Need help reading labs!

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Kathryn & Nugget

Member Since 2018
Hi everyone,

I just attached screenshots of Nugget's labs to her spreadsheet (on the JUNE/JULY LABS tab).

I need some help reading/understanding.

Basically my dilemma is that the vet today strongly recommended a blood transfusion to treat anemia brought on by kidney failure.

He also told me that her diabetes is now second to kidney failure and that I need to address anemia quickly, or we run the disk of further irreversible consequences.

I am quite frightened (and have been for the last 10 days), and I am feeling lost. I thought I finally had a handle on the diabetes, and now there's this whole kidney world that I am overwhelmed by.

Just looking for some advice, if anyone has been in the same place, or has experience reading labs, specifically in regards to anemia. I know HCT is hematocrit and Hb is hemoglobin and those are the important ones to look at in dealing with the anemia.

Thanks in advance.
 
Hi everyone,

I just attached screenshots of Nugget's labs to her spreadsheet (on the JUNE/JULY LABS tab).

I need some help reading/understanding.

Basically my dilemma is that the vet today strongly recommended a blood transfusion to treat anemia brought on by kidney failure.

He also told me that her diabetes is now second to kidney failure and that I need to address anemia quickly, or we run the disk of further irreversible consequences.

I am quite frightened (and have been for the last 10 days), and I am feeling lost. I thought I finally had a handle on the diabetes, and now there's this whole kidney world that I am overwhelmed by.

Just looking for some advice, if anyone has been in the same place, or has experience reading labs, specifically in regards to anemia. I know HCT is hematocrit and Hb is hemoglobin and those are the important ones to look at in dealing with the anemia.

Thanks in advance.
I can't see any info under the june/July tab
 
Under the regular lab tab I see some values. Looks like he's stage 4... Are you doing sub q's at home? I don't see the hct levels listed
 
I can't see any info under the june/July tab
They are all images of the labs- I don't know how to read them so I didn't want to start typing in numbers unless I was sure. I was just on the June/July tab, maybe that's why you couldn't see them? I closed out my spreadsheet just in case.
 
They are all images of the labs- I don't know how to read them so I didn't want to start typing in numbers unless I was sure. I was just on the June/July tab, maybe that's why you couldn't see them? I closed out my spreadsheet just in case.
Still can't see them. Maybe because I'm on a phone not computer. This is what it looks like.
FF786E5C-A03F-4D56-B625-36DF28F25AC2.png
 
Odd.. I just tried to fix it and I think I made it worse. Oops.

Thing is when you are adding the photo is adding a link not the actual photo and since we do not have access to your computer all we see is a broken link try just adding the photos to your post here in the tread or if you want to insert them in the spreadsheet you will have to use the paste special feature and paste them as an image
 
Thing is when you are adding the photo is adding a link not the actual photo and since we do not have access to your computer all we see is a broken link try just adding the photos to your post here in the tread or if you want to insert them in the spreadsheet you will have to use the paste special feature and paste them as an image
I used the insert function on Google Sheets to ensure they were in there properly, but for whatever reason it’s not working. I can try to upload them here as images.
 
It looks like you have everything on paper to begin with, is that correct?
Did anyone sit down with you and prioritize the results? There must be some that are inconsequential right at this time.
Can we upload a single page from Excel here? Not sure how that would appear on the screen.
When CJ was borderline anemic we got a lot of help from Google, fewer pop-ups and holistic mish-mash.
For Kathryn and Nugget. I don't want to clog up the thread.
Find your priorities. If Nugget's diabetes is under control for now focus on the rest and know that more help is coming with subQ's, diet etc. Big hugs :bighug:
...it's okay to cry as long as you remember we're all here. Eat right and try and get some solid sleep for yourself and Nugget. :)
 
In this results it does not appear the creatinine, BUN or SMDA how are they determining the kidney failure?

I'm not an expert but his electrolytes (sodium, calcium, potassium and chloride )do seem a little bit off but not terribly off is he getting IV fluids? If so what kind of fluids getting a lot of fluids can lower this numbers

I hope someone with a little bit more expertise in blood labs jumps in
 
In this results it does not appear the creatinine, BUN or SMDA how are they determining the kidney failure?

