1/20 Blackie

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Ele & Blackie (GA)

Ele & Blackie (GA)

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Here are Blackie's numbers since last night:
+12 78
+13 pmps 117 2.2 units
+1 129
+3.5 166
+5 239
+10.5 294
+11 amps 323 2.2 units

I'm wondering if he hasn't been in a small rebound every night for the last few nights. We'll see if the 2.2 will bring him back down tonight. I'll ask DH to get some spot checks today too.

Thanks for all your help last night Terri.
Hope everyone has a good Wednesday.
 
+1 294 Do you think that's really a drop or is it within the error range of the monitor? I don't know why he would go up and then go down an hour later when the shot couldn't have taken affect yet.
 
The 2.2 wasn't quite enough last night at the 117. Let's see how it does today, but consider that tonight may need to be 2.3.

According to all the reading I've done on Type II diabetes (all in humans of course), the pancreas continues to produce insulin. The problem is that it loses the ability to make use of the insulin it produces, creating insulin resistance. So it's possible that this morning's drop is the result of his pancreas in conjunction with a bit of overlap from last night's exogenous insulin. We can't know for sure of course and it's always possible that cats don't work the same as humans, but if they do, the zinc in the insulin helps support the cellular transport. Lantus and Lev both have zinc in their formulations, same as PZI, for this very reason.
 
I don't know if the 2.2 was not enough. We had a better amps this morning on the 2.2 than we've been having on the 2.4. And last night, Blackie couldn't get enough food. He was crying for food almost every hour. We had turkey for dinner and he was begging at our feet - something he has never done before. I'm just wondering if his body isn't saying "Hey, that 78 was really low, lets put some glucogen in here to make sure we don't go too low." and then his bg's go up for the night. Maybe I'm making too much of this because I want to have an answer for everything. :?
 
Have I asked you if Blackie has ever been tested for hyperthyroidism? I'm sorry if I'm repeating myself, but Lucy was pretty well regulated and still clawing my legs anytime I went to the kitchen and sticking her nose in my plate while I was eating my own dinner, behavior she has never before exhibited. We had to test her 3 times to finally get a positive on the free T4, but since she's been on the tapazole that begging behavior has resolved. However, with the hyperthyroidism also came the need for substantially more insulin (.8 units to 2.5 units).
 
He had a T4 test in November, but I don't think it was a free T4. I guess I don't know the difference. I can request one the next time we do bloodwork which will be in a month or so. Blackie is usually pretty laid back about his food, but last night was different.
 
Not sure if I'm getting the cart before the horse here. H has has several T4 tests that were above normal [I can dig specifics if it would help]. And we went round and round with it trying to figure out if he really was hyperthyroid. He did not exhibit any of the behavior [except hypothyroid? - sluggish]. Once a T4 blood test [or multiple] has raised suspicions, sicntigraphy is the method for confirmation. Anyway, H had multiple abnormal T4 results a normal for his age sicntigraphy and one or two more abnormal T4 tests. It is instructive that none of our vets [including our endocrinologist] suggested T3 or any of the other indicators. Ultimately it was put to rest that T4 can be inaccurate. If you do go the sicntigraphy route you will need to find a radiologist [nuclear medicine specialist] here is their website http://www.acvr.org/pet_owners/ . And if you do have the sicntigraphy done, for some reason it seems to matter who it is done by since any new vet I discussed the sicntigraphy results with wanted to know who it was done by...

The bottom line is that those darn T4s are not fool proof and I'd have a problem trusting them [positive or negative].
 
elle, tomtom was just tested today for his t4's to see if he's hyperT.
my understanding is that in an older cat, 7+ the t4's should be going down not up.
if he's symtomatic and has t4 abouve 2.5 that is rising he may very well have hypert.
i know the range is 0.8-4.0 but in an older cat the #'s drop.
i'm kind of hoping tomtom is hyperT cuase i think that would be a dx i could deal with.
he's back from a 2 year remission and i hope it's hypert.
i'll be watching what happens with you.
lori
and tomtom too!
 
Thanks, Lori. Blackie's T4 was 2.6 in his last bloodwork, but he is asymptomatic other than being hungry at night. I suspect that I have created a monster by feeding him from the table. I just started that the last time we had turkey and I guess when he smells turkey he thinks it's his dinner. :razz: I hope you figure out what's going on with Tom and get him back to OTJ.
 
elle, i'm curious why you shoot so much...2.2 into 117. is that in a u100 syringe? and the fact that he went up up up afterwards i agree (if i may be so bold as a newbie all over again) could be that the liver picked up on all that insulin and shot out some sugar.
pzi crowd please don't jump on me for having a thought, i know i am not up to speed. if there is a reason blackie is a high dose kittie i just don't know about it.
also elle, has blackie lost any weight or become more racy around the house? is he meowing more? just some other symptoms of hyper t. how old is blackie?
 
looks to me like he got his 2.2u and all he did for 12 hours was go up....am i missing something?
 
Hi Lori,
You ask a lot of good questions. If you look at the other page of his spreadsheet you'll see that since we started testing last April, he has been all over the place. For several months he was getting less than 1 unit, and then a UTI shot him way up. We got him down again below 1 unit, then another UTI combined with a vacation/pet sitter situation got him unregulated. Ever since then, he has needed between 2 and 3 units BID.

We have data that shows that we can shoot low numbers and I generally make sure that he's bg's are rising before we shoot. I would never recommend this to a newbie. As I said, I'm thinking those high flat numbers at night could be rebound. But I've found that it's never that cut & dried. It might be rebound and it might not. The only way to tell is to lower the dose.

Regarding Blackie, he is almost 17 years old and he has early renal insufficiency (CRF) and arthritis in addition to his diabetes. He has been diabetic for 4 1/2 years, but we didn't change his diet to lc canned and start testing until last year. He is his same old self, sleeps a lot, goes outside for a walk when the weather's good and has stayed at the same weight for several years.

I need to get that in my signature, but I just haven't had time. I hope you and Tom are doing well.
 
It's almost like he needs a tinse less during the day and tinse more at night to get things leveled out then maybe try to march back down. Good thing is some consistency in the trend over the past few days.
 
Gator & H said:
It's almost like he needs a tinse less during the day and tinse more at night to get things leveled out then maybe try to march back down. Good thing is some consistency in the trend over the past few days.
Click to expand...

Exactly what I was thinking. I'd stick with the 2.0 during the day and try the 2.2 at night.
 
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