New member/need asst tweeking Prozinc dose

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Gem

Member Since 2020
Poopsie (13 years old) was diagnosed near the end of July and put on NPH. Later, with a different vet, she was changed to Prozinc and has much better control. Vet recommended BG testing before meals and 1 unit, she quickly dropped down to between 150-200 at which he recommended 1/2 unit. The vet doesn't feel that doing curves is helpful as per him, they are unpredictable and unreliable. I have not done a curve since she started on the Prozinc but I am in the process of doing one today and I can see why they are important.
I have completed a spreadsheet and hopefully I can get some advice about dosing, I tend to dose on her pre-meal number and after reading on some of the forums, that's not the way to dose.
Also, now that the curve is done, what is up with her numbers today??
 
Welcome Gem, you will be in excellent hands here
I was just reading how much you feed Poopsie.
Most of us feed the larger meal in the AM and PM pre shots
Then during the course of each 12 hour cycle we feed smaller portions .
How much does she weigh.
Feeding smaller meals is easier on the pancreas
Yes you are correct we don't base dosages on pre shot numbers, we base them on their nadirs , how low she is dropping . That's why you need to be getting some tests in through each cycle, so we can see how the insulin is working .
I don't use Prozinc but I'm sure members will reply that are familiar with Prozinc
I love your kitty's name :cat:
 
Diane Tyler's Mom said:
Welcome Gem, you will be in excellent hands here
I was just reading how much you feed Poopsie.
Most of us feed the larger meal in the AM and PM pre shots
Then during the course of each 12 hour cycle we feed smaller portions .
How much does she weigh.
Feeding smaller meals is easier on the pancreas
Yes you are correct we don't base dosages on pre shot numbers, we base them on their nadirs , how low she is dropping . That's why you need to be getting some tests in through each cycle, so we can see how the insulin is working .
I don't use Prozinc but I'm sure members will reply that are familiar with Prozinc
I love your kitty's name :cat:
Click to expand...
 
Hello! Wow, what a beautiful curve from today! The first thing I need to mention is Poopsie has earned a reduction from dropping down to 68 today. :) On SLGS, any time you drop below 90 you reduce the dose by 0.25 units. You are definitely on the right track! :)

It would be helpful for you, rather than get one curve every once in a while, to test a couple times during the day and at least one "before bed" test at night, in addition to the pre-shots. They will show a better picture of what's happening than a curve. Though today's curve was excellent, if Poopsie had been running very high today from outside factors (such as getting into high-carb food) you might have been inclined to increase the dose.

If Poopsie drops below 90 again on a new dose of .25 units, we may be looking at a kitty who is eager to get off the juice (insulin).
 
wow, great spreadsheet! Looks like those numbers are really coming down. I'd do 0.25 esp. if you aren't there during the day, and since you don't have a lot of mid cycle numbers. Prozinc tends to hit it's lowest point 5-7 hours after the shot... you don't have to do a full curve often, but any time you can get a mid cycle reading that would be really helpful.
 
She is right at 10 pounds, she was 12 pounds prior to diabetes. I feed her either half a can of the Friskies or a small can of FF. I leave for work at 6:00 am and don’t get home until 5:30 so I don’t have a great opportunity to test more or break up her meals except on the weekends. So much to learn!
 
Panic said:
Hello! Wow, what a beautiful curve from today! The first thing I need to mention is Poopsie has earned a reduction from dropping down to 68 today. :) On SLGS, any time you drop below 90 you reduce the dose by 0.25 units. You are definitely on the right track! :)

It would be helpful for you, rather than get one curve every once in a while, to test a couple times during the day and at least one "before bed" test at night, in addition to the pre-shots. They will show a better picture of what's happening than a curve. Though today's curve was excellent, if Poopsie had been running very high today from outside factors (such as getting into high-carb food) you might have been inclined to increase the dose.

If Poopsie drops below 90 again on a new dose of .25 units, we may be looking at a kitty who is eager to get off the juice (insulin).
Click to expand...
 
