High Numbers

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Adrienne & Molly (GA)

Member Since 2019
Hello,
My Molly is on 4 units of lantus every 12 hours. The vet had suggested upping her insulin to 5 units. I do a test this morning before breakfast and her shot. It was at 28.9 so I increased her insulin to 5 units this morning. Why won't her numbers come down?
 
You do not have many BG entries in your SS. I see none with both a BG taken before shot and then more BGs between shots. That info is needed to see what is going one. If BGs go up with increasing dose that can mean that the dose is too high. I do not see the dose associated with BGs before 1/29.
 
Here's the basic testing routine we recommend to get an idea of what's going on and to evaluate a dose:
  1. test every day AM and PM before feeding and injecting (no food at least 2 hours before) to see if the planned dose is safe
  2. test at least once near mid cycle or at bedtime daily to see how low the BG goes
  3. do extra tests on days off to fill in the response picture
  4. if indicated by consistently high numbers on your spreadsheet, increase the dose by no more than 0.25 u at a time so you don't accidentally go right past a good dose
  5. post here for advice whenever you're confused or unsure of what to do.
She's on a high dose for a newly diagnosed kitty and, as Larry said, it's possible for a dose that's too high to result in high BGs.

The Urinary S/O food is high in carbs and the dry version especially so. My guy was on the canned S/O for a long time before his diabetes diagnosis. I switched him to canned low carb food right after his diagnosis as my vet recommended. I add a lot of water to each wet food meal so he's basically eating soup. He hasn't had any urinary issues with this feeding regimen for three years now.

If you decide to try low carb canned food with added water (and I suggest you do) that can have a significant impact on BG levels. The current diet is likely keeping Bg elevated - along with possibly a dose that's too high.
 
Here's the basic testing routine we recommend to get an idea of what's going on and to evaluate a dose:
  1. test every day AM and PM before feeding and injecting (no food at least 2 hours before) to see if the planned dose is safe
  2. test at least once near mid cycle or at bedtime daily to see how low the BG goes
  3. do extra tests on days off to fill in the response picture
  4. if indicated by consistently high numbers on your spreadsheet, increase the dose by no more than 0.25 u at a time so you don't accidentally go right past a good dose
  5. post here for advice whenever you're confused or unsure of what to do.
She's on a high dose for a newly diagnosed kitty and, as Larry said, it's possible for a dose that's too high to result in high BGs.

The Urinary S/O food is high in carbs and the dry version especially so. My guy was on the canned S/O for a long time before his diabetes diagnosis. I switched him to canned low carb food right after his diagnosis as my vet recommended. I add a lot of water to each wet food meal so he's basically eating soup. He hasn't had any urinary issues with this feeding regimen for three years now.

If you decide to try low carb canned food with added water (and I suggest you do) that can have a significant impact on BG levels. The current diet is likely keeping Bg elevated - along with possibly a dose that's too high.
 
Ok so test in the morning like I did this morning? then test again in the evening? Where she is on Lantus it takes 3 days to show results? I've been looking at changing her food but she loves her dry and she eats the SO moist in the morning. What's a low carb wet food?
 
Ok so test in the morning like I did this morning? then test again in the evening? Where she is on Lantus it takes 3 days to show results? I've been looking at changing her food but she loves her dry and she eats the SO moist in the morning. What's a low carb wet food?
Yes - test both AM and PM just before feeding and giving insulin. Withhold all food for two hours before these tests because you want to know what BG is without the elevation that food can cause. These tests tell you whether the planned dose is safe to give. You want the pre shot BG to be at least 14 mmol/L (250 in American units) as measured on your AT meter.

Lantus is a depot insulin and it can take up to 3 days or so for the depot to fill to the level that corresponds to the dose you're giving (depot is larger the higher the dose). That's why you won't necessarily see the full impact of a dose immediately after it's changed.

Low carb wet food is best for diabetics. They tend to be more dehydrated because of elevated blood sugar and their tendency to pee larger volumes. There are many low carb commercial wet foods available. If your budget requires it, Friskies and Fancy Feast pate style foods fit the bill of being less than 10% carbs as fed. If you want a vet diet, Purina Pro Plan DM pate is 6% carbs as fed. This is an excellent food list compiled by a feline vet who's an expert in nutrition: https://catinfo.org/docs/CatFoodProteinFatCarbPhosphorusChart.pdf Many of these foods are available in Canada.

Many kitties arrive here loving kibble but it's best to wean off of that. There are very few low carb kibbles on the market and they aren't available in Canada. Maybe you can introduce freeze dried meat treats to Molly and sprinkle a bit of that crushed up on her wet food meals. Pure Bites is one brand that is readily available in PetSmart and Pet Valu. Specialty "holistic" pet food stores carry Orijen brand freeze dried meat/fish treats and those are popular.

