Need help switching to wet food

[JCL]

Hi everyone. I have a diabetic cat named Pumba who was adopted by my family in 2014 and he is currently about 12 years old. He came to us overweight at 18 lbs but didn't yet have diabetes until 2 years later. We had no idea how to properly care for an obese cat and so never thought that dry food would only worsen his health condition.

He's been on insulin until now and currently requires 3 units a day, with his insulin levels coming up to about 310-380 each time we home test him. We've gone through multiple vets and not one of them ever bought up dry food being an issue, which I'm not quite sure why since the vast majority of diabetic cat owners online always strongly recommend wet food. He's currently on Royal Canin's Feline Glycobalance and though initially that plus the insulin did help get him down to 14 lbs, he's stayed the same weight ever since, which I suppose isn't too healthy since 12 or 13 is supposed to be the normal weight.

I've tried to give him wet food in the past and I've used the tricks that I read up online about; continuously putting a can of wet food next to his dry food to slowly introduce him to it, mixing his dry food with wet, giving different kinds of wet food, and just straight up replacing dry food with wet food altogether. He never wants to touch the wet food as long as the dry food is there and if it isn't, he'll just walk away and sit until his dry food comes. Being diabetic, I know I can't stand to starve him for too long so I always have to give in. I do have a strong feeling that wet food can help him because a couple months back we had him in the pet clinic for 2 nights to treat his pancreatitis and the vet reported that his insulin levels were so low they never gave him insulin. All that time they fed him wet food and he was said to have ate it all. But once he got home, he refused to eat anymore of what they fed him and went back to his old ways.

If anyone thinks they have advice that will help out an extremely stubborn cat change his ways, please let me know. I desperately want him to go into remission and I think he can do it but the difficulty he's giving my family over all these medical expenses is really mentally stressing us all out. Thanks in advance for anyone who replies!

 

[Chris & China (GA)]

One option (while you continue trying to get him to eat canned) is a low carb dry like Dr. Elsey's Clean Protein (5% for chicken, 9% for salmon) or Young Again Zero (5%)

It's still not the best because it's still dry (and the more water you can get into a cat, the healthier it keeps their kidneys) but it's someplace to start for a hard core kibble addict.

Dr. Elsey's is available at Chewy.com.....Young Again is only available from their website.

Both are pricey, but most cats don't eat much because it's so dense in nutrients.

 

[FurBabiesMama]

Young Again Zero (5%)

Young Again Zero and Zero Mature have trace carbs, < 1%.
From their site:
"Our ZERO foods on average contain less than 1% starch/digestible carbohydrates. Caloric breakdown: 46% from Protein, 53% from Fat and 0.8% from starch. We only use animal protein, NO plant proteins."
But, be forewarned that their food has been known to cause runny poop!

I feel your pain because I had a tough time transitioning my girls from dry to wet. I went through several foods to find the ones they would eat any of at all. (The cat food database - link in my signature - was very helpful for finding foods that had appropriate carbs, protein, fat.. and even keeping the phosphorous in check.) Once I found a couple they would at least eat a little of (FF Classics Chicken Feast and Sheba Pate Savory Chicken) I still had to jump through hoops to get them to eat enough. I microwaved it a few seconds to warm it up. I started cooking chicken breast and bone broth and adding a little of those to their food. After they ate a few bites and acted like they were done, I would stir it and maybe add some water, and that would get their interest again for another bite or two. In the beginning, I HAD to sprinkle some dry food on their wet food, especially Mia's, or there was no way they were going to be interested. I used the Young Again Zero Mature so I would at least not be adding carbs, and at first, I would crush a little of it and sprinkle it across the entire top surface of the wet food. Eventually, I could just sprinkle a few whole kibbles on there, and that was enough to get them started. I was able to stop doing that for Willow LONG before I could stop doing it with Mia. Once they got used to the wet food (I think the texture difference is a big part of the challenge), I was able to switch to a wet food that I felt had better ingredients. I still add a little water and bone broth and microwave it then sprinkle a little shredded chicken on it.. that became my routine, and they like it, and it is good for them... and they are spoiled.

There is something to be said for letting them get a little hungry though. I am not suggesting anything near starving him, just not being so quick to revert back to a bowl of dry food when he acts like he will not eat. How often is he fed? What kind of insulin is he getting?

That Glycobalance dry food has a pretty high carb %. There was someone on here who was able to drop their cat's insulin dose in half once they switched off of that food. If you are going to proceed with a switch, be sure you are carefully monitoring glucose levels since the drop in carb intake could drop the glucose levels pretty drastically.

If you have not already seen it, Dr. Pierson's site has info on transitioning dry food addicts: https://catinfo.org/docs/TipsForTransitioning1-14-11.pdf

 

[JCL]

One option (while you continue trying to get him to eat canned) is a low carb dry like Dr. Elsey's Clean Protein (5% for chicken, 9% for salmon) or Young Again Zero (5%)

It's still not the best because it's still dry (and the more water you can get into a cat, the healthier it keeps their kidneys) but it's someplace to start for a hard core kibble addict.

Dr. Elsey's is available at Chewy.com.....Young Again is only available from their website.

Both are pricey, but most cats don't eat much because it's so dense in nutrients.

Thank you for those recommendations, I think when we can manage to start with the 2 lb bag of Dr. Elsey's just to see if Pumba will like it. If not, perhaps we'll give Young Again Zero a try but the price is definitely something to think about.

 

[JCL]

Young Again Zero and Zero Mature have trace carbs, < 1%.
From their site:
"Our ZERO foods on average contain less than 1% starch/digestible carbohydrates. Caloric breakdown: 46% from Protein, 53% from Fat and 0.8% from starch. We only use animal protein, NO plant proteins."
But, be forewarned that their food has been known to cause runny poop!