Gem said:
She is right at 10 pounds, she was 12 pounds prior to diabetes. I feed her either half a can of the Friskies or a small can of FF. I leave for work at 6:00 am and don’t get home until 5:30 so I don’t have a great opportunity to test more or break up her meals except on the weekends. So much to learn!
Click to expand...
One thing you could do is get a timed feeder so she can have a mid day snack. Try to get a mid cycle test on days your home/weekends... and a before bed test would have helpful info too. The rule of thumb with food is about 20 calories per lb of ideal weight. So if 12 pounds was a good weight for her that would be about 240 calories per day. Fancy feast is about 85ish calories so that would be about 3 cans per day.
 
Do you think she needs to go back up to 12 lbs, or is 10 good? If she needs more don't restrict food until she's back to a good weight.

I would invest in a Petsafe 5 autofeeder, you can let her eat when you're not home and at night. Small meals during the day are important for a diabetic, especially one with numbers that indicate she may be off insulin sooner than later.

As for your schedule, if you can squeeze in an extra night test here and there, that would help you make up for missing most day cycle numbers. :)
 
I was definitely surprised by checking numbers today, very eye opening and I can see why it’s important to get those other values. I can’t check her more often during the week but I can do before bed and weekends. I learned a lot today. Thank you for the insight. I will drop her down to .25 and get more values to see what’s going on. Thanks so much.
 
Panic said:
Do you think she needs to go back up to 12 lbs, or is 10 good? If she needs more don't restrict food until she's back to a good weight.

I would invest in a Petsafe 5 autofeeder, you can let her eat when you're not home and at night. Small meals during the day are important for a diabetic, especially one with numbers that indicate she may be off insulin sooner than later.

As for your schedule, if you can squeeze in an extra night test here and there, that would help you make up for missing most day cycle numbers. :)
Click to expand...
 
She seems ok at 10 pounds but I think she still looks slight, I would like to see 11 pounds. So with feeding, should it be like four equal small meals during the day? Can I feed her a small breakfast and then put more food before I leave and let her graze all day? I will look for the automatic feeder as I would rather spread the food out.
 
JanetNJ said:
One thing you could do is get a timed feeder so she can have a mid day snack. Try to get a mid cycle test on days your home/weekends... and a before bed test would have helpful info too. The rule of thumb with food is about 20 calories per lb of ideal weight. So if 12 pounds was a good weight for her that would be about 240 calories per day. Fancy feast is about 85ish calories so that would be about 3 cans per day.
Click to expand...
 
Yes, if she is a grazer and it's safe to leave food out (no other pets who will steal it) you can just leave food out all day and just pick it up 2 hours before insulin time. :)
Let her have at least 220 calories per day, more if she wants. Usually unregulated diabetics need 2x the amount of food, more if underweight, but Poopsie may not need that much since her numbers are very good.
 
Panic said:
Hello! Wow, what a beautiful curve from today! The first thing I need to mention is Poopsie has earned a reduction from dropping down to 68 today. :) On SLGS, any time you drop below 90 you reduce the dose by 0.25 units. You are definitely on the right track! :)

It would be helpful for you, rather than get one curve every once in a while, to test a couple times during the day and at least one "before bed" test at night, in addition to the pre-shots. They will show a better picture of what's happening than a curve. Though today's curve was excellent, if Poopsie had been running very high today from outside factors (such as getting into high-carb food) you might have been inclined to increase the dose.

If Poopsie drops below 90 again on a new dose of .25 units, we may be looking at a kitty who is eager to get off the juice (insulin).
Click to expand...
What @Panic and @JanetNJ said is spot on.
 
Oh, I’m surprised by that! She will welcome the extra intake!
Panic said:
Hello! Wow, what a beautiful curve from today! The first thing I need to mention is Poopsie has earned a reduction from dropping down to 68 today. :) On SLGS, any time you drop below 90 you reduce the dose by 0.25 units. You are definitely on the right track! :)

It would be helpful for you, rather than get one curve every once in a while, to test a couple times during the day and at least one "before bed" test at night, in addition to the pre-shots. They will show a better picture of what's happening than a curve. Though today's curve was excellent, if Poopsie had been running very high today from outside factors (such as getting into high-carb food) you might have been inclined to increase the dose.

