New Member - 4 months with no progress on cat's diabetes and I am terrified

[LN04]

I have never felt so helpless and hopeless.

4 months of trying to get my cat's numbers down from 300 to 400+. To my shock, the vet's office has neglected to tell me very much.

I've had to learn online and I am losing hope.

5 units of ProZinc now. Everytime there is an increase there is an initial drop in her blood sugar #s. Then, it goes back to the high numbers again the following days.

The tech that was supposd to educate me 4 months ago barely covered the basics and even neglected to show me that you have to prepare the ProZinc bottle. She only focused on how I give the shot. Even left the ProZinc bottle I took home sitting on the table for the hour!! I vigorously shook the bottle the following days and weeks not knowing this destroyed the insulin. At the end of the tech educating me, I asked what I should do with the Prozinc bottle -- she only said to "keep it in the fridge" and NOTHING on preparing the bottle by rolling, nothing that it was critical to not let it freeze. Even the prescription label COVERED the "DO NOT SHAKE" on the box. It has been a nightmare these last four months.

I'm caretaking an elderly parent in her final days, so it's not like I had time to research -- sadly, I trusted my vet

They also gave me a bag of dry food, glcyobalance and a few cans of wet food in case she didn't like the dry food. Little did I know what I now read that she really should be on wet food to reduce carbs.

I am in such a state of terror now watching my cat get thinner and numbers not going down. I've researched and read, I've installed a Freestyle Libre sensor and use their reader.

But I watch her numbers NOT going down.

I feel like there is no hope for my cat. Last Monday, I has a full set of tests run again on my cats. Inflamation, no infections, glucose in urine, no ketones, and vet said to take it up to 5 units of ProZinc afterwards.

The numbers on ONE day (second day after starting 5 units) went down to nadir of 200. Yeah .........but that night and the following 1.5 days it only drops down to 300 as a nadir.

I'm starting to shift my cat to wet food in reading it can make a 100 difference by giving 1.5 ounces of can glycobalance every 12 hours.

Help. I feel so hopeless for my 12.5 year old friend that was active and seemingly healthy until she got her rabies shot mid-December. Within a couple of weeks, it was clear something was wrong with her.

The vet last week said it is diabetes and sees nothing else wrong.

What on earth do I do to save my cat?? She cannot go on with 300 to 400+ numbers

Thank you!

 

[squeem3]

@Suzanne & Darcy can help.

Is there another vet in your area you can use? Some vets just aren't experienced in diabetes or take a one size fits all approach to all clients.

You don't need the dry food or any prescription food. Low carb canned food is best. Brands like Fancy Feast and Friskies are fine and affordable. But do the change slowly as that can impact blood glucose levels and the 5 units of ProZinc may be too much.

 

[LN04]

It has been 4 months, and the lower # of units is not impacting the high 300-400+ at all. So, after the blood work and other tests, they told me to try 5 units. This is why I am terrified.

As to the food, I know you can do Friskies but I'm using Royal Canin Glycobalance dry (started in January as that is what they gave me) which I'm gradually switching to Glycobalance canned/wet as I finally saw an article on the dry food carbs issue. My vet said NOTHING on the dry food carb issue.

I am going to the best vet office in town. I have already put in a request to be referred to the local university vet school to have my cat evaluated but they have a long waiting list. I may ask if there are other vets which is awkward to ask your existing vet

Oddly, my cat seems to be feeling a bit better, but the Freestyle Libre shows high 300-400+ -- BUT the new sensor was just put on her yesterday afternoon. The day before the new sensor, I saw a 50 point overall drop with 200 nadir (might have been a sensor "pressure low" as I just read in your CGM info"). I also read on your CGM post that the first day or so of a new sensor is not reliable.

Last month, the vet's testing was all over 400 using 4 units of Prozinc. But, I'm not sure I have not been nearly freezing ProZinc as I did find my fridge temp was 35F at 2 am. Who knows if it went lower.

I will be getting a new fresh bottle of Prozinc soon as I bought a small fridge dedicated for the insulin only, and a wireless thermometer from La Crosse Technology to give alerts. Right now, I have water bottles I put in the fridge and it has to drop down to 40F before I put the new Prozinc in it

Thank you for your reply!

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

I have never felt so helpless and hopeless.

