? 02/15 Tinka 74 PMPS (LC meal),86 +1,67 +2 (2 tsp LC),74 +3,81 +4 (LC meal),99 +5.5,104 +6,133 +7.5

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TanyaG

TanyaG

Member Since 2016
Hi all, having an interesting cycle with Tinka today. We did a dose reduction 8 cycles ago for a number of factors mostly as she wasn't eating well, we had to shoot very low and then she dropped early at +1 so had to use a drop of honey and at +2 again. She's also recently stopped her AM steroid. We were planning to maintain this 2.5 dose for up 10 to cycles as we saw nadir's under 100. We are currently on cycle 9.

She started off a bit high today at AMPS could have been a bounce from seeing blue all day yest but may also have been as I slightly increased her PM steroid as unfort she's started to itch a bit again. Ideally if steroid didn't affect her BG so drastically I'd add it back in the AM but we have been working so hard to wean it down and its had a pretty drastic affect on her BG as since we took out her AM steroid we have been seeing a lot of blue and green! So that being said I'll only increase a little in the even if I need to, we were down to 1/8 so last night I probably did 1/6 roughly. Anyways she cleared it by midcyle today when we saw blue and by +10 we have green! Which is great:) Is she nadiring late? As she seems to dip midcyle then up a bit then a dip again sometimes to lowest value in the day at PMPS. This seems to be happening for the past week.

So looks like we may be shooting low again tonight! Hoping she wont be too low at PMPS as it took a lot of montoring and some honey when we shot at 4.1 on Feb 10th. I may need some online support if I do shoot low. Will post her PMPS in about 25 mins. Thanks!
 
Tinka's looking really good on this dose. :) As usual, get a +1 and a +2, if you are shooting your lowest yet. I'm off for a meeting for a few hours. I hope you have an uneventful evening.

Often when kitties are breaking a bounce, as she is this AM cycle, their nadirs will be later. Some kitties also do what is called the Lantus double dip, where they do a second smaller dip at the end of the cycle, but not as low as the main nadir.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Tinka's looking really good on this dose. :) As usual, get a +1 and a +2, if you are shooting your lowest yet. I'm off for a meeting for a few hours. I hope you have an uneventful evening.

Often when kitties are breaking a bounce, as she is this AM cycle, their nadirs will be later. Some kitties also do what is called the Lantus double dip, where they do a second smaller dip at the end of the cycle, but not as low as the main nadir.
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Thanks Wendy! I just got in her PMPS and she's slightly lower at 4.1. I am stalling. Should I was 15-20 mins and see if she's going up or down or does that not really matter. We shot at 4.1 the other night but had to intervene with honey at +1 but she didn't go below 50. Should I go ahead and feed and shoot or wait till someone can come on with me? Thank you!
 
Haven't heard back from anyone yet so I went ahead and fed and shot to keep on schedule. She's almost due for a +1 in the next 15 mins so will be able to tell if numbers are looking stable, food bump or dropping. Will post back then, hope to hear back for some advise on what to do if she's dropping. Thanks!
 
Great job shooting, I am back. It's fine to shoot if they are surfing. 77 and 74 are th same number with meter variance. Paws crossed for a beautiful surf.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Great job shooting, I am back. It's fine to shoot if they are surfing. 77 and 74 are th same number with meter variance. Paws crossed for a beautiful surf.
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Hi Wendy thank you :) Just got in a +2 and she has dropped to 67. Do I feed LC with a drop of honey or wait? Or a little LC? Thank you!!
 
Hi Tanya. Sorry I wasn't online earlier and no one else responded.

By any chance, when you were stalling, did you change your subject line to indicate that you were waiting for help?
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
Hi Tanya. Sorry I wasn't online earlier and no one else responded.

By any chance, when you were stalling, did you change your subject line to indicate that you were waiting for help?
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Hi Tricia, not to worry i understand everyone has busy lives outside of the forum too. Yes I did change my subject line to Tinka's values and then - stalling pls advise? As well as a blue ? in the beginning of the title.
 
