01/08 TIFIL DKA +13.5 63 DOSİNG?????

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ISIL&TIFIL

ISIL&TIFIL

Member Since 2011
Today she was very high in the morning...386 :(
She was on front of her water bowl again, just standing not drinking :(
I tried to give water to her with syringe, after she swallowed the water she vomitted :(
Now she is hiding in the closet...I don't understand, the ketones are gone, when is she going to feel better and when is she going to stop standing on front of then damn water bowl :(

I am confused about the dose, if she is going to dive down and fly high what king of strategy should I fallow?
I mean it can be that she is going down because of the iv fluids, it's not logical to reduce the dose before she finishes having the iv fluids. So does this mean that even if she is very low I most shoot the regular dose?
Even if I shoot the low numbers, I am sure she is going to have that rebound.

After 2 hours I will take her to the vet to have her iv fluids and her antibiotics and the syringe that they are making for her liver (I don't have any idea what it is).

I don't have any idea when the vet is going to stop giving fluids, I am not sure he knows either...
If somebody knows anything about this please help us...I mean, her ketones are finished, maybe the vet is giving iv fluids for her potassium deficiency. But mean while the fluids can be too much and it may harm the blood structure and the circulation.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA

I was afraid she was going to bounce this morning because of the stalled insulin, the reduced dose, and the lower BGs, last night.
Is it +11, yet? If she is high enough, you can shoot an hour early. Please let me know, okay?

I'm sure the vet knows how much fluid to give. And the fluids will probably make her feel better, today.
The rest of your medical questions, I don't know the answers for. Sorry.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA

Hello Dyana,
It's shooting time now but I shot her at +11, I was afraid...It is +1 now and she 413 :(
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA

I'm glad you shot at +11, as that will help her to fill her shed back up. Hopefully, the bounce will be quick.
Hang in there, Isil.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA

She still hiding :(
She also ate dry food, maybe that is one of the reasons that she is very high...
It's so hard to wait :(
I hope she will be well soon
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA

Yes, the dry food would make her higher, too. It is a combination of things.
If she continues to eat dry food, the dose may need to be adjusted. Has she eaten her breakfast?
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA

she ate alittle dry food in the morning but the vomitted it...We are going to the vet now, she will have an injection for her stomach...then I will feed her...
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA

Isil,

The late shot last night, the reduced dose and the dry food are all things that will contribute to higher BG #s. I agree with Dyana that shooting this morning @ +11 was a good idea.

Sometimes when I change my cats' foods they will throw up so the change in food could be making her vomit. Even if she likes the dry if she has not had any for a while that could be making her vomit. Even some brands of wet will make some of my cats vomit. Even one brand of LC canned makes Tinkerbell throw up. Ask your vet about giving her s/thg to settle her stomach, ondansetron (1/2 tab) worked well for Tawny for nausea and pepcid is often given with ABs (I think the dose is 1/4 10mg tab about 1/2 hr b4 feeding, I would have to look it up, Dyana probably knows w/out looking it up!). It could be s/thg else tho so definitely mention it to your vet.

Also I am not trying to frighten you, I know you are frightened enough, but please remember that the ketones can return so you need to monitor Tifil for ketones closely. Tawny is very very ketone prone. She was in the hospital 3 times in 6 weeks between the first of Nov and the middle of December last year. Each time her ketones had cleared and then she would do better for a few days and then she would relapse really fast and each time the ketones returned. She got fluids and all kinds of different meds and treatments and even the constant insulin drip in her IV to bring her fluids down (w/out her regular insulin, she just got the drip and was closely monitored in the hospital) and then she finally got an e-tube so that when she stopped eating I could feed her. It wasn't until she was finally getting enough calories (Wellness Turkey), for her during her illness at least about 300 per day (and sometimes this was via the e-tube), and insulin, that she finally started to recover and is now doing great. Several times in fact when her vets wanted me to reduce her dose from 3u to 2.5u b/c her BGs were in the mid-200s I refused to do it. I am so glad I did not reduce her dose.

I know how very scary it can be to shoot lower #s. I have been doing this for 3-1/2 years and sometimes fear still grips my heart when I shoot a low #. Taking everything else into consideration (i.e., has she been sick?, has she had ketones recently?. is this a bounce?, will she eat or can I get food into her if I shoot?) the main rule of thumb I use for shooting low is "will I be home to monitor?" That's what makes the difference for me. It can be so very difficult sometimes tho to know what to do. I still often run screaming to this board for help when I am not sure what to do!

