Advice needed for Butch

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Madeline528

Madeline528

Member Since 2015
Hello All. My 14 yr old cat Butch was diagnosed with diabetes. His glucose lab results are 457. No ketones were found in his urine. He is eating some but only eating canned tuna, boiled shrimp, and turkey breast. He is turning away from cat food. He has been prescribed Humulin N 300 units 2x day. I am uncomfortable with this insulin and waiting to speak with my vet before starting. Also, they are not recommending home testing but I know better. Prior to his diagnosis, he was eating fancy feast grill with temptation treats on it (he wouldn't eat it unless) & a little dry food. Not sure if an appetite stimulant is needed. I just want to make sure he's eating enough when insulin is started. Just at a crossroads of what to do first...
 
Hi Madeline and Butch and welcome .
Looks like you have had a previous kitty with diabetes. You might like to change the signature information to that of Butch so there is no mixup.

Humulin N insulin is not a suitable insulin for cats at all. Please go back to your vet asap and ask for Lantus insulin which is a much more suitable insulin. Also 300 units twice a day of Humulin N insulin is a deadly amount. PLEASE DO NOT GIVE THAT.
Do you thinking you have made a mistake with the dose?

At the moment let him eat whatever he wants to eat as it is important that he does eat.
While you are at the vets asking to swap the insulin to Lantus I would ask the vet for some anti nausea medication such a cerenia and ondansetron as Butch might be nauseated. You could also ask for an appetite stimulant but make sure to give the anti nausea medicine first.
The ondansetron is obtained from a human pharmacy and you will need the vet to write a script for that.
So I think the first thing I would do is go back to the vet to get the insulin changed and to get the anti nausea meds and the appetite stimulant.
If you are not starting insulin straight way, I would buy a bottle of ketostix from Walmart or a pharmacy and test Butch’s urine daily for ketones. No insulin and not eating well could let ketones in the door.
 
Have you ever tried Butch on freeze dried pure meat treats? They have some crunch and are zero/low carbs. Unlike Temptations which are high carb. At most pet stores you can get freeze dried shrimps, bonita flakes (tuna), and freeze dried turkey breast if those are the proteins he likes. Sprinkling low carb treats on his food may help with him eating the wet food. Or maybe try some freeze dried raw food (has crunch) or some air dried food like Ziwipeak also has crunch if that's what he needs.

Butch does need to eat some real cat food as pure meat doesn't give him all the nutrients he needs.
 
Hi. Thank you so much.


Hendrick Cuddleclaw said:
Hi Madeline sorry that nobody responded yesterday! I am not familiar with that type of insulin.

tagging some more expert members than I

@Bron and Sheba (GA)

@Bandit's Mom

@Wendy&Neko

@Christie & Maverick

@Suzanne & Darcy
Click to expand...
Hi. Thank you so much!
Hendrick Cuddleclaw said:
Hi Madeline sorry that nobody responded yesterday! I am not familiar with that type of insulin.

tagging some more expert members than I

@Bron and Sheba (GA)

@Bandit's Mom

@Wendy&Neko

@Christie & Maverick

@Suzanne & Darcy
Click to expand...

Hi. Thank you so much!
Hendrick Cuddleclaw said:
Hi Madeline sorry that nobody responded yesterday! I am not familiar with that type of insulin.

tagging some more expert members than I

@Bron and Sheba (GA)

@Bandit's Mom

@Wendy&Neko

@Christie & Maverick

@Suzanne & Darcy
Click to expand...
Hendrick Cuddleclaw said:
Hi Madeline sorry that nobody responded yesterday! I am not familiar with that type of insulin.

tagging some more expert members than I

@Bron and Sheba (GA)

@Bandit's Mom

@Wendy&Neko

@Christie & Maverick

@Suzanne & Darcy
Click to expand...
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
Hi Madeline and Butch and welcome .
Looks like you have had a previous kitty with diabetes. You might like to change the signature information to that of Butch so there is no mixup.

Humulin N insulin is not a suitable insulin for cats at all. Please go back to your vet asap and ask for Lantus insulin which is a much more suitable insulin. Also 300 units twice a day of Humulin N insulin is a deadly amount. PLEASE DO NOT GIVE THAT.
Do you thinking you have made a mistake with the dose?

At the moment let him eat whatever he wants to eat as it is important that he does eat.
While you are at the vets asking to swap the insulin to Lantus I would ask the vet for some anti nausea medication such a cerenia and ondansetron as Butch might be nauseated. You could also ask for an appetite stimulant but make sure to give the anti nausea medicine first.
The ondansetron is obtained from a human pharmacy and you will need the vet to write a script for that.
So I think the first thing I would do is go back to the vet to get the insulin changed and to get the anti nausea meds and the appetite stimulant.
If you are not starting insulin straight way, I would buy a bottle of ketostix from Walmart or a pharmacy and test Butch’s urine daily for ketones. No insulin and not eating well could let ketones in the door.
Click to expand...