Please do stick around so we can help you find the good dose range for Molly. I would also encourage you to go to the Lantus forum to read the information in the yellow stickies list at the top of that page. There are very many experienced people on that forum to help you as well.
 
I took her BG this morning before shot. It was 28.9 I have that in the SS? I work a full time job and can only test when I'm home.
Not a problem. If you can get those all important pre shot tests and a before bed test in the evening that would be very useful weekday info. You can get more daytime tests in on your days off to round out the picture.
 
Yes - test both AM and PM just before feeding and giving insulin. Withhold all food for two hours before these tests because you want to know what BG is without the elevation that food can cause. These tests tell you whether the planned dose is safe to give. You want the pre shot BG to be at least 14 mmol/L (250 in American units) as measured on your AT meter.

Lantus is a depot insulin and it can take up to 3 days or so for the depot to fill to the level that corresponds to the dose you're giving (depot is larger the higher the dose). That's why you won't necessarily see the full impact of a dose immediately after it's changed.

Low carb wet food is best for diabetics. They tend to be more dehydrated because of elevated blood sugar and their tendency to pee larger volumes. There are many low carb commercial wet foods available. If your budget requires it, Friskies and Fancy Feast pate style foods fit the bill of being less than 10% carbs as fed. If you want a vet diet, Purina Pro Plan DM pate is 6% carbs as fed. This is an excellent food list compiled by a feline vet who's an expert in nutrition: https://catinfo.org/docs/CatFoodProteinFatCarbPhosphorusChart.pdf Many of these foods are available in Canada.

Many kitties arrive here loving kibble but it's best to wean off of that. There are very few low carb kibbles on the market and they aren't available in Canada. Maybe you can introduce freeze dried meat treats to Molly and sprinkle a bit of that crushed up on her wet food meals. Pure Bites is one brand that is readily available in PetSmart and Pet Valu. Specialty "holistic" pet food stores carry Orijen brand freeze dried meat/fish treats and those are popular.

Please do stick around so we can help you find the good dose range for Molly. I would also encourage you to go to the Lantus forum to read the information in the yellow stickies list at the top of that page. There are very many experienced people on that forum to help you as well.

I am looking into changing her food. Possibly raw and low carb wet. But I'm scared where her insulin is so high. It's been so stressful she has bruises on her ears. From me trying to test her, I've watched the videos but she just hates to be tested. She's such a good cat and I just want to help her. The vet doesn't want to change her food. Only to test her once a week and I'm literally stressed. She's my baby and I just want her better.
 
I am looking into changing her food. Possibly raw and low carb wet. But I'm scared where her insulin is so high. It's been so stressful she has bruises on her ears. From me trying to test her, I've watched the videos but she just hates to be tested. She's such a good cat and I just want to help her. The vet doesn't want to change her food. Only to test her once a week and I'm literally stressed. She's my baby and I just want her better.
It’s so stressful isn’t it! I know. I’m only new too and it’s overwhelming when all the info in here seems to contradict the vets and it all sees so hard and complicated.... but keep going. You will get through!

The bruising on her ears; do you put firm pressure on the spot after you’ve got the blood drop? From experience of having to fingerprick myself to test my BGL 7 times a day, get that drop and then instant firm pressure for maybe five seconds seems to be the trick. If I just held it gently or didn’t really do anything because the blood wasn’t flowing anyway, then it would be far more likely to bruise slightly.

As for being scared with the high dose, that is why we home test all the time. Before every single shot. Then you can have a much clearer idea of if the BGL are high enough or not.

You’re right though, that changing food while on a high dose is a bit scary, so I hope others can help with a plan for that.
 
It’s so stressful isn’t it! I know. I’m only new too and it’s overwhelming when all the info in here seems to contradict the vets and it all sees so hard and complicated.... but keep going. You will get through!

The bruising on her ears; do you put firm pressure on the spot after you’ve got the blood drop? From experience of having to fingerprick myself to test my BGL 7 times a day, get that drop and then instant firm pressure for maybe five seconds seems to be the trick. If I just held it gently or didn’t really do anything because the blood wasn’t flowing anyway, then it would be far more likely to bruise slightly.

As for being scared with the high dose, that is why we home test all the time. Before every single shot. Then you can have a much clearer idea of if the BGL are high enough or not.

You’re right though, that changing food while on a high dose is a bit scary, so I hope others can help with a plan for that.

Her BG was 28.9 this morning so that's why I put it up to 5 units. The vet had told me to start her on that dosage Monday evening, but I thought that was awful high. She's still playful and loving!
I don't put pressure on her ear. I keep forgetting she just wants to get down.

I hope someone on her can help me with a food plan where her dosage is so high.
 
