1/16, Bell, AMPS 191 +2 192 +4 226 +8 333 PMPS 489

Seth&Bell

Seth&Bell

Very Active Member
Yesterday

Really weird couple of cycles for Bell. I was impressed she came down from the reds so quickly this AM, but she decided to go back for more tonight. Hoping this will turn out like 1/11 and 1/12 and she will come back low! We shall see!

Got her dental scheduled for next Tuesday. I have to drop her off at AMPS +0.5 and they will do the procedure sometime in the +1 to +2 range. I'm debating moving her (half) shot time back an hour so I can feed her a little bit with it. I guess I could still feed earlier and shoot without food at the normal time but I've never done that and I'm not sure she'd be very cooperative without the distraction :). I figure then I could just go back to the normal time in the PM because her cycle will be wonky anyway. But I thought I'd check first if there's a better approach. I could move it slowly back and then slowly forward, but I'm not sure that is worth the effort for a token dose.

I made sure they will monitor her BG during the dental. Confirmed they will do a dental xray before the cleaning. I also talked to them about her bad reaction after the last dental where she didn't sleep (or close her eyes!) for 3-4 days! That was bad. They think it was called by zorbium, which tracks based on some googling. Seems like one of those medications that lasts for days in the system so there's nothing you can do once it's in. They are planning to use something else, so hopefully that will help her after the procedure. They also agreed to a small meal 2-3 hours before the procedure. So I think I covered my bases! Thanks for the help all.

I have just had a bit of time to do some cursory reading into the IAA situation. I'm planning on diving into that in detail on this long weekend.

Bell seems a little bit sleepy/hungry/extra cuddly with all the ups and downs she is having. Currently I'm typing this one-handed as she sits on my lap for some extra pets.
 
@Jason - Kona's Dad: Here's better look at those daggers

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bluesunshine said:
Yesterday

Really weird couple of cycles for Bell. I was impressed she came down from the reds so quickly this AM, but she decided to go back for more tonight. Hoping this will turn out like 1/11 and 1/12 and she will come back low! We shall see!

Got her dental scheduled for next Tuesday. I have to drop her off at AMPS +0.5 and they will do the procedure sometime in the +1 to +2 range. I'm debating moving her (half) shot time back an hour so I can feed her a little bit with it. I guess I could still feed earlier and shoot without food at the normal time but I've never done that and I'm not sure she'd be very cooperative without the distraction :). I figure then I could just go back to the normal time in the PM because her cycle will be wonky anyway. But I thought I'd check first if there's a better approach. I could move it slowly back and then slowly forward, but I'm not sure that is worth the effort for a token dose.

I made sure they will monitor her BG during the dental. Confirmed they will do a dental xray before the cleaning. I also talked to them about her bad reaction after the last dental where she didn't sleep (or close her eyes!) for 3-4 days! That was bad. They think it was called by zorbium, which tracks based on some googling. Seems like one of those medications that lasts for days in the system so there's nothing you can do once it's in. They are planning to use something else, so hopefully that will help her after the procedure. They also agreed to a small meal 2-3 hours before the procedure. So I think I covered my bases! Thanks for the help all.

I have just had a bit of time to do some cursory reading into the IAA situation. I'm planning on diving into that in detail on this long weekend.

Bell seems a little bit sleepy/hungry/extra cuddly with all the ups and downs she is having. Currently I'm typing this one-handed as she sits on my lap for some extra pets.
Click to expand...

I don't know about IAA. I'll need to read about this. Is it diagnosed with a blood test? Did the vet recommend the test, or is this something you asked for based on symptoms? I hope Bell does very well on her Tuesday dental. I need to take Jude in for this as well.
 
Yeah Wendy recommended I check for IAA and Acromegaly once Bell crossed the 6 units dosage (I may be slightly off but it was around this number) without any other known causes for that high dosage need. If you look at yesterday's thread, Wendy posted some good primers on IAA. Looks like Jude is still in the "normal" dosage range so I don't think it is something you would need to worry about at this time. If you see Jude's dosage needs ramp up like Bell's had recently, it could be IAA or Acromegaly.

