04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 +4 45 +4.5 70 +5 59 +5.5 56

Status
Not open for further replies.

SugarFreeLucy

Member Since 2012
Morning all!

Well both Lucy and I managed a few hours sleep last night! I'm thankful that we have a well stocked selection of coffee to help me get through the workday!

Here is yesterday: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=69599

Miss Lucy is now down to 0.25u (yikes! that is hard to measure) her appetite is good and she seems to have forgiven me for the many extra pokes last night!

A big thank you again to all those who were checking on us last night!

slightly sleep deprived Val & Lucy
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy AMPS 83

Morning, Lucy is doing great! Congrats on the dosecrease. That's great with the good stock of coffee. :-D Have a nice day.
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy AMPS 83

Hi guys .. congrats on the decrease! AMPS is looking great lucy .. hope the coffee helps you through the day! Have a great weekend guys!
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy AMPS 83 PMPS 74

Evening everyone!

As you can see, Miss Lucy is having a lovely green start to the evening! For some reason she didn't eat her feeder meals today..was starving when i tested, but didn't finish all of her dinner?!? Not sure what that is about, I am wondering if she doesn't like the flavours of food she gets.

Will see how the evening progresses!
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32

So apparently I don't need sleep tonight!!!

Tested at +2, almost fell off my chair! My meter read 1.8 :shock: (~32US) She had no symptons, was snuggling on the couch beside me!

She has been given maple syrup (HC was in the car - hadn't unloaded groceries yet!) and I panicked lol

Will re-test in 30min
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32

With a 32, I'd prefer you retest in 20 minutes, just in case she goes lower KWIM?
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +2 (20min) ~41

ok, tested at +2 and 20 min, she is up to ~41 now.

Gave her some HC (mostly gravy, maybe about 4 chunks of food) she scarfed it down! She is currently getting a drink and heading back to her favourite pillow!
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 - repeat of last night?!?

Still at 41. gave more hc gravy. testing again in 30min

I assume that this is an indication that Ms. Pancreas has decided to come back from vacation and start working again?? I am also assuming that another decrease is in order for Lucy...I go to 0.10 in the am right? I don't stop the insulin 'cold turkey' right?

Will report back in 30min
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 - repeat of last night?!?

don't stop the insulin cold turkey YET - but sometimes 2 cycles in a row can be from the left-over higher dose in the previous cycle. in other words, her higher dose yesterday could still be affecting today's numbers, even though you reduced the dose this morning.

we like to see above 50 - that leaves a margin of safety. so keep testing every 20-30 minutes and repeat til you've got her above 50.

excellent catch. i'm glad you weren't complacent. there's nothing about this FD that one can ignore! great job.
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 - repeat of last night?!?

Woo Hoo!!! And Julie's at the plate as ump tonight ;-) ;-) :lol:
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 - repeat of last night?!?

+3.5 and still at 41

More hc and gave a tsp of lc...she is ravenous!
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 - repeat of last night?!?

hahaha marje. ;-)

might be a good idea to add a drop of karo syrup if she's still below 50 in the next test, which i'm assuming could be any moment now.
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 - repeat of last night?!?

Hey Julie!

You must have been posting as I was testing! She was below 50...45 to be exact. Gave her a tsp of food and some syrup again!
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 +4 45 repeat of last nigh

allrighty! i'd really like to see her above 50, although we don't want to overcarb her . . . i think i'd give a little larger amount of HC if she's still below 50 on the next test.
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 +4 45 repeat of last nigh

Val, are you home tomorrow to monitor?

we need to talk about her dose before you shoot in the morning, and it makes a difference if you are home to monitor or not.

eta: KWIM = know what i mean?
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 +4 45 repeat of last nigh

ok, as of +4.5 she is up to 71. gave her a tiny bit (1 tsp) of LC food, she is hungry!

As for tomorrow, I wasn't planning to be home for a decent part of the day, but I can be if needed. Was supposed to help out at the inlaw's garage sale, but can bail if needed.

I do have to be out for about an hour in the morning..but am flexible as to when that hour is.
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 +4 45 +4.5 70

glad she's up! yay!

just like last night, you want to see 2 rising numbers past the nadir that are not food influenced before you stop for the night. i think i'd stop giving her food now so you know if it's the food keeping her up, or if the lantus cycle is waning and she's just coming up. retest in 30 minutes.

ok, we'll put heads together and see if we have an idea for the morning. make sure you check here before you shoot.
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 +4 45 +4.5 70

Ok, at +5 she is at 59
No food after this test...she is not amused!

