New Member: looking for some help!

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KittenTheCat

KittenTheCat

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I have been reading this forum since Kitten was diagnosed with diabetes late in 2019. I am reading more about the disadvantages of feeding dry food and am looking for some advice on how to find an appropriate wet food for Kitten while also keeping the budget low as I am on one income with 2 cats and a dog. This forum has been a great tool and I am happy to have found it!

Here's my long story so far: I have found it very expensive already with the transition the initial diagnosis of Kitten's diabetes, the prescription diet food, syringes, changes of insulin (went from Caninsulin to Lantus - the vet understood my issues with cost and unfortunately didn't care to mention that the $153 bottle of Lantus can be bought over the counter at any pharmacy - thanks Costco for the $88 savings!) and the purchasing of AlphaTrak2 unit and replacements strips (I have found more cost effective options of these refills online, but they are still pricey. The other options mentioned in these forums don't seem to be available in my area of Ontario, Canada or maybe are discontinued?).

In January I approached my vet about changing Kitten to Tiki Cat wet food as a viable no carb wet food, but was recommended that I stay on the prescription dry food as these were tested and approved for cats with diabetes.

In a nutshell here is Kitten's history: Has always been an energetic cat who loves to play but also has a natural urge to eat inanimate objects (all corners of any piece of furniture have been chewed by her; over her 8 years of existence she has had 3 surgeries, 1st removed 4.5 hair elastics from her stomach; 2nd was her spay; 3rd removed an entire shoe lace from her stomach) - also to note, my house was a no hair elastic, no string household so the shoe lace was a huge surprise. After the spay she started to gain weight and had always been overweight (we're talking close to 20lbs) with no success when she was put on a diet literally over years (she would steal food from the other cat's microchip feeder and I am pretty sure he purposely would open it for her!). In August 2019 I had switched her to a different food in hopes she would lose weight and by November 2019 she had lost a significant amount of weight but it seemed too quick and I noticed some urinary issues and drinking lots of water, which brought me to the vet and the eventual diagnosis of diabetes (and slight UTI) in December 2019. From there, I had followed the directions of the vet and had made it so she no longer could steal food and was being fed twice a day. We started on Caninsulin and eventually switched to Lantus insulin. Also to mention, she started on Hill's diabetic dry food but soon disliked it and refused to eat (tried FortiFlora which she loved but then would only gum the powder off the food) so she was switched to the Royal Canin diabetic food and is still eating this without issue.

If you look at the spreadsheet you can see the full BG curves and the misc testing I completed. After the puking incident (likely due to getting into bacon grease) the vet changed her insulin to 1.0 unit of Lantus and has recommended it stay there. The next BG curve is scheduled for June and a full blood work to see how shes doing. One thing I have noticed is Kitten's ALWAYS hungry; I have mentioned it to the vet via email with no indication of why/if that will stop. She tries to steal food from the dog and if I am eating at the table she is relentless to try and steal food.

I feel her current condition and seemingly still high blood sugar numbers, she won't ever get into remission. At this point, I am wondering if I switch her to a 60% wet food and 40% dry food situation she may get better BG numbers? The reason I am saying 60/40 is because again, wet food is super expensive in comparison to dry food. I would love some suggestions on how to proceed. I understand a primary wet food diet is ideal, but in order for this to work for my budget, the food would need to cost no more than $50 per month because the prescription dry food works out to about $40 per month.

Also, my researching online has shown the foods below to be good options (but apparently expensive and harder to come by especially now that we are in a pandemic!). I would like to make these changes soon as I am working from home for the next foreseeable future due to the pandemic so I can keep a close eye on Kitten during this transition.
  • Tiki Cat - Puka Puka Luau Succulent Chicken
  • Tiki Cat -Hana Luau - individual wet can food
  • Petcurean - GO! Fit + Free Grain Free Chicken, Turkey + Duck Pate Recipe
  • Boreal - Red Tuna with Chicken in Gravy
Thanks for reading!
 

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Welcome "closet FDMB'er! Thanks for reaching out! As you already know there are people here that can help you with just about anything related to diabetes. (I'm so sorry about Kittens Pica issues.) My Waldo was a hoover vacuum. Ate anything he found on the floor! So sorry Kitten found that string . How scary!

There is NOTHING written in stone that you HAVE to feed food that cost so much. There are plenty of foods on the market that are LOW CARB. Thats all you need to be concerned with. A good low carb pate. I hear Tiki Cat is one of them.

Hold on for more advice on your other issues ok? help is on the way!
jeanne
 
Welcome! As Jeanne said, you don’t need an expensive food, just a low carb food. Wet is best and there are plenty options. Tiki is a great food, but as you say, expensive. I’m not sure what brands are available in Canada, but I think Fancy Feast Classic pate may be one of them. Another that may be available is Friskies pate. It’s great that you are hometesting some. If you can get a test before you feed and give the shot, then at least one more during the cycle, it will help us see what is going on. We also have a spreadsheet to record your test numbers http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/ If you need help setting it up, let us know and we’ll do it for you.
 