TanyaG said:
Yes I did change my subject line to Tinka's values and then - stalling pls advise? As well as a blue ? in the beginning of the title.
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*sigh* I was really hoping you hadn't, but I figured you had, as I know this has happened before. I'm so sorry you didn't get a response. The good news is that you handled it well, and you have learned so much! I'll keep checking back in case you need anything, but I think you know what you're doing. ;):(
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
*sigh* I was really hoping you hadn't, but I figured you had, as I know this has happened before. I'm so sorry you didn't get a response. The good news is that you handled it well, and you have learned so much! I'll keep checking back in case you need anything, but I think you know what you're doing. ;):(
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Thanks Tricia really appreciate your and everyone else's support :) I only felt ok to go ahead and shoot low tonight cause you had all helped me shoot lower twice this past week:) @Wendy&Neko was super helpful tonight too in advising me to wait on the honey at +2 and feed 2 tsp LC. This has helped as just did a +3 and she is now 74. Will continue to monitor on the hour. She is due to have her last evening meal in about 30 mins so this should hopefully help her surf too. Hoping we wont have a pj party. But def happy to be seeing green!

On the down side the itch is back and e-collar back on:( I really don't want to add back in the AM steroid after all this effort weaning it out this past week and finally seeing better values. I am thinking to just stick with PM steroid and not add the AM steroid back in and instead try an OTC anti-histamine. I need to then source a new raw novel protein fast but there are none where I live so will have to travel to the city. Hate her being in an e-collar and eyes are streaming and she's scratching and licking again. May be that we switched foods to rabbit and pork as she stopped eating the lamb or may be that the AM steroids absence is weaning more steroids out of her system. Will have to keep trying as I really don't want to go backwards after all this hard work.
 
Tanya, I am so sorry that the itch is back. I went through something similar with two of my kitties and I know how frustrating it is. Where is she licking? Is it one specific place? With Cinco, we were able to use a doggie shirt to cover his hot spots sometimes, and other times a coverall worked better. Both were miles better than an e-collar. I used the CoverMe for Cinco, but there are others out there if you google onesie for cats. I liked the CoverMe that was for dogs better because it snapped on the back and made it easier to get on and off and to give insulin without removing it.
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
Tanya, I am so sorry that the itch is back. I went through something similar with two of my kitties and I know how frustrating it is. Where is she licking? Is it one specific place? With Cinco, we were able to use a doggie shirt to cover his hot spots sometimes, and other times a coverall worked better. Both were miles better than an e-collar. I used the CoverMe for Cinco, but there are others out there if you google onesie for cats. I liked the CoverMe that was for dogs better because it snapped on the back and made it easier to get on and off and to give insulin without removing it.
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Thanks Tricia this skin issue has been an awfully long journey and I believe the pred long term use is likely what resulted in tinkas diabetes Dx. Im sure you know the frustrations too with having had two itchy cats! I just wish I knew the cause!

Sometimes she licks hot spots on her belly and inner legs. Other times she bites wounds into her paws. Most recently past 4 months has been scratching her ears and face really badly. Which is really challenging as only way to protect that area is a cone or e-collar. I def like the look of the coverme's thank you. Will have to see if they available in Canada. How did your cat react to them? I once tried a little knot west of tinks and she was not impressed so I'm not sure how she'd handle wearing one of these.

At the moment the itch is not bad but notably had started up again. It's not constant but is fairly often. She only made one small wound, but I put the e-collar on to be safe. The biggest area I worry about is her face as last time she scratched her face and eye really badly. I've cleaned her ears tonight so hopefully that helps. But the streaming eyes shows its def allergy related. I'm trying to remember what the anti-histamine that others have used on here. I'all have to search through old posts or ask again.

I may have to give her a little more steroid tonight or tmrw am. Highly reluctantly but I don't want it developing into a full flare. When her skin gets bad sue locks, bites and scratches constantly even with a cone on she'll lick the cone itself non stop cause she's so itchy which is then awful cause she can't reach the itchy spot. Anyway we not back to it being really bad it's just I'm concerned were not going to he her off the steroid was currently that's the only thing working. Whilst a small amount isn't terribly for her it can still hv a lot of long term side effects and I don't think that remission is possible with a diabetic cat on steroids as it directly affects the blood glucose. I'm not sure if it's possible, do you know?

Going to take a +4 now and feed her: let's hope she's surfing!
 