I feel your pain because I had a tough time transitioning my girls from dry to wet. I went through several foods to find the ones they would eat any of at all. (The cat food database - link in my signature - was very helpful for finding foods that had appropriate carbs, protein, fat.. and even keeping the phosphorous in check.) Once I found a couple they would at least eat a little of (FF Classics Chicken Feast and Sheba Pate Savory Chicken) I still had to jump through hoops to get them to eat enough. I microwaved it a few seconds to warm it up. I started cooking chicken breast and bone broth and adding a little of those to their food. After they ate a few bites and acted like they were done, I would stir it and maybe add some water, and that would get their interest again for another bite or two. In the beginning, I HAD to sprinkle some dry food on their wet food, especially Mia's, or there was no way they were going to be interested. I used the Young Again Zero Mature so I would at least not be adding carbs, and at first, I would crush a little of it and sprinkle it across the entire top surface of the wet food. Eventually, I could just sprinkle a few whole kibbles on there, and that was enough to get them started. I was able to stop doing that for Willow LONG before I could stop doing it with Mia. Once they got used to the wet food (I think the texture difference is a big part of the challenge), I was able to switch to a wet food that I felt had better ingredients. I still add a little water and bone broth and microwave it then sprinkle a little shredded chicken on it.. that became my routine, and they like it, and it is good for them... and they are spoiled.

There is something to be said for letting them get a little hungry though. I am not suggesting anything near starving him, just not being so quick to revert back to a bowl of dry food when he acts like he will not eat. How often is he fed? What kind of insulin is he getting?

That Glycobalance dry food has a pretty high carb %. There was someone on here who was able to drop their cat's insulin dose in half once they switched off of that food. If you are going to proceed with a switch, be sure you are carefully monitoring glucose levels since the drop in carb intake could drop the glucose levels pretty drastically.

If you have not already seen it, Dr. Pierson's site has info on transitioning dry food addicts: https://catinfo.org/docs/TipsForTransitioning1-14-11.pdf

It's hard to say how often he's fed. We put out about 3/4 of a cup for him in the morning which he's almost done with once we get back from work in the afternoon. Then we'd give him another 3/4 cup and at 10 PM we fill his bowl up halfway because if not he'd incessantly meow throughout the night if he can't find more food. He had been free feeding since we got him so he's still got a habit of eating a little bit at a time which is why we leave out the bowls but we try not to give him more than necessary unless it's night time. What can we do about him complaining throughout the night though? There's only so much meowing we can endure before we decide it's not worth losing sleep over. How long would you say we can let him stay hungry?

Did your cats eat all their dry food in one go before? And how did you handle having to spend all the money on different wet foods and how did you deal with having to throw away those that they didn't eat?

Regarding the insulin, he's on ProZinc. I forgot to mention that he's getting 3 units twice a day.

 

[FurBabiesMama]

It's hard to say how often he's fed. We put out about 3/4 of a cup for him in the morning which he's almost done with once we get back from work in the afternoon. Then we'd give him another 3/4 cup and at 10 PM we fill his bowl up halfway because if not he'd incessantly meow throughout the night if he can't find more food. He had been free feeding since we got him so he's still got a habit of eating a little bit at a time which is why we leave out the bowls but we try not to give him more than necessary unless it's night time. What can we do about him complaining throughout the night though? There's only so much meowing we can endure before we decide it's not worth losing sleep over. How long would you say we can let him stay hungry?

Did your cats eat all their dry food in one go before? And how did you handle having to spend all the money on different wet foods and how did you deal with having to throw away those that they didn't eat?

Regarding the insulin, he's on ProZinc. I forgot to mention that he's getting 3 units twice a day.

Previously, my girls had a bowl of dry food that they grazed on whenever they wanted. Now, I feed them wet food 4 times a day - 6am/pm and 12am/pm. A lot of people use auto-feeders to do similar. Whatever they do not eat right away is left out for them to graze on just like they used to do on their dry food. When you are doing blood glucose testing, it is best if they do not have access to food for two hours before your pre-shot glucose test so that the test results will not be impacted by food, but other than that window of time, grazing is okay.

When I was trying foods, I would just start with one can of something. If they responded to it at all, I would try another can or two. I never bought much quantity until I knew it was something they would actually eat. I did throw away a lot of food in the process, but it was just a necessary evil. The cost was not an issue for me, but I know that it is for many people who go through this. If you are trying out the lower priced options, that certainly helps.

3 units is a pretty big dose of ProZinc. I would not be surprised if getting rid of the high-carb dry food reduced the needed dose. Dry food also has more calories than wet, so switching would help with Pumba's weight. By the way, according to the manufacturer of the Glycobalance, your cat should not be getting more than 5/8 a cup of it in a day based on what you said his healthy weight should be. It sounds like he is getting much more than that. So, again, please be sure that you are home and able to monitor if/when you take away the dry and give wet. With such a drastic change in the carbs he is getting, his glucose could drop considerably. So, I would not want to even attempt to give any advice on how long to allow him to get hungry or on leaving him alone with only wet food while he is on this much insulin. You really have to be prepared for a possible glucose drop.

If you want to really get the most benefit out of this site, please take a few minutes to add a signature and set up a spreadsheet. Your signature can include info such as when he was diagnosed, what insulin he is on, what he eats, etc. That keeps us from having to ask about the same things every time you post. It should also include a link to your spreadsheet. The spreadsheet is a wonderful tool for recording glucose test results and insulin doses given, as well as any notes about things you want to remember or track. I cannot imagine managing this without it. There is a ProZinc forum where you can post if you ever want advice related to dosing or other insulin-specific things.