4 months of trying to get my cat's numbers down from 300 to 400+. To my shock, the vet's office has neglected to tell me very much.

I've had to learn online and I am losing hope.

5 units of ProZinc now. Everytime there is an increase there is an initial drop in her blood sugar #s. Then, it goes back to the high numbers again the following days.

The tech that was supposd to educate me 4 months ago barely covered the basics and even neglected to show me that you have to prepare the ProZinc bottle. She only focused on how I give the shot. Even left the ProZinc bottle I took home sitting on the table for the hour!! I vigorously shook the bottle the following days and weeks not knowing this destroyed the insulin. At the end of the tech educating me, I asked what I should do with the Prozinc bottle -- she only said to "keep it in the fridge" and NOTHING on preparing the bottle by rolling, nothing that it was critical to not let it freeze. Even the prescription label COVERED the "DO NOT SHAKE" on the box. It has been a nightmare these last four months.

I'm caretaking an elderly parent in her final days, so it's not like I had time to research -- sadly, I trusted my vet

They also gave me a bag of dry food, glcyobalance and a few cans of wet food in case she didn't like the dry food. Little did I know what I now read that she really should be on wet food to reduce carbs.

I am in such a state of terror now watching my cat get thinner and numbers not going down. I've researched and read, I've installed a Freestyle Libre sensor and use their reader.

But I watch her numbers NOT going down.

I feel like there is no hope for my cat. Last Monday, I has a full set of tests run again on my cats. Inflamation, no infections, glucose in urine, no ketones, and vet said to take it up to 5 units of ProZinc afterwards.

The numbers on ONE day (second day after starting 5 units) went down to nadir of 200. Yeah .........but that night and the following 1.5 days it only drops down to 300 as a nadir.

I'm starting to shift my cat to wet food in reading it can make a 100 difference by giving 1.5 ounces of can glycobalance every 12 hours.

Help. I feel so hopeless for my 12.5 year old friend that was active and seemingly healthy until she got her rabies shot mid-December. Within a couple of weeks, it was clear something was wrong with her.

The vet last week said it is diabetes and sees nothing else wrong.

What on earth do I do to save my cat?? She cannot go on with 300 to 400+ numbers

Thank you!

I would like to help you. I am so sorry. I can feel the desperation in your message. Do you have a spreadsheet with any BG numbers for your baby?

Don’t panic. We can turn this situation around. I just need to understand what has happened and what is happening now. Forgive me if I ask questions that have been asked before.

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

You are right about the ProZinc just needing to be gently rolled on the counter before drawing the insulin. I am glad you know that now. I am sorry you didn’t know it before.

Also, do not expel excess insulin into the vial. If you draw excess insulin into the syringe, expel the excess insulin into the sink or on a counter or a paper towel. The insulin syringes have lubricants in them and we don’t want any of the insulin that has been in contact with the lubricants to go back into the vial. A ProZinc vial can last for several months if stored in the refrigerator, gently rolled and nit had excess insulin expelled back into the vial.

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

So you will be making the change to low carb wet food? I would make it gradually over a period of about 5-7 days. Just add a little more of the LC each day and a little less of the other HC food. The glycobalance is not good for diabetic cats. You can use store brands like Fancy Feast pates or Friskies (although many of my foster cats get diarrhea on Friskies pates due to the very high organ meat content). Some good brands are Weruva and Tiki Cat. If you are not dealing with higher kidney bloodwork values, then you won’t have to be concerned with phosphorus necessarily and that will give you more options.

 

[LN04]

I would like to help you. I am so sorry. I can feel the desperation in your message. Do you have a spreadsheet with any BG numbers for your baby?

Don’t panic. We can turn this situation around. I just need to understand what has happened and what is happening now. Forgive me if I ask questions that have been asked before.

Thank you. I am fighting panic. I relaxed and put my trust in the vet -- resisted my over-researching tendencies in early January and I regret that.

There is not a spreadsheet for the same reason as above. i trusted the process which never panned out.

Rennie, my tux girl, went to the vet every 10-14 days for the BG readings. It ranges from a rare single 250, to mostly 300-400, and even up to 526 over these 4 months. In other words, the BG data is at the vet's office.