Hi Bron and Sheba. Thank you so much.

Yes, I have a previous kitty Layla Butch's sibling from the same litter. Layla is in admission since 12/10/15. I tried to change the signature information to that of Butch but I keep getting ERROR. It won't let me save. Any suggestions?

Sorry, I did make a mistake with the dosage of Humulin N. The vet prescribed 3 units of insulin 2x a day.

I have been reading about Humulin N insulin and I am very uncomfortable with using it. I did not start Butch on insulin because of it and am waiting to discuss it with my vet. I called my vet office and was told all vets in their office use Humulin N. I explained my concerns and asked for Butch to start Lantus and inquired about anti nausea medication and appetite stimulant. My vet won't be in till tomorrow so a message was left. The tech says either the vet or someone from the office will call me tomorrow. I'll reach out to follow up. How long after starting anti-nausea should I start the appetite stimulant?

I bought a bottle of Ketostix on Amazon and received it today. Would I be able to check his BG with them? I am worried because I am not sure how I'm going to test his BG with a blood monitor. I am a wheelchair user with limited hand function. Not sure, if I'll have the support to assist. I am hoping to find someone reliable to administer the insulin.

Thank you so much!

Hendrick Cuddleclaw said:
Hi Madeline sorry that nobody responded yesterday! I am not familiar with that type of insulin.

tagging some more expert members than I
Click to expand...
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Have you ever tried Butch on freeze dried pure meat treats? They have some crunch and are zero/low carbs. Unlike Temptations which are high carb. At most pet stores you can get freeze dried shrimps, bonita flakes (tuna), and freeze dried turkey breast if those are the proteins he likes. Sprinkling low carb treats on his food may help with him eating the wet food. Or maybe try some freeze dried raw food (has crunch) or some air dried food like Ziwipeak also has crunch if that's what he needs.

Butch does need to eat some real cat food as pure meat doesn't give him all the nutrients he needs.
Click to expand...

Hi Wendy & Neko. Thank you so much.

I am trying Butch with the PureBites dried pure meat treats. It is a hit or miss. He seems to eat the dried treats of the FF classic. Sometimes I get him to eat some of the wet with it. Today he ate 1 FF can with PureBits air dried tuna, some boiled shrimp and deli turkey meat. He looks to eat but gives me a hard time with eating real cat food. I'll look into freeze dried shrimp, bonita flakes, freeze dried raw food. I think Ziwipeak might be similar to PureBites. I'll check.

Thank you so much!
 
I'm afraid to tell you even 3u to start is too high. With a cat being fed dry food, the starting dose would be 1u. Regardless, as was pointed out, Humulin N isn't recommended for cats, in part because of how cats metabolize insulin. Humulin N just doesn't have the amount of duration, plus it hits hard and fast. If you need ammunition in your conversation, just refer to the most recent AAHA Guidelines for Managing Diabetes

As for the error in updating your signature, I believe you just need to shorten it, since you were last here and created your signature, the length/number of characters allowed has been reduced.

Madeline528 said:
I bought a bottle of Ketostix on Amazon and received it today. Would I be able to check his BG with them?
Click to expand...
Unfortunately no, Ketostix are a method to test for ketones, not BG, by inserting it into the urine and reading the results per color code after 15 seconds. A BG monitor would be the method used to test levels of blood sugar.
 
If you are going to have trouble testing the BG, you might like to look at getting a freestyle liber fitted. It lasts for two weeks and takes the BGs automatically. Some people get them fitted every few weeks but they are not cheap. But may be the answer for you if you can afford them.
You can give the appetite stimulant an hour after the anti nausea meds.
I will ask @Bandit's Mom to help you with the signature. She will contact you.
 
Madeline528 said:
Hi Bron and Sheba. Thank you so much.

Yes, I have a previous kitty Layla Butch's sibling from the same litter. Layla is in admission since 12/10/15. I tried to change the signature information to that of Butch but I keep getting ERROR. It won't let me save. Any suggestions?

Sorry, I did make a mistake with the dosage of Humulin N. The vet prescribed 3 units of insulin 2x a day.

I have been reading about Humulin N insulin and I am very uncomfortable with using it. I did not start Butch on insulin because of it and am waiting to discuss it with my vet. I called my vet office and was told all vets in their office use Humulin N. I explained my concerns and asked for Butch to start Lantus and inquired about anti nausea medication and appetite stimulant. My vet won't be in till tomorrow so a message was left. The tech says either the vet or someone from the office will call me tomorrow. I'll reach out to follow up. How long after starting anti-nausea should I start the appetite stimulant?

I bought a bottle of Ketostix on Amazon and received it today. Would I be able to check his BG with them? I am worried because I am not sure how I'm going to test his BG with a blood monitor. I am a wheelchair user with limited hand function. Not sure, if I'll have the support to assist. I am hoping to find someone reliable to administer the insulin.

Thank you so much!
Click to expand...

