10/26 Red AMPS. What to shoot?

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kathpj

kathpj

Member Since 2012
Hi I started Red on lantus last night (Im in NZ)
Getting spreadsheet set up today.
PMPS 324, gave 1 unit. PM+1 302.4, PM+2 210.6
AMPS 102.6 1 unit given. Am I right that if the reading had been under 50 no shot. Should I have kept at 1 unit for this am shot. Done now but what in the future?
What are the important +shot testings. I am doing these at home.
Thanks Kath
 
Re: new lantus user. advice please

Did you feed when you gave the shot this morning? There isn't a food spike.

Definitely get a +2.
I , myself , would check again at +1.5 since you just started.
You just don't know enough yet. datawise....
 
Re: new lantus user. advice please

On this board we advice new users not to shoot if their PS reading is less than 150 as you won't have enough data to predict what will happen. Even the experienced caregivers here do not shoot below 50. It's considered too low.

Kath, Red is dropping fairly quickly, you'll need to keep testing fairly often as Rhiannon suggests. Do you have any high carb/gravy foods? Or honey, syrup or corn syrup (called karo here)? Those should all be part of your hypo kit. You'll need them if he tests below 50.

Here is the link to the sticky on handling low numbers, please print it out so you have it ready in case there isn't someone around when you need them. http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=147
 
Re: new lantus user. advice please

Welcome, Kath!

With someone who is brand new to using Lantus, we generally suggest that if you get a pre-shot number below 150 that you post so we can lend a hand. Shooting lower numbers is a good goal to have. It can, however, be a bit nerve wracking if your cat's numbers begin to drift downward and you need to use food to manage the curve. We like to be around to walk you through the first couple of times this happens.

I would get a +1 and a +2 and post the numbers in your subject line. (You can change the subject line by going to your first post in this thread. Click on the "edit" button above the text box. Make the changes you want to make, then click on "submit." Only the subject line from the first post in the thread is visible on the board.)
 
AM +1 82.8 +5 55.8

Hi,
Tested +5 at 55.8.
He seems fine wandering around has just eaten normal low carb canned lunch.
I have honey if necessary. He wants to go out but will be staying in.
Will test at +6 and post result, haven't been able to get ss set up yet. did I do subject line correctly?
look froward to hearing from you.
Kath
 
Re: new lantus user. advice please

Hi Kath,

Good idea to test again soon. At this point you are trying to find out when his nadir is as that can vary from cat to cat, so some random tests as well as testing when low (like now) is a good idea.

For the subject line, you have to go and edit the subject line of your very first post of the day. The format is: DATE CatName then the numbers like you have done. So for now, it would be - 10/25 Red AMPS 102 +1 82 +5 55

You don't need to bother with the decimals when you do the multiplication to get the American numbers. This has been a very nice cycle for Red.
 
Re: 10/25 Red AMPS 102 +1 82 +5 55 +6 68

Hi
have just done +6 68.
Which I am pleased about. Don't want my 1st day to be frightening!
Will continue testing 2 hourly till +12(PMPS) What should it be above for me to shoot. If I don't shoot at that time do I leave whole cycle?
Kath & Red
 
Re: 10/25 Red AMPS 102 +1 82 +5 55 +6 68

How about getting your test about 15 min. before your shot time (AM +11.75) and posting the number? We can help you figure out whether or not to shoot.

If you skip a shot, you wait until your next shot time. There are times when it's advisable to stall to see where numbers are heading. The down side of stalling is that you don't feed and your next shot is due 12 hours from whenever you actually gave your shot. Obviously, this can throw your schedule off. You might want to take a look at this post on dealing with low pre-shot numbers.
 
Re: 10/25 Red AMPS 102 +1 82 +5 55 +6 68 +8 104 +12 10 109 +

Hi
AM +8 104, AM+10 109 AM+11.45 95.4
He has had some low carb canned food in the last 2 hours.
Do I shoot??, pls bear in mind it is evening in NZ so unable to test so extensively.
Kath + Red
 
Re: do I shoot? 10/25 Red AMPS 102 +1 82 +5 55 +12 10 109 +1

Kath

You can take off the 911 now :-D

The best two options you have are to stall and see if he comes up or skip the shot.

If you stall, I'll have you retest in 20 mins without feeding to see if he comes up. How long can you stall and be able to make it up 15 mins per cycle or 30 mins once a day?