At one point, the frustrated vet came out to the waiting area and said, "it's like she is not getting insulin at all!" I now know it is because I had been vigorously SHAKING the Prozinc bottle which destroyed the insulin the first day. I then kept giving the DEAD insulin for over 2 months.

I installed a CGM April 24 when I realized I had to take control, and I could not trust my vet. So, the data is in the CGM reader.

It also reflects the 300-400+ normal range. The Libre simply has "HI" when it is over 400.

Right now, I'm trying to fix ANYTHING I could be doing wrong -- shots, prepping bottle, properly rolling bottle, temperature bottle kept at. I probably will board Rennie for a day so the vet can administer their Prozinc and their procedures to see if they have better success -- trying to rule out the at-home treatment.

And, I've requested to go to the vet school for an evalution but that's a long wait that Rennie may not survive.

What I do not understand, NOR the two vets working on Rennie's case (a married couple), is why Rennie responds initially very well to ANY change, and then returns to high numbers again (i.e., new Prozinc bottle, new increase in units, new vetsulin bottle) Same pattern -- hopeful lower #s and reduction of symptoms -- and few days later back to high #s again

 

[LN04]

You are right about the ProZinc just needing to be gently rolled on the counter before drawing the insulin. I am glad you know that now. I am sorry you didn’t know it before.

Also, do not expel excess insulin into the vial. If you draw excess insulin into the syringe, expel the excess insulin into the sink or on a counter or a paper towel. The insulin syringes have lubricants in them and we don’t want any of the insulin that has been in contact with the lubricants to go back into the vial. A ProZinc vial can last for several months if stored in the refrigerator, gently rolled and nit had excess insulin expelled back into the vial.

This is news on the excess insulin back into the vial. The January tech specifically told me overdraw the insulin AND press it back into the vial!!! NOT what you explain here. Last week, I complained about that January tech, and the vet said she is the best tech we have!! Arrrggghhh!!!

 

[LN04]

So you will be making the change to low carb wet food? I would make it gradually over a period of about 5-7 days. Just add a little more of the LC each day and a little less of the other HC food. The glycobalance is not good for diabetic cats. You can use store brands like Fancy Feast pates or Friskies (although many of my foster cats get diarrhea on Friskies pates due to the very high organ meat content). Some good brands are Weruva and Tiki Cat. If you are not dealing with higher kidney bloodwork values, then you won’t have to be concerned with phosphorus necessarily and that will give you more options.

You wrote, "The glycobalance is not good for diabetic cats"

But glycobalance is solely FOR diabetic cats, and it is what the vet's office recommends.

So do off-the-shelf foods instead.... I'm going to have to look at this closely.

I am in that SLOW transition -- 3 days already -- of going from HC to LC. I know there is a risk of hypo if I did a sharp transition, and diarrhea issues.

 

[LN04]

You say to "roll the bottle on the counter" which is news to me as well. I have been told two different ways -- roll in between hands slowly with the bottle vertical. The other way is the same roll between hands but bottle horizontal. I called Prozinc customer service and they said either of those two ways that they recommend

 

[LN04]

I called Royal Canin customer service a few days ago on the carb issue.

They said their glycobalance dry food is 23% carb (obviously TOO high for a diabetic cat!!) and sadly, that is exactly what I've been feeding Rennie since early January.

Their wet glycobalance is 2.6% carb and that is under that 10% threshold.

They also told me that glycobalance is being replaced with their new reformulation product called glycobalance advanced. Old glycobalance will be gone by August.

The new glycobalance advanced has 1.6% carb

 

[LN04]

Rennie has maintained her weight, but has lost muscle. I can feel her spine now for instance.

She is in good spirits, but her common behaviors that were there all the time prior to mid-December are nearly gone. That said, if you saw her, she seems like a healthy happy cat.

Thank you for reading, your replies. It means a lot that you care, and have answers! I need to sleep now.

 

[squeem3]

There's nothing in prescription food that makes it better than commercially available foods. Take a look at the label. Those ingredients are common with many commercial brands of food. There's no magic or special or proprietary ingredient or formulation. Food labeled as for a specific health condition is a marketing gimmick. Pet food manufacturers lost a lawsuit sometime ago because of the false claim that their "prescription" food helps. Some info on prescription foods: Feeding Your Cat: Know the Basics of Feline Nutrition – Common Sense. Healthy Cats. Vets aren't familiar with proper nutrition and tend to sell whatever the pet food companies market to them. It's fine to ignore the vet about food. Pet food companies obviously don't want to bad mouth their product so don't expect much help from them.

