? Should I shoot?

Julie mueller

Julie mueller

Member Since 2019
As many know... Smokey has not had an appetite for over a week and it's been a struggle to get anything in him . I started zofran and the appetite stimulator this afternoon. His levels have been low all day . Hes at 99 right now and I'm supposed to do his shot in 30 minutes... he is eating better today .. he ate about 3 ounces for dinner . Should i shoot with him being that low already ?

BGL 99
Ketones .2
 
I'm not one of the experts and I do hope they give you a definitive answer soon. I do suspect that they will recommend shooting since there's Ketones present. As long as you can monitor and have plenty of supplies(test strips and higher carb food) to keep Smokey safe. I guess 30 min might tell you a different story about the amount to shoot...some insulin support needs to be given with the presence of ketones.

ETA: Thank goodness he's eating for you.
 
When did you give him the dinner?
3 Oz is a good meal. Was that in the 2 hour window before you test and normally don’t feed?
If the number is still low at PMPS you can stall and don’t feed and test in 20 mins.
A ketone test of 0,2 ketones is if no concern.
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
When did you give him the dinner?
3 Oz is a good meal. Was that in the 2 hour window before you test and normally don’t feed?
If the number is still low at PMPS you can stall and don’t feed and test in 20 mins.
A ketone test of 0,2 ketones is if no concern.
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Dinner was 45 minutes ago . I was supposed to shoot 15 minutes ago . I'm about to recheck him
 
If you fed 45 minutes ago the PMPS will be food influenced. It is best to not feed for the 2 hours Preshot so your BG is not food influenced. But let’s see what it is.
 
Julie mueller said:
No I'm worried to give it because he has been low all day. And after really examining his plate he are more like 1.5 ounces . I can tell his appetite is diminishing.. I'm guessing the meds are wearing off
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How long ago did he have the zofran and the appt stimulant?
I know you test for ketones, but does he have a history of ketones or DKA?
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
How long ago did he have the zofran and the appt stimulant?
I know you test for ketones, but does he have a history of ketones or DKA?
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He had the stimulant at noon and the zofran at 230pm eastern

He does not have a history but when we were at the vet Tuesday she said he had trace ketones and it scared me so I started testing
 
Julie mueller said:
He had the stimulant at noon and the zofran at 230pm eastern

He does not have a history but when we were at the vet Tuesday she said he had trace ketones and it scared me so I started testing
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How many hours ago was the zofran? 2.30pm eastern means nothing to me as I am in Australia.
Did the vet test with urine or blood for the ketones?
 
Julie mueller said:
Sorry!!!
Stimulant was 12 hours ago
Zofran was 9 hours ago

Vet tested with urine .
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Thanks.
Zofran can be given every 8 hours if needed so he can have that again during this cycle if needed.
I'm not sure how often the appt stimulant is given...
Looking at his SS it looks as if he could be coming off a bounce from the run of blue numbers on 3/3. This is cycle 7 since then and when they come off the bounce they sometimes drop lower like he did.

I don't think we should skip the dose if there were traces of ketones at the vet the other day.
I know you don't feel comfortable shooting the full dose.....how about giving 1/2 unit?
You will still have to test during the cycle and he could drop lower because of the depot which will influence this cycle no matter what you shoot.
Do you have plenty of test strips, higher carb food, able to test and feel comfortable to do that?
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
Thanks.
Zofran can be given every 8 hours if needed so he can have that again during this cycle if needed.
I'm not sure how often the appt stimulant is given...
Looking at his SS it looks as if he could be coming off a bounce from the run of blue numbers on 3/3. This is cycle 7 since then and when they come off the bounce they sometimes drop lower like he did.

I don't think we should skip the dose if there were traces of ketones at the vet the other day.
I know you don't feel comfortable shooting the full dose.....how about giving 1/2 unit?
You will still have to test during the cycle and he could drop lower because of the depot which will influence this cycle no matter what you shoot.
Do you have plenty of test strips, higher carb food, able to test and feel comfortable to do that?
Click to expand...


Yes . I actually just tested him and hes at 226 now . I just shot and got him to eat a little bit
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
Thanks.
Zofran can be given every 8 hours if needed so he can have that again during this cycle if needed.
I'm not sure how often the appt stimulant is given...
Looking at his SS it looks as if he could be coming off a bounce from the run of blue numbers on 3/3. This is cycle 7 since then and when they come off the bounce they sometimes drop lower like he did.

I don't think we should skip the dose if there were traces of ketones at the vet the other day.
I know you don't feel comfortable shooting the full dose.....how about giving 1/2 unit?
You will still have to test during the cycle and he could drop lower because of the depot which will influence this cycle no matter what you shoot.
Do you have plenty of test strips, higher carb food, able to test and feel comfortable to do that?
Click to expand...



What exactly does bounce mean ? Sorry I'm relatively new to this
 
Julie mueller said:
Yes . I actually just tested him and hes at 226 now . I just shot and got him to eat a little bit
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What dose did you give?

Julie mueller said:
What exactly does bounce mean ? Sorry I'm relatively new to this
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A diabetic cat can get used to being in higher than normal numbers. A bounce happens when a cat drops down too fast, too low, or into numbers he is no longer used to. His body panics and says '911...we have an emergency..." and his body dumps regulatory hormones and stored glucose into his system to "save himself". This shoots the BG up high and it can last on 1 to 6 cycles to resolve. There is nothing you can do about it but wait it out.
Sometimes when they are coming off the bounce they can drop low and quickly. It doesn't happen all the time or to all cats but it does happen quite often.