She's my baby and I just want her better.
She looks very cute in her avatar photo! :) Here's what I suggest:
  • drop back to 4 u for now
  • practice that testing routine I described above and continue it through the weekend at the 4 u dose and feed her current food while you gather data
  • pressure on the ear helps with bruising and many people use antibiotic ointment with pain relief after each test
  • incorporate low carb treats into the testing routine
  • go read about Lantus insulin on that forum (take it slowly - info overload).
Re dose: it's important to know that the dose is assessed on how low it drops the BG near the middle part of the cycle and not on how high the BG is in the AM and PM just before food and shot. If you get some key data on the 4 u dose with what she's been eating it will help us sort out what needs to happen next.

Are you using a Lantus pen or are you using a vial with U100 syringes? We recommend dose changes in 0.25 u increments and occasionally 0.5 u if the dose is high.
 
She looks very cute in her avatar photo! :) Here's what I suggest:
  • drop back to 4 u for now
  • practice that testing routine I described above and continue it through the weekend at the 4 u dose and feed her current food while you gather data
  • pressure on the ear helps with bruising and many people use antibiotic ointment with pain relief after each test
  • incorporate low carb treats into the testing routine
  • go read about Lantus insulin on that forum (take it slowly - info overload).
Re dose: it's important to know that the dose is assessed on how low it drops the BG near the middle part of the cycle and not on how high the BG is in the AM and PM just before food and shot. If you get some key data on the 4 u dose with what she's been eating it will help us sort out what needs to happen next.

Are you using a Lantus pen or are you using a vial with U100 syringes? We recommend dose changes in 0.25 u increments and occasionally 0.5 u if the dose is high.
Ok I’m home for work she hasn’t ate in over 2 hours. I did a test it was 21.1. She eats only Royal Canine dry and only wet in the morning. Her next shot is in 2.5 hours. I bought some polysporin today for her ears. It won’t hurt her? If she cleans her ears? Oh and I give her treats Royal Canine SO treats was 12 a day cut back to 6. I really appreciate you helping me. I need someone
So where I gave her 5 units this morning. Give her 4 tonight?
 
Ok I’m home for work she hasn’t ate in over 2 hours. I did a test it was 21.1. She eats only Royal Canine dry and only wet in the morning. Her next shot is in 2.5 hours. I bought some polysporin today for her ears. It won’t hurt her? If she cleans her ears? Oh and I give her treats Royal Canine SO treats was 12 a day cut back to 6. I really appreciate you helping me. I need someone
So where I gave her 5 units this morning. Give her 4 tonight?
Yes, give 4 u tonight according to that plan I wrote above. Re treats: have a look in your local pet stores for freeze dried chicken or fish treats and start getting her accustomed to them. :)

The polysprin will be fine. Just put a very thin smear of it on her ear after the BG test. Many people use it.
 
Let me know if you're using syringes or an insulin pen with its own needle end.

I'm using a poker I don't know what you call it. It's long and the vet gave it to me. I tried to use the pen but the top keeps popping off? I didn't test this morning. Her poor ears are bruised. I don't know if I should just use the pen where the point is smaller? and not as long. Do you think if I wet a cloth in warm water and rub her ears, before I poke her that would help? I'm going to test this afternoon.
What am I going to tell me vet, when he wants the number for 5 units? when I'm still at 4?
 
I'm using a poker I don't know what you call it. It's long and the vet gave it to me.
I'm not sure what you mean by this. The thing used to get a blood drop that comes with your meter is a lancet. It fits into a holder with a spring trigger mechanism. You can actually free hand the poke with the lancet and not bother with the trigger if the noise upsets Molly.

I tried to use the pen but the top keeps popping off?
Again, not sure what you mean. A Lantus "pen" actually looks like a plastic pen that has a removable cap. The pen has its own special needles that can be attached to the end and insulin is dispensed from there. Many people have a 10 mL vial of Lantus that they use with special insulin syringes. The syringe needle is poked into the rubber seal end of the vial to withdraw insulin.

If you could clarify those two things above it'll be easier for me to help. :)

Do you think if I wet a cloth in warm water and rub her ears, before I poke her that would help?
Warming the ear definitely helps, especially in cold weather. A warm washcloth is one thing to try. Many of us make what we call a "rice sock": take an old, clean sock, put a 1/4 cup or so of dry uncooked rice in the toe, tie it off and warm it in the microwave until it's quite warm to the touch (but not too hot!). Hold that on Molly's ear for 15 to 30 seconds and it should do the trick.

Re the vet: what dose did you give last night and this AM? The numbers aren't on your spreadsheet yet. If you dropped back to 4 u just tell the vet you were worried about the size of the dose. We've all been through the worry of doing something different from what the vet advised but, ultimately, Molly is your kitty and you need to do what's best for her.