Search for mobile vets in your area. I found a handful here that could come by and give injections. Unfortunately none of them were able to help with testing daily but a few said they could come by and show me how to do the bg testing. I ended up doing it myself but you might find that you can do it especially if your cat is good with testing. My cat comes running for his tests and sits down and purrs cause he knows he’s getting a treat. But I know others are not so lucky.

The Libre is always an option as well as Bron and Sheba mentioned
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
If you are going to have trouble testing the BG, you might like to look at getting a freestyle liber fitted. It lasts for two weeks and takes the BGs automatically. Some people get them fitted every few weeks but they are not cheap. But may be the answer for you if you can afford them.
You can give the appetite stimulant an hour after the anti nausea meds.
I will ask @Bandit's Mom to help you with the signature. She will contact you.
Click to expand...
Thank you so much. I will look into it. I am happy my vet prescribed the glargine insulin 1u 2x day. Butch ate about 2 cans FF classic today. I don't know if my mind is playing tricks but he seems to be drinking & peeing less. Tomorrow I hope to start him on the insulin
 
AbbottTheCat said:
Search for mobile vets in your area. I found a handful here that could come by and give injections. Unfortunately none of them were able to help with testing daily but a few said they could come by and show me how to do the bg testing. I ended up doing it myself but you might find that you can do it especially if your cat is good with testing. My cat comes running for his tests and sits down and purrs cause he knows he’s getting a treat. But I know others are not so lucky.

The Libre is always an option as well as Bron and Sheba mentioned
Click to expand...
Thank you so much. I’ll search for mobile vets in my area. Wow, I hope Butch enjoys being tested like Abbott
 
Christie & Maverick said:
I'm afraid to tell you even 3u to start is too high. With a cat being fed dry food, the starting dose would be 1u. Regardless, as was pointed out, Humulin N isn't recommended for cats, in part because of how cats metabolize insulin. Humulin N just doesn't have the amount of duration, plus it hits hard and fast. If you need ammunition in your conversation, just refer to the most recent AAHA Guidelines for Managing Diabetes

As for the error in updating your signature, I believe you just need to shorten it, since you were last here and created your signature, the length/number of characters allowed has been reduced.


Unfortunately no, Ketostix are a method to test for ketones, not BG, by inserting it into the urine and reading the results per color code after 15 seconds. A BG monitor would be the method used to test levels of blood sugar.
Click to expand...

Thank you so much. I spoke with my vet and he prescribed glargine insulin 1u 2x day. I am hoping to start tomorrow & to get a BG before shooting.
 
↑Christie & Maverick said
I'm afraid to tell you even 3u to start is too high. With a cat being fed dry food, the starting dose would be 1u. Regardless, as was pointed out, Humulin N isn't recommended for cats, in part because of how cats metabolize insulin. Humulin N just doesn't have the amount of duration, plus it hits hard and fast. If you need ammunition in your conversation, just refer to the most recent AAHA Guidelines for Managing Diabetes

As for the error in updating your signature, I believe you just need to shorten it, since you were last here and created your signature, the length/number of characters allowed has been reduced.


Unfortunately no, Ketostix are a method to test for ketones, not BG, by inserting it into the urine and reading the results per color code after 15 seconds. A BG monitor would be the method used to test levels of blood sugar.

Madeline said
Thank you so much. I spoke with my vet and he prescribed glargine insulin 1u 2x day. I am hoping to start tomorrow & to get a BG before shooting.

@Christie & Maverick
 
Madeline528 said:
Thank you so much. I’ll search for mobile vets in my area. Wow, I hope Butch enjoys being tested like Abbott
Click to expand...
If you haven’t already check out the sticky on testing:
https://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/hometesting-links-and-tips.287/

And remember to be patient, more than likely you will get some resistance in the first week but they generally warm up to testing.

I have settled on testing directly in front of his feeder and then dropping the treat in the bowl. This has worked out to be the best spot to test after some trial and error with other spots.

you could also try a treat before and after at first. Remember to give a treat even after failed attempts and be patient, you might not get cooperation right away.

Don’t be afraid to ask for help or advice, we have all been there. Good luck with testing!
 
Madeline528 said:
Hello All. My 14 yr old cat Butch was diagnosed with diabetes. His glucose lab results are 457. No ketones were found in his urine. He is eating some but only eating canned tuna, boiled shrimp, and turkey breast. He is turning away from cat food. He has been prescribed Humulin N 300 units 2x day. I am uncomfortable with this insulin and waiting to speak with my vet before starting. Also, they are not recommending home testing but I know better. Prior to his diagnosis, he was eating fancy feast grill with temptation treats on it (he wouldn't eat it unless) & a little dry food. Not sure if an appetite stimulant is needed. I just want to make sure he's eating enough when insulin is started. Just at a crossroads of what to do first...
Click to expand...
My kitty is on fancy feast classic pate which she loves. I occasionally use a crushed treat on top to wash down pills. She also is on daily cerenia. She is on Lantus.
 
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