TanyaG said:
I don't think that remission is possible with a diabetic cat on steroids as it directly affects the blood glucose. I'm not sure if it's possible, do you know?
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I'm not sure about remission, but I know that tight regulation is possible, as I was able to regulate my Harvey despite his being on Pred.
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
I gave my cats both Benadryl and Zyrtec on different occasions. Here is a really good reference for safe doses for cats.
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Thank you for this info! :) Yes I believe it was Zyrtec that some others on here had used with success. Did you have success with these anti-histamines without pred or did you use them in addition?
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
I'm not sure about remission, but I know that tight regulation is possible, as I was able to regulate my Harvey despite his being on Pred.
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That is good to know Tricia that tight regulation is at least possible on pred :) Did Harvey experience other side effects from being on pred long term?

Tinka use to be able to go longer periods without it but then it's got shorter and shorter and now it's literally a day off pred and she starts itching badly again, it's like the pred suppressed the condition which was helpful but drove it deeper. I'm really hoping for remission for Tinka in the future and that we can figure out a way to get her off pred. But we can only do the best we can so even tight regulation would be great.
 
TanyaG said:
Did you have success with these anti-histamines without pred or did you use them in addition?
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I gave the Benedryl to Sasha for itching. There was some relief, but it didn't completely eliminate the itching. I gave the Zyrtec for congestion, and it did help with that. I don't have experience with it for itching.

TanyaG said:
Did Harvey experience other side effects from being on pred long term?
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Well, it is what caused his diabetes. Once we reduced his Pred dose, it was easier to keep the BGs down. The only side effect I am aware of was increased appetite, which was a good thing as he had intestinal lymphoma and that made him not want to eat. The Pred helped to counteract that.

 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
I gave the Benedryl to Sasha for itching. There was some relief, but it didn't completely eliminate the itching. I gave the Zyrtec for congestion, and it did help with that. I don't have experience with it for itching.


Well, it is what caused his diabetes. Once we reduced his Pred dose, it was easier to keep the BGs down. The only side effect I am aware of was increased appetite, which was a good thing as he had intestinal lymphoma and that made him not want to eat. The Pred helped to counteract that.
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Good to know about the benedryl and pred thank you. I guess I'll just have to do a test trial with what works for Tinka. For tonight we gave her a little extra steroid and going to give her 1/6 in the AM if her BG isn't too high. Then try reduce again. Hopefully we can get her onto just 1/8 a day, that doesn't seem to affect her BG too badly.

I just retested her at +4 and she's 81 and fed her last feed. I'll try get in one more before bed. If she's around the same value is that surfing mean its generally ok for bed? I assume we may see a small food bump. Do you think thats ok or what would be a flag to stay up longer or retest again?
 
We really like to see two tests stable or higher without food influence. That means don't feed at the next test (assuming she hasn't dropped), get another test after that, and if THAT test is the same or higher, get one more. Then you will know she is safe. With my cats, I knew them well enough to know after that first test with no food influence whether or not it was safe, but that was after several months of monitoring. You are newer at this and only you can decide how comfortable you are with stopping before that second non-food test. If you can nap and wake up to test, that is a good option. I was never good at napping.
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
We really like to see two tests stable or higher without food influence. That means don't feed at the next test (assuming she hasn't dropped), get another test after that, and if THAT test is the same or higher, get one more. Then you will know she is safe. With my cats, I knew them well enough to know after that first test with no food influence whether or not it was safe, but that was after several months of monitoring. You are newer at this and only you can decide how comfortable you are with stopping before that second non-food test. If you can nap and wake up to test, that is a good option. I was never good at napping.
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Thanks Tricia:) So basically I didn't feed at +3 but I fed at +4. So that means I need to get a +5 (which would be influenced by food), then a +6 and a +7 (2 tests with no food influence if she hasn't dropped) that are stable or higher. What would be stable is that maintaining around the same BG as she currently has? Gosh that's gona be a late night tonight. I'm not one to nap either, will prob just have to stay up. +7 will take me to 3am. Going to having a pj party at this rate!

For next time if we having low values in the pm and I'm needing to go to bed or even during the am if im needing to go out could I delay a meal. For example next time can I delay her usual last evening meal (usually given around +3.5) and then I could get a +4 and +5 without food influence which would mean I wouldn't have to monitor as late if she stabilised?
 
