10/10/20 - Squeaky! AMPS 356, +4 = 331, PMPS 258, + 2 = 110 +3 = 66 +4 = 66 +5 = 81 +6 = 117

Okay, so now I understand better about how bringing the blood sugar levels down to lower numbers, somehow, helps heal the body. The body needs to get used to the low blood sugar. Then somehow the pancreas starts working better.

Squeaky's numbers continue to be high. Is there any way I need to be manipulating his food to bring his numbers down?

Also he sits next to his water dish a lot today. Is that normal behavior for a diabetic cat???

Thank you.
 
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Exactly!

Feeding a low carb diet is effective for diabetic cats. Feeding smaller meals through the day, and giving more or higher carb to steer if needed to help surf those green numbers is recommended.

Patience and adjusting the dose according to the protocols is the way of feline diabetes. It’s been less than a month...Every cats is different in how long they take to come to come down. We call them patience pants ;)

Not unusual at all for them to be right near their water dish. They instinctively want to flush the excess sugar from their blood stream - hence the increased water drinking and peeing. That is natural. As numbers come down and kitty regulates more, they tend to drink less.

So best thing you can do is keep learning, be consistent, and by following the protocols for dosing, you will get there!

I think I remember that you said the other night that Squeaky was on steroids? Did I remember that right? Many cats are steroid induced diabetics and once off the steroid, their sugars come down. I wouldn’t stop them early, just something to remember for later, once you are done the course of steroids.
 
thebigfuzz said:
Exactly!

Feeding a low carb diet is effective for diabetic cats. Feeding smaller meals through the day, and giving more or higher carb to steer if needed to help surf those green numbers is recommended.

Patience and adjusting the dose according to the protocols is the way of feline diabetes. It’s been less than a month...Every cats is different in how long they take to come to come down. We call them patience pants ;)

Not unusual at all for them to be right near their water dish. They instinctively want to flush the excess sugar from their blood stream - hence the increased water drinking and peeing. That is natural. As numbers come down and kitty regulates more, they tend to drink less.

So best thing you can do is keep learning, be consistent, and by following the protocols for dosing, you will get there!

I think I remember that you said the other night that Squeaky was on steroids? Did I remember that right? Many cats are steroid induced diabetics and once off the steroid, their sugars come down. I wouldn’t stop them early, just something to remember for later, once you are done the course of steroids.
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Oh Tanya,

Thank you for your kind and informative answer. Okay, patience pants it is. I always have a hard time when Squeaky doesn't look well and then it is impatience pants.

We are already on a NO carb diet and have been for several years.

Yes and the vet and I have a plan to get him off the prednisilone and onto budesonide for his IBD. It will take us about 2 weeks to get there. I am interested to see what happens from that alone. The pills should arrive in about 5 days and then we'll see what happens!

Patience pants. Patience pants. Patience pants. Thank you.

Hugs from me and purrs from Squeaky! Jan
 
You are welcome!

PS. It is possible that Squeaky might break the bounce tonight...just based on the declining numbers from AMPS through PMPS. If you can get a +2 before deciding about bedtime, that might be a good idea :)
 
Wow, we are actually going to do a +2 tonight. I was able to move up his shot time to 9 pm, so we can do an 11:00. I'll post as soon as I know!!!

Thank you!!! I appreciate your looking after us!!!!

He played this evening and is looking better now. Moved away from the water dish..... :)

Now I know I can never repay everybody's kindness on this board, but I will pass it along to others in some way..... Thank you.
 
Sounds great!

As you learn and gather information, it won’t be long before you are able to pay forward, if you can, to someone who is new in their journey with their kitty. :) Think of all you know now, that maybe you didn’t a month ago!

We were all new to this at one time :cool:
 
thebigfuzz said:
Sounds great!

As you learn and gather information, it won’t be long before you are able to pay forward, if you can, to someone who is new in their journey with their kitty. :) Think of all you know now, that maybe you didn’t a month ago!

We were all new to this at one time :cool:
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Yes it would be a good idea to help here, at least for a while........ I tend to be overwhelmed most of the time, though, because I take on too many service projects....... seems everybody needs help LOL.