Vet techs are kind of hit or miss. Some are experienced, others not so much. And take their job title with a grain of salt. Sometimes vet offices hire anyone who needs a job. So there may be "vet techs" who have zero experience. They just learn through the job. Others have a degree and / or professional certification or licensing.

 

[LN04]

There's nothing in prescription food that makes it better than commercially available foods. Take a look at the label. Those ingredients are common with many commercial brands of food. There's no magic or special or proprietary ingredient or formulation. Food labeled as for a specific health condition is a marketing gimmick. Pet food manufacturers lost a lawsuit sometime ago because of the false claim that their "prescription" food helps. Some info on prescription foods: Feeding Your Cat: Know the Basics of Feline Nutrition – Common Sense. Healthy Cats. Vets aren't familiar with proper nutrition and tend to sell whatever the pet food companies market to them. It's fine to ignore the vet about food. Pet food companies obviously don't want to bad mouth their product so don't expect much help from them.

Vet techs are kind of hit or miss. Some are experienced, others not so much. And take their job title with a grain of salt. Sometimes vet offices hire anyone who needs a job. So there may be "vet techs" who have zero experience. They just learn through the job. Others have a degree and / or professional certification or licensing.

Thank you for what you share here. It is part of my terror with this. WHO and WHAT to trust. Vet techs are unreliable. Food prescription are marketing gimmicks.

I know to gradually change a cat. I'm changing from glycobalance dry to wet. Then I will change to other wet food like you suggest. I am running out of time with Rennie, and nothing is moving her numbers down. Nothing. Only ONE day of numbers going down with a new unit of insulin, or a new bottle -- then it goes right back up. The nadir is 325 last night. This is hopeless.

She got 5 units a couple of days ago and actually had a nadir of 200!! First time (but may have been a pressure low with her laying on the CGM sensor).

At the same time, I have moved her to 50% wet glyco and 50% dry glyco in a transition -- again, NO lowering of her numbers

It is like her body gets a hit of more insulin (i.e., now ProZinc 5 units for a 7 lb cat), and her body forcefully moves it back up to the 300 to 425 range. SAME pattern for the last four months!

 

[LN04]

So you will be making the change to low carb wet food? I would make it gradually over a period of about 5-7 days. Just add a little more of the LC each day and a little less of the other HC food. The glycobalance is not good for diabetic cats. You can use store brands like Fancy Feast pates or Friskies (although many of my foster cats get diarrhea on Friskies pates due to the very high organ meat content). Some good brands are Weruva and Tiki Cat. If you are not dealing with higher kidney bloodwork values, then you won’t have to be concerned with phosphorus necessarily and that will give you more options.

Right now it is 3 days transition from glyco dry to glyco wet with 50/50 ratio. Once one wet 100% then I will look to other food brands as you suggest, but after I chat with the vet. I do not want to alienate the vet and still want to know exactly what the at-home treatment is. I know some here say that the vet does not need to know, but I disagree.

 

[LN04]

There's nothing in prescription food that makes it better than commercially available foods. Take a look at the label. Those ingredients are common with many commercial brands of food. There's no magic or special or proprietary ingredient or formulation. Food labeled as for a specific health condition is a marketing gimmick. Pet food manufacturers lost a lawsuit sometime ago because of the false claim that their "prescription" food helps. Some info on prescription foods: Feeding Your Cat: Know the Basics of Feline Nutrition – Common Sense. Healthy Cats. Vets aren't familiar with proper nutrition and tend to sell whatever the pet food companies market to them. It's fine to ignore the vet about food. Pet food companies obviously don't want to bad mouth their product so don't expect much help from them.

Vet techs are kind of hit or miss. Some are experienced, others not so much. And take their job title with a grain of salt. Sometimes vet offices hire anyone who needs a job. So there may be "vet techs" who have zero experience. They just learn through the job. Others have a degree and / or professional certification or licensing.

I have asked the vet techs if they are licensed. Some are learning without a license, but they are in the room with the licensed tech.