My vet had actually never tested for IAA before, but she had for Acromegaly. We had to get a blood draw and send it to Michigan State: https://vdl.msu.edu/Bin/Catalog.exe. IAA is 20031 and acromegaly is 20005 in that catalog.

Thank you for the well wishes! I hate to put her through it, but it is for the best.
 
Zorbium is long acting pain med. My last kittty to have extractions was given Zorbium and I told my vet afterwards that it was like she was on an acid trip for days. I did not like it. In addition, she got whacked in the eye by another of my cats and got an ulcer that required twice daily antibiotic ointment that took 2 months to heal. She was so out of it she likely didn’t have the reflexes to defend herself normally.

But she was in no pain. I personally would not want it to be used again. I would rather give buprenorphine injections every 12 hours for pain. That’s what I did with Minner’s mom after her full mouth extraction.
 
Yes! It was exactly like she was on a psychedelic! I was worried that she would never come back to her normal self. She's just stare wide-eyed at nothing for hours without even blinking. And then she'd try to settle in a comfy position and immediately jerk back and readjust. I felt horrible.

Poor poor Minner getting decked during that :(
 
This is exciting that things are in motion! Probably a little nerve wrecking for you, but this will help her. And so promising looking at Black Kitty’s SS yesterday once they got the IAA situated…
 
Yeah I am relieved to at least have a direction. I need to learn from you, Tim, and just absorb all this info. You do so well at it.
 
bluesunshine said:
Looks like Jude is still in the "normal" dosage range so I don't think it is something you would need to worry about at this time.
Click to expand...
When a cat gets to six units and is on a low carb diet, there is a strong likelihood of another condition like IAA or acromegaly (or Cushings) is present. It doesn't work the other way, a cat doesn't need to get to six units to have one of those conditions. We've seen a cat get to 3+something units and test positive for IAA. Ditto for acromegaly and Cushings. The large study that discovered one in four diabetic cats has acromegaly, found some on as small as 1 unit. And there have actually been non diabetic cats tested positive for it too.

There hasn't been a lot of research or studies on IAA. I've seen two studies on small numbers of cats, one said it was uncommon, the other said it was common. :rolleyes:. We've also seen some people request their vet to get both tests, and the vet didn't get the IAA test done cause they thought it's wasn't worth doing. Which is annoying if the acro test comes back negative but kitty still is on a high dose. We have a least three current kitties with IAA only, Oberon being a longer term diabetic and his caregiver Lisa only posts occasionally. Quite unusual for us to have 3 at once.

Regarding the dental, I like the idea of moving it back half an hour and feeding her a bit. Don't forget to take some more of her food there for them to feed her when she starts to wake out of anaesthesia. And a T-shirt of towel or something like that with your scent on it for her.
 
Thank you, Wendy! Sorry for misspeaking. I didn’t mean to imply that a cat with lower than 6 units couldn’t have those conditions, I’m just not sure what would prompt them to have those tests as opposed to assuming it was glucose toxicity or just following the normal dosing protocol.

Maybe due to the prevalence of acromegaly in diabetic cats it wouldn’t be a bad idea to have those tests done to any diabetic cat if the owner has the means to do so.

My tests for the two ran in the $200-$300 range, but I also had my vet take care of the shipping and everything else. I think other members have done it for cheaper by handling the shipping themselves if the vet is willing to have them handle all that.
 
I've also seen people charged even more because the vet sent it through Idexx. I paid more 13 years ago! But that went through an intermediary like Idexx and had to cross the border, etc.

I've seen some endocrine vets suggest testing if kitty isn't regulated by 6 months. But that assumes people are rigorous about testing and following a dosing protocol. The one IAA kitty that was tested at a lower dose, it was just the caregivers feeling that "something" was causing insulin resistance. We were all surprised when it came back positive. For acro and Cushings, there are other clinical signs that can show up on lower doses.
 
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