I have learned so much here. I'm much more confident about testing ears and giving insulin shots. The support from this group has been nothing short of AMAZING. It has been an incredible experience for me. I wish everybody could have this much support in their lives.....

I wish I could help everyone...... every time......
 
thebigfuzz said:
Ahhh, balance is important! I totally understand the desire to help everyone, every time.

The board IS amazing! Indeed! :)
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Broke the bounce, he was 110 at +2.

Do I need to do anything? Should I be feeding him trying to bring number up? Test in 1 hour?

Surprisingly, right around the 2 hour mark (we tested about 2.25), he stayed near his water dish, and then went to a quiet hiding place. Acting like high blood glucose..... ????
 
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I think they feel strange when dropping, at least Cosmo does. May be the reason for the hiding. I would feed and test again in an hour. If that test at +3 is lower, you can feed again with maybe a drop of syrup. You want to keep him surfing around 110 for as long as you can. Syrup wears off fast, so if you need to use it, you will need a test again.

I am headed to bed, but @Bandit's Mom and @Bron and Sheba (GA) should be in soon. @Wendy&Neko @tiffmaxee may still be up too.
 
thebigfuzz said:
I think they feel strange when dropping, at least Cosmo does. May be the reason for the hiding. I would feed and test again in an hour. If that test at +3 is lower, you can feed again with maybe a drop of syrup. You want to keep him surfing around 110 for as long as you can. Syrup wears off fast, so if you need to use it, you will need a test again.

I am headed to bed, but @Bandit's Mom and @Bron and Sheba (GA) should be in soon. @Wendy&Neko @tiffmaxee may still be up too.
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Thank you and good night, Tanya!!!!! I just fed Squeaky, about 12 or so pieces of raw pork. Set my alarm for 1 hour.
 
Ok, just so you know, it can be pretty quiet on the board until 1am PST. Seems especially quiet tonight.

Tag some of the members in my post to see if they are on if you need help. But, feed, test until you are confident in safe numbers.
 
I can't stay on too much longer tonight, but good catch on the +2! I do see @Bron and Sheba (GA) lurking in the shadows so hopefully she can check in on you tonight!

In a lot of cats, that +2 can almost act like a crystal ball in predicting what's going to happen later in the cycle.

If the +2 is about the same as the PS, it's usually going to be a pretty normal cycle...gradually down to nadir then gradually back up.

If the +2 is higher than the PS, it's usually a sign that there's a bounce and you can usually take a break on testing as much.

If the +2 is lower than the PS, that's your early warning siren that kitty might have plans to go much lower later in the cycle. (and yes, dropping from 258 to 110 in 2 hours is a BIG drop)

Hopefully a teaspoon or two of his regular food will slow him down and encourage him to surf.

P.S....there are cats that actually do better with low carb instead of no carb, and it's a good idea to have various types of food in the house. Some low/no carb, some medium carb and some high carb. It makes it a lot easier to "steer the curve" with different carb levels available.
 
Chris & China (GA) said:
I can't stay on too much longer tonight, but good catch on the +2! I do see @Bron and Sheba (GA)

P.S....there are cats that actually do better with low carb instead of no carb, and it's a good idea to have various types of food in the house. Some low/no carb, some medium carb and some high carb. It makes it a lot easier to "steer the curve" with different carb levels available.
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Thanks Chris, even a little carbs have caused diarrhea in the past....
 
Chris & China (GA) said:
Yeah, if you don't have any other types of food, a couple of drops of honey and a little more food (you don't want to fill him up in case you need him to continue to eat later)

Test again in 20-30 minutes
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Okay he didn't like the way the honey smelled. I did get some beef baby food, it has cornstarch in it. Would that be better? (If he will eat it)
 
Chris & China (GA) said:
Carbs don't cause diarrhea but sometimes the ingredients that go into the higher carb foods do. I think it was @Wendy&Neko who's cat couldn't tolerate the "gravy" type foods so she had to find something else

Maybe when things have calmed down we can look into other foods that might work.
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Thank you, Chris! He has IBD..... we took him off all carbs. Even a little carbs, gave him diarrhea. We can try again sometime. We're about to change him from prednisilone to budesonide.
 