You are doing such a great job with Tifil!
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA

I was going to make the same point as Desi. Ketones can easily recur. You need to keep testing. Making sure that Tifil is eating and getting enough insulin are the best ways to keep the ketones under control.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA

Hello,
Dear Desi, I think our cats are the same in health problems...I am very unhappy that tıfıl is really prone to ketones :(
We are back from the vet, tıfıl is much better (although her bg levels were very high all day).
When we came back home I gave tıfıl boiled Turkey, she loved it, seh ate it all, happy to say that she is eating alone :)..so I stopped giving dry food...I hope it will be much better

At the vet they tested for ketons and the result is negative, but I'll be testing everyday as you said...
They also tested for leucocytes in the urine and the reslt is negative....
But the potassium test result is still under 2 (must be between 3.5 and 5). They are still not convinced to give potassium supplements to her...

Tıfıl is feeling better like I said, but she is still hiding under the bed!
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA

HOORAY FOR HER EATING THE TURKEY!

still sending prayers and healing energy your way...

celi & binks

pic_12024843486187.jpg
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA

I'm so glad she's eating and feeling better, now.
And ketones = negative is reason for a happy dance
Cat%20Dance-338373.gif

I think she will feel even better, when her numbers are in the blues and greens, again.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA

HAHAHAHAH I loved the picture and the animation...so so sweet...
Thank you ladies :)
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +11 85 DOSİNG?????

well, what desi said, although i would wait til +12 hours given that she's at 85 right now. but if she is still lower at +12, will you be home to monitor?

just like last night, i think it's really important to not skip doses. seems like the fluids she's getting really bring her BG down.

do you have high carb canned food you can give her?
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +11 85 DOSİNG?????

I only have wd canned food and royal canin diabetic dry food
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +11 85 DOSİNG?????

Do you have any kind of syrup or honey? I also think a stall is a good idea to see if she comes up. We'd really like to see her full dose of insulin in her, if possible. It's also possible that not having dry later today plus the fluids
have brought her numbers down.

The dry food takes a while to kick in to raise numbers and then, as you've seen, really kicks it up a notch. Is it possible to run out and get any HC FF while you are stalling?

Sending her prayers and healing vines!
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +11 85 DOSİNG?????

I have honey,
It's 10.30 pm and there isn't any open market that I can find cat food but I think honey can help and also wd is high in carbs...
To stall is a good idea too, after half an hour is our shooting time...let's see if it's a rising number...
If it's not rising number, should I still shoot?
I mean, when I stall if the numbers are not rising, still full dose?
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +11 85 DOSİNG?????

Isil, you mentioned the other day that she was eating Recovery? Do you have any of that left? It is very high in carbs, 25% I believe it is. Do you know the carb content of the w/d? What is it?

Now I am not a dosing expert and not qualified to give dosing advice, but if you look at Tifil's SS from yesterday last night she was at 89 at +13.5, 110 @ +14.5, so her #s did climb. There may have been a food spike in there from the dry, I don't know. You shot the 1/2 dose & her #s continued to climb, again probably from the dry food but perhaps also from the lower dose. These are all things I would take into consideration in a situation like this for either Tinkerbell or Tawny. And whether or not you are going to be around or be able to wake up to monitor, that is really important, especially if you decide to go with the full dose.

Post her #s please. Many eyes on you at the moment.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +11 85 DOSİNG?????

The vet didn't allow me to give recovery, so I didn't buy it...
W/D's carb is 26.4
I can monitor her but she is hiding under the bed and our bed is too low to go down and get her.. I open the vacuum cleaner to get her out of there, but I live in an apartment and the neighbours will kill me...but I will still do my best :)
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +12 77 DOSİNG?????

i'd wait a little bit longer - say 30 minutes and retest.

you can mix honey with the regular low-carb canned food if you need to.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +11 85 DOSİNG?????

ISIL&TIFIL said:
The vet didn't allow me to give recovery, so I didn't buy it...
W/D's carb is 26.4
I can monitor her but she is hiding under the bed and our bed is too low to go down and get her.. I open the vacuum cleaner to get her out of there, but I live in an apartment and the neighbours will kill me...but I will still do my best :)
Click to expand...

Try a broom or a blow dryer.

26.4 carbs is good, that's pretty high, I think my hypo kit contains 17%-18% Friskies.

If it was my cat, I would stall for a little while, 15-30 minutes, I would get another BG in about 15 min, see what others say. How long has it been since she ate and what did she eat?
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +12 77 DOSİNG?????

isil, i think the message everyone is in agreement on is that with her history, it's critical she get her insulin even if you have to give her high carb foods to keep her BG up.

i don't know the magic number that's ok to shoot, so i hesitate to try to give one.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +12 77 DOSİNG?????

