intro/question about cat behavior

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manya

Member Since 2023
hi, im manya and my cats name is ted. He is a tuxedo cat and he is so sweet. (hes in my profile picture) Im here because I don't really know that much about diabetes in cats and my cats starting to worry me a lot.

Teds backround: Teds first 2-3 years were not good. He was abused and fed human food only. He is scared of male adults a lot and sometimes female adults. He loves kids though. When we first rescued him of course he was shy but he slowly opened up. He would eat a lot, mainly hard food, causing him to be 20lbs. My family and I moved to CA in june of 2021. He was fine with the move and seems to like CA a bit more because of the weather. He is aloud outside as long as our other 2 cats, Tipsy a ragdoll who is 9, and Barny who is 16. We let all of our cats outside because they are trained not to leave the yard or go to far. They are aloud out front and back and they love it. We do unfortunately have a coyote problem due to the area we live in (a lot of mountains near us). During the first couple of months of our move Ted did expierience trauma. He was sleeping on a chair in the backyard. We always have a timer to get our cats before dark, but he was left outside on accident. A coyote grabbed him and tried to hop up our brick wall with him. Thankfully he was fat at the time and the coyote was only slightly bigger than him. My mom also saw the coyote struggling to bring ted with him and she yelled VERY loud for the coyote to let go of Ted. We brought him in and made him comfortable. No serious injuries just 2 bite marks on his ruff. He wouldnt go outside for a week 1/2 after that. After that week 1/2 he was comfortable going outside again and to this day he is fine with it and the coyote problem is solved. Idk what happend because there are 0 coyotes around now. Its like they went extinct.

Last year all of our cats got fleas so we had to take them to the vet. They gave our cats each a shot which actually triggered Teds diabetes. He started aggressively pulling out his hair wherever he could, drinking/eating a lot. Not going to the bathroom in the litterbox, instead on rugs, basic symptoms of diabetes in cats. We have recently been giving him insulin for a couple of months now and it seems to be helping? im not sure because i cant ask him. I have only become concerned recently because his behavior has shifted A LOT. We recently changed his diet about 1-2 months ago because he was eating and drinking so so much. We took him to the vet and they told us to change his diet and for the first few days give him 1/2 a capsule of Gabapentin, so 50mg twice a day. It seemed to make him crazy. He stopped eating and drinking a lot but his behavior changed so much its concerning. He is always meowing. Hes wants attention so much. He wants more food. He seems way more happy. He loves to come to my bed because his favorite tortilla blanket is mine always on my bed, he loves to kneed it and purr which he usually would never purr. He seems to love me so much. But, he is becoming very aggressive towards my other 2 cats. Specifically the oldest (16yrs). He doesnt seem to mind my other cat to much because they are both usually on my bed. But when they are awake he stares at her and it looks like he is stalking her. Shes to scared to leave my room because he's next to the door. He stares both the girls down and fights the oldest a lot. Its becoming a thing where it happens like twice a day, every day. He fights her until we are able to seperate them. His tail gets puffy every time. He looks super scary when its happening because it looks like he has so much anger and wants to hurt them bad. It got so bad today when he was fighting the oldest. She stopped moving completely during the fight and was just laying there, completely still. While he was still beating her. She always fights back and i've never seen her do that. I don't know what triggers him to do this. I let him back in the house a couple hours ago, he is in my room sleeping. I moved the feliway thing to my room and sprayed lavender smelling water because I read it can help calm him. I am thinking that his anxiety has got really bad. I really do not want to put him on prozac because he has had bad expieriences with meds in the past. We do yell a lot in our household because my little brother is 13 going through puberty which is making him really mean. He always yells at my mom and dad and my mom and dad yell at him back. Because of his past trauma I can tell he get's very stressed out. My brother is so loud all the time and never calms down. He has very bad adhd and is on meds but still is too hyper. There is NO way I am getting rid of ANY of my cats. I treat them like my babies and put every single second of my time towards them. (im always at home). Our situation is difficult for Ted because he seems very stressful. I just want to help him. I do not want to give him any meds unless the vet says its the only way. Now on to my questions.

My questions:
-Do you guys have any idea on why this is happening? Is it the Diabetes?
-Could it be a reaction to insulin?
-Has any of your cats had similar behaviors? If so, how do you handle the behavior?
-If your cat has anxiety, what are ways that help your cat cope ?
-Could this just be a normal side effect of diabetes?
-Would re-introduction between the cats help ?
-Could it be the change in diet ?