TanyaG said:
For next time if we having low values in the pm and I'm needing to go to bed or even during the am if im needing to go out could I delay a meal. For example next time can I delay her usual last evening meal (usually given around +3.5) and then I could get a +4 and +5 without food influence which would mean I wouldn't have to monitor as late if she stabilised?
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Yes, assuming she didn't need feeding to bring her up at +3 or +3.5.

You don't have to wait an hour for the next test. You can test at +4.5 , then at +5, and I would do your last test at +6 (assuming the numbers you get at these tests are stable or rising).
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
Yes, assuming she didn't need feeding to bring her up at +3 or +3.5.

You don't have to wait an hour for the next test. You can test at +4.5 , then at +5, and I would do your last test at +6 (assuming the numbers you get at these tests are stable or rising).
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Just seeing your msg now thank you. I got in a +5.5 / 99 which she's gone up which is good but that could be from the food at +4 which is when I did last test. Just done a +6 now and she is 5.8 / 104. So looks like diss stabilising.

I'll just stay up and do a +7 to be safe. But now I know for next time to maybe hold off on her feed and also getting shorter tests.

Thanks so so much for all your amazing help tonight Tricia I really appreciate it! Hope iv not kept you up. What time zone are you on? I should be ok from here. If she drops lower again do I just feed a little LC? A drop of Honey only if she goes under 50? Thanks again!
 
TanyaG said:
If she drops lower again do I just feed a little LC? A drop of Honey only if she goes under 50? Thanks again!
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If it's just a little drop, LC is good. If it's a big drop or below 50, honey for sure. I don't think she'll drop, but she is a cat, so never say never. :rolleyes:

TanyaG said:
Thanks so so much for all your amazing help tonight Tricia I really appreciate it! Hope iv not kept you up. What time zone are you on?
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No problem, Tanya. I'm a night owl and have actually been watching two other kitties tonight. One CG just went to bed, so I'm down to you and one other. I'll probably be here another hour, so I'll check back to see if you need anything.

I'm in California, so Pacific time.
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
If it's just a little drop, LC is good. If it's a big drop or below 50, honey for sure. I don't think she'll drop, but she is a cat, so never say never. :rolleyes:


No problem, Tanya. I'm a night owl and have actually been watching two other kitties tonight. One CG just went to bed, so I'm down to you and one other. I'll probably be here another hour, so I'll check back to see if you need anything.

I'm in California, so Pacific time.
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Thank you Tricia you are a star!! I don't think she'll drop either but as you said she's a cat and ECID! I'm usually a night owl too. I'm actually going to have a bath now as I'm dealing with my own health issues tonight too, hope the hot water and Epsom salts will ease the pain. I'll plan to get a +7 or +7.5 in 45mins to an hour. Don't worry to stay up though if you need to hit they hay i think we should be good and now that I have more info from all iv learnt from you tonight I feel more equipped:) It's certainly been a blessing having your support thank you! Hope the other kitties you're watching are doing well too!
 
Ahhh, you're sweet, Tanya. I'm just paying it forward. If it weren't for the people that were here back in 2011 when I joined, my sweet Cinco would have most likely died (instead I got almost another 5 years with him). Then I wouldn't have learned so much about FD and cats' health in general, and when Harvey was diagnosed in 2015, I wouldn't have known what to do. I owe more to this place than I can ever repay. Plus, I love kitties and I can't stand seeing one in trouble and knowing the distress that causes in the beans that love him or her.

I'm sorry you're in pain. I can relate. I have severe osteoarthritis in my hands, feet and knees and sciatica as well (about 9 inches of metal in my back). But we all have our cross to bear, and there are plenty of people worse off than I am! I hope your bath brings you some relief, and that Tinka lets you get to bed soon.

I may still be here when you get your next test. I'll definitely keep checking for you until I go to bed. Surf safely, Tinka!
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
Ahhh, you're sweet, Tanya. I'm just paying it forward. If it weren't for the people that were here back in 2011 when I joined, my sweet Cinco would have most likely died (instead I got almost another 5 years with him). Then I wouldn't have learned so much about FD and cats' health in general, and when Harvey was diagnosed in 2015, I wouldn't have known what to do. I owe more to this place than I can ever repay. Plus, I love kitties and I can't stand seeing one in trouble and knowing the distress that causes in the beans that love him or her.

