05/07/21 LUCY 233 AMPS (insulin halted)

Susan and Lucy

Susan and Lucy

Member Since 2021
https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/thr...en-70-1st-day-on-insulin.247023/#post-2786611

Elise suggested starting a new thread...

Lucy is SO much better today. Yesterday she would not drink or eat and her breathing at one point got so slow that I thought I might be watching her last breath! But over night last night, she perked up and woke me up at 3am when she jumped up on the bed and started howling to wake me up. It was the most wonderful hollering I have ever heard from her! She was wide awake, not lethargic and ready to party, albeit still wobbly.

Since her neuropathy didn't magically cure itself, she jumped UP on the bed just fine, but jumping DOWN didn't go so well and she landed on her face when her legs gave out upon landing. After that happened, I put a big plastic tub at the end of the bed for a step with a heavy blanket on top for some traction. It is helping. She had one more accident today when she fell off of the top of her cat tower. I'm not even sure how/when she got up there. I may need to lay that thing down on the floor until I'm sure that she can get down when I'm not in the room. It's already positioned right next to a sofa for easier access, but that wasn't enough to prevent a fall in this case. She's okay, though I may have aged 10 years. Since she ate well today, I managed to get the first dose of Methyl B12 into her relatively easily.

Her alertness, appetite and thirst are coming back. I can't tell you how happy I am. She wants to hang out on the couch and watch TV with me as always, instead of hiding under things like she did yesterday when she was feeling so bad. I know that there are still issues and she can't just go without any insulin forever. I don't know if it's recommended that I defy my (current) vet and give her a partial dose. He says he doesn't do partial units, so he says that it's either 1 unit (which resulted in the crash) or NO insulin. Right now, she's on NO insulin until further notice from the vet. Her numbers were 233 on the ReliOn and 194 on the Alphatrak2 today about 4 hours after her morning meal. I will test her again about 4 hours after her evening meal. Since I'm not giving her insulin right now, the vet said not to test her OTHER than 4 hrs past each of the two meals. I know he doesn't do half unit dosing, but if that were the most appropriate plan, I believe that I am perfectly capable of measuring out 1/2 unit in the U100 syringe. I have a magnifying lamp that will help me get more specific. But I'm a little nervous about going rogue. I DO keep in mind that this vet originally wanted her to start with 2 units and I was the one who fought for 1 unit (thanks to the wisdom of the experts here on this forum).

She doesn't look like she's going to die any moment like she did yesterday so I'm greatly relieved.

-- Susan, who doesn't know how to write brief posts ;)
 
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If you use calipers you can measure the most minute dose. I think a lot of us do go rogue with dosing. Both my vets gave up trying to get me to do it their way. However, they knew I tested and would not put them in harm and I knew what to do if they got to low. Maybe 0.25 units would be better to start with, just a thought. You can work up if need to.

Vet might be thinking your using the pen. They only measure in whole units. Once you get it down you can teach vet how to do partial doses.
 
I’m sorry but I disagree with your vet. That’s no reason to only give whole unit doses. We increase and decrease in .25 increments. So many cats would go hypo on whole unit increases. I even increased and decreased in 1/8 increments using digital calipers.
I’m glad she’s feeling better. The neuropathy shows that she needs insulin. If off too long she will need bigger doses.
 
tiffmaxee said:
I’m sorry but I disagree with your vet. That’s no reason to only give whole unit doses. We increase and decrease in .25 increments. So many cats would go hypo on whole unit increases. I even increased and decreased in 1/8 increments using digital calipers.
I’m glad she’s feeling better. The neuropathy shows that she needs insulin. If off too long she will need bigger doses.
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This is a good point - about staying off insulin too long. There is a Harbor Freight right by my house. I read some messages on the forum about the calipers so I will make that happen.
 
I'm so glad she's feeling better!!! You really had a trial by fire... so glad you talked the vet out of giving 2 U. :eek:

I'm completely doing my own thing with dosing; my vet's great for other stuff, but this is out of his area and I'm getting better (and prompter!) advice from the board here. If you're willing to go that route, there are people here who can help you with dosing. The calipers are incredibly handy, especially for low doses. Look at the SS for Butters for an example of some really fine dose adjustments.

Thanks for starting the new thread; another thing we try to do is add a link to the previous day's thread so it's easy for someone to backtrack and see what's been going on recently. You can look at other people's posts today for examples. You can just copy the URL from yesterday's thread and paste it into today's using the "link" icon in the formatting bar.
 
Olive & Paula said:
If you use calipers you can measure the most minute dose. I think a lot of us do go rogue with dosing. Both my vets gave up trying to get me to do it their way. However, they knew I tested and would not put them in harm and I knew what to do if they got to low. Maybe 0.25 units would be better to start with, just a thought. You can work up if need to.

Vet might be thinking your using the pen. They only measure in whole units. Once you get it down you can teach vet how to do partial doses.
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Sadly, my vet said that he only does partial units because he doesn't think that the customers can measure smaller increments successfully. He knows I'm not using a pen because he sold me the syringes just a few days ago. Now that I have been through a hypo episode, I know what it looks like. I will start with .25 unit this weekend. As I mentioned to Elise, I will try to get some calipers tomorrow to make that easier. I have a magnifying lamp where the light is a ring light and the middle part is the magnifier so it leaves both hands free. Thanks for the great advice!
 