I'm not an expert but his electrolytes (sodium, calcium, potassium and chloride )do seem a little bit off but not terribly off is he getting IV fluids? If so what kind of fluids getting a lot of fluids can lower this numbers

I hope someone with a little bit more expertise in blood labs jumps in
She was on IV fluids 6/23-6/26, and then sub q at home, 100 ml, every day since then
 
It looks like you have everything on paper to begin with, is that correct?
Did anyone sit down with you and prioritize the results? There must be some that are inconsequential right at this time.
Can we upload a single page from Excel here? Not sure how that would appear on the screen.
When CJ was borderline anemic we got a lot of help from Google, fewer pop-ups and holistic mish-mash.
For Kathryn and Nugget. I don't want to clog up the thread.
Find your priorities. If Nugget's diabetes is under control for now focus on the rest and know that more help is coming with subQ's, diet etc. Big hugs :bighug:
...it's okay to cry as long as you remember we're all here. Eat right and try and get some solid sleep for yourself and Nugget. :)
Not being he has really sat down with me to explain, save for BUN and creatinine. They tell me she’s anemic, but not how bad it is, but apparently bad enough for a transfusion.

I am crying for sure. I wonder when it will stop. I look at her, I cry. I go to sleep, I cry. I wake up, I cry. I feed her, I cry. It’s tough.

The diabetes is sort of under control- it’s been hard because if she isn’t eating I am afraid to give her insulin. I don’t give her insulin, and BG shoots up.
 
Not being he has really sat down with me to explain, save for BUN and creatinine. They tell me she’s anemic, but not how bad it is, but apparently bad enough for a transfusion.

I am crying for sure. I wonder when it will stop. I look at her, I cry. I go to sleep, I cry. I wake up, I cry. I feed her, I cry. It’s tough.

The diabetes is sort of under control- it’s been hard because if she isn’t eating I am afraid to give her insulin. I don’t give her insulin, and BG shoots up.
That should have said No one has really sat down... sorry. I’m on my phone rather than computer, and the one drink I’ve had to try and mellow out (my deceased father’s bday is tomorrow, talk about emotional crap) is going right to my head.
 
You are not alone we are here for you

Doing transfusions is not something they can do easily were I live so vets down here have to take a maybe not so good approach to this problems down here and since he's at home getting subq we would probably try giving her b complex in the subq and probably some additional b12 methycolbalamine orally plus some other supplements including iron for a few days

This is just a thought for you to consider and also I would ask them to explain to me in detail what are the numbers they are using to give their assessment before taking any decisiĂłn
 
You are not alone we are here for you

Doing transfusions is not something they can do easily were I live so vets down here have to take a maybe not so good approach to this problems down here and since he's at home getting subq we would probably try giving her b complex in the subq and probably some additional b12 methycolbalamine orally plus some other supplements including iron for a few days
Do you think the vet at the hospital recommended the transfusion because it nets a nice profit for them? Or because he really thinks she needs it?

I have seen 7 vets since March- everyone tells me something different. I don’t know who to trust anymore... and I know vets are not like human medical doctors. But I should be able to find someone I trust.
 
Sorry I'm at my phone so I gave send by mistake

I'm not expert but none of his values seem terribly off and sometimes is not so much for profit but the easiest way so they do not consider other options.

Ask them if they couldn't do a transfusion (that's what happens here ) what would be the course of action
 
Kathryn, I thought it would be much easier to find a single sight that would explain blood panels, it's not.
You might see "CBC" in some searches, it means "complete blood count".
Wikihow wants me to download something, sounds sketchy, lots of pop-ups etc.
This is the best of what I looked through;
All feline hospital...Does not go into numerical values but does explain what each component does.
http://www.allfelinehospital.com/blood-work-explanation.pml
PetMD...A super slow sight, lots of ads. If you scroll to the bottom and click Next it goes to a different topic.
I have found PetMD helpful in really specific areas.
https://www.petmd.com/blogs/thedail...y-tests-tell-you-about-your-cats-health-30777#
This is PetMD's home page.
https://www.petmd.com/
If you're like me, a real visual learner I have to print things out and sit down with a hi-liter and post-it notes. If I click your profile now I'll lose all the above. Do you live in Ontario?
Post 13 and 14 showed up very well. That's all I have for now Kathryn. :bighug:
 
Specifically regarding anemia, there are two types, regenerative and non-regenerative. See link here for more info:

https://www.felinecrf.org/anaemia.htm

To me, an HCT value of 23 isn't great, but it's certainly not time for blood transfusion. My recollection is when HCT numbers get under 20, you can try Erythropoiesis Stimulating Agents (ESAs) first. For now I would suggest you try vitamin B supplements. Unfortunately, I can't share much there, my kitty with CRF and anemia dropped very quickly and I needed to go straight to Epogen, one of the types of ESAs.

There is a lot of other info on kidney disease in cats and you'll find info also on types of vitamin B supplements, at the website I referred you to...www.felinecfr.org.