Links about signature and spreadsheet:
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/editing-your-signature-profile-and-preferences.130340/
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/understanding-the-spreadsheet-grid.156606/

 

[JCL]

Previously, my girls had a bowl of dry food that they grazed on whenever they wanted. Now, I feed them wet food 4 times a day - 6am/pm and 12am/pm. A lot of people use auto-feeders to do similar. Whatever they do not eat right away is left out for them to graze on just like they used to do on their dry food. When you are doing blood glucose testing, it is best if they do not have access to food for two hours before your pre-shot glucose test so that the test results will not be impacted by food, but other than that window of time, grazing is okay.

When I was trying foods, I would just start with one can of something. If they responded to it at all, I would try another can or two. I never bought much quantity until I knew it was something they would actually eat. I did throw away a lot of food in the process, but it was just a necessary evil. The cost was not an issue for me, but I know that it is for many people who go through this. If you are trying out the lower priced options, that certainly helps.

3 units is a pretty big dose of ProZinc. I would not be surprised if getting rid of the high-carb dry food reduced the needed dose. Dry food also has more calories than wet, so switching would help with Pumba's weight. By the way, according to the manufacturer of the Glycobalance, your cat should not be getting more than 5/8 a cup of it in a day based on what you said his healthy weight should be. It sounds like he is getting much more than that. So, again, please be sure that you are home and able to monitor if/when you take away the dry and give wet. With such a drastic change in the carbs he is getting, his glucose could drop considerably. So, I would not want to even attempt to give any advice on how long to allow him to get hungry or on leaving him alone with only wet food while he is on this much insulin. You really have to be prepared for a possible glucose drop.

If you want to really get the most benefit out of this site, please take a few minutes to add a signature and set up a spreadsheet. Your signature can include info such as when he was diagnosed, what insulin he is on, what he eats, etc. That keeps us from having to ask about the same things every time you post. It should also include a link to your spreadsheet. The spreadsheet is a wonderful tool for recording glucose test results and insulin doses given, as well as any notes about things you want to remember or track. I cannot imagine managing this without it. There is a ProZinc forum where you can post if you ever want advice related to dosing or other insulin-specific things.

Links about signature and spreadsheet:
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/editing-your-signature-profile-and-preferences.130340/
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/fdmb-spreadsheet-instructions.130337/
http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/understanding-the-spreadsheet-grid.156606/

Thanks for the suggestions, I've created the spreadsheet and edited my signature. In regards to testing, would you recommend testing every day even if Pumba doesn't eat wet food?

If leaving the wet food out, how long would you leave it before you throw it out? There's an issue we have with storing the wet food we buy because we're not sure for how long it can be in the fridge for after being opened before it expires.

And I realized we were giving him more food than necessary but thinking about it, 5/8 cups split into 2-3 meals a day equals barely anything at each meal. When we try to give him the correct amounts, it stresses everyone out because he complains incessantly and we have to try to ignore it. Those times we did try giving him wet food but he'd rather wait for his dry food than try anything new. With the current amounts we've been feeding him, he's stayed at a somewhat constant BG level so if it's not hurting him we didn't want to force the restriction on him. However we also know we want to decrease his BG levels so occasionally we'll try to get back onto this. I know what we're doing isn't what's best for him but it's hard to not give into him because otherwise he's a really calm and sweet cat. I'm planning to buy some wet food this weekend and try it out with him while following the feeding directions. We've just been down this road so many times that it gets exhausting, that's all

 

[PiePie]

Thanks for the suggestions, I've created the spreadsheet and edited my signature. In regards to testing, would you recommend testing every day even if Pumba doesn't eat wet food?

If leaving the wet food out, how long would you leave it before you throw it out? There's an issue we have with storing the wet food we buy because we're not sure for how long it can be in the fridge for after being opened before it expires.

And I realized we were giving him more food than necessary but thinking about it, 5/8 cups split into 2-3 meals a day equals barely anything at each meal. When we try to give him the correct amounts, it stresses everyone out because he complains incessantly and we have to try to ignore it. Those times we did try giving him wet food but he'd rather wait for his dry food than try anything new. With the current amounts we've been feeding him, he's stayed at a somewhat constant BG level so if it's not hurting him we didn't want to force the restriction on him. However we also know we want to decrease his BG levels so occasionally we'll try to get back onto this. I know what we're doing isn't what's best for him but it's hard to not give into him because otherwise he's a really calm and sweet cat. I'm planning to buy some wet food this weekend and try it out with him while following the feeding directions. We've just been down this road so many times that it gets exhausting, that's all

Can you try using smaller cans if you're concerned about keeping it? I would think it would last about 3 days in the fridge. I feed my cats at 6am and 6pm. They come back and eat the food from the morning in the afternoon and don't seem to have any issues, it seems fine to leave it out.

 

[FurBabiesMama]

In regards to testing, would you recommend testing every day even if Pumba doesn't eat wet food?

Yes, I would. Getting a test in before every shot allows you to make sure his glucose is high enough to warrant the insulin dose. If he is unexpectedly lower than normal and you give him that big dose of insulin, it could be dangerous. Just like a person would not give themselves or their child insulin without knowing their glucose level, you will find that most of us here never give a shot without testing first. Getting mid-cycle tests, when possible, is how you know what impact the insulin dose is having. How is his dosing currently being determined? Do you go to a vet periodically for fructosamine tests or curves? If you test regularly at home, you do not have to do that (which saves vet visit stress and $$$).

If leaving the wet food out, how long would you leave it before you throw it out? There's an issue we have with storing the wet food we buy because we're not sure for how long it can be in the fridge for after being opened before it expires.