As to the food, I really want to study this more. My Rennie is likely going to die, and I do not want on my conscious to not have done the most for her even if it is paying for pricey food.

 

[LN04]

In continuing my online research on Rennie, AND my past history with cats that had IBD, it occured to me that if she has early stage IBD (she had symptoms I now see last year), then it likely explains her current insulin resistence. The recent full testing of Rennie last week shows systemic inflammation.

I've left a message for the vet that I want to treat Rennie for early stage IBD and see if this also helps resolve the insulin resistance. Diet, B12 shots in first round of attempted treatment.

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

Right now it is 3 days transition from glyco dry to glyco wet with 50/50 ratio. Once one wet 100% then I will look to other food brands as you suggest, but after I chat with the vet. I do not want to alienate the vet and still want to know exactly what the at-home treatment is. I know some here say that the vet does not need to know, but I disagree.

It depends upon the veterinarian. I have seen some veterinarians give some extremely bad and incorrect advice to some of our members here. I have seen veterinarians recommend doses that have caused cats to go into hypoglycemia. It is particularly bad advice to tell a client to not check their cats blood glucose levels, for example. We see that a lot here as well. What human doctor would ever give insulin to their patient and then tell them — don’t bother to check your blood glucose levels? Now I’m not saying you are a veterinarian did any of that, but it happens frequently. On the other hand, Ihave also seen some veterinarians who have learned from their clients who are members here — and have been so impressed by their clients spreadsheets and the care they are giving the cat … that they just say “keep doing what you’re doing.”

 

[Tim & Pookey]

I struggled with that too when I landed here. Why should I trust some random internet people when I have a vet? The fact is though the people here have been practicing this stuff since the 90s, based on publicized research. The support I was getting from the vet was nonexistent. It wasn’t their fault though, I just don’t think they saw a lot of diabetic cats. More dogs. So I stuck around and read (and still do) as much as I can. If your vet is in tune with the latest FD stuff then even better.

 

[LN04]

It depends upon the veterinarian. I have seen some veterinarians give some extremely bad and incorrect advice to some of our members here. I have seen veterinarians recommend doses that have caused cats to go into hypoglycemia. It is particularly bad advice to tell a client to not check their cats blood glucose levels, for example. We see that a lot here as well. What human doctor would ever give insulin to their patient and then tell them — don’t bother to check your blood glucose levels? Now I’m not saying you are a veterinarian did any of that, but it happens frequently. On the other hand, Ihave also seen some veterinarians who have learned from their clients who are members here — and have been so impressed by their clients spreadsheets and the care they are giving the cat … that they just say “keep doing what you’re doing.”

Earlier I wrote how this has impacted my trust with the vet office, and my regret of not researching earlier. I also said I'm caring a dying family member so that is hard work in itself. And, now I also have a sick cat. Such is life. Yes, it is stunning the bad advice...... tragic in many ways

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

Earlier I wrote how this has impacted my trust with the vet office, and my regret of not researching earlier. I also said I'm caring a dying family member so that is hard work in itself. And, now I also have a sick cat. Such is life. Yes, it is stunning the bad advice...... tragic in many ways

You are really stressed to an extreme degree. It’s a LOT!

 

[LN04]

Ahhh thank you. Yes, stressed beyond extreme. And, when you are taking care of a dying elderly family member, it is not uncommon that everyone disappears. They do not want involvement. So, I was trusting the vet's office to guide me. However, as said earlier in a reply to me, many vets have a usual track they follow. They did test extensively initially to rule out other co-occuring illnesses. But IBD hides in the early stage. And, Rennie definitely had a reaction to the rabies shot which likely inflamed her, setting off the pre-diabetic condition in her -- and the row of dominoes fell. Likely early stage IBD, pre-diabetic to now insulin resistent with inflammation. Other sources of inflamation have been ruled out.

But, I studied early stage IBD, and with AI, realized Rennie's symptoms last year were pre-cursors to IBD.

And, what do you want to know about a dying 95 year old woman with her plateful of illnesses? I'm exhausted. I do not want to lose Rennie during all this.......

I very much appreciate the help for her FD. If anything, it has me looking at this in a larger way with permission that the vets do NOT look at everything, or wrong advice. So, I brainstormed this morning and IBD occurred to me. So thank you to all of you.

