Issues with Libre false low readings, help?

[tedsmom1]

Hello, Ted recently got a Libre for the first time, it is a Libre Freestyle 2. His first night it was going off like he dipped too low, scared me to death since we are doing this due to a recent hypoglycemic episode he had. I tested him with my regular meter, he was like 100 something. He’s had it on almost a week and almost every day it has done this. At about the 3-4 hour mark after shot, it starts alarming that it’s dipping into the 60s and even 50s. I test, he’s well above that. Just this morning, it keeps going off, dropping into the 50s, I test and it’s 84. It then bounced back up to 70 something, but has now dropped and stayed in the 50s. I even had him eat some after the first alert just to be safe, so idk how it’s still dropping in reading. Yesterday I was on my way to leave work because it dropped into the 50s and wasn’t bouncing back as quick as it has the other days (normally after a minute or a few it would bounce up way higher). I was about to head to the parking lot and it bounced to 70. I waited and called the emergent vet that’s been working with me, and while talking to them to them it bounced up even more. And every time it does these low readings, it never logs it as an official reading on his day graph. It logs the alert it sent, but it’s not counting it towards his real numbers. I’m stressing to the max due to this libre. I’ve even lowered his dose from 1.5 to 1.25 last night and this morning. Has anyone else had these issues? The whole point of this is to help them get him regulated after that episode, but idk if this data is even correct. I take pictures of the low reading before it disappears and of my regular meter to show the vet comparison.

 

[CORKY]

@Staci & Ivy

 

[Staci & Ivy]

Hello, Ted recently got a Libre for the first time, it is a Libre Freestyle 2. His first night it was going off like he dipped too low, scared me to death since we are doing this due to a recent hypoglycemic episode he had. I tested him with my regular meter, he was like 100 something. He’s had it on almost a week and almost every day it has done this. At about the 3-4 hour mark after shot, it starts alarming that it’s dipping into the 60s and even 50s. I test, he’s well above that. Just this morning, it keeps going off, dropping into the 50s, I test and it’s 84. It then bounced back up to 70 something, but has now dropped and stayed in the 50s. I even had him eat some after the first alert just to be safe, so idk how it’s still dropping in reading. Yesterday I was on my way to leave work because it dropped into the 50s and wasn’t bouncing back as quick as it has the other days (normally after a minute or a few it would bounce up way higher). I was about to head to the parking lot and it bounced to 70. I waited and called the emergent vet that’s been working with me, and while talking to them to them it bounced up even more. And every time it does these low readings, it never logs it as an official reading on his day graph. It logs the alert it sent, but it’s not counting it towards his real numbers. I’m stressing to the max due to this libre. I’ve even lowered his dose from 1.5 to 1.25 last night and this morning. Has anyone else had these issues? The whole point of this is to help them get him regulated after that episode, but idk if this data is even correct. I take pictures of the low reading before it disappears and of my regular meter to show the vet comparison.

Hi Ted’s mom,
What you are seeing is not uncommon with Libre use.
There is usually some discrepancy from the Libre to a handheld meter and a blood test (but not always).

It’s excellent that you can double check with a blood test. We recommend testing low BG on a Libre to make sure you can keep Ted safe.
Since you use a pet meter, those numbers will read a little higher than a human handheld glucometer.

The truth is what you are seeing in the Libre is pretty close in range to your blood test.

It’s not uncommon for them to dip to the 50s on the Libre and then bounce up from there and then as you said, it’s gone from the graph (but in the logbook).

It seems Ted dips around when the insulin onsets (+3 or +4 hours after his injection).
You will get accustomed to these things with using a Libre. But it’s always good to be on alert especially if they are lingering in lower levels in the Libre.

I suggest reading this document for more information about using a Libre. I hope this helps!
Getting Started With Continuous Glucose Monitors (CGMs) for Diabetic Cats

 

[tedsmom1]

Hi Ted’s mom,
What you are seeing is not uncommon with Libre use.
There is usually some discrepancy from the Libre to a handheld meter and a blood test (but not always).