If Poopsie drops below 90 again on a new dose of .25 units, we may be looking at a kitty who is eager to get off the juice (insulin).
Click to expand...
Panic said:
Hello! Wow, what a beautiful curve from today! The first thing I need to mention is Poopsie has earned a reduction from dropping down to 68 today. :) On SLGS, any time you drop below 90 you reduce the dose by 0.25 units. You are definitely on the right track! :)

It would be helpful for you, rather than get one curve every once in a while, to test a couple times during the day and at least one "before bed" test at night, in addition to the pre-shots. They will show a better picture of what's happening than a curve. Though today's curve was excellent, if Poopsie had been running very high today from outside factors (such as getting into high-carb food) you might have been inclined to increase the dose.

If Poopsie drops below 90 again on a new dose of .25 units, we may be looking at a kitty who is eager to get off the juice (insulin).
Click to expand...
 
I have a some follow up questions. Should I have gave her insulin last night when she was 92 at dinner time? I didn’t because she was low/normal yesterday and this morning she was 190 and I gave her .25 and checking her 6 hours later she is at 170. I gave her a quarter can of Friskies pate this morning and I am giving her additional throughout the day. I’m confused by her numbers today.
 
Normally I'd say 92 is much too low to shoot and would agree with you ... but Poopsie is throwing good low numbers left and right. Perhaps @Deb & Wink can say whether it's safer to skip under 100 or give just a liiiiittle bit to keep her going. I can't give advice on that because I'm fairly new to helping with kitties anxious to get off the juice. :p She may also have had a slightly elevated BG this morning from the 68 yesterday. And the fact that you skipped.
 
Gem said:
I have a some follow up questions. Should I have gave her insulin last night when she was 92 at dinner time? I didn’t because she was low/normal yesterday and this morning she was 190 and I gave her .25 and checking her 6 hours later she is at 170. I gave her a quarter can of Friskies pate this morning and I am giving her additional throughout the day. I’m confused by her numbers today.
Click to expand...
Tagging
@Panic

@JanetNJ

@Deb & Wink
Thank you ladies
 
Last edited:
Diane Tyler's Mom said:
@Gem
If you want to tag members who have given you advice in the
past just do this
@first couple letters of who you want to tag and a group of names will cone up, then just tap on their name after you are done and hit post you will see their name come up in blue
Click to expand...
Thanks, I’m a bit confused on how to do all this so that is very helpful!
 
Gem said:
Thanks, I’m a bit confused on how to do all this so that is very helpful!
Click to expand...
You can either tag someone in the beginning before you start typing
Just skip a line after you tag the first person
Example
@Gem

@Gem

Next person f you want to tag another

Or you can tag them at the end of your post
After you type your last word you would make a space then tag, see I put a space the word now
I'll show you now @Gem
 
Gem said:
I have a some follow up questions. Should I have gave her insulin last night when she was 92 at dinner time? I didn’t because she was low/normal yesterday and this morning she was 190 and I gave her .25 and checking her 6 hours later she is at 170. I gave her a quarter can of Friskies pate this morning and I am giving her additional throughout the day. I’m confused by her numbers today.
Click to expand...

You don't have enough mid-cycle data to know if that 92 was a safe BG pre-shot number to shoot. So no, skipping the shot was the right thing to do. As long as there are no ketones present and/or no history of DKA.

If you are giving a bit more insulin than the normal dose, we call that a FAT dose. Note it on the SS in the U (units) column as a 0.25F
If you are giving a bit less insulin than the normal dose, we call that a SKINNY dose. Note it on the SS in the U (units) column as a 0.25S

It's really those mid-cycle BG tests that will let you know what is going on with a particular insulin dose.

We know it's hard to get tests in the AM cycle when you are away at work (or in the PM cycle if you work nights). But please try to get at least one more test in the PM cycle. The "before bed time" test is a good one to get every cycle. So say around +2 would be a good time. That +2 also gives you an indication of where the cycle is headed, BG number wise.

"Better too high for a cycle, then too low for a moment." Or something like that.

p.s. Even though you were on vacation 9/17 to 9/19, you should still have a row for each of those days. Would you please update your SS to add those rows? You can say 0 insulin for the dose and n/a for the pre-shot BG readings.
 
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