12-hour cycle. In a perfect world, the BG would slowly come down to a low number that is not that different from the PS and then go back up. If you took his BGs for one cycle and plotted it on a graph, you would get the "curve". Of course, sometimes (like the other day when Mikey came down fast), it might look like a "U". In a tightly regulated cat, it will be almost flat.

I know you are really busy, but I encourage you to check out other SSs. You can learn SO much....I am constantly studying other SSs trying to pick out patterns, etc. Many beans in LL do the same thing.

Let me know if I haven't answered clearly. You're learning alot really fast!!
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175

Hey Marje,
Sorry for the delay and not posting my question on the condo. I meant to do it when I got home but you beat me to it ;-) . It's so hard to type in the condo with my phone. Mikey did good tonight! I was very worried but had faith everything would be ok

Saturday I will be gone in the afternoon only and will be able to give him his shots, food (also when i leave with the timer, great idea BTW) and at least +1. There is no set time I have to leave or come home so my schedule is being based around him.
Sunday is a different story. There is a walk in central park for brain cancer (i have a family member that passed and every year they walk in his honor) the walk is at 8:30 and should end around 11am. I can be home around 12 but that is too late to give the shot. I was thinking to have someone come and shoot but not sure that is a good idea? Possibly just skipping? Mikey is doing so well I don't want to leave him but I am faced with choosing between him and other things that are equally important. I am hoping to be able to go to the walk but if I can't, then I can't. I won't sacrifice his health for it, but would really like to participate in the walk with my family as they are important to me as well. So any suggestions are greatly appreciated on how I can handle Sunday.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175

I forgot to respond to this in my last post.

to "mybuddybinks" thank you, i thought they were nice numbers too but wasn't sure. Still a new bean ;-)

Marje-thanks for the clarification. I have been looking at some other SS's but it's hard to understand because I am still trying to learn all the lingo and how Lantus works. I keep posting as much as I do and asking questions (though I know are repetative for you all) because it's hard for me to find the time to read through all the information that is posted in LL. When I think of a question, I ask because though I have the luxury of working from home I am getting so side tracked with everything here I am very behind in the "other(job)work" I need to do. I'm still trying to find that balance! I have printed up a bunch of the stickies and some of the posts that I feel I may need for future reference. I do really appreciate all the time everyone takes to read and respond and guide me in the right direction.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175

It's ok....keep asking questions. We're here to help.

I'm trying to get dinner and get Gracie fed....hopefully someone will have some other ideas for you for Sunday. I really think if you don't have someone to shoot/test, you can just skip his am shot and go enjoy the day with the fam and pick up that night. He won't lose much ground....
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175

Marjorie,
Sunday is 5 cycles away, right?

Jenn, you normally shoot at 11am, right?

Why can't she just adjust the shooting schedule by 15 minutes per cycle or 30 minutes a day between now and then so that she can shoot when she gets home from the walk? Isn't that a win-win for everybody, including Mikey?

Carl
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67

Carl: I'm not a fan of shooting and leaving. She told me the other day she has to leave at 6:30 am...there isn't enough time to back him off 4.5 hours.

Jenn....This is a pretty good drop for a +2 number. I would retest in 30 minutes from the +2 and see where he is...which is now...
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67

Marjorie,
She said up above that she would be home by noon. Move him forward 15 minutes a cylce from now till then. She can shoot at 12:15 sunday afternoon, after she gets home. Then she won't have to "shoot and leave". It'll be "enter and shoot" :smile:

Friday am 11:15
Friday pm 11:30
Sat am 11:45
Sat pm 12:00
Sun AM 12:15 (would actually be "pm" technically)
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38

Jenn....breathe. Give him atbsp of HC food tsp of HC gravy and a drop or two of karo. Retest in 20.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38

Jenn,
Is he doing okay?
Got the hypo kit nearby?
Test again in 15?
Carl
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38

all your's Marje,
didn't see your name on the bottom.
I'm here watching though

carl
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38

Carl....I got it. If she tests too soon, the number won't be up yet. It takes 20-30 mins for the number to come up. He's ok.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38

I gave him 1tbsp HC (wet food w/ gravy and drop of karo)
I never saw him eat so fast! Like he hasn't eaten all day. I don't think I fed him enough today. Trying to spread the food out and I think I calculated wrong
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38

Jenn.....once you get the gravy/karo in him, please take the 911 off. Carl and I have eyes on you.