Some other thoughts:

Believe me, I know how totally overwhelming and confusing this all is. So much too learn in a very short time, many changes to your routine, worry about overdosing your kitty or doing anything to hurt her, struggling with reading stuff here that's different from what your vet has said. It's very understandable. :bighug:

Many have arrived here in the same state as you. They were told to do one thing by the vet and it was at odds with advice given here. They were very conflicted about listening to people on the internet and some had to face their vet's outrage over that. Some switched vets. Some smile and nod when the vet tells them what to do and they go home and do what they've learned works for their kitty. Some (like me) are very lucky to have a vet who is willing to work collaboratively and admit when they don't know everything about treating feline diabetes. You'll have to give this some thought.

What I CAN guarantee is that the combined level of expertise in treating feline diabetes among members of this forum is huge. It outstrips that of any general practice vet for sure - and even some vet specialists. Any advice given here is public in the forum and can be seen by others. People with little experience will admit they can't help with dosing. People who have experience will look carefully at the data on your spreadsheet (this is why we're so relentless in wanting to see it!) and keep safety of your kitty at the forefront when suggesting anything.

Learning as much as you can about Molly's insulin, how it works and how it's used best is what you absolutely have to do. Coming here for help is really important but you'll feel so much better if you've done some homework. The yellow stickies on the Lantus forum are a wonderful source of information. Yes, it's a lot to take in but baby steps and ask a lot of questions.

We're here to help. You're not alone. :)
 
I'm not sure what you mean by this. The thing used to get a blood drop that comes with your meter is a lancet. It fits into a holder with a spring trigger mechanism. You can actually free hand the poke with the lancet and not bother with the trigger if the noise upsets Molly.


Again, not sure what you mean. A Lantus "pen" actually looks like a plastic pen that has a removable cap. The pen has its own special needles that can be attached to the end and insulin is dispensed from there. Many people have a 10 mL vial of Lantus that they use with special insulin syringes. The syringe needle is poked into the rubber seal end of the vial to withdraw insulin.

If you could clarify those two things above it'll be easier for me to help. :)


Warming the ear definitely helps, especially in cold weather. A warm washcloth is one thing to try. Many of us make what we call a "rice sock": take an old, clean sock, put a 1/4 cup or so of dry uncooked rice in the toe, tie it off and warm it in the microwave until it's quite warm to the touch (but not too hot!). Hold that on Molly's ear for 15 to 30 seconds and it should do the trick.

Re the vet: what dose did you give last night and this AM? The numbers aren't on your spreadsheet yet. If you dropped back to 4 u just tell the vet you were worried about the size of the dose. We've all been through the worry of doing something different from what the vet advised but, ultimately, Molly is your kitty and you need to do what's best for her.

Some other thoughts:

Believe me, I know how totally overwhelming and confusing this all is. So much too learn in a very short time, many changes to your routine, worry about overdosing your kitty or doing anything to hurt her, struggling with reading stuff here that's different from what your vet has said. It's very understandable. :bighug:

Many have arrived here in the same state as you. They were told to do one thing by the vet and it was at odds with advice given here. They were very conflicted about listening to people on the internet and some had to face their vet's outrage over that. Some switched vets. Some smile and nod when the vet tells them what to do and they go home and do what they've learned works for their kitty. Some (like me) are very lucky to have a vet who is willing to work collaboratively and admit when they don't know everything about treating feline diabetes. You'll have to give this some thought.

What I CAN guarantee is that the combined level of expertise in treating feline diabetes among members of this forum is huge. It outstrips that of any general practice vet for sure - and even some vet specialists. Any advice given here is public in the forum and can be seen by others. People with little experience will admit they can't help with dosing. People who have experience will look carefully at the data on your spreadsheet (this is why we're so relentless in wanting to see it!) and keep safety of your kitty at the forefront when suggesting anything.

Learning as much as you can about Molly's insulin, how it works and how it's used best is what you absolutely have to do. Coming here for help is really important but you'll feel so much better if you've done some homework. The yellow stickies on the Lantus forum are a wonderful source of information. Yes, it's a lot to take in but baby steps and ask a lot of questions.

We're here to help. You're not alone. :)

hypodermic-needle.jpg

The One on the far left is the one I've been using to poke her. I have the Lantus pen but I think it's broken, but was thinking of using the free hand with a lancet. I have updated my spreadsheet from Dec 27 til today. with the amounts of units. I just received the Alpha trak on the 21 for home monitoring. I was talking her to the vet once a week for her curve. Should I start changing her food? I never realized how stressful and frustrating this all can be.
 
I'm a little confused here - in the photo above, is that what you use to inject her insulin, or to get a blood drop to test her BG? The Lantus pen and the lancet are two entirely different things - the Lancet pen is solely for injecting her insulin; it shouldn't be used to poke her for her BG tests. The lancet is a little gadget with a tiny needle on the end that you poke her ear with to get a blood droplet.

I'm not clear whether we're misunderstanding what you are telling us, or that you aren't understanding what we're telling you.