Jan D said:
Hi Bhooma, +3 =66, Squeaky ate 6 pieces of raw pork, a tiny chicken treat, and I rubbed a little honey on his gums which he didn't like and drank water. Will test again in about 15 minutes.
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It will take more than 15 minutes for the food/honey to hit his bloodstream. Test in half an hour. Since testing is such an issue with him, you could test in hours intervals too, unless he drops below 50.
 
Bandit's Mom said:
It will take more than 15 minutes for the food/honey to hit his bloodstream. Test in half an hour. Since testing is such an issue with him, you could test in hours intervals too, unless he drops below 50.
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Hi Bhooma, +4 = 66 it's been about 45 minutes since he ate 6 pieces of raw pork and I rubbed a tiny bit of honey in his mouth.

I'll just try feeding again and a little honey again.
 
If the next test is higher, you want to get another one without feeding him to see if he stays up without food.
Unless he starts a bounce (number is much higher) in which case you can call it a night!
 
Bandit's Mom said:
:bighug:

You could test in half an hour if you'd like. Though he may want an hour to recover from the latest test!
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Okay, so would you mind explaining what is happening, why this is different? Why no food this time? What is the mechanism we are working with here?

I do get the feeling, he understands somehow that I am loving him, but he of course doesn't like the pricks, etc.
 
Jan D said:
Okay, so would you mind explaining what is happening, why this is different? Why no food this time? What is the mechanism we are working with here?
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OK. Let me see if I can explain this correctly. I've only been here a year, so if I am wrong, hopefully someone with more experience will correct me! (@Bron and Sheba (GA) , @Chris & China (GA) ).

So I guess you know that the insulin action in a normal/active cycle is a curve with the insulin action being strongest till the nadir after which it peters out and numbers start rising on their own. Additionally, when a kitty is breaking a bounce there is more downward momentum. When you get an indication that a cycle is an active/bounce breaking one and the kitty is heading low, you want to feed to keep the kitty in safe numbers - counter the insulin action to the extent required. Once you get an indication that the insulin action is tapering off - that the kitty no longer needs food to keep it from diving - you can stop feeding. This is usually at or around the nadir. With time you get to understand where your kitty nadirs. Nadirs can move around though and are usually lower in bounce breaking cycles.

One thing I am very sure of though - expect the unexpected and expect to get far less sleep than you'd like to! :D
 
Hi Jan and Bhooma
Looks like Squeaky broke the bounce this cycle.
I used to give Sheba honey instead of carbs often to get her numbers up. Honey only lasts an hour or an hour and a half at most so you do need to continue testing beyond that time to see he is coming up on his own and isn’t going to drop back down.

Once you get the numbers up into safe territory feeding a snack of low carb can encourage them to surf in good numbers.
 
Bandit's Mom said:
OK. Let me see if I can explain this correctly. I've only been here a year, so if I am wrong, hopefully someone with more experience will correct me! (@Bron and Sheba (GA) , @Chris & China (GA) ).

So I guess you know that the insulin action in a normal/active cycle is a curve with the insulin action being strongest till the nadir after which it peters out and numbers start rising on their own. Additionally, when a kitty is breaking a bounce there is more downward momentum. When you get an indication that a cycle is an active/bounce breaking one and the kitty is heading low, you want to feed to keep the kitty in safe numbers - counter the insulin action to the extent required. Once you get an indication that the insulin action is tapering off - that the kitty no longer needs food to keep it from diving - you can stop feeding. This is usually at or around the nadir. With time you get to understand where your kitty nadirs. Nadirs can move around though and are usually lower in bounce breaking cycles.

One thing I am very sure of though - expect the unexpected and expect to get far less sleep than you'd like to! :D
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Thanks I will have to re-read it in the morning, since my brains aren't working any longer tonight......

No sleep huh. That is not what I would like to hear. I need sleep.

Okay, 117 (no food before). Now what happens? Do I feed or not? Are we done for the night?
 
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