I'm sorry you're in pain. I can relate. I have severe osteoarthritis in my hands, feet and knees and sciatica as well (about 9 inches of metal in my back). But we all have our cross to bear, and there are plenty of people worse off than I am! I hope your bath brings you some relief, and that Tinka lets you get to bed soon.

I may still be here when you get your next test. I'll definitely keep checking for you until I go to bed. Surf safely, Tinka!
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Thanks so much Tricia! So wonderful to hear about your experience here with both Cinco and Harvey, how wonderful! :) I feel the same way finding this forum has been an incredible blessing I could not do this without you all, so much love and thanks to everyone on here!!

Sorry to hear you have chronic health issues too, it really is a challenge, but continue to do the best we can and stay hopeful for healing and improvements for the future. I'll pray for you too :) The bath seems to be helping a bit which is good.

Tinka is happy as Larry fast asleep with hubby in bed. No idea what's going on lol! Will wake her up in 30 mins for hopefully her last BG for the night. I'm still amazed how good she is with all the ear tests and shots etc she actually jumps up on her designated chair when we just call her and puurs away plus she's a nervous cat who usually freaks out at shall things but hasn't with anything diabetes related. She's really taken it in her stride, it's like she knows we're really helping her and thanks to you all we are able to test and shoot her insulin etc without causing pain and stress. She loves her little treat reward and the attention. It's amazing!
 
A lot of people believe the cats know we're helping them. Cinco was always very mellow and didn't mind being poked and prodded, as long as we fed him! That came from being a starving stray, I think. Harvey, on the other hand, had definite opinions about all the fuss. :rolleyes: But he had a very determined Mama and didn't stand a chance against me! ;)

I'm glad Tinka makes it easy for you. So many here struggle, especially at first, and get discouraged. Sometimes I lie awake at night, worrying about someone that was having a hard time getting tests and controlling their kitty's numbers. It really kills me when they just disappear. I can't help but wonder if the kitty is okay. :( I've always been a little too sensitive. o_O
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
A lot of people believe the cats know we're helping them. Cinco was always very mellow and didn't mind being poked and prodded, as long as we fed him! That came from being a starving stray, I think. Harvey, on the other hand, had definite opinions about all the fuss. :rolleyes: But he had a very determined Mama and didn't stand a chance against me! ;)

I'm glad Tinka makes it easy for you. So many here struggle, especially at first, and get discouraged. Sometimes I lie awake at night, worrying about someone that was having a hard time getting tests and controlling their kitty's numbers. It really kills me when they just disappear. I can't help but wonder if the kitty is okay. :( I've always been a little too sensitive. o_O
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That's wonderful about Cinco, I read his story about how you took him in its so special. He must have had such a love for you. I would have expected Tinka to kick up a big fuss. She does with other things like claws being trimmed or meds in her ear or even homeopathics in her mouth or cleaning hot spots etc. She jumps at noises and scares really easily. But the diabetes tests have gone so well. Someone shared on here to make a set place where you do tests and shoot and so we have a set chair and I think that really helped her to know whats expected and what happens there. We give her lots of pets and LC freeze dried Orijen treats after which she loves. Well done for persevering with Harvey it's certainly not easy when kitties resist I know only to well in other areas with Tinka. I really feel for those struggling with testing and shooting etc as it can already be a stressful process! I'm a very sensitive person too. But hey rather we have big hearts of compassion then not. Know ur making a big difference helping ppl on here like me and I'm super grateful! Tinka is too :)
 
Taffysmama said:
Great job tonight, Tanya and Tinka!!!:cat:
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Thanks so much! Tinka is keeping it interesting that's for sure :) it's a lot of effort monitoring but I'm really pleased to see green again! Just hope she doesn't go up too much as we gave a little extra steroid tonight at +4 and planning some for the AM too unfortunately as the itch is back. But hopefully it won't disrupt things too much. Hope Taffy is doing well tonight:) I think he needs to join the pj party!
 
I was just reading your profile info and looking at Tinka's spreadsheet...poor thing, those skin allergies are so frustrating! She is indoor only?
 
Taffysmama said:
I was just reading your profile info and looking at Tinka's spreadsheet...poor thing, those skin allergies are so frustrating! She is indoor only?
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Yes the skin issues have been so awful and just seem to be getting worse. Yes she's indoor only. I feel like they are probably environmental and food allergies. Been trying food options for over a year already.
 
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