It can be left out a long time in an air conditioned home. Mine is never left out more than 6 hours, but I have seen people on here mention leaving theirs out 8 or even 12 hours. Some people freeze some and leave that out when they need it to be able to last longer. I get the small cans. I never have to put any in the refrigerator; however, I would think it would be fine in there for a few days.

And I realized we were giving him more food than necessary but thinking about it, 5/8 cups split into 2-3 meals a day equals barely anything at each meal.

That is because the calorie density is so high. Being overweight is not good for a diabetic (or any of us ), nor is getting SO many carbs. If you could get him on wet food, he could have so much more food yet stay within the calories it is healthy for him to have.

With the current amounts we've been feeding him, he's stayed at a somewhat constant BG level so if it's not hurting him we didn't want to force the restriction on him. However we also know we want to decrease his BG levels so occasionally we'll try to get back onto this. I know what we're doing isn't what's best for him but it's hard to not give into him because otherwise he's a really calm and sweet cat. I'm planning to buy some wet food this weekend and try it out with him while following the feeding directions. We've just been down this road so many times that it gets exhausting, that's all

I do not know what his 'constant BG level' is. You mentioned him getting into the 300s but I do not know if that is just at pre-shot time or if he is actually that high at other times or what. I am assuming you are not happy with the levels though since you said you want them to decrease. Lowering his carb intake really will help with that. He is also on a rather high dose, so I am sure you want to see that go down. As far as giving into him because he is a 'calm and sweet cat'. Maybe try thinking of it this way, it is like having a child who wants potato chips, candy and donuts all the time instead of healthy food. Do you allow it to keep them 'calm and sweet' or do you work through the challenges to see that they learn to eat healthy food since you know it is so much better for them? I know it is not easy, I promise you I got so frustrated during the transition. Sometimes, I did not think it would ever work, but I stuck to it, and it did. I feel so great that it is behind us... and my babies are very calm and sweet and love me very much.. they are no worse for having been through it. If you have not read catinfo.org yet, you may want to. What she says about dry food may give you added motivation.

In the end, it is really up to you. So, please do not take anything I have said as trying to boss you around or condemn your choices. We each get to decide what our goals are with our cats and what we feel is the best way to get there.

 

[JanetNJ]

Both companies will send a free sample

 

[Veronica & Babu-chiri]

Did your cats eat all their dry food in one go before? And how did you handle having to spend all the money on different wet foods and how did you deal with having to throw away those that they didn't eat?

My cats never ate all their food in one go, not when they were on dry and they still don't they are grazers all the way so I pretty much serve about one tablespoon at a time still they won't finish that all at once but after a few turns they eat it and I leave them some more before I leave the house and I have a time feeder that will open mid day , with this sistem there's wet food pretty much out all the time and the food can be there sometimes for hours without it getting spoiled usually the problem is it gets dry and then they won't eat it, I keep the rest on the frigdge also for 3-4 days and is ok too.

Even now I still have to throw away some food with a lot of remorse actually for the waste but that's why I try not to serve to much at once so that then I don't have throw away much

Keep trying, one of my cyvies (non-diabetic cat) stubbornly refused to eat the wet food for months and just suddenly out of the blue on her own one day she started eating from the others food and never again wanted the dry

 

[Veronica & Babu-chiri]

In regards to testing, would you recommend testing every day even if Pumba doesn't eat wet food?

Regardless what you are feeding him the only way to make sure is safe to give him a shot of insulin specially a high one like the one you are giving is by testing before every shot, so you need to test at least twice a day, after that if you can get some mid day tests that will help you see how he's doing during the day and help adjusting his dose so it would be very good or doing a curve once a week besides the pre shot testing

 

[JCL]

Can you try using smaller cans if you're concerned about keeping it? I would think it would last about 3 days in the fridge. I feed my cats at 6am and 6pm. They come back and eat the food from the morning in the afternoon and don't seem to have any issues, it seems fine to leave it out.

I'm aiming to buy 3 oz cans since they're the smallest I can get I think. Does the wet food get dry if you leave it out for a couple of hours? I'd like to also ask what kind of wet food do you feed them, like paté, chunky, strips etc?

 

[JCL]

Yes, I would. Getting a test in before every shot allows you to make sure his glucose is high enough to warrant the insulin dose. If he is unexpectedly lower than normal and you give him that big dose of insulin, it could be dangerous. Just like a person would not give themselves or their child insulin without knowing their glucose level, you will find that most of us here never give a shot without testing first. Getting mid-cycle tests, when possible, is how you know what impact the insulin dose is having. How is his dosing currently being determined? Do you go to a vet periodically for fructosamine tests or curves? If you test regularly at home, you do not have to do that (which saves vet visit stress and $$$).


It can be left out a long time in an air conditioned home. Mine is never left out more than 6 hours, but I have seen people on here mention leaving theirs out 8 or even 12 hours. Some people freeze some and leave that out when they need it to be able to last longer. I get the small cans. I never have to put any in the refrigerator; however, I would think it would be fine in there for a few days.


That is because the calorie density is so high. Being overweight is not good for a diabetic (or any of us ), nor is getting SO many carbs. If you could get him on wet food, he could have so much more food yet stay within the calories it is healthy for him to have.