Waving from the Kawarthas.

Lantus.
You can walk into any pharmacy and buy Lantus. Only humans need a prescription. Just say it is for your cat. Ask for the package of 5 vials – roughly $120. You can use it to the last drop and the package will last you a long time. Chances are the large vial of Lantus will probably expire before you use it up.

Strips.
Alpha Trak strips are crazy expensive. Even human strips are expensive in Canada (but the insulin is much cheaper than in the US). A lot of people use a human meter - FreeStyle Lite. It takes a small drop of blood. Strips are roughly $80 for 100. You will be going through more strips than you think. It is worthwhile saving PC points and using them to buy the strips at Shoppers Drug Mart. If you are a senior or have a senior relative close by, take advantage of their Seniors Days. Some people check Ebay for deals.

There is a human glucometre with very cheap strips. The downside is that it takes a much larger drop of blood and I found it read higher than the FreeStyle Lite. The biggest downside is that the strips are not available to buy at a drug store at a moment's notice or in a crisis. You can only buy them online and would need to have 300-400 in stock (100 in your hypo kit) at any given time. With everything backed-up with the virus, you may not get an order as quick as you would like.
https://diabetesexpress.ca/products/bravo-meter

Food.
There is nothing special about the prescription diabetic food except the price. The prescription dry food is high in carbs. In fact, there is no dry food available in Canada that is low carb. Your vet may want to switch you to Purina DM wet food. It is considered low carb but again, pricy. If your vet insists, buy a can or two, then tell the vet that your cat will not eat it.

Fancy Feast and Friskies pates (and only the pates) are low carb and very easy on the wallet. Do get a couple of cans of Fancy Feat Gravy Lovers (high carb) for your hypo kit. Also, I believe the small cans of PC pates are low carb.

DO NOT SWITCH TO AN ALL WET FOOD DIET UNTIL YOU ARE TESTING REGULARLY. Switching to low carb wet food can make a difference of up to 100 points. It is best to gradually transition to wet food, have your hypo kit handy (just in case) and to test on a regular basis while doing so.

Some links:
It would help tremendously if you could set up a spreadsheet. If you ask questions or need someone with you during a low numbers situation, the spreadsheet is the first place a person will go.

Hope this helps.
 
Not everyone has Excel on their computer, tablet or smartphone, so the custom spreadsheet you created will not open for many people. Our standardized, color code spreadsheet (SS) has a template you copy to setup your own version. It will probably take you 5 minutes to setup following the instructions Sharon gave you back in post #4. The last couple of weeks of data would be helpful to see in the SS. You do need a google email account.
 
Sharon14 said:
Welcome! As Jeanne said, you don’t need an expensive food, just a low carb food. Wet is best and there are plenty options. Tiki is a great food, but as you say, expensive. I’m not sure what brands are available in Canada, but I think Fancy Feast Classic pate may be one of them. Another that may be available is Friskies pate. It’s great that you are hometesting some. If you can get a test before you feed and give the shot, then at least one more during the cycle, it will help us see what is going on. We also have a spreadsheet to record your test numbers http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/ If you need help setting it up, let us know and we’ll do it for you.
Click to expand...
Thanks! I’ll upload the spreadsheet shortly. I didn’t realize my attachment wouldn’t work.
 
Red & Rover (GA) said:
Waving from the Kawarthas.

Lantus.
You can walk into any pharmacy and buy Lantus. Only humans need a prescription. Just say it is for your cat. Ask for the package of 5 vials – roughly $120. You can use it to the last drop and the package will last you a long time. Chances are the large vial of Lantus will probably expire before you use it up.

Strips.
Alpha Trak strips are crazy expensive. Even human strips are expensive in Canada (but the insulin is much cheaper than in the US). A lot of people use a human meter - FreeStyle Lite. It takes a small drop of blood. Strips are roughly $80 for 100. You will be going through more strips than you think. It is worthwhile saving PC points and using them to buy the strips at Shoppers Drug Mart. If you are a senior or have a senior relative close by, take advantage of their Seniors Days. Some people check Ebay for deals.

There is a human glucometre with very cheap strips. The downside is that it takes a much larger drop of blood and I found it read higher than the FreeStyle Lite. The biggest downside is that the strips are not available to buy at a drug store at a moment's notice or in a crisis. You can only buy them online and would need to have 300-400 in stock (100 in your hypo kit) at any given time. With everything backed-up with the virus, you may not get an order as quick as you would like.
https://diabetesexpress.ca/products/bravo-meter

Food.
There is nothing special about the prescription diabetic food except the price. The prescription dry food is high in carbs. In fact, there is no dry food available in Canada that is low carb. Your vet may want to switch you to Purina DM wet food. It is considered low carb but again, pricy. If your vet insists, buy a can or two, then tell the vet that your cat will not eat it.