Susan and Lucy said:
Sadly, my vet said that he only does partial units because he doesn't think that the customers can measure smaller increments successfully. He knows I'm not using a pen because he sold me the syringes just a few days ago. Now that I have been through a hypo episode, I know what it looks like. I will start with .25 unit this weekend. As I mentioned to Elise, I will try to get some calipers tomorrow to make that easier. I have a magnifying lamp where the light is a ring light and the middle part is the magnifier so it leaves both hands free. Thanks for the great advice!
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Do the syringes have 1/2 unit marks? That helps.
 
Olive & Paula said:
Do the syringes have 1/2 unit marks? That helps.
Click to expand...

No they don't have the half unit marks. I probably shouldn't have purchased them from the vet. I had already been reading on this forum about the 1/2 unit markings when his officer told me that they had set aside a box of syringes for me (at a jacked up price too, little did I know at the time). My fault entirely. I should have stuck to my guns and turned them down. I will use my magnifier light and also the calipers as soon as I am able to go get them from Harbor Freight. Believe me, after getting through the low BG event this week, I will be paying VERY close attention! I have a lot of motivation to any more of these events!
 
It is soooo good to read of the improvement since yesterday. You must have been so happy when she woke you yelling for food! Good luck with the calipers.
 
Liz & Minnie said:
It is soooo good to read of the improvement since yesterday. You must have been so happy when she woke you yelling for food! Good luck with the calipers.
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You know it! I was a zombie this morning with no sleep. I didn't mention that I was up til 2:00 - watching Lucy and being worried. Then she woke me up at 3:00 and after I went back to bed, she woke me up for good between 6:00 and 7:00. I was thrilled! I might be less thrilled if she does it again tonight. LOL. Of course, now that I'm almost catatonic from sleep deprivation (no pun intended), I have to stay up to test her glucose at 11:00pm first. What we do for our kitties! (The vet wants me to test 4 hours after each meal for now.)
 
I can imagine. Those nights are NOT FUN.

I had to go and research, reading about your vet is getting my BP up! This is the info for the vet from the other post, don't know if it's anywhere near you though

https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/thr...22-6-173-8-161-hold-dose.246940/#post-2785353
Jaime & Mowgli said:
Vet update: I found a mobile vet who was willing to come to our house and draw blood from Mowgli (and his brother Junior) to run another comprehensive panel and IGF-1 & IAA. The vet was VERY nice and helpful. He was very open to us running the tests. He even took the time to look through Mowgli's entire spreadsheet! His words were "Considering how much effort you are putting in to care for Mowgli, I want to make sure I do you justice". We didn't discuss treatment of Acro if Mowgli comes back positive, but he seemed very open to working with us. He even said he would do some research on his own regarding treatment options and that I am welcome to forward him any information I have since he sees that I am well informed. Needless to say I am very happy to have found this vet!
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Jaime & Mowgli said:
His name is Dr. David Lepovic, and he has his practice out of Rancho Cucamonga. His website says he serves the San Bernardino County area (https://www.homeveterinaryhousecalls.com/), so I'm not sure if Los Angeles is too far for him. But I would definitely recommend him based on my one housecall.
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Liz & Minnie said:
I can imagine. Those nights are NOT FUN.

I had to go and research, reading about your vet is getting my BP up! This is the info for the vet from the other post, don't know if it's anywhere near you though

https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/thr...22-6-173-8-161-hold-dose.246940/#post-2785353
Click to expand...

Thanks Liz. I think he's probably too far to come to me. I'm technically in Pasadena, but his location in Rancho Cucamonga is 35-40 miles from me. I will keep this information though. You never know. There are a few local mobile vets that I have seen people glowingly recommend on NextDoor (social media site) for in home euthanasia...not something I'm looking for right now! But they have wonderful reviews AND they are full-fledged vets so I might look into that as well. I hadn't really considered mobile vets before you mentioned it.
 
Hi, don't think of it as "defying your vet" so much as just doing what is best for your kitty. You are Lucy's advocate and a paying customer. You don't have to listen to what the vet says and imo they don't know everything. I'm another person who has done everything diabetes-related for Butters exclusively with the help of people on this board and did not listen to the vets...but not before purchasing overpriced supplies, including a box of syringes without 1/2 unit markings on them. Those I ended up donating to a local animal shelter.

I've had to go up against a number of vets who did not know much about feline diabetes and I basically would do a "smile and nod" when they told me what to do, and I would continue getting help here. One vet decided Butters was in remission when she was getting 1u of insulin because she was mostly in normal range. She couldn't seem to understand that her numbers were good because of the insulin. Butters was in the hospital for pancreatitis at the time, so the vet initially stopped insulin without my consent. Butters became unregulated and it took me over two months and going up to 4.25u to get her regulated again. :banghead:

Her current vet is fantastic because he actually looks at the humans as equal partners in the care of the animal. And he is completely hands off with her diabetes except to give high praise for how good her spreadsheet looks. It looks the way it does because of the people on FDMB.

Best of luck with the .25u dose!
 
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