I do not know what his 'constant BG level' is. You mentioned him getting into the 300s but I do not know if that is just at pre-shot time or if he is actually that high at other times or what. I am assuming you are not happy with the levels though since you said you want them to decrease. Lowering his carb intake really will help with that. He is also on a rather high dose, so I am sure you want to see that go down. As far as giving into him because he is a 'calm and sweet cat'. Maybe try thinking of it this way, it is like having a child who wants potato chips, candy and donuts all the time instead of healthy food. Do you allow it to keep them 'calm and sweet' or do you work through the challenges to see that they learn to eat healthy food since you know it is so much better for them? I know it is not easy, I promise you I got so frustrated during the transition. Sometimes, I did not think it would ever work, but I stuck to it, and it did. I feel so great that it is behind us... and my babies are very calm and sweet and love me very much.. they are no worse for having been through it. If you have not read catinfo.org yet, you may want to. What she says about dry food may give you added motivation.

In the end, it is really up to you. So, please do not take anything I have said as trying to boss you around or condemn your choices. We each get to decide what our goals are with our cats and what we feel is the best way to get there.

I'd done testing once a week, usually on Saturday or Sunday about 6-7 hours after his morning shot. Because the figures I got were in the 300 range, I considered that to be consistent if nothing else. A main concern of mine for when I start to test daily is Pumba's ears since I always use them for testing. I know the pricking of the lancet doesn't hurt but there's always a dark red mark of some kind on the pierced area afterwards. Is there any other places on him I can test on alternatively?

If I were handling a kid, I honestly think I'd have less of a hard time because they can actually communicate verbally with you And I'd like you to know that I appreciate you sticking around to answer my constant barrage of questions. I don't know anyone else dealing with a diabetic cat so to be able to converse with a bunch of people who have experience with this is just what I am looking for.

 

[Chris & China (GA)]

Most of us add extra water to the canned food to help keep it from drying out, but it's also fine to leave it out all day.

If you can swing it, an auto feeder like the PetSafe 5 is great to have because it helps keep the food fresh and you can program it to open and offer food when you want it too

You can get low carb foods in lots of forms....Check this FOOD CHART for foods under 10% carbs

 

[Chris & China (GA)]

there's always a dark red mark of some kind on the pierced area afterwards.

Make sure you apply a little pressure for 10 seconds or so to help prevent bruising....also, a little Neosporin with pain relief ointment can help heal up those little pokes quickly

 

[JCL]

My cats never ate all their food in one go, not when they were on dry and they still don't they are grazers all the way so I pretty much serve about one tablespoon at a time still they won't finish that all at once but after a few turns they eat it and I leave them some more before I leave the house and I have a time feeder that will open mid day , with this sistem there's wet food pretty much out all the time and the food can be there sometimes for hours without it getting spoiled usually the problem is it gets dry and then they won't eat it, I keep the rest on the frigdge also for 3-4 days and is ok too.

Even now I still have to throw away some food with a lot of remorse actually for the waste but that's why I try not to serve to much at once so that then I don't have throw away much

Keep trying, one of my cyvies (non-diabetic cat) stubbornly refused to eat the wet food for months and just suddenly out of the blue on her own one day she started eating from the others food and never again wanted the dry

Would you mind telling me what kind of timed feeder do you use for the wet food? I rarely see or hear about feeders like that but it sounds quite handy for the future. Also, how long did it take you to switch them to wet food?

I took a look at your spreadsheet and even though it's quite late for it, still wanted to say congrats on getting your Babu-chiri OTJ. I saw that you gave him a very small amount of insulin throughout the process and gradually increased despite the different AMPS. Was he eating wet food during this whole time and what would you attribute his improvement (3/30 and after) to?

 

[JCL]

Most of us add extra water to the canned food to help keep it from drying out, but it's also fine to leave it out all day.

If you can swing it, an auto feeder like the PetSafe 5 is great to have because it helps keep the food fresh and you can program it to open and offer food when you want it too

You can get low carb foods in lots of forms....Check this FOOD CHART for foods under 10% carbs

Thanks for telling me about PetSafe 5, it's definitely something to consider buying. I noticed on Amazon that it stores "semi-moist" food so I'm guessing foods that need water or gravy wouldn't fare too well? Have you tried out different kinds of wet food to see how they stood up?

Thanks also for the chart,it should be helpful for narrowing down my shopping list for the weekend. I looked at your spreadsheet and I was curious as to what made you put China back on insulin after being OTJ? She seems to be doing quite well lately.

 

[FurBabiesMama]

I'd done testing once a week, usually on Saturday or Sunday about 6-7 hours.. after his morning shot. Because the figures I got were in the 300 range, I considered that to be consistent if nothing else. A main concern of mine for when I start to test daily is Pumba's ears since I always use them for testing. I know the pricking of the lancet doesn't hurt but there's always a dark red mark of some kind on the pierced area afterwards. Is there any other places on him I can test on alternatively?

If I were handling a kid, I honestly think I'd have less of a hard time because they can actually communicate verbally with you And I'd like you to know that I appreciate you sticking around to answer my constant barrage of questions. I don't know anyone else dealing with a diabetic cat so to be able to converse with a bunch of people who have experience with this is just what I am looking for.

Testing just once a week really does not give you anywhere near enough information. He could either be staying too high all the time (300s are too high!), or he could actually be going too low then 'bouncing' up high because his body is reacting. I always test with Mia's ears. In fact, she does not like me to use one of them, so it very rarely is used...meaning one ear takes the brunt of the testing. If you warm the ear before poking, it should bleed easier, so one little poke should do it. Then, like Chris said, apply light pressure for a few seconds. You can also apply a little Neosporin occasionally if you think it seems irritated. Personally, I do not use the kind with pain medicine in it because of some things I have read about that, but a lot of people here do. Someone posted a picture of their cats ear the other day saying it had been poked over 8000 times (they had been at this a long time), but the ear looked just fine.

Yeah, children sure can communicate verbally with you. They can wail and cry and scream at you about how they don't want to eat those vegetables, they want cake... and you are mean, and you are torturing them...I think that might be worse than persistent meowing.

