11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, PMPS 480 Please read.

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Amy & Revson

Member Since 2011
Good Morning!
Happy Thanksgiving weekend to everyone.
I hope you all are having a nice time with your furry families (and their people too!)
Glad to hear that Jill's DH is doing better.


Rev is struggling and so am I.

I know there was a reply post about me and my vet not understanding how Lantus works. And, that may be true.

She sent me off with the Lantus and told me how to shoot. BUT NOTHING ELSE!
Everything I am learning, I am getting from here.

So, I'm re-reading the Lantus stickies.
We are handling the insulin properly.
We are shooting on a 12/12 schedule.
We still do not have reliable extra readings, I'm sorry.
We are updating the SS daily.
Ketones were negative on Thursday, will check again today

Help Needed:
I can not get him to eat enough.
And, most importantly, what to do about his high numbers??

Amy
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

Hi Amy: What is the problem with Revson and eating? How much does he eat? With these high numbers his dose needs to go up IMHO. It is also important you get ketone tests with high numbers. Does he have any other physical problems. How is he acting (WCR) well cat report. If you can provide some answers to these questions everyone will have a better idea of how to help you and Revson.
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

Dear Amy,
I'm bumping your condo to the top of the list to get some more knowledgeable eyes on your problem. Is Revson a former dry-kibble eater and have you had trouble getting him to eat wet food? If so, you might try sprinkling Fortiflora on his wet food (available at Amazon and all the mail-order kitty sites, and at your vet's). It contains an ingredient ("animal digest") that is one of the things that turns cats on to dry food. Sprinkling it on his wet food might make it more interesting to him. I can't help with trying to determine Revson's dose, but I would suggest choosing one of your meters and sticking with it.

Hang in there,

Ella & Rusty
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

Amy --

What constitutes eating "enough?" I would base the amount on calories. Janet and Binky's food charts lists calories. Dr. Lisa uses this formula for calculating the needed caloric intake (although she says this is a generous calculation):

Required calories per day = [13.6 X optimal lean body weight in pounds] + 70​

The issue with dose is that I feel like my hands are tied. Without some spot checks, I'm afraid to suggest any change in dose. I would not want to cause harm to your cat. Lantus dosing is based on the nadir. Right now, I have no way of knowing whether the high pre-shots numbers are due to Revson bouncing off of a low mid-cycle number. To illustrate, Gabby has has pre-shots in the 400s with a mid-cycle in the 40s and thereby got a dose reduction. (See 11/2/09 on her SS. There's a tab at the bottom for the older data.) If I hadn't been testing, I would have increased, rather than decreased, her dose. Please do whatever you can to get at least one spot check per cycle.
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

First, with the high numbers and issues getting Revson to eat, I would definitely do all you can to get a ketone test today.
How is he feeling and acting?
I use FortiFlora as an appetite stimulant when my cats are off. They may turn their nose up at the food, but come running as soon as they hear that little package being opened. They LOVE it. And will usually eat all their food up, once it's sprinkled with FortiFlora.
Hopefully, this will bump you up for more dosing advice.
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

Hi Amy,

I am sorry you and Revson are having these issues. I can't give any dosing advice. About the eating, there are several tricks to entice reluctant kitties. Have you tried any of these: watering down his food, heating to "mouse body" temperature, adding a sprinkle of freeze dried chicken dust or bonito flakes or parmesan cheese, finger feeding? There are many other things I have seen people suggest and I'm sure others will add in their favorite tips.

In the meanwhile, the more tests you can get in (especially overnight) the more helpful it will be to those who can make dose suggestions, as they look for patterns.

Good luck.
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

He ate less than 1/2 a can of FF flaked shrimp & fish... one of his favorites.
He ate a small amount of chicken baby food. He was willing to lick it off of my fingers when he gave up on the dish.
I offered him at least 4 other low-carb choices, he didn't want any of them
Sprinkled Purebites on top to get him to eat the FF.

He's hungry because when the vet offered him some High-Energy (low carb?) dry food about a week ago, he scarfed it down.
Plus he stole a small amount of dry kibble from my mom's civvie cat when we got here Thursday.
And, he'd eat Stella & Chewy's complete Chick Chick Chicken freeze dried dinner, but it seems to bump his numbers.