It’s excellent that you can double check with a blood test. We recommend testing low BG on a Libre to make sure you can keep Ted safe.
Since you use a pet meter, those numbers will read a little higher than a human handheld glucometer.

The truth is what you are seeing in the Libre is pretty close in range to your blood test.

It’s not uncommon for them to dip to the 50s on the Libre and then bounce up from there and then as you said, it’s gone from the graph (but in the logbook).

It seems Ted dips around when the insulin onsets (+3 or +4 hours after his injection).
You will get accustomed to these things with using a Libre. But it’s always good to be on alert especially if they are lingering in lower levels in the Libre.

I suggest reading this document for more information about using a Libre. I hope this helps!
Getting Started With Continuous Glucose Monitors (CGMs) for Diabetic Cats

Thank you! I read that article/post a couple of times. Yeah Friday it did it again but I think he may have actually gone low. It went off saying low 60s, so I tested him and it said 84. But it kept dropping and stayed in the 50s for over an hour. I already had to fight for one ear test, I could not get blood out and I know I was bothering him. He wouldn’t let me take more. So I just made sure he ate and kept an eye on him. He was acting fine other than getting upset with me and running thinking I was going to prick his ear again. So which number is most correct? A pet meter or the libre? I guess I’m still confused on how it’s converted or considered when using a meter for humans. I’m just terrified he’s dipping too low and I’m unaware of it, like I need to get another libre to keep track of him.

 

[Staci & Ivy]

Thank you! I read that article/post a couple of times. Yeah Friday it did it again but I think he may have actually gone low. It went off saying low 60s, so I tested him and it said 84. But it kept dropping and stayed in the 50s for over an hour. I already had to fight for one ear test, I could not get blood out and I know I was bothering him. He wouldn’t let me take more. So I just made sure he ate and kept an eye on him. He was acting fine other than getting upset with me and running thinking I was going to prick his ear again. So which number is most correct? A pet meter or the libre? I guess I’m still confused on how it’s converted or considered when using a meter for humans. I’m just terrified he’s dipping too low and I’m unaware of it, like I need to get another libre to keep track of him.

The blood test from an ear prick will always be more accurate than the Libre, so that’s the one to trust.
With a pet meter I believe your “take action” number is 68, so if he reads under 68, you reduce by .25 units at the next dose.

The Libre is your guide to what range he’s in.
But they are reading pretty close, so it gives you a good idea where he is.

 

[tedsmom1]

The blood test from an ear prick will always be more accurate than the Libre, so that’s the one to trust.
With a pet meter I believe your “take action” number is 68, so if he reads under 68, you reduce by .25 units at the next dose.

The Libre is your guide to what range he’s in.
But they are reading pretty close, so it gives you a good idea where he is.

Okay thank you, that helps. I updated my spreadsheet with the numbers I keep track with my pet meter, but I’d like to add in separate for the Libre readings. I did reduce his shots those days I think it really was getting low. Weirdly his numbers don’t go down overnight.

I think I may get another one when this one is done. It’s nice to have more data, it’s just also stressing me out, ha.

 

[Staci & Ivy]

Okay thank you, that helps. I updated my spreadsheet with the numbers I keep track with my pet meter, but I’d like to add in separate for the Libre readings. I did reduce his shots those days I think it really was getting low. Weirdly his numbers don’t go down overnight.

I think I may get another one when this one is done. It’s nice to have more data, it’s just also stressing me out, ha.

Have you chosen a protocol to follow? Either SLGS or TR yet?
I don’t see any indication on your signature (look at the bottom of my information, my Signature.

We don’t change the dose one time only. You want to stick to a dose as indicated by the protocol to see how it’s doing.

If you change the dose each cycle, you won’t know what dose is correct for him.

Has anyone given you any information on how to set up a signature and correctly post your thread?

