shots and feeding question

[Darwin H.]

I've always wondered. I know to spread out the shots to 12 hours apart, but what about when I feed earlier than that, can i still give the shot 1-2 hours later ? yes I have taken the BG before feeding but wonder what the timeline to feed is when trying to stay at the 12 hour spread for injections? I've been sometimes injecting an hour earlier after feeding or waiting until near the 12 hour mark when it comes to dinner. Breakfast is never an issue, only dinner when the crying and nagging starts. Im sure others have questioned this also.

Thanks :^)

 

[Sandy and Black Kitty]

I've always wondered. I know to spread out the shots to 12 hours apart, but what about when I feed earlier than that, can i still give the shot 1-2 hours later ? yes I have taken the BG before feeding but wonder what the timeline to feed is when trying to stay at the 12 hour spread for injections? I've been sometimes injecting an hour earlier after feeding or waiting until near the 12 hour mark when it comes to dinner. Breakfast is never an issue, only dinner when the crying and nagging starts. Im sure others have questioned this also.

Thanks :^)

With Lantus/Basaglar or Levimir we test, feed and shoot all within about 10 minutes. Being that they are slow acting insulins there is no need to have food on board before shooting.
Additionally we recommend no feeding after +10 because it could artificially inflate the PS number.

Note that shooting early (sooner than 12 hours after the previous shot) in general is not recommended - it has potential to increase the amount of insulin in free circulation which can lead to unexpected lows.

I ended up using the following feeding schedule, thanks to a 5 compartment programmable timed feeder (which was a life saver). I fed him hos shot time meals and the feeder fed him the mini meals. If I needed to guide the numbers with additional food, I worked around the regular schedule and amounts.

Full meal with AM shot - 1/2 can (3.5oz can)
AM+4 -1/4 can mini meal
AM+8 -1/4 can mini meal
Full meal with PM shot - 1/2 can
PM+4 -1/4 can mini meal
PM+8 -1/4 can mini meal

I just took a look at your ss and wanted to say that when I see a lot of AM black numbers the first place I look is to the PM cycle proceeding to see if there were any lows or quick drops, both of which can trigger a nasty bounce. I strongly suspect this may be the case with your kitty.

Getting some data on the PM cycles will provide a fuller picture of what is really going on, particularly since most kitties run lower on the overnights.
As it stands you are making dosing decisions with only half of the picture. Keep in mind that with slow acting depot type of insulins dosing decisions are based on how low a particular dose takes your kitty (nadir) so its really important to have as full a picture as possible.

 

[Darwin H.]

My schedule does not always allow for being precise but I try to stay with the 12 hr as best I can. They make tings dicey with not always eating much after i test him. Then he goes back and forth to the food till it's gone. At night I leave some kibble as he tests too high in the AM and often vomits up bile waiting to get breakfast as manyf cats do anticipating being fed. With food affecting his numbers it's always a guess of how it plays out.

 

[Sienne and Gabby (GA)]

The basic rule with the long-acting, depot types of insulin is that an early shot acts like a dose increase whereas a late shot acts like a dose reduction. This is why we urge people to try to stick as close as possible to a 12-hour schedule. In all likelihood 30 min. isn't going to make a huge difference but it really depends on how sensitive your cat is to schedule alterations.

Regardless of when you're giving the shot, you want to test, feed, and shoot at whenever you are giving insulin. With Basaglar, you want to give food and insulin at roughly the same time as Sandy noted. Lantus/Basaglar doesn't start working until about 2 hrs after you give an injection. Having a kitty that grazes is not a problem as frequent, small meals are often recommended for diabetic cats. It puts less pressure on the pancreas.

I'd encourage you to not give kibble at night. Leave out Darwin's usual food, low carb treats like freeze dried chicken, or (I know, this is a lousy suggestion), get up and give him a snack at +9 or a bit before or use a timed feeder so you don't have to disrupt your sleep.

I also want to underscore the importance of getting a before bed test every night. It's the only way to insure that Darwin is safe as many cats run into lower numbers at night. It may also go a long way to understand those high AMPS numbers. Those high numbers may be bounces.

Also, Darwin has been in the 50s on two occasions. Was there a reason you didn't reduce his dose?

 

[Darwin H.]

The basic rule with the long-acting, depot types of insulin is that an early shot acts like a dose increase whereas a late shot acts like a dose reduction. This is why we urge people to try to stick as close as possible to a 12-hour schedule. In all likelihood 30 min. isn't going to make a huge difference but it really depends on how sensitive your cat is to schedule alterations.

Regardless of when you're giving the shot, you want to test, feed, and shoot at whenever you are giving insulin. With Basaglar, you want to give food and insulin at roughly the same time as Sandy noted. Lantus/Basaglar doesn't start working until about 2 hrs after you give an injection. Having a kitty that grazes is not a problem as frequent, small meals are often recommended for diabetic cats. It puts less pressure on the pancreas.

I'd encourage you to not give kibble at night. Leave out Darwin's usual food, low carb treats like freeze dried chicken, or (I know, this is a lousy suggestion), get up and give him a snack at +9 or a bit before or use a timed feeder so you don't have to disrupt your sleep.

I also want to underscore the importance of getting a before bed test every night. It's the only way to insure that Darwin is safe as many cats run into lower numbers at night. It may also go a long way to understand those high AMPS numbers. Those high numbers may be bounces.

Also, Darwin has been in the 50s on two occasions. Was there a reason you didn't reduce his dose?

I am Dar, Cat is Simba. Did not reduce dose because hours later he was back up. Thanks. Today's strict every 2 hr curve was 259,94,50,120,248 with the last PM ahead still. My meter against lab is and I assume continues to be 30 points lower than measured lab blood test.