If you can't stall, I think you should skip the shot. You would then shoot at your regular time tomorrow or if you wanted to move the shot time up or back a bit, you could do that.

Please let me know which option you'd like to do.
 
Re: do I shoot? 10/25 Red AMPS 102 +1 82 +5 55 +12 10 109 +1

Kath

You can also shoot a reduced dose but I didn't mention it earlier because the cycle is likely to play out the same as if you shot the full dose since the depot for lantus is at play. Id rather see him coming up if you are going to shoot.

At some point, we need you to do a spreadsheet.
 
Re: do I shoot? 10/25 Red AMPS 102 +1 82 +5 55 +12 10 109 +1

Hi,
I hope I have taken off alert. Thank you for your prompt reply.

I did his blood again AMPS +12.5 (30 mins after last reading) it is the same 95.

As going to be middle of the night at PMPS +5/6 when he was at his lowest today (our 1st day) think I should not shoot and leave till 7am.

Does that sound ok?

kath & Red
 
Re: do I shoot? 10/25 Red AMPS 102 +1 82 +5 55 +12 10 109 +1

Yes. That sounds fine. We really like you to have more data and a spreadsheet before you shoot this low.

Thanks for taking off the 911. We hope we see you back tomorrow. We are a close group very willing to help.
 
Re: do I shoot? 10/25 Red AMPS 102 +1 82 +5 55 +12 10 109 +1

Thank you,
trying to do spreadsheet. Will test again later tonight and get some more readings.
Does it depend on his level AMPS to whether I give him 1 unit again or reduce the dose? I guess you don't want to be missing too many shots?
Kath & Red
 
Re: do I shoot? 10/25 Red AMPS 102 +1 82 +5 55 +12 10 109 +1

Great on the spreadsheet :-D Thank you.

I'd get a couple tests to make sure he's coming up. He might be high in the morning. If he is above 150, shoot his normal 1u dose. If he is under 150, don't feed him. Post here and ask for help.

The best thing is to get a test one hour before you plan to shoot and post it. That will give the early morning helpers a chance to give you suggestions if he's low. My guess is he will go up sometime in the next few hours.

Lantus likes consistency so it's important to find a dose you can safely shoot every 12 hours.
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

after no pm shot continued to test.
AM +12.5 95
AM +13.5 4.2
AM +15 59
do I need to make him eat??

Tested again 20 mins later 55
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

Hello Kath, Jane here, Marje has gone to bed and she and I did a hand-off for LL :smile:

I am finding it a little tricky to go through your condo to find all the BG readings... Please make every effort to set up a spreadsheet, ok?

I would feed some LC food and re-test in 20-30 minutes.

Am I right in assuming you shot 1u this morning? Or did you skip the PM shot *and* the AM shot after that?

Jane
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

I am in New Zealand so times upside down!!
At 7am this morning shot 1 unit, advised (and decided to miss pm shot) now numbers are AMPS +15.
Is this normal?
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

I'm sorry, Kath - it's a little tricky to answer that without more information on Red. ECID (Every Cat Is Different), too, so "normal" often isn't a useful term :smile:

Thanks for clarifying the shots! :smile:

Without a recap of the BG readings you do have (which I will do for you in a moment), I need a bit more time to sort through this thread (also called a "condo" here in LL) to know what's going on.

Yes, I think you should feed. What food do you have?

Please retest 30 minutes (at the most) after your last test. You should have fed some food already, but if you did not, please do so now.

I will watch for your next update.

You could also take off the 911 - I will be here with you until you're safe, ok?
Jane
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

RECAP

(PMPS) 324 --- 1u Shot
(+1) 302
(+2) 211
(AMPS) 103 --- 1u Shot
(+1) 83
(+5) 56
(+6) 68
(+8) 104
(+10) 109
(+11.45) 95 --- Skipped Shot
(+12.5) 95
(+13.5) 76
(+15) 59

Kath, can you please, just to sure, tell me if BEFORE the BG readings I listed in the recap, you got any other tests/readings?
And please also tell me the date of the PMPS I listed (324)?

Thanks :smile:
Jane
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

Started lantus 7pm yesterday 1 unit given.PMPS 324
PM +1 302
PM +3 210
AMPS 102 1 unit given
AM+1 82
AM+5 55
AM+6 68
AM+8 104
AM+10 109
AM+11.75 95
AM+12.5 95
DID NOT SHOOT
AM+13.5 75
AM+15 59
AM+ 15.25 55
EATEN
AM+ 16 65
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

Hi Kath, and Welcome.