 

[JCL]

Testing just once a week really does not give you anywhere near enough information. He could either be staying too high all the time (300s are too high!), or he could actually be going too low then 'bouncing' up high because his body is reacting. I always test with Mia's ears. In fact, she does not like me to use one of them, so it very rarely is used...meaning one ear takes the brunt of the testing. If you warm the ear before poking, it should bleed easier, so one little poke should do it. Then, like Chris said, apply light pressure for a few seconds. You can also apply a little Neosporin occasionally if you think it seems irritated. Personally, I do not use the kind with pain medicine in it because of some things I have read about that, but a lot of people here do. Someone posted a picture of their cats ear the other day saying it had been poked over 8000 times (they had been at this a long time), but the ear looked just fine.

Yeah, children sure can communicate verbally with you. They can wail and cry and scream at you about how they don't want to eat those vegetables, they want cake... and you are mean, and you are torturing them...I think that might be worse than persistent meowing.

I've updated the spreadsheet for today and I can see why you were confused earlier about my "constant" numbers. I had no idea Pumba's BG level would be so high before the shot. I was out for most of the day so I didn't do as many tests in between as I could have. I did get him to eat a very tiny amount of wet food that I found stashed away, Purina chunky chicken, but that wasn't without some tricks. There wasn't much dry food left in his bowl so I bought the wet food out (have to puree it for him because he doesn't know how to chew on it and only licks) and he didn't touch it, as expected. He stopped eating after a couple of minutes and walked away so I took the wet food to him and a handful of dry food. I dropped a piece of the dry food to see if he still wanted it and he did so after a couple more drops on the ground, I began dropping them into the wet food. In the process of trying to get to the dry food, he managed to lick up some of the wet food so I think that's a start, right? Definitely wouldn't say he's into the wet food yet though. I'll try the other brands I bought tomorrow and see what happens.

 

[JanetNJ]

I've updated the spreadsheet for today and I can see why you were confused earlier about my "constant" numbers. I had no idea Pumba's BG level would be so high before the shot. I was out for most of the day so I didn't do as many tests in between as I could have. I did get him to eat a very tiny amount of wet food that I found stashed away, Purina chunky chicken, but that wasn't without some tricks. There wasn't much dry food left in his bowl so I bought the wet food out (have to puree it for him because he doesn't know how to chew on it and only licks) and he didn't touch it, as expected. He stopped eating after a couple of minutes and walked away so I took the wet food to him and a handful of dry food. I dropped a piece of the dry food to see if he still wanted it and he did so after a couple more drops on the ground, I began dropping them into the wet food. In the process of trying to get to the dry food, he managed to lick up some of the wet food so I think that's a start, right? Definitely wouldn't say he's into the wet food yet though. I'll try the other brands I bought tomorrow and see what happens.

If you get some FortiFlora on top that might entice him too. It's a probiotic that they flavor with the same stuff that makes dry food so addictive. Lol

 

[FurBabiesMama]

I've updated the spreadsheet for today and I can see why you were confused earlier about my "constant" numbers. I had no idea Pumba's BG level would be so high before the shot. I was out for most of the day so I didn't do as many tests in between as I could have. I did get him to eat a very tiny amount of wet food that I found stashed away, Purina chunky chicken, but that wasn't without some tricks. There wasn't much dry food left in his bowl so I bought the wet food out (have to puree it for him because he doesn't know how to chew on it and only licks) and he didn't touch it, as expected. He stopped eating after a couple of minutes and walked away so I took the wet food to him and a handful of dry food. I dropped a piece of the dry food to see if he still wanted it and he did so after a couple more drops on the ground, I began dropping them into the wet food. In the process of trying to get to the dry food, he managed to lick up some of the wet food so I think that's a start, right? Definitely wouldn't say he's into the wet food yet though. I'll try the other brands I bought tomorrow and see what happens.

More regular testing is going to really give you a clearer picture of what is going on. Glad to see you jump right in on it! Based on the few test you have logged so far, he is staying really high. So, be careful as you start taking away his carbs. The carbs could be contributing to those high numbers, so his numbers could drop a lot. That is ultimately a good thing, of course, but it may impact the amount of insulin he needs.

Putting the dry on top of the wet so that they cannot help but get some of the wet in the process of getting the dry is exactly how I was able to get my girls started on wet. If his only option to get his dry food is in wet, he is going to go for it. If you add water to the wet and mix it up so that is very soupy, that may help, too. My girls would be picking the dry food out of the 'soup', and I would start hearing the slurpy sound of them lapping up the soup, too. They still love really soupy food.

I am excited to see how this journey goes! You can do it.

 

[JCL]

If you get some FortiFlora on top that might entice him too. It's a probiotic that they flavor with the same stuff that makes dry food so addictive. Lol

Yes I'm planning to buy that soon. Have you bought it and tried it before? If so, may I ask where you buy yours from?

 

[JCL]

More regular testing is going to really give you a clearer picture of what is going on. Glad to see you jump right in on it! Based on the few test you have logged so far, he is staying really high. So, be careful as you start taking away his carbs. The carbs could be contributing to those high numbers, so his numbers could drop a lot. That is ultimately a good thing, of course, but it may impact the amount of insulin he needs.

Putting the dry on top of the wet so that they cannot help but get some of the wet in the process of getting the dry is exactly how I was able to get my girls started on wet. If his only option to get his dry food is in wet, he is going to go for it. If you add water to the wet and mix it up so that is very soupy, that may help, too. My girls would be picking the dry food out of the 'soup', and I would start hearing the slurpy sound of them lapping up the soup, too. They still love really soupy food.