I would definitely ask your vet about vitamin B, it can't hurt, some kitties improve with just the supplement.

BUN and creatinine are quite high in the latest labs. I see you have previous lab results in your SS, but with the new lab values, they will have different ranges than IDEXX, so don't compare the values, you need to refer back to the new lab ranges instead. That said, just a thought, any chance Nugget ate something toxic? That might spike kidney function values, I can't compare March 1st with June 26th, those Nova CXX ranges seem strange to me, not that I'm an expert, just have a bit of experience with my own kitties over the years.
 
A HCT of 24 shows your cat is anemic but not at the point that a transfusion is necessary. If it drops much more it would be time for epogen or Aranesp injections which you can do at home. Are you familiar with tanyascrf.org? It explains everything about kidney disease and how to treat conditions caused by it. With the high creatinine and BUN I wouldn’t be surprised if B vitamins and injections are needed. There’s lot you can do.

Start by reading this:

http://www.felinecrf.org/anaemia.htm

I had a cat with levels off the chart and she also had intestinal lymphoma. I used Tanya’s as a guide and she lived nearly a year of quality time before the cancer killed her, not the kidney disease.
 
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BTW, Tanya has a book version of her website that you can get on amazon. I know sometimes it's easier to read a hard copy when there's a lot of information.
 
Lots of cats with recurring UTI fare much better long term with water fountains / cleaner water. Just a thought so Nugget's situation doesn't get any more complicated.
This is from a drop down list in Google;
Is my cat in pain with kidney failure?
Although kidney failure itself may not be painful some symptoms do cause pain and discomfort. Nausea, gagging at the sight or smell of food, constipation and stomach irritation.
I have transdermal BUPE for Noah and have given it with a vet's blessing to my other cats with UTI or constipation. It just helps them not be so miserable.
 
@Ana and Frosty
Can you make sense of reading the blood work results posted above?
Ana is a brain surgeon everyone, she's just too modest to say so. :rolleyes:
Lmao. I’m not even A surgeon... I’m just the assistant haha

Let me catch up on all the posts first, as it’s a lot to read. Upon quick skim, it looks like they were doing a blood gas, rather than a normal metabolic panel and complete blood count . In humans, electrolyte values are calculated on a blood gas, rather than reflect an actual number (a close estimation, but not 100% accurate). I don’t know if that’s the same for animals. Perhaps @Janine & Floyd could weigh in? (She’s an actual vet).

I’ll look at it further and let you know what I think it all means.
 
Sorry I'm at my phone so I gave send by mistake

I'm not expert but none of his values seem terribly off and sometimes is not so much for profit but the easiest way so they do not consider other options.

Ask them if they couldn't do a transfusion (that's what happens here ) what would be the course of action
I called the hospital yesterday, but the receptionist said the doctor we are seeing was in the middle of an absolute emergency and that he probably wouldn't be able to get back to me yesterday. Today is a holiday, so hopefully I get an answer tomorrow.
 
Specifically regarding anemia, there are two types, regenerative and non-regenerative. See link here for more info:

https://www.felinecrf.org/anaemia.htm

To me, an HCT value of 23 isn't great, but it's certainly not time for blood transfusion. My recollection is when HCT numbers get under 20, you can try Erythropoiesis Stimulating Agents (ESAs) first. For now I would suggest you try vitamin B supplements. Unfortunately, I can't share much there, my kitty with CRF and anemia dropped very quickly and I needed to go straight to Epogen, one of the types of ESAs.

There is a lot of other info on kidney disease in cats and you'll find info also on types of vitamin B supplements, at the website I referred you to...www.felinecfr.org.

I would definitely ask your vet about vitamin B, it can't hurt, some kitties improve with just the supplement.

BUN and creatinine are quite high in the latest labs. I see you have previous lab results in your SS, but with the new lab values, they will have different ranges than IDEXX, so don't compare the values, you need to refer back to the new lab ranges instead. That said, just a thought, any chance Nugget ate something toxic? That might spike kidney function values, I can't compare March 1st with June 26th, those Nova CXX ranges seem strange to me, not that I'm an expert, just have a bit of experience with my own kitties over the years.

Good to know that I shouldn't compare the IDEXX to the Nova.

The hospital vet said that the ESAs are FAR more expensive than the transfusions, and that they don't always have success, in fact, some ESAs will kill cats. The more I think about this, the more I think maybe he was trying to scare me into a transfusion as the only option.

You know not one vet has asked if she could have eaten something toxic. The only thing I can thing of is that I caught her drinking out of the bathroom toilet- and I had one of those lysol bulbs on the side of the bowl to help with cleaning. I don't have any toxic plants in the house, she has no access to cleaning chemicals.
 