Any other suggestions or anything that you can add that will be helpful. PLEASE ADD IT!!!
if you read this whole god dam thing i appreciate you fr. like ong i do. thank you
 
Hi and welcome to the forum. I am very glad Ted got away from the coyote.
I have not heard of that sort of behaviour with the insulin. Maybe he is feeling irritated by something.
I cant really help you with that but I'll tag a few people
@Suzanne & Darcy
@tiffmaxee
@Ale & Bobo & Minnie (GA)

Can you tell me what sort of insulin you are giving Ted please and how much and how often?
What type of food are you feeding him?
DO you ever get the blood glucose checked?
 
I live in California and you need to know that the coyotes are NOT extinct. They are all over and even in the flats. They come out at all hours. It is not safe to let them outside even in your backyard. Join Next Door and you will see coyote sightings and reports of dead animals found. Get a catio so they can be outside if you want but safe. I’m so glad your story has a happy ending.

I have not heard of any of the symptoms you mention being diabetes related. He does sound stressed.
 
I’m in California too and I was going to say you’re lucky because I see coyotes outside my window almost every night. I hear the packs “talking” in the middle of turn night. It actually wakes me up. I guess how many there are depends on what city/area you are in.

I’ve never heard of behavior changing like this due to diabetes. Can you tell us the insulin and dose he’s on? Can you also tell us what was the diet change and what you’re feeding him now? Does he let you give the injections without any issues? It sounds like territorial behavior though. Has anything changed in the house? New family members living there now? Have any of the other cats been taken to the vet or hospitalized recently? And lastly, how long has this new behavior been going on for?
 
If the behavior shifts in your family (your 13-year-old brother) are new that could be causing Ted to become stressed which could make him more territorial. Cats are incredibly habitual creatures, and even small changes in their environment can sometimes make them stressed.

I am not an expert but many years ago, my boyfriend (at the time) offered to catsit another cat, while we were also in the process of moving. One or the other would probably have been fine, but both at once sent my cat Penelope over the edge. It didn't help that that boyfriend sucked and wouldn't listen to me when I wanted to confine them to different rooms (which could limit their stress). Penelope is generally incredibly kind and calm. Every vet we've had tells us how sweet she is. But for that week, she was yowling and chasing that other poor cat around and hissing at everything including us, and smashing him with her paws. It was a terrible sleepless week. But the moment the move was over she immediately relaxed, and even became friends with that other cat.

Is there any way to find a calm space for Ted where he may feel less stressed, even while your household might be a bit more chaotic? Giving him a space where he can feel more in control might help with his behaviour.
 
Last year all of our cats got fleas so we had to take them to the vet. They gave our cats each a shot which actually triggered Teds diabetes. He started aggressively pulling out his hair wherever he could, drinking/eating a lot. Not going to the bathroom in the litterbox, instead on rugs, basic symptoms of diabetes in cats. u

This is interesting to me because aggressively pulling out his hair and going outside the litter box are not something we see too often in diabetic cats. Yes, drinking tons of water and always being hungry definitely are. How was the diabetes diagnosed? How much insulin are you giving, how often, and what kind of insulin?

are you testing Ted's blood glucose at home to ensure the insulin isn't too much or too little?
 
name of insulin: Insulin Glargine (insulin glargine-yfgh) injection

Dosage: 2 units (2units in morning at 8am, and 2units at night 9:30pm)

Where do we inject insulin/is it stressful to do so? It is hard to catch him because he hates being heald but overall he takes it like a champ tbh. We insert the shot in his scruff and its over in less than 5 seconds. He doesnt meow/hiss/complain at all. Doesnt hurt him and when we let him go hes just chillen.

Side effects: shaky limbs (not bad though seems to not be in pain )

Testing blood glucose: we take him to the vet once a month to check but he stays there all day and its to stressful so we are considering getting a monitor that goes on his back.

How he was diagnosed: The vet confirmed that the predisone shot (flea shot type thing) triggered it to start. We got him the shot because the fleas caused him to be so itchy he was ripping out pretty much all of his hair.

recent injured/hospitalized pets?
our 16yr old cat got 1 of her eyes removed due to glacoma. This happened last year December of 2022.

How long has teds behaviors been happening? since January 2023.

Recent home changes/habitat changes? we have not moved any furniture or anything so everything is in the same place. We moved from colorado to california in june of 2021. He adjusted well and seemed to be happier with the new enviroment. I think the CO weather really stressed him out and he had trauma there aswell. But he seems to love CA. He loves the weather because he loves to tan (lay in sun) and go hunting (one of his favorite hobbies).