I am excited to see how this journey goes! You can do it.

My vet instructed me to give 2 units if he's under 300 so if he's still under 300 by the time I get his PMPS I'll go for that. I was able to get him to lick just a little more of the wet food with the same method around midnight combined with a couple pieces of his dry food. He seemed to lost interest after a few minutes and started wandering away to find someone else who would hopefully give him a bowl of dry food. I'm planning to try again later in the day but he catches on fast so not sure how long this trick will hold up. Did your girls eventually eat more of the wet food as time went on?

 

[FurBabiesMama]

Did your girls eventually eat more of the wet food as time went on?

Yes. The only dry food they got was the little bit I sprinkled over their wet food - so there were no other options. As time went on, they ate more and more of the wet food.

 

[JanetNJ]

Yes I'm planning to buy that soon. Have you bought it and tried it before? If so, may I ask where you buy yours from?

I have gotten it from Amazon and from Adwdiabetes.com (with a10% off code missu10

I use it every day for my one underweight cat that barely eats (I think she has a poor sense of smell).

 

[JCL]

Yes. The only dry food they got was the little bit I sprinkled over their wet food - so there were no other options. As time went on, they ate more and more of the wet food.

Did you crush the dry food into a powder-like form? I did that the second time around and it was less work than having to throw pieces of dry food for him until I throw them into the wet food. Hopefully when I get the FortiFlora, it'll work as well. But there's one thing I'm having a problem with. Once he's finished lapping up all the water I've added in, he won't eat anymore of the wet food because he can't pick it up with his tongue so there's still a lot of that left afterwards. Am I not making the wet food soupy enough?

 

[JCL]

I have gotten it from Amazon and from Adwdiabetes.com (with a10% off code missu10

I use it every day for my one underweight cat that barely eats (I think she has a poor sense of smell).

Thanks for the code, it'll be useful since the product is a little pricier than I expected.

 

[FurBabiesMama]

Did you crush the dry food into a powder-like form? I did that the second time around and it was less work than having to throw pieces of dry food for him until I throw them into the wet food. Hopefully when I get the FortiFlora, it'll work as well. But there's one thing I'm having a problem with. Once he's finished lapping up all the water I've added in, he won't eat anymore of the wet food because he can't pick it up with his tongue so there's still a lot of that left afterwards. Am I not making the wet food soupy enough?

Yes. In the beginning, I crushed a little dry food and sprinkled it over the surface of the wet food.

Make sure you are stirring the food into the added water very well so that it becomes really soupy food rather than water sitting on top of food. (I hope that makes sense.) After he finishes round one of eating from it, you may have to stir it and bring it back to the center of the bowl, maybe even stir in a little more water.

 

[Veronica & Babu-chiri]

Would you mind telling me what kind of timed feeder do you use for the wet food? I raredaysee or hear about feeders like that but it sounds handy for the future. Also, how long did it take you to switch them to wet food?

This is similar to the one I have, I think mine is an older model

https://www.amazon.com/WOpet-Automa...ation/dp/B01LYC6GD4?tag=felinediabetesfdmb-20

I can pretty much put any kind of food in there and also it has some space under the tray where I put an ice pack on really warm days

, how long did it take you to switch them to wet food?

It was different for each one, Babu was pretty sick from an UTI when he was diagnosed and between the infection and diabetes I had to assist feed him for about 3 days and that was done with wet food and never went back to the dry, so he pretty much switched in one day, of the other three, one gave a taste to the wet food and totally loved it, so also instantly, other took about two weeks of mixing wet with dry and the forth one as I mentioned took about three months before she even wanted to try the wet food she was complicated ( she has always been very picky even on dry I couln’t change her food because she would just stop eating) wouln’t accept mixing wet and dry so I started putting her two plates one with dry one with wet side by side, and eventually she decided to try the wet .

I saw that you gave him a very small amount of insulin throughout the process

He was what I would call a micro dose cat, he actually pretty much hypoed on 1 unit on his first novolin shoot ( he went from around 500 to 80 and that was measured at the vet ) so we changed to Lantus that is a less harsh insulin to try and handle a softer curve and it worked better, still he was a diver all the way.

and gradually increased despite the different AMPS

With Lantus you dose based on the nadir not on the AMPS or PMPS (pre shoot tests are pretty much just to make sure is safe to shoot) that is why I kept increasing despite the pre shoot values

Was he eating wet food during this whole time and what would you attribute his improvement (3/30 and after) to?

Yes he was eating wet low carb food all the time with some mixing of mid carb to help feed the curve, this not how is usually done and probably not the best but it was to try to stop him from diving too dramatically since as I mentioned he was a serious diver and try and keep the curve a little bit flatter.

I really don’t know or can pin point something specific I did around that date, my best guess is that it was around then, that his pancreas started working again.

 

[JCL]

Yes. In the beginning, I crushed a little dry food and sprinkled it over the surface of the wet food.

Make sure you are stirring the food into the added water very well so that it becomes really soupy food rather than water sitting on top of food. (I hope that makes sense.) After he finishes round one of eating from it, you may have to stir it and bring it back to the center of the bowl, maybe even stir in a little more water.

I actually had an idea to puree the food instead since all Pumba can do is lick at it. Turns out it worked like a charm. I gave him half of it after blending it with some water and he ate it all up in 20 minutes. I got the food to something close to the consistency of gravy. I've only gotten through one 3 oz can so far of Purina's Beyond Chicken & Sweet Potato and have another one that's Whitefish & Spinach, which I'm giving him tomorrow morning, so I hope he'll like the fishy flavor too. I can see from the Food Chart that the carbs are quite low which is nice but protein is also not that high. Based on your knowledge, would you say it's adequate for a diabetic cat?