Kathryn, I thought it would be much easier to find a single sight that would explain blood panels, it's not.
You might see "CBC" in some searches, it means "complete blood count".
Wikihow wants me to download something, sounds sketchy, lots of pop-ups etc.
This is the best of what I looked through;
All feline hospital...Does not go into numerical values but does explain what each component does.
http://www.allfelinehospital.com/blood-work-explanation.pml
PetMD...A super slow sight, lots of ads. If you scroll to the bottom and click Next it goes to a different topic.
I have found PetMD helpful in really specific areas.
https://www.petmd.com/blogs/thedail...y-tests-tell-you-about-your-cats-health-30777#
This is PetMD's home page.
https://www.petmd.com/
If you're like me, a real visual learner I have to print things out and sit down with a hi-liter and post-it notes. If I click your profile now I'll lose all the above. Do you live in Ontario?
Post 13 and 14 showed up very well. That's all I have for now Kathryn. :bighug:

Thank you for the links... I am going to read them now. I think the hardest part of understanding the labs was knowing what all the "codes" mean. Obviously some I can figure out, but some I just don't know. I have a file folder with all her labs, receipts, etc. so I have been taking notes on everything I am reading. Nope, not Ontario, we are in NYC.
 
A HCT of 24 shows your cat is anemic but not at the point that a transfusion is necessary. If it drops much more it would be time for epogen or Aranesp injections which you can do at home. Are you familiar with tanyascrf.org? It explains everything about kidney disease and how to treat conditions caused by it. With the high creatinine and BUN I wouldn’t be surprised if B vitamins and injections are needed. There’s lot you can do.

Start by reading this:

http://www.felinecrf.org/anaemia.htm

I had a cat with levels off the chart and she also had intestinal lymphoma. I used Tanya’s as a guide and she lived nearly a year of quality time before the cancer killed her, not the kidney disease.
I've been reading everything on Tanya's website- she's amassed quite a bit of quality information. Just a lot to read and understand.

The vet said the injections would be far more expensive and dangerous than the transfusion, and the more I research, the more I see conflicting information that contradicts the vet's information.
 
Sorry guys, I meant to go to the pool and read all of this, but instead I fell asleep and just woke up.
I read through this and I understand what's going on. Major disclaimer though - I am not a vet, I take care of human patients, so this is just basically explanation of values. I cannot give you advice on what to do with your cat. I will tell you what I know of a cat who got a blood transfusion though at the end.

So like I said before, these are blood gasses - not sure if they're arterial or venous, but these are usually taken when a human patient is in the ICU, or sometimes for a faster set of results. That's why they look different than regular labs, and can seem confusing.
So first, I am going to explain the meaning of each set of labs from 6/24-6/26 and summarize what I think is going on based on these labs. I'll try to explain it the best I can.

So on 6/24, I see that his Ph is lower than normal. meaning his blood is slightly acidic. I also see that CO2 is low, which is an acid, which means that his body is trying to compensate for a low acidity. Bicarb (HCO3) is at the low end of normal, which is due to kidney failure, probably causing the low pH. (It is low after fluids are given, so it may be falsely elevated here? not sure). I think this is uncompensated metabolic acidosis. His sugar is also 150, so there's probably no ketones present. His oxygen saturation is 94%, which is OK. His Hemoglobin is 9. and hematocrit is 27. That is lower than the reference range, which could also be due to kidney failure - kidneys produce erythropoietin, which makes red blood cells (RBCs), and when they are not functioning well, they produce less of it. His potassium is also low on those labs, but other electrolytes are OK. This may be due to insulin administration, as it tends to drive potassium into the cells. Not too concerned about that, would be more concerned if it was high, as kidneys excrete potassium. BUN and Cr are pretty high, 118/8.4, but bear in mind that the cat's normal range is higher than that of a human, so it might look higher to me than it actually is.

6/25. His pH on this set of labs is still low, so he is still in metabolic acidosis. CO2 is at the low end of normal, so it is still not compensated. HCO3 is still at the low end of normal, which I think is causing the acidosis. After fluids were given, I see that H/H are even lower. This is probably due to dilution effect by the IV fluids, and 7.7 is pretty low for a human. I don't know what the threshold for a cat is for a transfusion, but for a human it's 7, if they are not actively bleeding.
Magnesium is high on this set of labs, which may be due to decreased excretion from kidneys. BUN an Cr are lower than the day before, because of the fluids given. Oxygen saturation in blood is 96.9%, which is good.

