5/8 Yoyo AMPS 211,+2 156,+4 148,+7 161,+9.5 176,PMPS 174,+2 202,+4 125,+6 120,+7 130,

Debra and Yoyo said:
The second dips really scare me. I am always afraid that when I give him the insulin that he will go way down past 50. And this morning he was down to 52 when I stalled. I always heard that one should stall and see if the numbers come up. But with Yoyo, as I have experienced before, he seems to go lower instead of going up. So I guess stalling isn't a great idea for Yoyo.
With this mornings low numbers, would you have fed LC food or would you have fed MC food before giving the insulin?
Click to expand...
The second dips shouldn’t scare you as numbers will tend to rise after that. Guaranteed? No, but typically they will if you feed and shoot on time if the BG is above 50.

Stalling is a technique usually used if we are working with a new member or the BG is below 50. Stalling is typically for the benefit of the CG and not the cat if the BG is above 50. In most instances with an experienced CG like you and a BG above 50, if the CG is able and available to test, stalling is not the best option.

I would not have fed LC or MC before giving insulin in the situation you had yesterday. I would have given insulin on time and then fed a normal LC meal and tested no later than +1. But....you could have fed a MC meal after insulin if you’d shot the 64 just to ease your mind. It wouldn’t have hurt to do so but I’d have still tested no later than +1.

Debra and Yoyo said:
I guess most of my fear is not understanding how insulin works and by that I mean how the insulin on such day will effect his numbers. I fear that the food will not raise his count enough or that his number is so low already and what if he has a BIG drop? That is what scares me the most.
Click to expand...

It does take some time to be able to study the patterns and figure out what he might do but because insulin is a hormone and not a medication and things can change from day to day including the weather (which can affect the BG) so if anyone tells you they can predict exactly what their cat will do every day, they are blowing sunshine up your skirt. That can lead to complacency and that can end badly. We had that happen to a long-time member. Yes, once cats flatten out and quit bouncing, it becomes easier to predict their patterns but it’s not guaranteed that they won’t drop low on a dose that has had them nice and steady.

Remember that the drops aren’t as big below 100 as they are when the BG is over 200, for example. But....you are in control with testing and feeding. You might want to test (and maybe feed) a bit more until you know the BG is steady or rising s but before onset in the scenario you had yesterday.

Debra and Yoyo said:
Which is more serious.....giving insulin after a bounce is clearing or giving insulin after a second dip?
Click to expand...

Neither is serious but I don’t think that’s really your question. ;) I always found shooting a dropping number from a bounce to be a little more :nailbiting: because Gracie, on Lantus, would just keep dropping even after I fed her and into the next cycle and then onset. She was always a drama queen clearing bounces. I learned how to handle it but I didn’t like it and she was much better on Levemir. Shooting a second dip shouldn’t usually be any issue because you shoot (above 50 human meter), you feed, and the BG will typically start to rise because it’s at the end of the cycle and you’ve just added food to the mix, usually further slowing down duration. What you might see is flat numbers and that’s the goal. That’s taking advantage of carryover and overlap.

Does that make sense? It’s hard to understand the whole carryover and overlap concepts so let me know if I need to explain those.
 
Marje and Gracie said:
The second dips shouldn’t scare you as numbers will tend to rise after that. Guaranteed? No, but typically they will if you feed and shoot on time if the BG is above 50.

Stalling is a technique usually used if we are working with a new member or the BG is below 50. Stalling is typically for the benefit of the CG and not the cat if the BG is above 50. In most instances with an experienced CG like you and a BG above 50, if the CG is able and available to test, stalling is not the best option.

I would not have fed LC or MC before giving insulin in the situation you had yesterday. I would have given insulin on time and then fed a normal LC meal and tested no later than +1. But....you could have fed a MC meal after insulin if you’d shot the 64 just to ease your mind. It wouldn’t have hurt to do so but I’d have still tested no later than +1.



It does take some time to be able to study the patterns and figure out what he might do but because insulin is a hormone and not a medication and things can change from day to day including the weather (which can affect the BG) so if anyone tells you they can predict exactly what their cat will do every day, they are blowing sunshine up your skirt. That can lead to complacency and that can end badly. We had that happen to a long-time member. Yes, once cats flatten out and quit bouncing, it becomes easier to predict their patterns but it’s not guaranteed that they won’t drop low on a dose that has had them nice and steady.

Remember that the drops aren’t as big below 100 as they are when the BG is over 200, for example. But....you are in control with testing and feeding. You might want to test (and maybe feed) a bit more until you know the BG is steady or rising s but before onset in the scenario you had yesterday.



Neither is serious but I don’t think that’s really your question. ;) I always found shooting a dropping number from a bounce to be a little more :nailbiting: because Gracie, on Lantus, would just keep dropping even after I fed her and into the next cycle and then onset. She was always a drama queen clearing bounces. I learned how to handle it but I didn’t like it and she was much better on Levemir. Shooting a second dip shouldn’t usually be any issue because you shoot (above 50 human meter), you feed, and the BG will typically start to rise because it’s at the end of the cycle and you’ve just added food to the mix, usually further slowing down duration. What you might see is flat numbers and that’s the goal. That’s taking advantage of carryover and overlap.

Does that make sense? It’s hard to understand the whole carryover and overlap concepts so let me know if I need to explain those.
Click to expand...

Carryover and overlap.....is that referring to the depot? Is that what a scond dip is?

I feel better reading what you wrote, but still, when I am by myself and I see those low numbers I freak out. I am afraid that I will hurt Yoyo by giving him his insulin dosage. It is a fear, and I know I must get over it to help Yoyo- but it is hard to do!! I will REMEMBER all that you wrote, I printed it out, and I will reread it again and again.

Thank you for having patience with me. I know I can test one's nerves, and I apologize for that. I seem to get stuck on things and have a problem moving forward. That is me in a nut shell:eek::eek:o_O

P.s.....if Yo tested 51 or 50, would you still give him his dosage of insulin? (I know 50 and above, but it is soooo close to 50 and below).;)
 
Debra and Yoyo said:
Carryover and overlap.....is that referring to the depot? Is that what a scond dip is?
Click to expand...
Carryover is when one cycle has a longer duration than 12 hours. Overlap is when one cycle is waning as the other one is onsetting. No, they don’t have anything to do with the second dip :) That’s just a benefit of Lantus that happens to some, but not all, kitties.

You are definitely not testing my nerves! You want to learn and you’ve come so far in helping Yo! There’s almost always someone on the board to help you with low numbers but you have it down. You can always resort to honey or syrup if you need to u til the food brings him up. He seems fairly responsive to food.

Yes, for a 50 or 51, and for Yo now, I’d shoot the full dose as long as I had supplies and could test. The protocol is built with a margin of safety and that’s why 50 is safe to shoot provided you can monitor.

Let’s hope he’s starts settling into this dose a bit more!
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top