I will test again in 30 min. And I will make sure I check in the morning before I shoot....I am guessing my options are shoot or not shoot?
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 +4 45 +4.5 70

there's no way to know if this low number is still leftover shed from yesterday's dose. it's possible. if that's the case, then repeating the .25u dose would be smart. the protocol calls for a reduction when a newly diagnosed cat goes under 50, but sometimes when they are sequential cycles it doesn't hold.

but . . . it could be that lucy is on a mission to get off of insulin. that's what it's looking like.

i think your choice is to shoot 0.1u or skip - it might be too soon to reduce, but i doubt you want to keep repeating tonight and last night. if she were mine, i would follow the protocol and shoot the 0.1u. the best success is to work through the dosing protocol, let the pancreas heal in those green numbers. if you shoot, you really have to monitor, however. we don't have a crystal ball to know what she might do.

Reducing the dose:
If kitty drops below 40 (long term diabetic) or 50 (newly diagnosed diabetic) reduce the dose by 0.25 unit. If kitty has a history of not holding reductions well or if reductions are close together... sneak the dose down by shaving the dose rather than reducing by a full quarter unit. Alternatively, at each newly reduced dose... try to make sure kitty maintains numbers in the normal range for seven days before reducing the dose further.
If an attempted reduction fails, go right back up to the last good dose.
Try to go from 0.25u to 0.1u before stopping insulin completely.

if you get a preshot number in the morning that makes you want advice, post and include "dose help now" or something like that, in your subject line and hopefully someone will be on to give you a hand.
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 +4 45 +4.5 70

she seems to be settling in the 50s...at +5.5 she is at 56

Ok, I am also inclined to shoot the 0.1u, just becuase it seems to cause more problems if/when I skip doses! Lucy sure does seem to be on a mission to be finished with insulin sooner than later (not that I am complaining! :lol: )
And I don't think I can handle a third sleep deprived night in a row, I will however make my decision when I see her pre shot number in the morning.

I will make sure that I post if the morning number is concerning, hopefully there will be someone around

Testing again in 30 min
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 +4 45 +4.5 70 +5 59 +5.5

sounds like a good plan! you're doing a great job, val! really!

you shoot at 7am East coast time? there are usually people on by then.

here is the information from the yellow starred sticky above on Low Numbers that pertains to a low preshot number:

HOW TO DEAL WITH LOW PRESHOT NUMBERS

**** The following guidelines apply to the Tight Regulation Protocol for Lantus or Levemir ****


You just tested your cat’s preshot number, and there is a much lower than usual number staring back at you. What do you do?

There is no one-size-fits all answer, but there are some general guidelines. As with everything else, each cat is different (ECID) and each caregiver is different too.

The short answer is that most kitties can be shot at +12, almost regardless of the number, once you are data ready to do so. The exception is that shooting 30s or 40s is not recommended for most cats, so if the cat is less than 50 then usually the best option is to wait until they are above 50 to shoot. While you’re waiting, the shed is draining, so you want to get the insulin in as soon as it makes sense to shoot.

If it is your first time shooting green, then we will likely suggest that you stall the first time, even if the number is 80-100. That will let you collect data on what your cat will do when you stall. One thing you can do if you are having a low cycle is to get a +10 and +11. Those will give you a good idea of how quickly the cat’s numbers are rising (or not) when preshot time arrives.

Beyond the general guidelines, there are other factors we consider when we are helping someone with a low preshot.
If the low preshot is not part of that cat’s normal pattern or there is reason to think something might be wrong, we will be more conservative.
If the cat is not a food spiker or tends to have an early onset/early nadir then they may not want to shoot as low. If the cat has a late nadir, then they will HAVE to learn to shoot low.
We will also be more conservative in some cases because of the person – if you are not able to monitor then you want to be more careful, or if you are not sure that you can get back to the board to keep us updated throughout the cycle. Trust me, if you shoot low, we will be watching for your updates and we will worry if we don’t see them.
We have to be a lot more careful with the cats who eat only dry food, because they don’t have access to the tools the rest of us use to keep our cats safe.
Also, when it comes to very low preshots, there is an unwritten rule that whoever helps that person shoot low should expect to sit with them through any low parts of the cycle. There have been times when I knew a cat’s number was likely shootable, but I also knew that I could not be around to help if the shot resulted in low numbers later in the cycle. For safety’s sake, if I could not find someone else who would be available to support for the next several hours, I would most likely suggest that the shot be reduced or skipped. I will not encourage someone to shoot low and then abandon them.
There are a lot of other scenarios, and you always want to keep your cat in mind.