I wouldn't be surprised if Smokey bounces again after the BG of 99. Only time will tell.
In the meantime I would get a +1 and +2 until we see what he has in store.
If his appetite goes off I would repeat the zofran.
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
What dose did you give?


A diabetic cat can get used to being in higher than normal numbers. A bounce happens when a cat drops down too fast, too low, or into numbers he is no longer used to. His body panics and says '911...we have an emergency..." and his body dumps regulatory hormones and stored glucose into his system to "save himself". This shoots the BG up high and it can last on 1 to 6 cycles to resolve. There is nothing you can do about it but wait it out.
Sometimes when they are coming off the bounce they can drop low and quickly. It doesn't happen all the time or to all cats but it does happen quite often.

I wouldn't be surprised if Smokey bounces again after the BG of 99. Only time will tell.
In the meantime I would get a +1 and +2 until we see what he has in store.
If his appetite goes off I would repeat the zofran.
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Okay . If his +1 and +2 look ok without a big decrease should I be in the clear or when do you think I'll be ok to go to sleep ?
 
Julie mueller said:
Okay . If his +1 and +2 look ok without a big decrease should I be in the clear or when do you think I'll be ok to go to sleep ?
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I would borrow @Chris & China (GA) crystal ball if I could to tell you but last I heard it was broken ;)
Let's see what the +1 and +2 are. He may bounce again or he may stay flat.
When I had to test during the night I always set the alarm and got up. I didn't just stay up.....I would not have survived.
Are you good at waking up for alarms or do you sleep through?
What dose did you give ?
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
I would borrow @Chris & China (GA) crystal ball if I could to tell you but last I heard it was broken ;)
Let's see what the +1 and +2 are. He may bounce again or he may stay flat.
When I had to test during the night I always set the alwarm and get up. I didn't just stay up.....I would not have survived.
Are you good at waking up for alarms or do you sleep through?
What dose did you give ?
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I gave .75 unit.
Yeah -i know you cant predict that :joyful: I'm hoping he stays flat so I dont have too much to worry about. I could do that .. its rough for me because I have 2 under the age of 3 so I get little sleep as it is .

I'll be testing in 15 minutes for the +1
 
Julie mueller said:
I gave .75 unit.
Yeah -i know you cant predict that :joyful: I'm hoping he stays flat so I dont have too much to worry about. I could do that .. its rough for me because I have 2 under the age of 3 so I get little sleep as it is .

I'll be testing in 15 minutes for the +1
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I understand how hard it must be for you with two small kids as well. That’s tough. Smokey is a lucky fellow!
Go back to the 1 unit tomorrow
 
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Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
I understand how hard it must be for you with two small kids as well. That’s tough. Smokey is a lucky fellow!
Go back to the 1 unit tomorrow
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252 +1

Yes I will. And it will be the first full day ( 2 doses) of anti nausea and stimulant so I'm hoping that helps getting him back to a normal eating pattern
 
Julie mueller said:
252 +1

Yes I will. And it will be the first full day ( 2 doses) of anti nausea and stimulant so I'm hoping that helps getting him back to a normal eating pattern
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Looking like it could be the start of another bounce. Very common in newly diagnosed cats. Sheba was a champion diver and bouncer in her day.

See you +2
When you get a chance can you update the SS please?
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
Looking like it could be the start of another bounce. Very common in newly diagnosed cats. Sheba was a champion diver and bouncer in her day.

See you +2
When you get a chance can you update the SS please?
Click to expand...

And that means he will continue to go up?

I updated the spread sheet .

Also- he just went over and ate most of his dinner ( about another 2 ounces) - it makes me so happy hes finally eating again but Its gravy bits :arghh::arghh:
 
Yay for eating!!
Don’t worry too much at the moment what it is he is eating. The important thing is he is eating!
You will get back on track soon enough. If there is any hint of ketones in the picture it is really important he eats well, and he gets his insulin. And encourage fluids.
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
Yay for eating!!
Don’t worry too much at the moment what it is he is eating. The important thing is he is eating!
You will get back on track soon enough. If there is any hint of ketones in the picture it is really important he eats well, and he gets his insulin. And encourage fluids.
Click to expand...

+2 192
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
I’d get a +3 to see what he’s up to.
Or a +4 and you could set the alarm as long as you will wake up.
I’d offer a snack now of low carb food and see if he’ll eat it.
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Right after I tested he got up and went and ate more of his food. I'm going to try and get a +3 . If it hasnt dropped much you think I'll be okay ?
 
Julie mueller said:
Right after I tested he got up and went and ate more of his food. I'm going to try and get a +3 . If it hasnt dropped much you think I'll be okay ?
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It’s very hard to say. There really isn’t enough data to say when his nadir is.
Its really good he’s eating.
What time is it for you now?
 
For future reference, it is better to give the anti nausea meds some time to work before giving the appetite stimulant.

Glad Bron was around for you.
 
Bron and Sheba (GA) said:
Ok I’m confused.
If you tested at +2 (3am) and it was 192, wouldn’t +4 be at 5am.? I’m obviously missing something!
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1130 pm- gave shot
1230 +1
130am +2
230 +3 ( clocks in the US jumped ahead an hour so now its 330)
430 am +4
530 am +5


Yes you were right . Sorry! I'm going to blame it on the lack of sleep :rolleyes:
 
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