? 1/30 Ozzy AMPS 293, +1 366, PMPS 246 Labs Posted- Lots of Questions (sorry!)

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Ozzy Pawzbourne

Ozzy Pawzbourne

Member Since 2016
Yesterday

Guys....I got to witness Ozzy produce the most PERFECT poop ever this morning! I'm sorry for the TMI, but we have be struggling with stinky poo and lots of puke lately so it's been obvious that his tummy has been off. I cannot tell you how excited I am to see this! LOL! This was a fecal score of 2. You can read about fecal scores (and other info on GI issues) in the quick reference guide I uploaded. What a way to start the day -- for me and him! :woot::woot::woot::woot::woot:

Thanks for all the guidance on the probiotics, AV Juice, and SEB. I'm sure all three had a part in this.

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Wish I could get a +2. No one is going to be here to monitor today.:) The 366 (from 293) could be a food spike. or a fur shot,....but I doubt it was a fur shot.
 
Ozzy Pawzbourne said:
I know...sorry! :p But the tummy issues have been ruining my life, my carpets, and poor Ozzy's well-being so I am so pleased that things are working again so to speak!
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SOOOOOOOOOOOO glad for this news, Jo:bighug::bighug::bighug:....i love Aloe and SEB...i went and got some yesterday so can quit giving the capsule kind i started using for convenience. Reading your threads reminded me to go get the loose SEB at our Mama Jeans health store....SEB and Aloe ROCK:cool::):rolleyes::woot:
 
And as long as we r talking POOPS, Ozzy's big brother had a great BM as well last night. Tried a suppository...epic fail. Then tried warm water enema with small success. Then we prayed for poo movement and , voila, a really great deposit in the LB. Both our boys must have gotten together and decided to give themselves and us a break :):):):). Its hilarious how a cat pooping can bring such joy and relief:bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug::woot::woot::woot::woot::woot:
 
Beth 73 said:
And as long as we r talking POOPS,
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That's ok - my condo can be the place for poop shop talk today. :woot::woot: So glad to hear Elmo is doing better in this area, too. I was wondering if you had tried the coconut oil someone else suggested.
Beth 73 said:
...i went and got some yesterday
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Oh, I wish you would've told me...I apparently have a life time supply and I could've sent you some. Of course, if I remember correctly: you're like me and an "I want it now" kinda person. So waiting for the mail delivery might not have worked for you. And I'm certainly not amazon! Hah!
 
Ozzy Pawzbourne said:
That's ok - my condo can be the place for poop shop talk today. :woot::woot: So glad to hear Elmo is doing better in this area, too. I was wondering if you had tried the coconut oil someone else suggested.

Oh, I wish you would've told me...I apparently have a life time supply and I could've sent you some. Of course, if I remember correctly: you're like me and an "I want it now" kinda person. So waiting for the mail delivery might not have worked for you. And I'm certainly not amazon! Hah!
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:):):):):):).....yep, sometimes even Amazon moves too slowly for me :woot:
 
@Marje and Gracie Bringing this conversation over to today's condo---

Marje and Gracie said:
It's up to you whether you want to just ask your vet if she has a refractometer and can do a quick in-house USG of an first morning sample.
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I am not opposed to this, but won't be able to do so until this weekend. Probably can't get her a stool sample until then either. How fresh do these samples need to be? Buying that refractometer is not sounding so crazy now. I have no idea how to use it though! Maybe his low USG was a fluke on this test. I think it was normal on the last ones, but I can't view my SS from this computer to tell.
Marje and Gracie said:
I wonder if he might be drinking more than you think plus the water you give him? Still, his USG early in the morning should be above 1.040.
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He could be and maybe we just don't notice. His test was done around 3:30PM in the afternoon (so much later in the day than his early morning wee) and was about 2 hours after he ate his snack (likely with water added). Not sure if that makes a difference.
I tried to do a little research on why USG would be low/dilute and these were the most common causes found:
  • Kidney Disease - but as you mentioned his SDMA, creatine and BUN levels were normal.
  • Liver Disease - he did have abnormal liver enzymes in DKA but his levels have returned to normal
  • HyperT- his T4 test was normal, still waiting for his fT4 to come back
  • Low potassium- he did have lower potassium when in DKA but his levels have returned to normal
  • Overactive adrenals- this was something the vet suggested when he was in the hospital. I'm not sure what tests are done for the adrenals to tell if they are normal/abnormal.
So based on the above potential causes of low USG, I don't know that any of those could be in play right now (I am sure there could be other reasons, too). Or maybe the low USG is an early sign of either kidney disease or liver disease.