I'm sorry you're feeling so stressed out and overwhelmed with all of this; it is or has been uncharted territory for all of us at some point, and yes, it is hard and it is scary and it is overwhelming - but you can do it! You and she will start to get used to the routine, and soon you'll be an old pro. :D Just hang in there.

And yes, do get rid of the dry food, you'll have an ongoing struggle to keep her BG down if she's eating what is essentially junk food.
 
OK. I see what you have for poking. Those are needles that would be put on syringes but the vet gave them to you to do the poking. In your AlphaTrak kit there should have been the meter, some strips and a the blue plastic lancet holder with the spring mechanism and some light blue plastic lancets. If you paid for that kit it should all be in there - or are you just borrowing it from your vet?

I have the Lantus pen but I think it's broken,

Is this what you have?

3845398857001_5790497237001_5790496282001-vs.jpg


If so, the pen needle end can be removed to expose the inner cartridge of insulin. You can use what's called a U100 insulin syringe to draw up insulin from the inner cartridge. If your pen is broken you might not be getting the proper insulin dose or any insulin at all periodically.

I was talking her to the vet once a week for her curve.
This is an unnecessary expense. We can help you do it at home.

Should I start changing her food?
Not yet. We need to see what her BG looks like at the current dose and diet.

I never realized how stressful and frustrating this all can be.
I promise it gets better!! Knowledge is power and this is definitely a kitty disease where that is so very true. You NEED to know how she's reacting to the insulin. You NEED to do whatever you can to optimize her BG and feeding low carb wet food is near the top of the list along with finding the right insulin dose.

Some more questions for you:
  • what is the reason your vet wants you to use the Lantus pen?
  • did he/she talk to you at all about using U100 insulin syringes instead of the pen?
  • what sort of testing at home did your vet suggest, seeing as you were given needles to do the poking?
Are there any other questions you have? Ask anything and I'll do my best to answer. There seems to be some confusion on and I want to get everything as clear in your mind as possible. :)
 
I'm a little confused here - in the photo above, is that what you use to inject her insulin, or to get a blood drop to test her BG? The Lantus pen and the lancet are two entirely different things - the Lancet pen is solely for injecting her insulin; it shouldn't be used to poke her for her BG tests. The lancet is a little gadget with a tiny needle on the end that you poke her ear with to get a blood droplet.

I'm not clear whether we're misunderstanding what you are telling us, or that you aren't understanding what we're telling you.

I'm sorry you're feeling so stressed out and overwhelmed with all of this; it is or has been uncharted territory for all of us at some point, and yes, it is hard and it is scary and it is overwhelming - but you can do it! You and she will start to get used to the routine, and soon you'll be an old pro. :D Just hang in there.

And yes, do get rid of the dry food, you'll have an ongoing struggle to keep her BG down if she's eating what is essentially junk food.

The photo is what I'm using to get her BG. I don't use the lancet pen to inject her insulin I use a needle for that. Hopefully that makes since. Do I still use the wet SO to feed her?
 
More photos:
alphatrack-starter-kit_1024x1024.jpg


This is the full kit: meter, blue/clear plastic lancet holder, pale blue plastic lancets, vial of strips, small dropper bottle of control solution, log book.
 
The photo is what I'm using to get her BG. I don't use the lancet pen to inject her insulin I use a needle for that. Hopefully that makes since. Do I still use the wet SO to feed her?
Yes, that makes sense. :) Are your needles (syringes) U100 syringes with half unit marks on them?

Yes, keep her on the same food for now. We need to see what her BG looks like at the dose she's on (are you going to stay at 4 u?) with the food she eats.

I posted this before but in case it got lost in the threads, here's how you want to test:
  1. test every day AM and PM before feeding and injecting (no food at least 2 hours before) to see if the planned dose is safe ESSENTIAL!
  2. test at least once near mid cycle or at bedtime daily to see how low the BG goes If you're out at work get one as you come in the door and definitely before bed. Get more on days off.
  3. do extra tests on days off to fill in the response picture
  4. if indicated by consistently high numbers on your spreadsheet, increase the dose by no more than 0.25 u (eyeballed) at a time so you don't accidentally go right past a good dose If she ends up needing a high dose of 5 u or more those can be 0.5 u changes.
  5. post here for advice whenever you're confused or unsure of what to do.

This is useful: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/hometesting-links-and-tips.287/
 
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OK. I see what you have for poking. Those are needles that would be put on syringes but the vet gave them to you to do the poking. In your AlphaTrak kit there should have been the meter, some strips and a the blue plastic lancet holder with the spring mechanism and some light blue plastic lancets. If you paid for that kit it should all be in there - or are you just borrowing it from your vet?



Is this what you have?

View attachment 42244

If so, the pen needle end can be removed to expose the inner cartridge of insulin. You can use what's called a U100 insulin syringe to draw up insulin from the inner cartridge. If your pen is broken you might not be getting the proper insulin dose or any insulin at all periodically.