Fancy Feast and Friskies pates (and only the pates) are low carb and very easy on the wallet. Do get a couple of cans of Fancy Feat Gravy Lovers (high carb) for your hypo kit. Also, I believe the small cans of PC pates are low carb.

DO NOT SWITCH TO AN ALL WET FOOD DIET UNTIL YOU ARE TESTING REGULARLY. Switching to low carb wet food can make a difference of up to 100 points. It is best to gradually transition to wet food, have your hypo kit handy (just in case) and to test on a regular basis while doing so.

Some links:
It would help tremendously if you could set up a spreadsheet. If you ask questions or need someone with you during a low numbers situation, the spreadsheet is the first place a person will go.

Hope this helps.
Click to expand...
My $153 bottle of lantus I think was done it was about 2 months used and I saw on here that’s usually around the max timing. I just picked up the 5 pack of cartridges of insulin at Costco for $98 and started it yesterday evening. I’ll upload the spreadsheet soon so you can see her numbers (didn’t realize my spreadsheet wouldn’t work). She has recently gone high in numbers but I wonder if the possibly old lantus could be the cause? I also read blood sugar numbers differently than I’ve been seeing on the forums. I am guessing once I do the spreadsheet it will convert my numbers (ie blood sugar number today was something like 24.4).
Thanks for the helpful info!
 
Deb & Wink said:
Not everyone has Excel on their computer, tablet or smartphone, so the custom spreadsheet you created will not open for many people. Our standardized, color code spreadsheet (SS) has a template you copy to setup your own version. It will probably take you 5 minutes to setup following the instructions Sharon gave you back in post #4. The last couple of weeks of data would be helpful to see in the SS. You do need a google email account.
Click to expand...
Is there a legend for the spreadsheet? What is Dosing Method (SLGS or TR)? Thanks!
 
KittenTheCat said:
My $153 bottle of lantus I think was done it was about 2 months used and I saw on here that’s usually around the max timing. I just picked up the 5 pack of cartridges of insulin at Costco for $98 and started it yesterday evening. I’ll upload the spreadsheet soon so you can see her numbers (didn’t realize my spreadsheet wouldn’t work). She has recently gone high in numbers but I wonder if the possibly old lantus could be the cause? I also read blood sugar numbers differently than I’ve been seeing on the forums. I am guessing once I do the spreadsheet it will convert my numbers (ie blood sugar number today was something like 24.4).
Thanks for the helpful info!
Click to expand...
You can use the vials of Lantus until the very last drop as long as it is stored properly in the fridge. Ignore the "28 days" recommendations. That is for humans who do not generally refrigerate their current bottle of Lantus.

Since you are not in the US, use the World spreadsheet. The numbers should convert automatically on the US spreadsheet.
 
KittenTheCat said:
Is there a legend for the spreadsheet? What is AMPS and Dosing Method (SLGS or TR)? Thanks!
Click to expand...
Holler if you need help setting up a spreadsheet. There are a couple of people here who can do it in minutes.
 
Red & Rover (GA) said:
You can use the vials of Lantus until the very last drop as long as it is stored properly in the fridge. Ignore the "28 days" recommendations. That is for humans who do not generally refrigerate their current bottle of Lantus.

Since you are not in the US, use the World spreadsheet. The numbers should convert automatically on the US spreadsheet.
Click to expand...

Oh I still have 75% of that bottle of 10 ml Lantus. Kitten has had some very soft/patty cake like BMs this week and high BG numbers with no changes to insulin/food so the only explanation I could come up with was that the Lantus has gone "off". When I started looking into it, the online forums said 2 months max. I am conflicted if the 10 ml Lantus is still good or not - it looks fine and has been in the fridge the entire time. My only concerns is it seems to be really "smelly" of insulin. For now, Kitten is on the new 3 ml cartridge I purchased.

Should I go back to the 10 ml Lantus and finish it?
 
KittenTheCat said:
I think I have successfully uploaded the spreadsheet.
Click to expand...
Good job! We can see a "view only" version of the SS (spreadsheet) now, so you did the link and permissions correctly. Thank you
Would you do one thing on your SS (spreadsheet) please? Enter a row for every date, even if you do not have any test data.
Thank you. It helps our brains to process the SS better.

Some people describe the smell of lantus as smelling like bandaids.

Please get a pre-shot BG test, every cycle. So you know the blood glucose is high enough to give your cat insulin. We want to keep Kitten safe.
 
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