Ozzy also has blood and protein in his urine. Could this be from the way the sample was taken? Blood has protein in it and if there is blood in the urine, some protein could spill into the urine as well.

I read that two of the most common reasons for protein in the urine are UTIs and Kidney disease. So here is another marker for kidney issues (as well as the low USG). I also read that protein in very dilute urine is very worrisome. My head is spinning a little.

I also read that an infection in the tract could also cause leakage of protein in the urine. Ozzy seems to have slightly elevated WBC, but I can't tell because there were no reference ranges on the lab (just compared to the reference ranges from the other labs). Ozzy did take a round of antibiotics when he came home from the hospital and his urine culture taken when he was in DKA was negative for an infection.

I'm starting to lean towards the fact that Ozzy may be headed towards kidney trouble even though the vet said he has no renal issues. Maybe not now, but perhaps he is headed that way. If so, what can I do now to intervene/be proactive to make sure things don't get worse or maybe reverse it?

Also, anyone have any feedback on my other questions I posted on yesterday's condo?
  • What are your thoughts on the low amylase result? The vet said that with pancreatitis this number would be elevated so we can rest assure that pancreatitis is not in the mix. I tried to do a little research myself and saw that a low value could indicate pancreas destruction and/or insulin deficiency. Ozzy's tests were normal before so I am not sure why this is coming up below normal now.
  • Total protein in blood is right on the end/low side of the reference range. What does this mean? Is there something we should be looking to do to improve this?
  • What do you think about the notes on the platelets? Vet said the number was low but normal due to clotting.
  • Ozzy's neutrophils came down significantly since his last tests, but his Eosinphils have continued to rise (doubled since last test). Anything else besides parasites to consider? What about Ozzy's GI problems as of late? Also read this could be due to the growth of a tumor.
  • Urine has trace protein. Should we be concerned?
  • Also, what about the WBC and RBC in his urine? There were no references ranges on this test, but it seems the numbers are on the high side compared to the other labs reference ranges (especially the RBC). Could this be from the sample technique (cystocentesis)? The results did show that there was trace blood in his urine. Should we be concerned?
I am SO sorry for all the questions and hypothesizing! This is what happens when you give a lawyer a set of lab work and she starts mulling over every little detail to try to make sense of it all!

Thanks in advance for any feedback!! It is so VERY VERY APPRECIATED!! :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
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Hi Jo.

@Marje and Gracie is the bloodwork guru, so perhaps she can answer your questions. I just work here. ;):p

One thing you can do to help mitigate possible kidney issues is feeds lower phosphorous food. I know the last thing you want to do right now is change Ozzy's food :eek:, but Fancy Feast foods are very high in phosphorous. That's one benefit of going to homemade, which I believe you've been attempting to do when Ozzy isn't jumping off cliffs or puking.

Just have to say, hooray for a perfect poo!
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If you are concerned about protein in the urine being a marker for kidney disease, next time you can get a urine protein/creatinine ratio test done. Protein in the urine was an early indicator of kidney disease for Neko. But of course she liked to confuse things cause it's also common with acrocats. Never did know which (kidney or acro or both) caused the protein. There are several causes of protein in the urine and it needs to be diagnosed before starting the right treatment. Has Ozzy had a blood pressure taken recently? High BP is one cause.

Neko's blood platelet count was almost always low due to clotting. Don't worry about it.

Eosinphils can also be raised due to food allergies. It's mentioned in the ibd link I gave you.

Above all, remember that a blood test is a snapshot in time. Things can change for one sample. Try not to fret or worry about something unless you see it repeated in a second test. I personally had to work to follow that piece of advice my vet gave me.:oops: Did your vet have any concerns with the results?

Oh, and yeah for good poo!
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
Just have to say, hooray for a perfect poo!
dancing-poop.gif
dancing-poop.gif
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Ya for dancing poo!!! This is the greatest thing ever!! Hahaha!

Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
One thing you can do to help mitigate possible kidney issues is feeds lower phosphorous food. I know the last thing you want to do right now is change Ozzy's food :eek:, but Fancy Feast foods are very high in phosphorous. That's one benefit of going to homemade, which I believe you've been attempting to do when Ozzy isn't jumping off cliffs or puking.
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Ozzy is no longer eating FF foods (except GL when he drops low) because he threw up that crap all over my house. :blackeye: He now eats weruva, and from my research this food is one of the best low carb, high protein, low phosphorus foods so I guess we are on the right track food wise. We also feed some raw, but I'm not ready yet to take a leap into the homemade kind yet.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
If you are concerned about protein in the urine being a marker for kidney disease, next time you can get a urine protein/creatinine ratio test done. Protein in the urine was an early indicator of kidney disease for Neko. But of course she liked to confuse things cause it's also common with acrocats. Never did know which (kidney or acro or both) caused the protein. There are several causes of protein in the urine and it needs to be diagnosed before starting the right treatment. Has Ozzy had a blood pressure taken recently? High BP is one cause.