6/26 - so here we are still acidic with a lower CO2, and we see that bicarb is low at 14.7, and the body is trying to compensate for the low bicarb. his oxygen saturation on there is 88%, which is low. This is concerning, and could be due to a low H/H, or could just be variation in labs, since the previous 2 days O2 saturation was better. His hemoglobin is lowest here, 7.6/23, again lower because he was given fluids. BUN and Cr are lower too than before, due to fluids, although still higher than normal. So the fluids are working.

As for question of whether to give a transfusion - again, I do not know the transfusion threshold for cats. Based on his labs, it does look like he has kidney failure that is starting to affect his electrolyte excretion, hemoglobin production, and will eventually cause his blood oxygen saturation to go too low. I realize the cost, but I personally would probably do the transfusion if it were my cat. My friend's "miracle" kitty that I posted about a few posts back (probably in the Cushing's forum), got multiple blood transfusions which saved her life. The way we found out she was anemic was that she started having seizures from the low oxygen in the blood. I think her hemoglobin was 5 something at that time. She had some kind of autoimmune bone marrow issue, and is now in remission on medication (after a $6,000 workup which included a bone marrow biopsy. We are seriously crazy cat ladies over here). Of course we do not want to wait til the hemoglobin is that low to give a transfusion to your kitty, so it would be worthwhile asking your vet, or a vet on here what their transfusion threshold is.

Also, what was the reason the cat was in the hospital? What were his symptoms? Was he lethargic? Short of breath or tired with minimal activity? Those CAN be symptoms of anemia (but are not specific to it, either).

I hope this helps a little bit. Let me know what questions you have!
 
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Lmao. I’m not even A surgeon... I’m just the assistant haha

Let me catch up on all the posts first, as it’s a lot to read. Upon quick skim, it looks like they were doing a blood gas, rather than a normal metabolic panel and complete blood count . In humans, electrolyte values are calculated on a blood gas, rather than reflect an actual number (a close estimation, but not 100% accurate). I don’t know if that’s the same for animals. Perhaps @Janine & Floyd could weigh in? (She’s an actual vet).

I’ll look at it further and let you know what I think it all means.
Thanks Ana, I appreciate it. Nugget did have a CBC drawn on June 23 that was sent out to a lab for processing. All the other labs have been in hospital labs that were literally processed in a half hour. Would a CBC and metabolic panel be worth running?
 
Thanks Ana, I appreciate it. Nugget did have a CBC drawn on June 23 that was sent out to a lab for processing. All the other labs have been in hospital labs that were literally processed in a half hour. Would a CBC and metabolic panel be worth running?
I wouldn't. I think this is giving us enough information, it's just in a different format. Blood gasses are ran much faster than the CBC and all the others, and can be done in house, which is probably why they did it. Hope my novel helps ;)
 
I may be out of line here but I think you need a doctor you can trust and that will at least get back to you when you need something

You could in the mean time start giving her some B12 they did wonders for my cyvie ( non diabetic cat) when she was borderline anemic, this is the one I use https://www.vitacost.com/vitacost-vitamin-b-12-methylcobalamin-500-mcg-300-capsules this alone is going to help her a lot I give 250 mcg every 12 hours but given her numbers you could give her 1000 mcg ( that would be one capsule in the morning and one in the afteroon ) B12 is water soluble so what ever she doesn't use she will just get rid in the urine so is pretty safe to give ( you can just spread it on her food) and if she accepts you could give her some chicken harts pices in her food like in odd days , this will help her iron levels also with practically no risk
 
I may be out of line here but I think you need a doctor you can trust and that will at least get back to you when you need something

You could in the mean time start giving her some B12 they did wonders for my cyvie ( non diabetic cat) when she was borderline anemic, this is the one I use https://www.vitacost.com/vitacost-vitamin-b-12-methylcobalamin-500-mcg-300-capsules this alone is going to help her a lot I give 250 mcg every 12 hours but given her numbers you could give her 1000 mcg ( that would be one capsule in the morning and one in the afteroon ) B12 is water soluble so what ever she doesn't use she will just get rid in the urine so is pretty safe to give ( you can just spread it on her food) and if she accepts you could give her some chicken harts pices in her food like in odd days , this will help her iron levels also with practically no risk
This won't help. Anemia in kidney failure is caused by decreased erythropoetin production by the kidney, and has nothing to do with B12, folate, or even iron. Those stores are likely normal in the body. I would stay away from giving anything extra because the kidneys will have to excrete it, and the kidneys aren't functioning well. The last thing we want is vitamin toxicity.
 