Some general rules when stalling (ECID):

** 50s or higher – don’t feed. The number will bump up on its own soon due to the insulin wearing off.
** 40s or lower – you have a couple of choices.

When 40’s occur at the end of the cycle, it can be beneficial to withhold food and test in 15-20 minutes to determine if kitty is on the rise or hasn’t reached nadir yet.
If they are hanging in the 40s for a while, or if they are still dropping, it is ok to feed a tsp or two of LC and retest. This is very tricky. You want to avoid feeding too much while you’re waiting for them to go over 50, because you don’t want to artificially inflate the number with food.
--- Example: if kitty is 43 and you feed a whole meal, or feed some HC, and the number bumps up to 52, is that the cat’s natural end-of-cycle rise, or is it food spike? What if it is food spike? Then if you shoot the 52, when the food wears off he might drop back to the 40’s (and when insulin kicks in a couple of hours later, you might have a problem). If the 52 is the cat’s natural rise, then he will probably keep rising for the next few hours until insulin kicks in. If you can’t tell whether the number is food spike or natural rise, it’s safest to wait. Your data will help you here. Study the spreadsheet. How much food spike does the cat usually get? How many hours after the shot does the insulin’s onset usually occur in this cat? At what number is the cat likely to be when onset occurs? If the cat does drop, how easy/hard is it to regain control of the numbers? How carb sensitive is he?

** Test often (every 15-20 minutes, or at most every 30 minutes). You want to catch the rise the minute it starts. With most of our cats, once they start to rise they will really zoom. You want to get the insulin in as soon as possible, because it will be another 2-3 hours before the insulin kicks in and you don’t want to let the cycle get too far ahead of you.

Perhaps the most important guideline in shooting low is that any time you shoot your lowest ever number, you should get a +1 and +2 to give you an idea of how the cycle will go. If the +1 is not higher than PS, or if +2 is much lower than PS, that means “pay attention” over the next few hours. Those tests will also help you become even more data ready for the next time you are presented with a low preshot reading.

Using the overlap by shooting low is a great way to take advantage of Lantus/Levemir’s long, flat cycles, once you have learned to do so safely.

~ written by Libby and Lucy
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 +4 45 +4.5 70 +5 59 +5.5

thank you julie! I appreciate the support! Just tested again...+6 she is at 59. Should I be doing something more to bump her up a bit more? She seems to be leveling out over the last 3 tests?!?

Yes, we test at 7am EST, I usually don't stay on too much in the mornings as I am rushing to work, so I don't usually get to see who is on. Thanks for posting the sticky about low pre-shots, funny because I was reading that tonight before I shot her 74!
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 +4 45 +4.5 70 +5 59 +5.5

good for you for reading the sticky tonight! i know when i first started i knew i'd read things, but didn't know where to find them again half the time! :lol: so i always find things for new people in case they are in the same spot i was!

you don't have to do anything. this is a safe range - if you want to go to bed it would be a good idea to leave a little more LC food out for her. as long as she's coasting along it's ok to just keep monitoring her without giving more food.

is that about as clear as mud? :roll: let me try again:

if you want to go to bed, once you've had 2 flat or rising numbers without giving food, go ahead, but leave a little more LC out since she's not exactly high!

if you're staying up to monitor, you don't need to feed her.
 
Re: 04/27 Lucy PMPS 74 +2 32 +3 41 +4 45 +4.5 70 +5 59 +5.5

Yep! Clear as mud! :lol:

I am going to do one more test at +6.5 then head for bed. I will make sure I leave some LC out for her over night. I think we both would benefit from a few hours sleep, and a few less ear pokes!

Thank you again Julie for staying up with us, we truly appreciate it :smile:

Will check in again at morning test time!

Have a good rest of your night
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top