Neko's blood platelet count was almost always low due to clotting. Don't worry about it.

Eosinphils can also be raised due to food allergies. It's mentioned in the ibd link I gave you.

Above all, remember that a blood test is a snapshot in time. Things can change for one sample. Try not to fret or worry about something unless you see it repeated in a second test. I personally had to work to follow that piece of advice my vet gave me.:oops: Did your vet have any concerns with the results?

Oh, and yeah for good poo!
Click to expand...
Hi Wendy, thanks for your feedback.

No, Ozzy has not had a BP taken. I don't know why that is not routine...or maybe it's a big deal to do it to a cat? I'd hate to take him back to the vet just to get a BP.

I'm wondering about the Eosinphils and IBD, obviously because he's had a pukey/pooey problem for several weeks now (that is fortunately starting to take a turn for the better). I did read that article you sent yesterday. Thank you.

The vet did not share any concerns over the results and said we need to focus on his DM management and getting his tummy issues back under control. But she also said he didn't have pancreatitis and all his test came back normal for this even though his SpecFL is still pending. So I'm a critic...and on the fence. :confused: It's also hard to keep having $300 blood tests run regularly, especially after trying to recover from a $5K vet bill for DKA. I am not sure when we should be taking him back for more blood work.
 
Your mileage can vary on getting a BP. Vet's usually won't do it unless they think there's a reason to. Neko used to get huge vetty stress with her blood pressure. But be fine with her blood sugar. :rolleyes: First time we tried getting BP the vet clinic was busy, full of noisy dogs, vetty was late due to an emergency, technicians were new, yada yada. BP was 220 which is very high. Second attempt, a puppy jumped her kennel in the waiting room - result 180. Third attempt at the dental vetty - after being in the cat section of the clinic relaxing with Feliway's going - 140 or normal.
 
Came home and checked the litter box and the kitties were pooing a lot today...like they were saving it up for when I am not here spocking their privacy matters.

There were several nice looking deposits and then a few loose tacky ones. Then it dawned on me...they are Figgie's!! His diet changed drastically too! He has been on probiotics, AV juice, and SEB since yesterday too so hoping he improves as well. Having my civvie kitty having similar issues (minus all the vomiting) makes me feel better that it is probably all the diet changes recently that are causing all Ozzy's GI problems. Hoping things continue to improve for both my buddies in the coming weeks.
 
Ozzy Pawzbourne said:
@Marje and Gracie Bringing this conversation over to today's condo---
I am not opposed to this, but won't be able to do so until this weekend. Probably can't get her a stool sample until then either. How fresh do these samples need to be? Buying that refractometer is not sounding so crazy now. I have no idea how to use it though! Maybe his low USG was a fluke on this test. I think it was normal on the last ones, but I can't view my SS from this computer to tell.

He could be and maybe we just don't notice. His test was done around 3:30PM in the afternoon (so much later in the day than his early morning wee) and was about 2 hours after he ate his snack (likely with water added). Not sure if that makes a difference.
I tried to do a little research on why USG would be low/dilute and these were the most common causes found:
  • Kidney Disease - but as you mentioned his SDMA, creatine and BUN levels were normal.
  • Liver Disease - he did have abnormal liver enzymes in DKA but his levels have returned to normal
  • HyperT- his T4 test was normal, still waiting for his fT4 to come back
  • Low potassium- he did have lower potassium when in DKA but his levels have returned to normal
  • Overactive adrenals- this was something the vet suggested when he was in the hospital. I'm not sure what tests are done for the adrenals to tell if they are normal/abnormal.
So based on the above potential causes of low USG, I don't know that any of those could be in play right now (I am sure there could be other reasons, too). Or maybe the low USG is an early sign of either kidney disease or liver disease.

Ozzy also has blood and protein in his urine. Could this be from the way the sample was taken? Blood has protein in it and if there is blood in the urine, some protein could spill into the urine as well.

I read that two of the most common reasons for protein in the urine are UTIs and Kidney disease. So here is another marker for kidney issues (as well as the low USG). I also read that protein in very dilute urine is very worrisome. My head is spinning a little.

I also read that an infection in the tract could also cause leakage of protein in the urine. Ozzy seems to have slightly elevated WBC, but I can't tell because there were no reference ranges on the lab (just compared to the reference ranges from the other labs). Ozzy did take a round of antibiotics when he came home from the hospital and his urine culture taken when he was in DKA was negative for an infection.