Sorry guys, I meant to go to the pool and read all of this, but instead I fell asleep and just woke up.
I read through this and I understand what's going on. Major disclaimer though - I am not a vet, I take care of human patients, so this is just basically explanation of values. I cannot give you advice on what to do with your cat. I will tell you what I know of a cat who got a blood transfusion though at the end.

So like I said before, these are blood gasses - not sure if they're arterial or venous, but these are usually taken when a human patient is in the ICU, or sometimes for a faster set of results. That's why they look different than regular labs, and can seem confusing.
So first, I am going to explain the meaning of each set of labs from 6/24-6/26 and summarize what I think is going on based on these labs. I'll try to explain it the best I can.

So on 6/24, I see that his Ph is lower than normal. meaning his blood is slightly acidic. I also see that CO2 is low, which is an acid, which means that his body is trying to compensate for a low acidity. Bicarb (HCO3) is at the low end of normal, which is due to kidney failure, probably causing the low pH. (It is low after fluids are given, so it may be falsely elevated here? not sure). I think this is uncompensated metabolic acidosis. His sugar is also 150, so there's probably no ketones present. His oxygen saturation is 94%, which is OK. His Hemoglobin is 9. and hematocrit is 27. That is lower than the reference range, which could also be due to kidney failure - kidneys produce erythropoietin, which makes red blood cells (RBCs), and when they are not functioning well, they produce less of it. His potassium is also low on those labs, but other electrolytes are OK. This may be due to insulin administration, as it tends to drive potassium into the cells. Not too concerned about that, would be more concerned if it was high, as kidneys excrete potassium. BUN and Cr are pretty high, 118/8.4, but bear in mind that the cat's normal range is higher than that of a human, so it might look higher to me than it actually is.

6/25. His pH on this set of labs is still low, so he is still in metabolic acidosis. CO2 is at the low end of normal, so it is still not compensated. HCO3 is still at the low end of normal, which I think is causing the acidosis. After fluids were given, I see that H/H are even lower. This is probably due to dilution effect by the IV fluids, and 7.7 is pretty low for a human. I don't know what the threshold for a cat is for a transfusion, but for a human it's 7, if they are not actively bleeding.
Magnesium is high on this set of labs, which may be due to decreased excretion from kidneys. BUN an Cr are lower than the day before, because of the fluids given. Oxygen saturation in blood is 96.9%, which is good.

6/26 - so here we are still acidic with a lower CO2, and we see that bicarb is low at 14.7, and the body is trying to compensate for the low bicarb. his oxygen saturation on there is 88%, which is low. This is concerning, and could be due to a low H/H, or could just be variation in labs, since the previous 2 days O2 saturation was better. His hemoglobin is lowest here, 7.6/23, again lower because he was given fluids. BUN and Cr are lower too than before, due to fluids, although still higher than normal. So the fluids are working.

As for question of whether to give a transfusion - again, I do not know the transfusion threshold for cats. Based on his labs, it does look like he has kidney failure that is starting to affect his electrolyte excretion, hemoglobin production, and will eventually cause his blood oxygen saturation to go too low. I realize the cost, but I would probably do the transfusion. My friend's "miracle" kitty that I posted about a few posts back (probably in the Cushing's forum), got multiple blood transfusions. The way we found out she was anemic was that she started having seizures from the low oxygen. I think her hemoglobin was 5 something at that time. She had some kind of autoimmune bone marrow issue, and is now in remission on medication. Of course we do not want to wait that long to give a transfusion to your kitty, so it would be worthwhile asking your vet, or a vet on here what their transfusion threshold is.

Also, what was the reason the cat was in the hospital? What were his symptoms? Was he lethargic? Short of breath or tired with minimal activitY? Those CAN be symptoms of anemia (but are not specific to it, either).

I hope this helps a little bit. Let me know what questions you have!
Hi Ana, WOW do you know a lot! Thank you times a million for taking the time to explain all of that to me. I knew that IV fluids could affect things, but I didn't really understand how.