Is he acting ok? Do you have chocolate? Now would be the time for you to eat the chocolate. ;-)
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38

Jenn
don't look backwards. that was "then". we can figure out the food schedule in a little while...

put on some coffee. :smile:
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38

Jenn
what did the clock say when you got that 38?

I can be the timekeeper. you watch mikey
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38

911 is off. I underfed him today. Has to be. I think I only fed him a can and I had been feeding him 1.5 cans/day
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38

ok, that's 20 minutes'
test him
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38

Jenn: it wasn't the lack of food today. He has just decided he's done with this dose. This is not unusual. This has happened to me with Gracie even when she easily got all her food. As long as you've been feeding him this evening, then he's just ready for a reduction. Which is GREAT!!!
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

REALLY? ARE YOU SURE??? (don't mean to question you, I just can't believe it!)
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

Nice job. Ok....a few things....
1. you need to test every 30 minutes for the next hour or so because HC and karo wear off. In general, it takes karo about 2 hours to wear off but ECID.

2. if he's hungry still, you can feed him LC food but don't overfeed....keep it small helpings in case he comes back down

3. If he continues to rise into the 100s, you can test every hour; you need two rising numbers not influenced by food to go to testing every two hours.

4. once all of the above applies, if he gets up over 200, you can go to bed for the night

5. he gets a dose reduction of .25u in the morning
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

marje
can she shoot at 11:15 in the morning to work towards sunday?
Carl
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

Ok, I am giving him 1.5u now (forgive my math skills) with a .25 reduction what would the new dose be? And should I change the time? If changing the time will set him back I would rather make sure I get home by 11am sunday.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

1.25 will be the dose
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

Jenn: NICE JOB!!! So you handled your first really low number like a pro. I added a bit to my last post so please reread it. If he's hungry and you need to feed him more...small amounts until he's up safely. If you feed him too much
now and he comes back down, he'll be too full.

So for Sunday....IF you will be home by 12:15, then yes, Carl's schedule works. Just shoot late 15 mins every cycle until Sunday.
Friday am cycle 11:15 a.m.
Friday pm cycle 11:30 p.m.
Sat am cycle 11:45 a.m.
Sat pm cycle 12:00 a.m.
Sun am cycle 12:15 p.m.

Then Sunday night, you can start working back to 11/11 in 15 minute increments.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

with a .25 reduction what would the new dose be? And should I change the time? If changing the time will set him back I would rather make sure I get home by 11am sunday.

Good questions...you're learning the right ones to ask. Carl gave you the dose...1.25u tomorrow. A late shot is like a reduction but usually if you shoot within 15 mins, it doesn't really have an effect. It isn't the best scenario BUT we all have lives and it's important to you and your family. Mikey will be fine as long as you only move him in 15 mins blocks each cycle.

Let me see if I can find a picture of what 1.25u looks like. Such a fun dose to draw.... :lol: :lol: :lol: The important thing is that you figure out what you think it is....halfway between 1.5 and 1u and that's what you draw consistently. Your 1.25u may not look like mine but as long as you get it close to halfway in between and you are consistent, then it's absolutely great.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

miso00 said:
Ok, I am giving him 1.5u now (forgive my math skills) with a .25 reduction what would the new dose be? And should I change the time? If changing the time will set him back I would rather make sure I get home by 11am sunday.

Jenn'
15 minutes isn't going to mess mikey up or set him back. every lantus user has to do this twice a year when the clocks change, and I don't think the kitties suffer any ill effects from it.

Carl
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

Jenn,
another good suggestion i've seen on getting the right amount. save a used syringe. practice drawing up water into it to the 1.25 line. save it for later. use colored water if it makes it easier to see.
then when you draw up the insulin into a fresh syringe, hold it side by side with your "demo" one and if they match up, you're good to go.
the colored water will help to make sure you don't use the wrong one to shoot from too! :smile:
carl
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

Just reading through the posts to make sure I got all your messages since we tend to cross post when something is happening like this.