I'm starting to lean towards the fact that Ozzy may be headed towards kidney trouble even though the vet said he has no renal issues. Maybe not now, but perhaps he is headed that way. If so, what can I do now to intervene/be proactive to make sure things don't get worse or maybe reverse it?

Also, anyone have any feedback on my other questions I posted on yesterday's condo?
  • What are your thoughts on the low amylase result? The vet said that with pancreatitis this number would be elevated so we can rest assure that pancreatitis is not in the mix. I tried to do a little research myself and saw that a low value could indicate pancreas destruction and/or insulin deficiency. Ozzy's tests were normal before so I am not sure why this is coming up below normal now.
  • Total protein in blood is right on the end/low side of the reference range. What does this mean? Is there something we should be looking to do to improve this?
  • What do you think about the notes on the platelets? Vet said the number was low but normal due to clotting.
  • Ozzy's neutrophils came down significantly since his last tests, but his Eosinphils have continued to rise (doubled since last test). Anything else besides parasites to consider? What about Ozzy's GI problems as of late? Also read this could be due to the growth of a tumor.
  • Urine has trace protein. Should we be concerned?
  • Also, what about the WBC and RBC in his urine? There were no references ranges on this test, but it seems the numbers are on the high side compared to the other labs reference ranges (especially the RBC). Could this be from the sample technique (cystocentesis)? The results did show that there was trace blood in his urine. Should we be concerned?
I am SO sorry for all the questions and hypothesizing! This is what happens when you give a lawyer a set of lab work and she starts mulling over every little detail to try to make sense of it all!

Thanks in advance for any feedback!! It is so VERY VERY APPRECIATED!! :bighug::bighug::bighug::bighug:
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If they drew urine via cystocentesis, it could be the cause of the blood in the urine if they nicked a capillary. I would probably not get too worked up about trace protein in the urine but it's likely they still have his urine sample and they could run the protein:creatinine ratio. I actually think you'd be seeing some issues with his creatinine and SDMA. I might just take another urine sample in in a few weeks and have them retest it and then you'll see what the trend is for his USG and the protein. If you aren't checking a sample for bacteria, then it does not need to be sterile. You can collect it first thing in the morning, put it in the frig, and run it to the vet when you can.

You can't reverse chronic kidney disease and, as I said, he's not really showing that right now. When a kitty is dx with it in early stages, the biggest thing is to feed low phosphorus foods but Ozzy's P is fine now.

On the other question:
  • I responded yesterday on low amylase. It's usually of no significance. I, personally, wouldn't worry about it.
  • I wouldn't worry about the total protein value. It can vary; again labs see a snapshot in time so just watch for trends.
  • It is not uncommon at all for platelets to clump when they draw the blood and the value to be low. I wouldn't worry about one test.
  • I responded yesterday about eosinophils. Several things can cause an elevation: allergies, fleas, parasites, IBD, etc...I left you a list. With his vomiting and poo issues, I wouldn't be surprised if he had IBD but you'd have to do an ultrasound to see if his intestines were thickened. IBD is definitively diagnosed by biopsy but I would start with an U/S.
  • I wouldn't worry about trace protein in the urine; just do another urinalysis in a bit and see what it looks like then.
  • His WBCs in urine are normal; the rbcs can be from nicking a capillary if they did cystocentesis.
 
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@Marje and Gracie Thank you for taking the time to reply and provide feedback on Ozzy's labs. I am sorry; I don't see the comments you reference that you posted on my condo yesterday (albumin or eosinphils) which I why I was still seeking feedback. Thank you so much for your thoughts today. I really appreciate it and value your feedback.
 
@Taffysmama amazon! My trusted online retailer for pretty much everything! Want some?? I have a lifetime supply! lol. I will mail you some for free if you want. PM me if interested.

Don't worry- it will all have to come out of Taffy at some point!

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Ozzy Pawzbourne said:
@Taffysmama amazon! My trusted online retailer for pretty much everything! Want some?? I have a lifetime supply! lol. I will mail you some for free if you want. PM me if interested.

Don't worry- it will all have to come out of Taffy at some point!

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LOL, that is a big bag! I buy 4 oz. bags at my local health food store, in Whittier, and that will last me a long time (years). I used it more frequently with other cats, but does not seem to do much for Taffy. He might even be allergic. You can use it for the mama bean and papa bean, too, since you have so much. It is good for digestive upset, acid reflux, sore throat (with honey). Just look up recipes. Thank you for the generous offer, though.
 
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