 

[Sienne and Gabby (GA)]

FWIW, we have your back! The early stages of managing your cat's diabetes are stressful even without all of the other things you're dealing with.

Please ditch all of the Royal Canin food. The canned food is about 14% carb. As you noted, the dry food is even higher. You have lots of choices for low carb canned food. We lean toward canned food because that are very few dry foods that are low in carbs. The moisture in canned foods is also a big plus. This is a food chart that while a bit dated, has a ton of good information. The chart was developed by a vet. Most vets get very little information on nutrition during their training. They typically rely of the marketing reps for their information. In addition, just because it's "prescription" doesn't mean it's a good choice. The pet food manufacturers lost a class action suit for calling their food "prescription."

Whether you roll the insulin between your hands or on the counter, it doesn't matter. Rolling it between your hands warms it up just a little but as long as you're not shaking the insulin, you're good.

A couple of thoughts about numbers....
If you were relying to test data from the vets office, the stress of being there may have been contributing to higher numbers. Now that you have a Libre on your kitty, you can monitor at home without the influence of car rides and vet stress. There is also a phenomenon that we refer to as a "bounce." If your cat drops into a low range of numbers, experiences a fast drop into numbers, or is in a lower range their body isn't accustomed to, their liver and pancreas may release a stored form of glucose along with counterregulatory hormones. When this happens, it causes numbers to spike upward. It can take up to 3 days for the bounce to clear. This is a normal process -- it's hugely annoying to us but it is protective for your cat.

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

I've left a message for the vet that I want to treat Rennie for early stage IBD and see if this also helps resolve the insulin resistance. Diet, B12 shots in first round of attempted treatment.

First I would want to get an abdominal ultrasound to either confirm or rule out of my cat had IBD at any stage. The symptoms of IBD can be similar to other conditions. Have you had a full GI panel done? I would actually have that sent out first. That would help point things in the right direction or rule out (or in) possible IBD or some things like Exocrine Pancreatic Insufficiency. I had a friend whose cat had symptoms of IBD and he finally had the Texas A&M GI panel done (after I bugged her about it for a long time) and it came back that he was low in folate. Now, I don’t know why he was low in folate as his ultrasound was completely normal at the time. With folate supplementation his symptoms all went away.

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

I do wish you had a spreadsheet on your cat so I could see the patterns. How did you arrive at 5 units? What I mean is… by how much were you increasing the dose at a time. I hope it wasn’t increasing by full units at a time?

My cat had a condition called Acromegaly which made him extremely insulin resistant.

 

[Suzanne & Darcy]

One of the first things to try if you are concerned about IBD would be a novel protein diet. I am sure you have read about them. It is possible to find novel and single source protein foods that are low in carbs.

I would not give my cat B-12 injections prior to doing the GI panel and finding out if B-12
(Cobalamin) was a problem/deficiency, which can indicate absorption problems in the gut.

Pancreatitis can also be diagnosed— and it’s not uncommon in diabetic cats. There are also tests for inflammatory markers.

How much weight has Rennie lost? That is such a worry. How is Rennie’s appetite? Are you feeding multiple small meals throughout the day? That’s very important for cats on insulin.

 

[JL and Chip]

Quick question (just for good measure): what insulin syringes are you using? The info on the package would be helpful or a photo of either the package or syringe.

I too can hear the desperation in your posts. I completely understand, far more than you know, and others around here do too. You are not alone in this.

Did the vet also run a thyroid panel, or at least a T4, with the last bloodwork? It’s often an add-on and not part of the standard labs. I always ask for a copy of my cat’s bloodwork before I leave the office so I can put it in my file for reference. It might be worth asking your vet for a copy — they can usually email or snail mail it to you relatively easily. I have a few other questions about what showed up on the bloodwork as well.

I agree with @Suzanne & Darcy about running a GI Panel before starting any type of IBD treatment. It’s a send out blood test to Texas A&M University and is helpful on ruling in/out certain GI and pancreas issues. I’ve done more than I can count over the years and they can be enlightening. My vet, who doesn’t typically do such testing, has even started running them in other patients after seeing our results.

