9/24 Smudge: AMPS 342, +3 95, +3.5 84, +4 85, +5 101, PMPS 236, +2.5 194

Hi Alli!
Both cycles yesterday looked fabulous, with blue streaks with a green :cool::cool::D
Smudge is working the dose! Let's do it again and meet up with Mikan at beach! (assuming she won't have the reversed curve again :rolleyes:)
Have a great Sunday!
 
Sienne and Gabby (GA) said:
To respond to the earlier tag, you are correct. Since Smudge is relatively new to nadirs in the green, you hold the dose for at least 10 cycles/5 days.

When you mentioned the black AMPS, if it were me, I would have re-tested. That AMPS was not the norm for your cat. It could have been a bad test or bad strip.
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Thank you Sienne. I think what was lost on me is you hold from that green nadir, not from the first day of the dose. Now, he also had that green last night (not as low), so does that hold restart?
 
Mikanmama said:
Hi Alli!
Both cycles yesterday looked fabulous, with blue streaks with a green :cool::cool::D
Smudge is working the dose! Let's do it again and meet up with Mikan at beach! (assuming she won't have the reversed curve again :rolleyes:)
Have a great Sunday!
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allicatmeow said:
Thank you Sienne. I think what was lost on me is you hold from that green nadir, not from the first day of the dose. Now, he also had that green last night (not as low), so does that hold restart?
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Hi Kit & Stacy! It feels so weird to hear people say my Smudge is "working the dose"! I felt like a pipe dream and here we are. Hope he does today too. And Mikan and Ivy do with him! :cat:
 
Hi Alli, good to see that green last night but Smudge can do better ;).

My interpretation of TR and when to increase is that the green nadir we're looking for is in the 50-80. If the green is in this range, I HOLD the current dose, regardless of the number of cycles.
If the nadirs are above this but still green, then I increase after 5 days (10 cycles) from when I first started the dose. If I'm getting blues, I increase after 3-4 days on a dose.

MODS/EXPERIENCED MEMBERS PLEASE CORRECT ME IF IM WRONG :)

Sometimes I'll hold a dose a little longer factoring bounces and how fast they clear and because of my ability to monitor. Cleo loves the 3am limes :rolleyes:

Here's where ECID comes into play. Smudge had DKA which usually means being more aggressive with dose increases. But, I believe you have difficulties monitoring in the second half of the PM cycle for health reasons (?).

If Smudge were my cat, I might be inclined to hold the dose a little bit longer, as long as he is not showing ketones, and attempt to slow the big drops at onset which I believe are triggering the bounces.
That's my 2¢ FWIW :)

Let's see what others say.
 
Angela & Cleo said:
Hi Alli, good to see that green last night but Smudge can do better ;).

My interpretation of TR and when to increase is that the green nadir we're looking for is in the 50-80. If the green is in this range, I HOLD the current dose, regardless of the number of cycles.
If the nadirs are above this but still green, then I increase after 5 days (10 cycles) from when I first started the dose. If I'm getting blues, I increase after 3-4 days on a dose.

MODS/EXPERIENCED MEMBERS PLEASE CORRECT ME IF IM WRONG :)

Sometimes I'll hold a dose a little longer factoring bounces and how fast they clear and because of my ability to monitor. Cleo loves the 3am limes :rolleyes:

Here's where ECID comes into play. Smudge had DKA which usually means being more aggressive with dose increases. But, I believe you have difficulties monitoring in the second half of the PM cycle for health reasons (?).

If Smudge were my cat, I might be inclined to hold the dose a little bit longer, as long as he is not showing ketones, and attempt to slow the big drops at onset which I believe are triggering the bounces.
That's my 2¢ FWIW :)

Let's see what others say.
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Angela, you should be a teacher! Thank you so much. What I was unsure of, was whether or not I hold from first dose or from that 72. I also now understand it's a bit of an ECID choice, because he is working lower numbers finally and also because of ketones.

Smudge is still not showing ketones (0.1 yesterday), so I feel safe holding the dose from that 72. I do want to be aggressive for him, just not too much so while we are getting data. I have no problem increasing after 3 days, which would mean if I don't get a 50-80 today, I could increase. As always, VERY open to opinions on this. Just wanna do right by him!

I have difficulty getting PM numbers past +3 during the week, as I have to take something to sleep or I'm not functional for my mentally demanding/organizational job. Waking up is near impossible and I sleep through multiple alarms (this is still new, with horrible timing, and hoping I adapt as time goes). :(

And a positive note: Smudge is officially 100% out and about in my home! He is getting regular zoomies, playing (he never played at my mom's), and he follows me around like a dog. He knows where the food is and rubs his face on that cabinet every time I go in the kitchen. Penny tolerates him and has stopped hissing, he respects her and submisses to her (lays down relaxed) if they are near each other. He knows the couch is "hers" and stays on the ottoman so she can have her space. The dynamic is really working well and I'm so proud of them. Although, they want each other's food more than their own of course. :cat:
 
That's amazing that they're getting along ❤️

What's his feeding schedule and carb %? Maybe there's a way to temper the big drops at onset to flatten him out a bit?
 
Angela & Cleo said:
That's amazing that they're getting along ❤️

What's his feeding schedule and carb %? Maybe there's a way to temper the big drops at onset to flatten him out a bit?
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Boy he's gonna keep me on my toes today, 95 @ +3.

He eats FF classic pate only, which is 2-3%. He eats about half his AM meal right at preshot, gets his shot, then eats the other half about an hour later, leaving maybe a teaspoon or two behind. I leave that out for him to have a snack when he wants over the rest of the cycle since it's so little - he's incredibly smart about it. He also gets Purebites freeze dried chicken treats at every test (0% carb).
 