How we control his diet? He eats soft food during the day and we leave out a small bowl of hard food at night time for all of our cats.

Food brands/how often does he eat? We give him 3 cans of Natural balance (single animal protein source) 5.5oz a day. We only give him half of a can at a time. Whenever he comes to the plate after nap time we feed him.

He has been calmer the last 2 days because I made my room into his safe place. I got my own feliway thing for my room, i make sure its either silent or quiet. I spray lavender mist because its supposed to be calming (like 2 sprays cus i know cats smell stuff way more than we do), I have my fan on low, I give him attention (pet him cus he just sleeps), hes always sleeping with me (even before the past 2 days), he has a favorite blanket (a huge tortilla blanket that he makes mini tortillas on. he is always sleeping on it.), Whenever im in the room i make sure to be quiet and not do anything that stresses him (sudden movements, picking him up, getting to close to his face, his toes are automatically off limits). Whenever I am not in the room I crack my door so it is quiet and he can still leave whenever he wants to eat or go to the bathroom and it is completely silent so he can sleep in piece.

And finally, what is my baby teddies weight? He is 14lbs.
 
Yes thank you. We make sure our cats are not eaten by keeping a close eye. We only let them outside that way they feel they have more freedom in our household. Especially because it is a little stressful in our house.
 
Yes! I put my full dedication into making my room his safe space. Its always silent when im not in there, i leave my door cracked so theres not much noise coming in. I got my own feliway thing for my room. He has a special blanket and i give him my love. This is seeming to help a lot more.
 
Hello and welcome from me too. This is a post we ask new members to look at:
New? How You Can Help Us Help You!

I'm a little worried about the shaky legs you described. Please read the post I linked (blue text), especially the links describing hypo symptoms. Being aggressive is also a sign of moderate hypoglycemia. It is possible for cats that are diabetic because of steroids (prednisolone shot) to go into remission and no longer need insulin or at least need less insulin. Especially if combined with a change to lower carb food, such as going from hard food to a low carb wet food. If they go into remission or just need a lower dose because of the change in food, they can go hypo. Hypo's are dangerous. The only way to know for sure is to home test his blood sugars, which we are big advocates of here, so we can keep kitty safe. If this is something you are interested in doing, we can help you learn how.
 
The only way to know for sure is to home test his blood sugars, which we are big advocates of here, so we can keep kitty safe. If this is something you are interested in doing, we can help you learn how.
yes could you please teach me or tell me how to? I will check out the link because i dont know what hypo is
 
Here is another post for you Hometesting Links and Tips. Lots of tips and videos here. Most people pick up a human blood glucose (BG) meter. You want one that needs a small blood drop and cheap test strips - which is what you go through. In the US, the Relion brand in Walmart is one such option.

Hypo or hypoglycemia is low blood sugar, it can kill. It is why human diabetics test their blood sugars too. Another option, also used by humans is a continuous BG meter, such as the Freestyle Libre, which some vets will put on for you. One of our members wrote up a post about it: Freestyle Libre for Cats; Tips and Information
 
Thanks Wendy, I had been thinking about this post and the aggression, and how it could be too much insulin causing it.

@manya Thanks for the info. Lantus is a great insulin, that is good to see. Lantus doses must be given as close to 12 hours apart as possible, it would be good to adjust your times to every 12 hours.

learning how to test kitty's blood glucose seemed impossible to me but after a few tries we figured it out and you will too! It is very helpful to know what is going on.
 
I was thinking the same about too much insulin that’s why I asked about the dose.

a few things that I see as issues right away. Glargine is a generic form of Lantus and it’s a great insulin for cats, but it needs consistency and it needs to be given 12 hours apart. Right now you’re giving the am shot at 8 and the pm shot at 9:30, which is an hour and a half late. That’s a problem because it acts like a decrease and then the am shot is an hour and a half early, which acts like an increase. Can you start to give the shots at the same time in the am and pm?

secondly, diabetic cats need low carb food and the dry food you’re leaving out at night is high in carbs. You should transition him off of it but not before you start to home test because it could bring his bg level too low for the insulin dose he’s on now. Did you start at 1 unit and increase to 2 or did your vet start him at 2? There’s really no way to know what the current dose is doing to him daily if you’re not home testing. I assume your vet is doing a curve since he’s there all day and that’s not necessary once you’re home testing. If you don’t think you can, then yes the libre meter is your best bet, but it only stays on for about 2 weeks and some cats manage to get it off.
 