Since you are using Prozinc, has Suzanne helped you yet?

 

[Staci & Ivy]

@Suzanne & Darcy
Can you help?

 

[tedsmom1]

She actually helped me quite a bit in my first post on the forum recently! It was about how Ted had his first hypo episode and was hospitalized for about 2 days. It was really more due to him needing fluids because his kidney levels were slightly elevated. They came down, but we went to get new bloodwork since it has been about a month after, his levels were slightly elevated again. They said it means beginning of kidney disease most likely. We go to see his cardiologist and internist beginning of August to check his heart disease status again and see how his kidneys look. The emergent/specialists vets and my regular vet wanted him to try this Libre to get more information.

I guess I misunderstood the changing of the dose methods. I got scared to give him the full dose since he kept dipping on the numbers. A woman I work with had a diabetic cat, she suggested doing the lower doses. She said she did that all the time for her cat based on how their readings had been. As long as he's been diabetic, he has been fairly consistent until this episode. He was on 2.5units, but after that episode the emergent vet said 1.5.

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

There is not yet a lot of data on your spreadsheet as far as mid-cycle tests go, but with the numbers we do have, I would recommend not shooting more than 1.25 units or even reducing to 1 unit and holding that dose for seven days. After a symptomatic hypo event, a cat can be more sensitive to insulin. Did Ted have a symptomatic hypo?

The Libre sensors are notorious for reading too low in the lower numbers. That is why you need to be able to check with a handheld glucometer. It would be best probably if you could just use a human glucometer because, after all, the Libre sensors are designed to measure human interstitial glucose and are not made for pets. The differences between the two may be even more pronounced.

ProZinc usually works best with consistent doses, but there are occasions where a reduced dose may be necessary, but often it is not. However, we gather data to see how to adjust the doses.

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

He’s had it on almost a week and almost every day it has done this

You should be able to put a lot more data on your spreadsheet? Correct?

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

With ProZinc, we have two dosing methods. SLGS (Start Low Go Slow) and the Modified ProZinc Method (MPM). Your spreadsheet says TR (Tight Regulation) but that is for Lantus/Levemir/Glargine users.

Have you read the dosing protocols on the ProZinc forum? Generally we recommend starting with SLGS for the first month and gathering data. With the Libre, we should be able to fill in a lot of data on his spreadsheet quickly (while ignoring the lows to some extent if you check them with your handheld glucometer.) I can help you with your dosing and your ProZinc journey. If you post on the ProZinc Forum I will be a lot more likely to see your posts. You can also tag me and or even send a PM to let me know you have made a post and need help.

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

With your spreadsheet, you can use a single spreadsheet to record his data. I just need a way to distinguish between the Libre numbers and the handheld glucometer numbers. Many people will either put an asterisk after the handheld glucometer numbers or put an (Alpha Trak) or an R (ReliOn) after those numbers to show which are which.

 

[tedsmom1]

With ProZinc, we have two dosing methods. SLGS (Start Low Go Slow) and the Modified ProZinc Method (MPM). Your spreadsheet says TR (Tight Regulation) but that is for Lantus/Levemir/Glargine users.

Have you read the dosing protocols on the ProZinc forum? Generally we recommend starting with SLGS for the first month and gathering data. With the Libre, we should be able to fill in a lot of data on his spreadsheet quickly (while ignoring the lows to some extent if you check them with your handheld glucometer.) I can help you with your dosing and your ProZinc journey. If you post on the ProZinc Forum I will be a lot more likely to see your posts. You can also tag me and or even send a PM to let me know you have made a post and need help.

Oh sorry, I was trying to fill out the signature and things and I thought those were the options and tr meant regular dose. I’m trying to read as much as I can on here, I’m sorry. I’m also now trying to figure out how to get this off him without hurting him, I just got an alert it failed and it shut down and to remove it. It’s pretty stuck on him and I don’t want to hurt him. I’ll try to upload the data I did get from the libre as soon as I can.