A quick recap of what landed us in the hospital:
3/1- diagnosed with diabetes by a regular veterinary practice
4/4- saw an internal medicine diabetic specialist at the AMC in NYC.
5/26- went for follow up at AMC, and to do a fructosamine. That night she started acting very odd- super lethargic, not really interested in food, blood sugar spiked (at least it was a spike for her, I've since been told it wasn't really that high). Emailed the IM doctor, she said to keep an eye, there wasn't much to be done unless symptoms persisted. She also told me the fructosamine was low, and it was a sign we might be headed into diabetic remission, to reduce insulin to one unit once a day. Symptoms persisted for 72 hours and I noticed a huge increase in water intake, but chalked this up to higher than normal blood sugar.
5/30-6/4- saw an improvement, less lethargic, better appetite.
6/9- appetite starts to decrease again, lethargy increasing, and is disinterested in a lot- won't play, but will still greet us at the door.
6/10- Something wasn't sitting right, so I made an appointment with a vet who only deals with cats.
6/15- we visit said vet. He thinks it is a virus, possibly feline herpes, possibly something picked up at the AMC. He prescribes anti-viral and appetite stimulant, gives her cerenia injection and sub q fluids in office- he weighs her and she is down almost a pound in 2.5 weeks. Says keep an eye- doesn't recommend running labs.
6/17- I call the vet and say I'm still worried, I don't see much improvement, and she's really struggling to eat. He says take her to ER if things get much worse, otherwise come back in.
6/23- I bring her back to the vet. The look on his face immediately tells me that something is wrong. He says her kidneys are huge, she is dangerously dehydrated, does an x-ray, notes spots on kidneys that he thinks are stones, temperature and blood pressure are normal, says to go to another emergency hospital so they can do an ultrasound.
6/23, one hour later- I get to the ER, and they take her in for what I thought was going to be in and out. They come back and say I cannot take her home, she must be admitted. Now I'm scared to death, so I let them admit her.
6/23-6/24- communication is basically IMPOSSIBLE. I'm told no doctor has examined her, but that the ultrasound showed "obliterated kidneys" and a cyst in the liver. I drive into the city during the Pride Parade, have to park 5 avenues and 5 blocks away from the hospital because I can't get any closer due to street closures, I walk in, demand the cat be released, and then proceed to walk back to the car and drive to an animal hospital in Westchester.
6/24- she is admitted for another 48 hours in the 2nd hosp, I get a lot more information and updates.
6/26- I bring her home, with daily antibiotics, daily famotodine, daily cerenia and sub q fluids.
6/27- We are back in the ER at 10PM because she was hypoglycemic. She gets two oral dextrose doses, and one IV dextrose. They want to keep her overnight, I say no (can't afford it).
6/28- She urinates all over the couch. She stays outside for a little while with my boyfriend, he brings her in, she pees all over the kitchen floor. I relocate to sleeping on the floor in the office/cat room with her. She has a bout of diarrhea that night. I'm convinced I will wake up to a dead cat.
6/29-7/2- some improvements (no more incontinence). Better appetite
7/3- incontinent again, on the couch, in the morning while I was asleep on the couch. Clean up couch again. Has another episode of incontinence in the evening.
7/4- appetite much better today- but still very lethargic. She is seeking my attention, wants to sit on my lap a lot.

So there's that!
 
@Kathryn & Nugget , WOW, you guys have been through a lot! I'm really sorry you had to go through that :bighug:
Where do you live? I lived in White Plains for 3 years. I used to take my (other) cats to the White Plains animal hospital, which I really liked. My family lives in Stamford, CT and they have "Just Cats" there which is also good. I know one NYC hospital, we took my friend's dog there when we were in PA school when he had a seizure. Unfortunately, turned out that his kidneys didn't develop normally (he was only 1 ) and he was in severe kidney failure, and we had to put him down. It was pretty traumatic. (She was here for school for AZ, she was 23 at the time and he was her only "family" here.)

It's hard to tell what is causing the symptoms exactly because they are not specific to any particular illness. It could be the kidney failure and dehydration. I agree with what someone said before, to find a vet that you feel comfortable with and can communicate easily with, and formulate a plan. The incontinence can be due to kidney issues, but at least she is peeing and pooping, which is a good thing I think. Are you continuing to give her fluids? I can't pretend to know much about kidney issues in cats (I'm a PA in general/colorectal surgery, so not even a kidney expert by any means). So I think the best thing would be to find a more affordable place where you can trust and communicate better with the vets.

I know transfusions are expensive. Did they give you a quote? Is it totally unaffordable?

I really hope things get better for you guys. Hugs!
 
Without airing dirty laundry, I need help.

I am scheduled to visit my grandma, out of state, for a week. Date of departure is less than a week away.

My SO (who won't be my SO should I go on this trip), is emotionally and physically unable to give her the fluids or medications.
He does not want me to bring Nugget with me.
He wants me to postpone the trip. He says I am SELFISH for going to see my grandma.

If I postpone, then when it comes up again, he will still be unable to give fluids, and the vicious circle will continue. He is not understanding the importance of these fluids.