REALLY? ARE YOU SURE??? (don't mean to question you, I just can't believe it!)

Yes....take a look at Gracie's SS on 11/11 am cycle. She dropped from 54 to 38 in one hour...being fed on the hour. I'm sure I could give you a long list of similar times she has done this.
You did not do anything wrong by miscalculating the food. It's just a coincidence.

The only way the food issue would have been involved is if you forgot to feed him tonight. Then when his insulin onset, he would not have had any carbs to help deal with that. So as long as you
fed him tonight at his PS, whatever happened this morning does not matter.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

Marje,
one question on the guidelines you laid out. If mikey goes over 200 before going over 100 twice over two hours, is she good to go?
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

Jenn
coming up on 30 minutes
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

Sorry. i'm so confused with how to post in the SS since we are not on 1/2 hour or hour time increments.

BG 120 @ 2:40am
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87/120

I know the subject line is not right. I"m sorry I am so tired I can't think numbers right now. If it needs to be corrected please advise.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87

carlinsc said:
Marje,
one question on the guidelines you laid out. If mikey goes over 200 before going over 100 twice over two hours, is she good to go?

She needs to test every 30 mins until she has two rising numbers. She can feed small amounts of LC food.

If he gets over 100 after two rising numbers, she can test on the hour; I'd then get two rising tests before I felt comfortable going to a longer schedule.

If he shoots up over 200 after one hour, then I'd probably go two hours to test him. He may wobble a little bit but he probably won't come all the way back down into the 50s. Even still...I'd be sure to test him again after two hours just to be certain.

I hope that makes sense....exhaustion overcoming my brain. The bottom line is to just stay vigilant until he is up....usually if you get them up to 150-200, they won't come back too far down. And don't be surprised if he just skyrockets. He is totally not used to 38 and his liver will probably send his numbers way up.
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87/120

Jen,
it's just housekeeping.... tomorrow you'll have a new condo anyway, right? Pretty sure it's only me and you that can see the subject right now anyway. :lol:
On the SS, I would just "stack" a couple numbers in the +3 and +4 columns. you might have to reduce the font size to fit.
like 38 and 87 in the +3 and 120 in the +4
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87/120

ok, marge, got it that time! thanks, it also moves things closer to the bottom of the thread so we don't have to keep scrolling up :lol:
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87/120

so the next test is at 3:10
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87/120

I know the subject line is not right. I"m sorry I am so tired I can't think numbers right now. If it needs to be corrected please advise

Just round it up...call it his +3.75 in the subject line and in his SS.

So he's going to come up fast.....wow. Why don't you test him next at 3:30 (+4.5) and if he's up even more....a lot more, then go a couple hours. If he's only up a little, test him at 4:30 (+5.5).

Try to get some sleep between now and then.

Carl is taking over.....you all are doing absolutely great.

Ni Ni.

PS PJ PARTY!!!!!
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87/120

Jenn,
So you know..... I have my profile set up to send me an email like when I get a PM. I also use the "subscribe thread" button at the bottom of this page. When ever somebody replies or posts in a "subscribed thread", I get an email.

when I get email, my phone "notification" ringer goes off, letting me know "I"ve Got Mail" (except my ringtone is Mr. Hanky from South Park saying "Howdy Ho!" ) :smile:

So, if I am not in front of the computer and you post in this thread, my phone will let me know you've posted. I'm like seconds away, I live in a dinky house! So I won't miss anything you or anyone else posts in this thread.... gotcha covered!

carl
 
Re: 12/1 Mikey PMPS 175 +2/67 +3/38 +3.20min/87/120

I will get the next test at 3:10am

The last time I fed him was 1:45 it was the HC wet food w/ gravy 1tbs and 1 drop karo. I know Marje said I can feed him small amounts of LC but when? I know he is hungry because he's trying to open the door to where I keep his treats.
 
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