This is the Recap that I am seeing, please let me know if it's wrong.

324 PMPS - shot 1 unit
302 +1
210 +2
102 AMPS - shot 1 unit
82 +1
55 +5
68 +6
104 +8
109 +10
95 +11
95 +12.5
4.2 (I don't know what this number is in US) +13.5
59 +15
55 +15.33

I think you're going to be skipping this shot, so go ahead and feed him, and test again in about 30 minutes.
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

Woohoo, three recaps :lol:

Dyana, 4.2 = 76 (rounded up from 75.6). Thanks for coming!

Kath: Your "yesterday night," when you gave the first ever Lantus shot - was that Tuesday or Wednesday night? (I'm in Cape Town so it's Thursday for me :lol:)

Jane
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

the 324 pmps was evening of 24th oct.
prior to that daily readings
Tues 22nd 7 am 304
10 am 307
1pm 299
4pm 322
these levels have been pretty consistant for Red
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

Perfect, Kath, thanks for that! You're *ahead* of me, I though you were behind in terms of time zones :mrgreen: Time zones get me confused all the time :lol:

Have you got a BG update for us?

You're doing great at testing! Well done :smile:

Jane
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

Jane said:
RECAP

23rd October
(AMBG) 304 --- No Shot
(+3) 307
(+6) 299
(+9) 322
24th October
(PMPS) 324 --- 1u Shot (Lantus, First Ever Shot)
(+1) 302
(+2) 211
25th October
(AMPS) 103 --- 1u Shot
(+1) 83
(+5) 56
(+6) 68
(+8) 104
(+10) 109
(+11.45) 95 --- Skipped Shot
(+12.5) 95
(+13.5) 76
(+15) 59
(+ 15.25) 55 --- Fed (Whiskas Jelly Canned)
(+16) 65
Click to expand...
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

fed whiskers jellymeat loaf style, his normal low carb tinned food
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

Ok, great! Thanks :smile:

Red is coming up nicely now!

I would probably give a bit more regular LC at this point, and re-test in a hour. Do you think that will work for you?
Jane
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

Jane said:
UPDATED RECAP

23rd October
(AMBG) 304 --- No Shot
(+3) 307
(+6) 299
(+9) 322
24th October
(PMPS) 324 --- 1u Shot (Lantus, First Ever Shot)
(+1) 302
(+2) 211
25th October
(AMPS) 103 --- 1u Shot
(+1) 83
(+5) 56
(+6) 68
(+8) 104
(+10) 109
(+11.45) 95 --- Skipped Shot
(+12.5) 95
(+13.5) 76
(+15) 59
(+ 15.25) 55 --- Fed (Whiskas Jelly Canned)
(+16) 65
(+16.5) 72
Click to expand...
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

I will wake him and try to give more food.
As its now midnight and I need to be up very early tomorrow will have to go to bed. This has been a very tiring day!!
I will follow the advice given re the am shot and post my reading before 7 am.
Thank you so very much for the support tonight, priceless xx
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

It's our pleasure, Kath!

I'm glad he ate a bit more. If you *can* get a couple more spot checks, it would be tremendously useful.

I will keep a look-out for you in case you do post again before you next Pre-Shot.

I hope you get some rest :smile: Great job!
Hugs
Jane
 
Re: numbers dropping AM+15

Kath:

Given that the 1.0u is dropping Red into very green numbers coupled with our knowing very little about your cat, I want to suggest you reduce his dose. Usually, we don't see this much of a response to Lantus after one or two shots. As you've experienced, managing low numbers, especially this early in the process, can be nerve wracking. I also suspect that your cat's body is making a very good adjustment to being on a low carb diet. All of this factors in to how he's responding to insulin.

I'd like to suggest that you drop the dose to 0.5u. Hopefully, this will allow you to give a shot safely twice a day.
 
Goodmorning.
Reds AMPS is 342. I stuggled to get this reading so could be a bit stressed!! (both of us)
In 5 mins I intend to shoot 0.5 units as suggested last night.
Yes, he seemed to react well to his dose yesrerday. I think that was a good reaction, Im just not used to it.
Thanks Kath
 
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