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

Oh sorry, I was trying to fill out the signature and things and I thought those were the options and tr meant regular dose. I’m trying to read as much as I can on here, I’m sorry. I’m also now trying to figure out how to get this off him without hurting him, I just got an alert it failed and it shut down and to remove it. It’s pretty stuck on him and I don’t want to hurt him. I’ll try to upload the data I did get from the libre as soon as I can.

Oh no. I am sorry you are having difficulties with your baby! Don’t worry a bit right now about the dosing method or anything. That’s what I am here for! Eventually we can get things sorted out.

Is your Libre failing then? @Staci & Ivy can help with that.

 

[tedsmom1]

Oh no. I am sorry you are having difficulties with your baby! Don’t worry a bit right now about the dosing method or anything. That’s what I am here for! Eventually we can get things sorted out.

Is your Libre failing then? @Staci & Ivy can help with that.

Thank you. I appreciate all your help! I’ve been a wreck ever since his episode. Yeah the Libre stopped working close to 5, which is about when I test/feed him before shot. It tried reading/connecting for over an hour I think before it gave up. It looks like part of it was already coming up, maybe that’s why it failed? I’m attaching a picture of what it alerted to me. I put some olive oil on it and was able to get a good amount lifted but he was getting upset so I let him be. He’s snoozing now. I’m hoping it’ll loosen more and I can get it off without hurting him.

 

[Staci & Ivy]

Oh sorry, I was trying to fill out the signature and things and I thought those were the options and tr meant regular dose. I’m trying to read as much as I can on here, I’m sorry. I’m also now trying to figure out how to get this off him without hurting him, I just got an alert it failed and it shut down and to remove it. It’s pretty stuck on him and I don’t want to hurt him. I’ll try to upload the data I did get from the libre as soon as I can.

If it’s failed it’s done
Do you know if the vet used glue to install it?
It’s highly recommended not to ever use glue as it can cause the Libre to fail and the glue can harm their fragile skin.
(You can read the document above for tips to remote it).

I use organic coconut oil on a qtip and very gently go around the paper under the sensor to loosen the sensor. Without any glue it comes right off in about 5-10 minutes.
You can also order Brava spray from Amazon to help get it off.

 

[Staci & Ivy]

Thank you. I appreciate all your help! I’ve been a wreck ever since his episode. Yeah the Libre stopped working close to 5, which is about when I test/feed him before shot. It tried reading/connecting for over an hour I think before it gave up. It looks like part of it was already coming up, maybe that’s why it failed? I’m attaching a picture of what it alerted to me. I put some olive oil on it and was able to get a good amount lifted but he was getting upset so I let him be. He’s snoozing now. I’m hoping it’ll loosen more and I can get it off without hurting him.

Olive oil is good too.
Was it reading very low?
How long was it on him?

I’ve found if they are very low for several hours that. An cause it to shut down.
I think it’s a safety feature (it thinks the human is too low and it must be malfunctioning).

 

[tedsmom1]

Olive oil is good too.
Was it reading very low?
How long was it on him?

I’ve found if they are very low for several hours that. An cause it to shut down.
I think it’s a safety feature (it thinks the human is too low and it must be malfunctioning).

No it wasn’t low when it failed, it was on the higher end since it was about shot time. He’s had it on about 8 days. He’s been a good boy about not messing with it, but he does lay on it and loaf, and I think that kind of made it start to come up enough to fail it. The vet didn’t say anything about what kind of glue, but it’s on him pretty good. If we try another one I’ll make sure to do something different, cause I feel awful it’s kind of just stuck on him right now.

 

[Staci & Ivy]

No it wasn’t low when it failed, it was on the higher end since it was about shot time. He’s had it on about 8 days. He’s been a good boy about not messing with it, but he does lay on it and loaf, and I think that kind of made it start to come up enough to fail it. The vet didn’t say anything about what kind of glue, but it’s on him pretty good. If we try another one I’ll make sure to do something different, cause I feel awful it’s kind of just stuck on him right now.