I don't think plain turkey has any carbs in it. I'm glad you have the 26% carb food on hand.
I think we should try to shoot the full dose tonight, hopefully her numbers will go up soon.
We really don't want to see her in the red again, tomorrow, but a bounce could still happen.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +12 77 DOSİNG?????

ISIL&TIFIL said:
She ate Turkey 3.5 hours ago....
Click to expand...

THat's right, you said you gave her the boiled turkey and she ate it, that's good. if that was 3.5 hrs ago I believe any food spikes clear after about 3 hours so IMO this 77 would be a "true" number. S/one please correct me if i am wrong...

Isil, as you are stalling make sure that you consider her next shot after this one, what your schedule will be like for morning's shot.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +12 77 DOSİNG?????

I'm glad there isn't a problem with your schedule.
You must still be about 1 1/2 hours behind schedule from yesterday's late shot.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +12 77 DOSİNG?????

Isil. I've asked for some more eyes on your condo. I'm going to run outside real quick to get my cats a walk before it gets dark outside. I'll be back in about 15 minutes.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +12.5 66 DOSİNG?????

If it was Tawny or Tinkerbell I would stall another 30 minutes & test again, without feeding. See what others think.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +12.5 66 DOSİNG?????

i would also stall. you're only 1/2 hour late at this point. keep your chin up and we'll check with you in another 30 minutes from your last test. many hugs, isil!!!!! you're doing great.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +12.5 66 DOSİNG?????

Isil, how much flexibility do you have in your shot schedule?

I think you should stall another 30 minutes.
And, I think you should try to think of a way to keep her out from under the bed, while you're stalling. Later, she may need to be tested often. Can you shut the bedroom door, or something?
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +12.5 66 DOSİNG?????

block the space under the bed with shoe boxes, towel or sheet that's enough of a problem that she can't push through. shutting the bedroom door is a good idea.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +12.5 66 DOSİNG?????

julie & punkin said:
block the space under the bed with shoe boxes, towel or sheet that's enough of a problem that she can't push through.
Click to expand...
or pillows and couch cushions ... ducks and hides.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +13 71 DOSİNG?????

Good, she's surfing, again.
Isil, how much flexibility to you have in your shot schedule? Do you have to go to work, tomorrow?
I would like to see you stall another 30 minutes. But with the 1 1/2 hours still behind, you will then be 3 hours behind.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +13 71 DOSİNG?????

Tomorrow I am planning to take tıfıl to the vet at 1 o'clock and then I have to go to work..so I can stall again, no problem...
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +13 71 DOSİNG?????

I agree w/Dyana. Stall another 30 minutes if you can. This is similar to what she did last night, now she is surfing. Are you confident you can get her to eat or get food into her when you shoot?
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +13 71 DOSİNG?????

I am sure she won't eat, But I will make her eat.....But I can only shoot If I see a rising number
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +13 71 DOSİNG?????

hi isil,

i'm looking back over tifil's ss and wondering what you want to do. you shot lots of under 100 numbers over the summer, and even in november. i think dyana, desi and i don't really have more to offer you than you probably already know - so while we're here with you, it's you that needs to decide.

what would you feel best about doing?
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +13 71 DOSİNG?????

ok - you answered while i was posting. so you'd like to wait til you see a rising number and then shoot the full dose?
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +13 71 DOSİNG?????

Yes but on summer she was getting small amounts of insulin, 3iu is a really big big number for greens...I know that lantus starts to act after +2 with tıfıl but what if it will be an active cycle?
I am afraid
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +13 71 DOSİNG?????

Isil,

Julie is right, you have shot this low of a # b4, 3u & 3.25u it looks like from Tifil's SS in Nov & Dec. EDITED to strike out, I read it wrong, Isil is right, it was much lower doses during summer ~ Desi ~ / When I looked at it b4 I only looked at yesterday.

I also agree w/Dyana that there is the bounce to consider, Tifil will likely bounce off these greens.

It is up to you, what are you most comfortable with? If it were me, I would stall until +13.5, then make my final decision. Please keep posting her #s, we are watching.
 
Re: 01/08 TIFIL DKA +13 71 DOSİNG?????

I know. I would be, too. But, we will be here with you, through it all. You have 26% carb food. She should feel like eating naturally, if she feels she is going too low.

Come on Tifil, up you go, girl, please.
 
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