For what it’s worth, cats seem to tolerate higher BG numbers for quite awhile without significant adverse consequences that are seen in humans. If you’re not testing for ketones, it might be a good idea (as a precaution) to pick up some ketostix either at a pharmacy or online. They’re urine dip sticks so not hard to use.

I’m not trying to give you more homework, just giving you some tangible steps you can consider given how painful and helpless one feels in these circumstances.

Finally, as for vets, they’re sort of the General Practitioner of the animal world, but instead of one species, they have to know about multiple species and the nuances of medication and illnesses in all of those species. Cats are not small dogs, and there’s just so much to know, not to mention a host of diseases they don’t see very often. Most of the vets I’ve seen over the years (and I’ve seen a lot) know very little about feline diabetes. Their hearts might be in the right place, but they’re just not experts. The folks on this message board live “in the trenches” of FD every day. We have the benefit of multiple voices, backgrounds, and skill sets that have made this place a goldmine of information since 1996. I’ve been here since 2005 myself and am currently on diabetic cat #5. I say all of that because it’s hard to trust random strangers on the Internet. But nothing you have posted is new to us. Even though it seems overwhelming and hopeless right now, we can usually help you find a path through. As for things like a spreadsheet, as unnecessary as that might sound, it really does help us frame the situation and give better insight and suggestions. You don’t have to do the spreadsheet yourself — we have folks who can set one up for you in minutes, just ask.

Hang in there. You have some seasoned voices who have already posted and we all want to help. And give your kitty some special snuggles from me. Hugs to you as you walk this final path of saying goodbye to your family member.

 

[LN04]

I struggled with that too when I landed here. Why should I trust some random internet people when I have a vet? The fact is though the people here have been practicing this stuff since the 90s, based on publicized research. The support I was getting from the vet was nonexistent. It wasn’t their fault though, I just don’t think they saw a lot of diabetic cats. More dogs. So I stuck around and read (and still do) as much as I can. If your vet is in tune with the latest FD stuff then even better.

Thank you for your reply. Yes, you understand what I'm saying. The vet told me at the start of January, that FD is the third most common elder cat illness. So, I am surprised how difficult my experience has been.

 

[LN04]

I'm getting overwhelmed. I very very much appreciate the replies and suggestions!! ultrasound was done in early January. i will have to ask the vet if all tests were run. I've requested a referral to the local vet school for them to see Rennie. In the meantime, I'm focusing on proper food. Correct home procedures. Presumptive IBD even if she does not have IBD, it does not hurt to do the food.

Glycobalance wet is 2.6% carb, not 14% carb. The newest glycobalance advanced is 1.6% carb.

Rennie now has 90% wet glycobalance, with 10% dry glycobalance (dry food helps remove tartar)

Her numbers did go lower to 250. Yeah! But, then went above 400...

As to what was written above on the annoying bounce. I have seen this all the time these past four months -- it is a nightmare. What was written above is that the bounce supposedly lasts 3 days. Problem is that Rennie's numbers do not go down again after 3 days. THIS is why I am hopeless.

But, I think the food might work. I say this with everything tried and it does not pan out -- but the food lately has her at least touching 250 or 300 once or twice a day. All I can do is keep researching and trying. I have a very old family member I am caretaking at the same time, and it also has it's own nightmarish quality.

Tough times. Rennie was my comfort, and now I may lose her. But, this is life.

I do not have a spreadsheet. I can barely function and I don't have numbers. I got the Libre for reasons stated above -- vet visit stress, and needing trends. I only see numbers below 400 on the Freestyle Libre reader (otherwise, it only says "HI" above 400). And, Rennie often is above 400.

I have double checked the needles and I am using the correct red-tipped, U-40 needles. I have purchased a small fridge that people like for their human insulin which is dedicated to the new Prozinc bottle which I will be getting soon. Also, I am now using the La Crosse Technology wireless thermometer which sends out an alert if it exceeds a designated temperature. It is normally for the fridge and freezer sections, but I'm using it for the regular fridge (current location of Prozinc) and the new small fridge which I'm watching to make sure it stays in the 36 to 46F range. I filled it 75% full of water bottles to reduce temperature variance when opening the door.

I imagine the vets have run all the tests you suggested. I asked for the complete package they have last week, and the start of January. But, I'll ask on the GI tests. Thanks for the suggestion.