Wow Alli!
Smudge really really wanted to play at the beach!
Fabulous job managing it.
I also appreciate the conversations between you and @Angela & Cleo - the timing of an increase has always been a bit confusing to me.
I am also looking a potential increase soon (shhhh, don't tell Mikan) so this is very very helpful. Thank you :)
Hope Smudge will give you a mellow curve from here on. :bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
Smudge has spoken! No increase :joyful:.
I'm on my phone but when I get to my PC, I'm going to share a few saved links I have that address the steep drops at onset. Surf safely.
Did you feed a little LC after each test? Not much, just a Smidge for Smudge (sorry couldn't resist :p)
 
Mikanmama said:
Wow Alli!
Smudge really really wanted to play at the beach!
Fabulous job managing it.
I also appreciate the conversations between you and @Angela & Cleo - the timing of an increase has always been a bit confusing to me.
I am also looking a potential increase soon (shhhh, don't tell Mikan) so this is very very helpful. Thank you :)
Hope Smudge will give you a mellow curve from here on. :bighug::bighug::bighug:
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Hoping for a mellow curve too, flat at +4 so I'll leave him be til +5. He's doing his "I had a steep drop so I'm sleepy" nap time now.

Angela & Cleo said:
Smudge has spoken! No increase :joyful:.
I'm on my phone but when I get to my PC, I'm going to share a few saved links I have that address the steep drops at onset. Surf safely.
Did you feed a little LC after each test? Not much, just a Smidge for Smudge (sorry couldn't resist :p)
Click to expand...
Looking forward to that, thank you! He tends to snack himself after I test on that little I leave behind, almost like a habit. And if he doesn't, I just put a little on my fingers and he eats it. Not interested in any at +4 though, he has the steep drop don't-feel-goods, which is normal for him about now in the cycle.
 
By any chance do you have or would you consider getting a timed feeder? If you notice, Smudge's numbers tend to drop after he eats. It likely means that his pancreas is responding to food by producing insulin. If you can give him a snack at around +8 during the PM cycle, I'd be curious to see if his AMPS is lower.

Also, is there a reason Penny can't eat the same food as Smudge? It would make your life considerably easier.
 
Sienne and Gabby (GA) said:
By any chance do you have or would you consider getting a timed feeder? If you notice, Smudge's numbers tend to drop after he eats. It likely means that his pancreas is responding to food by producing insulin. If you can give him a snack at around +8 during the PM cycle, I'd be curious to see if his AMPS is lower.

Also, is there a reason Penny can't eat the same food as Smudge? It would make your life considerably easier.
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I have a timed one I used while Smudge was separated from Penny, that worked well. Unfortunately, Penny has stage 3 chronic kidney disease, so she can only eat specific kidney diet food, which is why I have the Surefeed microchip feeders for them now. I won't be able to do a +8 snack today, but I can try this manually at some point. Thank you for this observation and idea!
 
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Looks like Smudge could use a dose increase. He's not new to greens, so you don't need to hold 10 cycles from when he first see greens. With TR, you increase every 10 consecutive cycles from when you start the dose, unless close to tightly regulated. Which he's not. And he's been on this dose for 12 cycles now. One could delay an increase a cycle or two from those 10 cycles if you think he was about to break a bounce on the cycle you planned to increase. Increase on a bounce breaking cycle can be a little too much downward momentum meaning you'd have to monitor really closely. Otherwise, it's not good to hold a dose too long.

Now, don't get me wrong. I'm liking the fact that Smudge is seeing green fairly regularly, but I'd love to see more greens and lasting longer. 2.75 units isn't getting him there. And I'd like to see him ditch those numbers above 300 (well actually 200's and above), and more insulin can do that too. If you see Smudge is dropping by your +3 at night, feel free to use that microchip feeder with higher carb food in it to keep him safe.

Plus, Smudge is a very recently diagnosed diabetic. You have a golden window of time in which it's easier to get a cat regulated, and if all goes well, into remission. If that is a goal of yours, then I'd follow TR as written.
 
allicatmeow said:
Angela, you should be a teacher! Thank you so much. What I was unsure of, was whether or not I hold from first dose or from that 72. I also now understand it's a bit of an ECID choice, because he is working lower numbers finally and also because of ketones.

Smudge is still not showing ketones (0.1 yesterday), so I feel safe holding the dose from that 72. I do want to be aggressive for him, just not too much so while we are getting data. I have no problem increasing after 3 days, which would mean if I don't get a 50-80 today, I could increase. As always, VERY open to opinions on this. Just wanna do right by him!

I have difficulty getting PM numbers past +3 during the week, as I have to take something to sleep or I'm not functional for my mentally demanding/organizational job. Waking up is near impossible and I sleep through multiple alarms (this is still new, with horrible timing, and hoping I adapt as time goes). :(

And a positive note: Smudge is officially 100% out and about in my home! He is getting regular zoomies, playing (he never played at my mom's), and he follows me around like a dog. He knows where the food is and rubs his face on that cabinet every time I go in the kitchen. Penny tolerates him and has stopped hissing, he respects her and submisses to her (lays down relaxed) if they are near each other. He knows the couch is "hers" and stays on the ottoman so she can have her space. The dynamic is really working well and I'm so proud of them. Although, they want each other's food more than their own of course. :cat:
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So glad Penny and Smudge are doing so well together! You are working so hard and it’s obvious how well you are doing with them Alli! I’m so impressed at what you’ve accomplished in such a short time! :bighug:
 
Hi Alli. Looks like Smudge went bang jumping with Fistuk :joyful: he's done a thorough job on the dose. I hope he discovers the surf board for you :bighug:
 
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