I do not know what to do. There is so much arguing over this. I know I am not selfish... if I was, I wouldn't have done everything I could for this fur baby- he was in denial even about the diabetes- I took the cat by myself to a vet to see what was going on.

If he can't see everything that I have sacrificed and continue to sacrifice, I can't continue like this. What should I do? I want to go on my trip. I miss my grandma very, very much, I don't get to see her often, and as we all known, we never get enough time with the ones we love.

He said if she dies and I am not here it is my fault. My heart is just broken. Damned if I do, damned if I don't.
 
@Kathryn & Nugget , WOW, you guys have been through a lot! I'm really sorry you had to go through that :bighug:
Where do you live? I lived in White Plains for 3 years. I used to take my (other) cats to the White Plains animal hospital, which I really liked. My family lives in Stamford, CT and they have "Just Cats" there which is also good. I know one NYC hospital, we took my friend's dog there when we were in PA school when he had a seizure. Unfortunately, turned out that his kidneys didn't develop normally (he was only 1 ) and he was in severe kidney failure, and we had to put him down. It was pretty traumatic. (She was here for school for AZ, she was 23 at the time and he was her only "family" here.)

It's hard to tell what is causing the symptoms exactly because they are not specific to any particular illness. It could be the kidney failure and dehydration. I agree with what someone said before, to find a vet that you feel comfortable with and can communicate easily with, and formulate a plan. The incontinence can be due to kidney issues, but at least she is peeing and pooping, which is a good thing I think. Are you continuing to give her fluids? I can't pretend to know much about kidney issues in cats (I'm a PA in general/colorectal surgery, so not even a kidney expert by any means). So I think the best thing would be to find a more affordable place where you can trust and communicate better with the vets.

I know transfusions are expensive. Did they give you a quote? Is it totally unaffordable?

I really hope things get better for you guys. Hugs!
We live in the Bronx. We've been going to the animal hospital in Yonkers. (Prior to that it was a cat vet in Manhattan, the IM vet at AMC, and then I saw three other vets- one in Eastchester, one in Mamaroneck and one in Tuckahoe). I am continuing to give fluids- its someone else who claims to love this cat who can't do it. The quote for the transfusion was $1100... if I have to, I can swing it, it just won't be easy. I'm already in over $6k since March (plus what he spent, another $2000+).

I appreciate the hug... I need them pretty often these days.
 
I am sorry your SO is not supportive. Sometimes, when animals and/or family members are sick or are in need of our attention, it creates strain on relationships, and people do/say stupid things. Sounds like it might be one of those situations (on his part, not yours).

I think you need to go see your grandma. Can you get a pet sitter or someone who can administer fluids to the cat? We used "next door neighborhood" website/app to find our pet sitter, and now she introduced us to another one - a backup when she is not available. I am thrilled to have 2 pet sitters so I can go away and live my life.

Also, where do you live? Seems like it might be close to me.
 
We live in the Bronx. We've been going to the animal hospital in Yonkers. (Prior to that it was a cat vet in Manhattan, the IM vet at AMC, and then I saw three other vets- one in Eastchester, one in Mamaroneck and one in Tuckahoe). I am continuing to give fluids- its someone else who claims to love this cat who can't do it. The quote for the transfusion was $1100... if I have to, I can swing it, it just won't be easy. I'm already in over $6k since March (plus what he spent, another $2000+).

I appreciate the hug... I need them pretty often these days.
I went to Mercy College in the Bronx for PA school! Lots of fond memories. <3
 
I am sorry your SO is not supportive. Sometimes, when animals and/or family members are sick or are in need of our attention, it creates strain on relationships, and people do/say stupid things. Sounds like it might be one of those situations (on his part, not yours).

I think you need to go see your grandma. Can you get a pet sitter or someone who can administer fluids to the cat? We used "next door neighborhood" website/app to find our pet sitter, and now she introduced us to another one - a backup when she is not available. I am thrilled to have 2 pet sitters so I can go away and live my life.

Also, where do you live? Seems like it might be close to me.
We are definitely close by- I am about 15 minutes away from Mercy.

Unfortunately I don't have anyone who can administer the fluids and meds. I just wish he could step up and figure it out... even if he gives 150 ML every other day instead of 100 every day- it would only be Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday... and if every other day Thursday, Saturday and Monday.

I told him it was selfish of him to expect me to handle all of this on my own- I can give fluids without his help, and if I had to, I could give meds without his help. I definitely need to see my grandma. And sooner, rather than later, while the cat is as stable as she has been.
 
Did you start the b12 methylcobalamin yet? You can get them at a pharmacy, grocery store or vitamin shop
 
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