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omg you guys are so helpful thank you. The vet started at 1 and then went to 2 and he was getting 3units at one point so that was too high so we changed back to 2. I am going to see about home testing because I was watching and reading a lot on that on here last night and it doesnt look that difficult. I scheduled an appt. with the vet because i'm trying to get him in asap to talk about this to the vet.
 
Yes I am going to adjust the hours to 12 apart. thank you for that. I also watched your video where you test hendrick and it did not look that difficult. your kitty was very calm and not bothered which i was suprised because hearing how it works seems painful. I am going to get home testing supplies asap because not knowing his blood glucose levels worries me.
 
yes thank you for confirming what hypo is. It is my top priority to test his levels asap to see what is going on. I am very new to this so this is very helpful for me. My parents are a little confused abt this too so sharing things that you guys have said helps a lot
 
Always aim for the sweet spot warm the ears up first, you can put rice in a sock and put it in the microwave, test it on the inside of your wrist to be sure it's not to hot, like you would test a babies bottle. You can fill a pill bottle with warm water and roll it on the ears also.Just keep rubbing the ears with your fingers to warm them up
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6. As the ears get used to bleeding and grow more capilares, it gets easier to get the amount of blood you need on the first try. If he won’t stand still, you can get the blood onto a clean finger nail and test from there.
When you do get some blood you can try milking the ear.
Get you finger and gently push up toward the blood , more will appear
You will put the cotton round behind his ear in case you poke your finger, after you are done testing you will fold the cotton round over his ear to stop the bleeding , press gently for about 10 or 20 seconds until it stops
Get 26 or 28 gauge lancets
A lot of us use the lancets to test freehand not the lancing device
I find it better to see where I'm aiming
Look at the lancet under a light and you will see one side is curved upward, that's the side you want to poke with
 
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If you’re worried about leaving food out at night, a lot of members here use an auto feeder that will dispense the food at the time you program it to do so. Great news about home testing! We can help you with lots of tips as you go. Remember, you can get a a human that works perfectly fine, no need for a pet meter that requires expensive test strips.
 
New? How You Can Help Us Help You!
Tap on your name up top and then tap on signature, add the info from the blue link I have you and answer each question and tap save
This link will tell you how to fill out your signature, it's at the end of everyone's post in gray letters, information about your kitty that we need to know ,just so we don't have to keep asking you :cat:
I'll give you the link to set up our spreadsheet were we track our cats BG numbers in case you need advice
Relion Premier Classic Meter at Walmart for 9 dollars
https://www.walmart.com/ip/ReliOn-Premier-CLASSIC-Blood-Glucose-Monitoring-System/552134103

The tests strips are 17.88 for 100
https://www.walmart.com/ip/ReliOn-Premier-Blood-Glucose-Test-Strips-100-Count/575088197
You can order them on line also
We don't increase by whole units of insulin, we adjust the dose by 0.25 units at a time.
Do you have the U-100 syringes with half unit markings?
Spreadsheet link it will also tell you how the spreadsheet works
If you need help setting it up just ask we have a member here that will be happy to do it for you
https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/how-to-create-a-spreadsheet.241706/
 
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We give him 3 cans of Natural balance
Do you know how many carbs are in the flavor you feed?
We like to feed 6% and under
Here is our food chart see if it's on here
https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/dr-pierson-new-food-chart.174147/
Do you have a hypo kit set up just in case you need to bring up Teds BG up
Such as
med and high carb wet food and some honey?


Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Gourmet Beef Feast in Gravy
20% High Carbs

Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Gourmet Chicken Feast in Gravy 15% Med Carbs

Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Turkey Feast in Gravy 15% Med Carbs

Fancy Feast Gravy Lovers Chicken and Beef in Gravy 15% Med Carbs

Good idea to mark the cans with magic marker how many carbs

Or any on the food chart. Doesn't have to be Fancy Feast just an example about the med and high carb foods
And some honey in the house

https://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/dr-pierson-new-food-

Between 11% and 17% is medium carbs.

18% and over is high carb.
 
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When your vet has been testing monthly is he doing just a standard glucose test (which could be high if your Ted gets very stressed in the car and vet) or a fructosamine test which provides the avg over the past 2 weeks?
My take on his behavior - if he is not feeling well that can signal weakness to other cats. Perhaps he is being overly aggressive/defensive because of that, his perception that he needs to project strength.
Pulling out his own hair is usually a sign of stress - or at least was in one of my cats years ago.
 
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