This is an unnecessary expense. We can help you do it at home.


Not yet. We need to see what her BG looks like at the current dose and diet.


I promise it gets better!! Knowledge is power and this is definitely a kitty disease where that is so very true. You NEED to know how she's reacting to the insulin. You NEED to do whatever you can to optimize her BG and feeding low carb wet food is near the top of the list along with finding the right insulin dose.

Some more questions for you:
  • what was the reason your vet wants you to use the Lantus pen?
  • did he/she talk to you at all about using U100 insulin syringes instead of the pen?
  • what sort of testing at home did your vet suggest, seeing as you were given needles to do the poking?
Are there any other questions you have? Ask anything and I'll do my best to answer. There seems to be some confusion on and I want to get everything as clear in your mind as possible. :)

Yes, I agree the trip to the vet each week was getting expensive. I had ordered the monitor and they trained me how to test her. The vet said only to test her once a week and then email then the results. I use insulin syringes for her insulin every 12 hours. Not to change her food where she has a history with crystals in her urine. But I thought more wet SO could be added? she only eats that in the morning.
I'm very happy that you are helping me. I'm not educated on diabetes at all. Thought it would be easy and it's not. Last week and this week. I've had days where I went in a room and cried. Molly hasn't had it so good. She came to our door a stray 6 months old. We took her in and she developed crystals took a long time to get her normal. Then Last December she was diagnosed with asthma. That's under control now. Now trying to get her diabetes under control!
 
Yes, I agree the trip to the vet each week was getting expensive. I had ordered the monitor and they trained me how to test her. The vet said only to test her once a week and then email then the results. I use insulin syringes for her insulin every 12 hours. Not to change her food where she has a history with crystals in her urine. But I thought more wet SO could be added? she only eats that in the morning.
I'm very happy that you are helping me. I'm not educated on diabetes at all. Thought it would be easy and it's not. Last week and this week. I've had days where I went in a room and cried. Molly hasn't had it so good. She came to our door a stray 6 months old. We took her in and she developed crystals took a long time to get her normal. Then Last December she was diagnosed with asthma. That's under control now. Now trying to get her diabetes under control!
We're here to help! We'll get it sorted guaranteed!

but the pen
Do you mean the blue plastic holder for the lancets? Some of them are long and skinny whereas the one in the photo is the shorter version. I'm getting confused when you say pen because your Lantus is also in a pen dispenser.

Re strips: I was paying $100 for a vial of 50 strips at my vet clinic. I can't sustain that so I switched to a human meter. All strips are expensive in Canada but I'll give you some info on cutting costs later. Have to go do something right now.
 
Yes, that makes sense. :) Are your needles (syringes) U100 syringes with half unit marks on them?

Yes, keep her on the same food for now. We need to see what her BG looks like at the dose she's on (are you going to stay at 4 u?) with the food she eat.

I posted this before but in case it got lost in the threads, here's how you want to test:
  1. test every day AM and PM before feeding and injecting (no food at least 2 hours before) to see if the planned dose is safe ESSENTIAL!
  2. test at least once near mid cycle or at bedtime daily to see how low the BG goes If you're out at work get one as you come in the door and definitely before bed. Get more on days off.
  3. do extra tests on days off to fill in the response picture
  4. if indicated by consistently high numbers on your spreadsheet, increase the dose by no more than 0.25 u (eyeballed) at a time so you don't accidentally go right past a good dose If she ends up needing a high dose of 5 u or more those can be 0.5 u changes.
  5. post here for advice whenever you're confused or unsure of what to do.

This is useful: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/hometesting-links-and-tips.287/

Ok I didn't test this morning but I'm off work at 3:30pm do I test her as soon as I get home? Then her shot is at 6pm when should I test again?
Yes the syringes I have have half marks on them.
 
Ok I didn't test this morning but I'm off work at 3:30pm do I test her as soon as I get home? Then her shot is at 6pm when should I test again?
Yes, that will be good info. Take all food away from her right after so when you test her at suppertime pre supper and shot her BG won't be food elevated. Post here and keep your spreadsheet up to date. There's a three hour time difference between us so it'll be around 9 PM for me when you do the pre shot test. I'll keep an eye out.
 
BTW - if by pen you meant the dark blue plastic device in your meter kit, you don't need to use it to poke Molly's ears. You can hold the lancets in your hand to free hand the poke. It's easier to see where you're poking as you know from using the needles.
 
BTW - if by pen you meant the dark blue plastic device in your meter kit, you don't need to use it to poke Molly's ears. You can hold the lancets in your hand to free hand the poke. It's easier to see where you're poking as you know from using the needles.