How Rennie arrived at 5 units is week after week of insulin resistance. The numbers always were high except the intial drop down -- then it went up, and remained in the 300 to 400+ range. At one point, it was 526. This is when I sadly was (uninformed) shaking the insulin bottle vigorously.

There is something that causes the return to the high numbers without lowering after 3 days. Before putting Rennie through MRI and invasive procedures, I'm making sure all the home treatment is correct. I may board her for a day or two and let the vet office take care of her and see if they get better results. Also, I'm focusing on the food issue now -- gradually switching her to wet food, and that IS getting her to go below 350 on the Libre reader, to briefly touching 250 to 300 range. But, then she goes back over 400 later on. WITHOUT the wet food, she stays above ~340. Soooo, the dry food definitely was an issue for those 4 months!! (again, why on earth my vet office even GAVE me dry food is beyond my comprehension)

I suspect early stage IBD (nearly impossible to detect) is causing the inflammation which is causing the insulin resistance. I want to treat presumptive IBD without steroid use.

I've had several IBD cats in the past, so it is my likely feeding Purina One dry food for their lifetimes that is the cause -- and now, likely impacting Rennie as well.

I'm also going to try and visit the local vet school to see if they will let me speak with their nutritionist for advice on a meal plan.

Thank you again. All of you have been so caring and helpful in my dark place. Rennie is in good spirits and is improving in her behavior this week. Thanks to all of you!!!!

 

[LN04]

Quick question (just for good measure): what insulin syringes are you using? The info on the package would be helpful or a photo of either the package or syringe.

I too can hear the desperation in your posts. I completely understand, far more than you know, and others around here do too. You are not alone in this.

Did the vet also run a thyroid panel, or at least a T4, with the last bloodwork? It’s often an add-on and not part of the standard labs. I always ask for a copy of my cat’s bloodwork before I leave the office so I can put it in my file for reference. It might be worth asking your vet for a copy — they can usually email or snail mail it to you relatively easily. I have a few other questions about what showed up on the bloodwork as well.

I agree with @Suzanne & Darcy about running a GI Panel before starting any type of IBD treatment. It’s a send out blood test to Texas A&M University and is helpful on ruling in/out certain GI and pancreas issues. I’ve done more than I can count over the years and they can be enlightening. My vet, who doesn’t typically do such testing, has even started running them in other patients after seeing our results.

For what it’s worth, cats seem to tolerate higher BG numbers for quite awhile without significant adverse consequences that are seen in humans. If you’re not testing for ketones, it might be a good idea (as a precaution) to pick up some ketostix either at a pharmacy or online. They’re urine dip sticks so not hard to use.

I’m not trying to give you more homework, just giving you some tangible steps you can consider given how painful and helpless one feels in these circumstances.

Finally, as for vets, they’re sort of the General Practitioner of the animal world, but instead of one species, they have to know about multiple species and the nuances of medication and illnesses in all of those species. Cats are not small dogs, and there’s just so much to know, not to mention a host of diseases they don’t see very often. Most of the vets I’ve seen over the years (and I’ve seen a lot) know very little about feline diabetes. Their hearts might be in the right place, but they’re just not experts. The folks on this message board live “in the trenches” of FD every day. We have the benefit of multiple voices, backgrounds, and skill sets that have made this place a goldmine of information since 1996. I’ve been here since 2005 myself and am currently on diabetic cat #5. I say all of that because it’s hard to trust random strangers on the Internet. But nothing you have posted is new to us. Even though it seems overwhelming and hopeless right now, we can usually help you find a path through. As for things like a spreadsheet, as unnecessary as that might sound, it really does help us frame the situation and give better insight and suggestions. You don’t have to do the spreadsheet yourself — we have folks who can set one up for you in minutes, just ask.

Hang in there. You have some seasoned voices who have already posted and we all want to help. And give your kitty some special snuggles from me. Hugs to you as you walk this final path of saying goodbye to your family member.

As to the spreadsheet, I do not have the data from the first 4 months. The GI panel. I'm going to ask the vet tomorrow about it along with verifying T4.

One of the first things the vet said in early January is that feline diabetes is common -- the top 3 and they have experience. They kept assuring me, yet the BG #s never went down. Thank you for your kindness and assurances. It does help me incredibly!! That someone cares -- it helps!