Hmmm. It could be from the glue.
Just work on it a little at a time with olive oil or cotton on a qtip. Even baby oil (but make sure he can’t lick that).
No rush.

 

[tedsmom1]

Hmmm. It could be from the glue.
Just work on it a little at a time with olive oil or cotton on a qtip. Even baby oil (but make sure he can’t lick that).
No rush.

Okay, yeah I’ll keep doing that with the olive oil. Thank you!

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

but he does lay on it and loaf,

Another thing is that when kitty is lying on the Libre it can affect the reading as well.

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

Thank you. I appreciate all your help! I’ve been a wreck ever since his episode. Yeah the Libre stopped working close to 5, which is about when I test/feed him before shot. It tried reading/connecting for over an hour I think before it gave up. It looks like part of it was already coming up, maybe that’s why it failed? I’m attaching a picture of what it alerted to me. I put some olive oil on it and was able to get a good amount lifted but he was getting upset so I let him be. He’s snoozing now. I’m hoping it’ll loosen more and I can get it off without hurting him.

He is going to be safe. Try to get the preshot tests today and a mid-cycle test or two and put them into your spreadsheet. Try to give a small amount of food at +2 and +4. Then hopefully we can see where we are and what Ted has been up to with his BG.

 

[tedsmom1]

He is going to be safe. Try to get the preshot tests today and a mid-cycle test or two and put them into your spreadsheet. Try to give a small amount of food at +2 and +4. Then hopefully we can see where we are and what Ted has been up to with his BG.

Thank you I’ve just been so worried about him. Since the libre died before his shot last night, I took a reading close to the +4 mark since he seemed to be dipping lowest around 3-4 hour mark. He was at 126.
I had to fight to get a reading this morning, idk why but sometimes it’s just harder than other times to get enough for the meter. He starts to get upset and I feel like I’m hurting his ear. I try to add a bit more petroleum jelly on it after to help heal but I know it gets sore. I’ll see if I can do a mid-cycle reading, but I don’t want to bother him so much he won’t let me even get a pre shot reading.

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

Thank you I’ve just been so worried about him. Since the libre died before his shot last night, I took a reading close to the +4 mark since he seemed to be dipping lowest around 3-4 hour mark. He was at 126.
I had to fight to get a reading this morning, idk why but sometimes it’s just harder than other times to get enough for the meter. He starts to get upset and I feel like I’m hurting his ear. I try to add a bit more petroleum jelly on it after to help heal but I know it gets sore. I’ll see if I can do a mid-cycle reading, but I don’t want to bother him so much he won’t let me even get a pre shot reading.

126 is a good safe number. Well done!

Are you warming his ears before you prick? What size lancet are you using? In the beginning a little larger size is better— until it becomes really easy for both of you. Are you giving him a treat with every BG test (whether successful or not?)

 

[tedsmom1]

126 is a good safe number. Well done!

Are you warming his ears before you prick? What size lancet are you using? In the beginning a little larger size is better— until it becomes really easy for both of you. Are you giving him a treat with every BG test (whether successful or not?)

I rub his ear a bit to warm it up and then put a thin layer of petroleum jelly, that’s actually been the biggest help. I’ll try to get something specific to help warm it up more. I use the PetTest brand lancets that are 21 gauge. What size do most people use? I can try another size.
And usually I’ll test him then take him to eat breakfast/dinner as kind of a reward, then shot after he eats. He’s not really a treat guy. He sometimes likes the freeze dried chicken bits with his food, but he doesn’t like churros or anything like that. He refuses all wet food. I buy different kinds and flavors all the time. He refuses it all. The one I offered this morning that he refused I put outside and a raccoon loved it. Wish Ted would have loved it. My neighborhood raccoons and possums are getting fed high end cat food, ha. I love him more than anything but boy is he difficult.