Yes, that's what I meant by pen. I'm going to use the lancet free hand. Also going to try the rice sock today! She has a bad bruise on her ear. :(
 
Yes, that's what I meant by pen. I'm going to use the lancet free hand. Also going to try the rice sock today! She has a bad bruise on her ear. :(
Poor kitty! A well warmed ear, some firm pressure after the poke and a thin film of Polysporin should help. Try hard to avoid the vein when you poke. It hurts more and will bleed more and cause bruising. I find the very edge of the ear works well. It's almost like you've just missed the ear - that close to the edge. And tell yourself that this is to help your little girl. Incorrect dosing and unregulated BG are much worse problems for her.
 
Poor kitty! A well warmed ear, some firm pressure after the poke and a thin film of Polysporin should help. Try hard to avoid the vein when you poke. It hurts more and will bleed more and cause bruising. I find the very edge of the ear works well. It's almost like you've just missed the ear - that close to the edge. And tell yourself that this is to help your little girl. Incorrect dosing and unregulated BG are much worse problems for her.

Do they feel the poke? yesterday she flinched and shook her head. Some of the videos I watched the cat just sits there. Seems like they don't feel it.
 
Do they feel the poke? yesterday she flinched and shook her head. Some of the videos I watched the cat just sits there. Seems like they don't feel it.
Yes, sometimes they do. Try not to worry too much because it's to help her. Back in the early days I agonized over poking Teasel on a curve day. I dreaded it. Now I know it's what I have to do to keep him safe, I'm better at it and he's very accustomed to it. Over time there will be more tiny blood vessels in the poking areas so it'll get easier.

What works best for me is a very quick little jabbing motion on the very edge of the ear. Sometimes you have to stroke the ear firmly in a milking action to get the bead of blood to form.
 
Some things you can do to save money:
  • Do a curve at home when your vet wants one. Send the numbers to him/her. Use your AT meter for that because the vet will want pet meter numbers. Another plus is that vet stress won't have elevated Molly's BGs. That can lead to incorrect dosing recommendations.
  • Buy a human meter to save on the cost of strips. All meter strips are expensive in Canada, generally about $80 - $90 for 100 strips for most types of meter. Get a meter that gives a reading with a very tiny blood drop. I use a Freestyle Lite meter. It uses strips very much like the AT meter and reads a very small blood drop. A human meter will read lower than your AT but we can show you how to interpret the numbers.
  • You likely have Shoppers Drug Mart where you live and they probably have 20% off every Thursday for Seniors' Day (I think it's a Canada-wide program). That's for anyone 55 or older so if you have an older friend, relative or work colleague who's willing to buy your strips on a Thursday to claim that discount it'll help. Shoppers also has a points program and you can earn points on strips purchases. I rack up points quickly and often get my strips almost free. You can also buy lancets there.
  • If you buy your Lantus pen from your vet you probably pay more than you would in a human pharmacy. The best option is to buy a 5-pack of Lantus pen cartridges. You don't need the pen body. You're already used to withdrawing insulin from the cartridge inside your Lantus pen. The cost of the 5-pack will vary a bit so call around for prices. I've paid $125 at Shoppers and $109 at Rexall. Shoppers doesn't discount insulin nor do they give points on it. You'll use each cartridge well before the insulin loses its oomph and unopened cartridges are good in your fridge until the package expiry - usually 2 years down the line.
 
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I had a moment of deja vu when I saw the needles the vet gave you to do blood testing. My vet tech did the same thing and I was appalled that they thought they needed a "dagger" to get blood from my girl's ears. Those needles are likely the culprit in bruising Molly's ears.

Definitely use the lancets either freehand or if you prefer to use the lancing advice, I have found that it's best to remove the cap. Unfortunately the spring loaded lancing devices are made for humans who test on a fleshy finger rather than a flimsy ear so the cap makes it harder to make contact with the ear. The new lancing device included with the AT2 meter also has a black top rendering it impossible to see where you are poking the ear. If you remove the cap, insert the lancet, you can use it that way. And remember your kitty has less nerve endings in their ears than you do in your fingers so kitty doesn't feel the poke nearly as much as you would in your finger.

Another little trick I found helpful for testing was to use a very thin skim of Vaseline on the spot where I intended to poke the ear. This causes the blood to bead up rather than spreading out into the fur which was an absolute must with my black kitty.

A diabetes diagnosis can be very overwhelming but once you get into a routine and get a bit more experience testing and understanding how Molly is responding to the insulin, it will get much much easier. We've all gone through a period of feeling confused and worried but that will gradually improve and you'll wonder why you thought this was going to be hard. You've got some great advice from Kris. Just take this one step at a time and you and Molly will be just fine.:D
 
Hello and welcome from the west coast of B.C. :) None of us here knew much about diabetes when we started. It does seem overwhelming at first, it that’s why we are so willing to help new people.