I have been trying to feed him every couple of hours instead of leaving it out.
He ignores it when it's left out, and I'm hoping he's more hungry when he has to wait an 2 hours or so between meals.
He was eating fresh chicken & shrimp at home, I have not made any for him at my mom's house, but I can.

5 P's
Purring, check.
Peeing, check.
Pooping (every other day - normal for him lately), check.
Preening, not much, just his paws. Not much preening since he was diagnosed.
Playing, no, but uses his scratching post (not a big "player" usually.) Can't go outside here.

Chatty in the morning. Was awake long before I was and banged at the door to get out of the room. Walked on me, stuck his face in mine.... all usual.
Quiet during the day & evening. Napping mostly.

Amy
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

Sienne and Gabby said:
Amy --

The issue with dose is that I feel like my hands are tied. Without some spot checks, I'm afraid to suggest any change in dose. I would not want to cause harm to your cat. Lantus dosing is based on the nadir. Right now, I have no way of knowing whether the high pre-shots numbers are due to Revson bouncing off of a low mid-cycle number. To illustrate, Gabby has has pre-shots in the 400s with a mid-cycle in the 40s and thereby got a dose reduction. (See 11/2/09 on her SS. There's a tab at the bottom for the older data.) If I hadn't been testing, I would have increased, rather than decreased, her dose. Please do whatever you can to get at least one spot check per cycle.
Click to expand...

Here's another example: If you look at J.D.'s spreadsheet, 09/07 PMPS was 369, +6 was 29, and 09/08 AMPS was 390.
If I didn't catch that low number at +6, I wouldn't know he was just bouncing.
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

Ok... will do multiple checks today. Will someone look later at my SS please? Ketone test today too.

Bonita flakes purchased where?

Amy
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

The cheapist place to get Bonito Flakes are from a chinese market, if you have any in your area.

Setting alarms to get quick middle of the night tests, is what I do, and suggest you do when you can, as well.
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

you don't have to do a curve for us to get a better picture to be able to help revson, although a curve is always great. one spot-check in each cycle, at different times would probably give more info than one curve every week. if it's a money issue, which for many people it is (strips are not cheap) - are you buying the supplies online? they cost about 1/2 of what you pay retail. the cheapest meter and strips is the walmart relion confirm and you can buy arkay brand strips online for just pennies each that apparently work in the relion. if that's the issue, people can suggest how to buy online.

anything you can do to get more tests in would help us know more about what's going on. the key here is if he is continuous high the answer is to increase the dose. if he's bouncing to highs the answer may be to reduce the dose (if he's getting below 50's) or to manage with high carb food (if the dose seems right and his low number is 50-100ish). so learning what's happening inbetween the preshot tests is the only way to know what tactic to take. there's no other way to find out.

about the food - it sounds like he's a dry food addict. take some dry food and pulverize it, then sprinkle a little bit on the canned and see if that gets him to eat the canned.
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

If you don't have an Asian market in your area, Petco sells tuna flakes are a vastly more expensive price.
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

I'm glad you're planning some tests today. Really it takes tests over several cycles to determine whether it is safe to increase his dose. It's the weekend, so it's a great time to get some data. f you can get a couple of tests today, a couple tonight, and a couple tomorrow that would help us see what the dose is doing. Aim to get maybe a +4 and +6 in one cycle, a +8 and +10 somewhere along the line, and the others whenever you can. A curve done in just one cycle doesn't help as much, especially if that cycle happens to be one in which he is in the middle of a bounce. We need to see where he is going when he is NOT bouncing. Sometimes that can feel like a game of hide-and-seek, but it's necessary.
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

just dropping by to let you know we're thinking of you and hoping things even out...

celi
 
Re: 11/26 Revson, AMPS HI, new dose? Please read.

Hi Amy: If you just got one can of bonito flakes locally, then you could order them on line much cheaper. I actually buy them in a huge pkg at a local holistic pet food store because our cats really like them. They are cheaper that way, too.

I'm so glad you've got input from Sienne and Libby. Because Rev went into the 90s on 1.75u, he could be doing it somewhere else and you now have him at a higher dose. It's difficult for all of us to get up at night and test but a few spot checks really will help. You don't want to get him into an overdose and truly, too much insulin can look like too little.

Good luck....we'll be happy to help when we can see what he's doing and recommend a safe dose.
 
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