I had to deal with urinary issues and diabetes at the start. My girl cat got her diabetes diagnosis and one week later my boy cat got his for cystitis. She wanted to wolf his food, but the CD was too high in carbs, so I switched him to a low carb, low phosphorus diet with water added to his food. I really needed a diet that worked for both. As others have said, once you are testing enough to keep your girl safe, you can think about changing foods. The vets sell you their food, so may not want you to change. It took a while for me to get my boy cat’s vet to come up with something both could eat, and she eventually suggested raw.

Changing to a good low carb diet has made a huge difference for many kitties, provided you are testing enough to do so.
 
Some questions for you whenever you have some time:
  1. How was Molly's diabetes diagnosis arrived at? Did the vet do a fructosamine test or only a single BG test in the clinic?
  2. Did she ever have steroids to treat her asthma?
  3. When she developed urinary problems were crystals found in her urine? A lot of crystals?
  4. Did she every get totally blocked from her urinary problems?
  5. Did her urinary issues come and go over time, ie., flare up and then subside repeatedly?
  6. Was there any mention of something called "idiopathic cystitis" or "feline urinary syndrome" when she had urinary problems?
  7. Did the vet account for the extra stress when she was at the clinic to have a curve done? Did he mention that stress can cause BG to run higher?
 
Any luck getting an evening pre shot test? Not here to judge, just keeping an eye.

When I test Teasel I actually sit on the floor in my bathroom with him sitting up between my bent knees facing forward. I wrap a loosely rolled hand towel around his neck like a cervical collar people with a neck injury wear to keep his head steady. He's inclined to toss his head suddenly when I'm trying to poke and this restricts his movement gently. My bent knees act like a sort of wall on each side of him. He gets a freeze dried chicken treat before and after each test - also before and after insulin injections. I free hand the poke.

Try some different techniques with Molly to see what location, method of loose restraint, etc. makes it easier. The calmer the human, the calmer the kitty too. ;)
 
The calmer the human, the calmer the kitty too. ;)
That's possibly the most important part of testing. You need to go at it with a "can do" attitude and kitty will learn to trust you completely. Some folks even sing to soothe their own angst while testing.
I am so lucky with my girl. I would sit on my kitchen floor with the equipment and she'd do her little dance walking back and forth by me a few times close enough to hit me with her tail and after she passed a few times, she'd just plunk her little butt down and away we'd go! I tried to make her think it was her idea rather than mine and it worked! ;)
 
Adrienne, you can keep posting here for now. If you're concerned about not giving the 5 u dose your vet recommended you can give it. I'd try 4 u if I was in your position. Keep feeding Molly the same way for now.

Were you able to get a pre shot test?
 
I had a moment of deja vu when I saw the needles the vet gave you to do blood testing. My vet tech did the same thing and I was appalled that they thought they needed a "dagger" to get blood from my girl's ears. Those needles are likely the culprit in bruising Molly's ears.

Definitely use the lancets either freehand or if you prefer to use the lancing advice, I have found that it's best to remove the cap. Unfortunately the spring loaded lancing devices are made for humans who test on a fleshy finger rather than a flimsy ear so the cap makes it harder to make contact with the ear. The new lancing device included with the AT2 meter also has a black top rendering it impossible to see where you are poking the ear. If you remove the cap, insert the lancet, you can use it that way. And remember your kitty has less nerve endings in their ears than you do in your fingers so kitty doesn't feel the poke nearly as much as you would in your finger.

Another little trick I found helpful for testing was to use a very thin skim of Vaseline on the spot where I intended to poke the ear. This causes the blood to bead up rather than spreading out into the fur which was an absolute must with my black kitty.

A diabetes diagnosis can be very overwhelming but once you get into a routine and get a bit more experience testing and understanding how Molly is responding to the insulin, it will get much much easier. We've all gone through a period of feeling confused and worried but that will gradually improve and you'll wonder why you thought this was going to be hard. You've got some great advice from Kris. Just take this one step at a time and you and Molly will be just fine.:D

I switched to the lancets freehand. The most difficult time I have at the moment is: I can't test her BG in the morning before her breakfast. She hears my alarm go off and she's meeting me at the bedroom door. I tried to test her this morning she won't sit still and lays her ears back. She wants her food. I posted on the FB page and someone had mentioned to test after she eats? I tested her yesterday afternoon and sang to her and it helped. But the blood wasn't coming out after I kept rubbing her ear where I poked her.
 
Can you feed Molly half or 3/4 of her usual meal, then test her? That way she gets part of what she wants and then will come to see the rest of her food as a treat for being a good girl. This is a common problem and as long as you test immediately after she finishes eating, any food influence in the numbers should be negligible.
Did you warm her ear? That helps. Don't rub the ear......rather massaging it from the head up toward the poked spot. As you test more, the ears will grow more capillaries and blood samples will be easier to get. You may also find that one ear bleeds better than the other.
 
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