 

[JCL]

This is similar to the one I have, I think mine is an older model

https://www.amazon.com/WOpet-Automa...ation/dp/B01LYC6GD4?tag=felinediabetesfdmb-20

I can pretty much put any kind of food in there and also it has some space under the tray where I put an ice pack on really warm days



It was different for each one, Babu was pretty sick from an UTI when he was diagnosed and between the infection and diabetes I had to assist feed him for about 3 days and that was done with wet food and never went back to the dry, so he pretty much switched in one day, of the other three, one gave a taste to the wet food and totally loved it, so also instantly, other took about two weeks of mixing wet with dry and the forth one as I mentioned took about three months before she even wanted to try the wet food she was complicated ( she has always been very picky even on dry I couln’t change her food because she would just stop eating) wouln’t accept mixing wet and dry so I started putting her two plates one with dry one with wet side by side, and eventually she decided to try the wet .



He was what I would call a micro dose cat, he actually pretty much hypoed on 1 unit on his first novolin shoot ( he went from around 500 to 80 and that was measured at the vet ) so we changed to Lantus that is a less harsh insulin to try and handle a softer curve and it worked better, still he was a diver all the way.




With Lantus you dose based on the nadir not on the AMPS or PMPS (pre shoot tests are pretty much just to make sure is safe to shoot) that is why I kept increasing despite the pre shoot values




Yes he was eating wet low carb food all the time with some mixing of mid carb to help feed the curve, this not how is usually done and probably not the best but it was to try to stop him from diving too dramatically since as I mentioned he was a serious diver and try and keep the curve a little bit flatter.

I really don’t know or can pin point something specific I did around that date, my best guess is that it was around then, that his pancreas started working again.

Thanks for answering all my questions. I can see Babu-Chiri had a more unique case so I was just really curious about it. Still happy for him and you and hoping I can achieve what you have as well in the near future.

 

[FurBabiesMama]

I actually had an idea to puree the food instead since all Pumba can do is lick at it. Turns out it worked like a charm. I gave him half of it after blending it with some water and he ate it all up in 20 minutes. I got the food to something close to the consistency of gravy. I've only gotten through one 3 oz can so far of Purina's Beyond Chicken & Sweet Potato and have another one that's Whitefish & Spinach, which I'm giving him tomorrow morning, so I hope he'll like the fishy flavor too. I can see from the Food Chart that the carbs are quite low which is nice but protein is also not that high. Based on your knowledge, would you say it's adequate for a diabetic cat?

Great! I am glad you are finding ways to get him to eat the wet food. That chart is from Dr. Pierson, and she says, " I usually like to start with protein minimum of 40, fat maximum of 50, carb max of 10, and for cats with kidney issues....phos less than 300." http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/food-chart-update.176833/

 

[Lesliejm]

I'm aiming to buy 3 oz cans since they're the smallest I can get I think. Does the wet food get dry if you leave it out for a couple of hours? I'd like to also ask what kind of wet food do you feed them, like paté, chunky, strips etc?

Sheba perfect portions pate! Just enough and low in carbs.

 

[JCL]

Great! I am glad you are finding ways to get him to eat the wet food. That chart is from Dr. Pierson, and she says, " I usually like to start with protein minimum of 40, fat maximum of 50, carb max of 10, and for cats with kidney issues....phos less than 300." http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/food-chart-update.176833/

I tried those filters and none of the foods listed were available near me Do you have to order your Weruva online? The thing I'm thinking about is price because weighing at around 14 lbs, Pumba would need probably 6 of those 3 oz cans a day and boy do the costs add up!

I don't know what to make of it but when I took Puma's PMPS today, it was 441 which was really high up from his AMPS. I gave him some of the dry food because I don't have an automatic feeder at the moment and didn't want to let him go hungry from morning until late afternoon. Is this something to be alarmed about? It was quite shocking and I couldn't help but panic a little because I can't figure out where the problem is.

 

[FurBabiesMama]

I tried those filters and none of the foods listed were available near me Do you have to order your Weruva online? The thing I'm thinking about is price because weighing at around 14 lbs, Pumba would need probably 6 of those 3 oz cans a day and boy do the costs add up!

I don't know what to make of it but when I took Puma's PMPS today, it was 441 which was really high up from his AMPS. I gave him some of the dry food because I don't have an automatic feeder at the moment and didn't want to let him go hungry from morning until late afternoon. Is this something to be alarmed about? It was quite shocking and I couldn't help but panic a little because I can't figure out where the problem is.

Are you in the US? If so, I would be very surprised if you cannot find at least some of the foods even at a grocery or department store. A lot of people here buy the low carb Fancy Feast options or even Friskies. Sheba is another option. Some of the other brands are usually only at pet stores or online through Chewy, Amazon or other online retailers. I can get Weruva locally, but I found the best price at hollywoodfeed.com, and I have the food auto-shipped to me. (The food I get is not really a low-cost option though.) I feed one small can per meal divided between my two cats, four meals a day. Mia is 12lbs and Willow is somewhere between 5.5 and 6lbs. (I also add a little shredded home-cooked chicken breast and bone broth to each meal.)

There are lots of possibilities to explain the PMPS. Are you able to take away access to food two hours before the pre-shot test? If not, since he still had access to dry food, he could have eaten some, and that would raise his glucose. It is also possible his glucose went lower than he is used to during the day, and he 'bounced' from it. That can happen even if they do not go too low, just lower than they are used to. Do not think you are going to understand or be able to explain every test result. Glucose levels fluctuate a lot. Consistency is important though, so it will be best when you get to the point that you are consistently feeding only low-carb food, and whenever possible, giving the same dose for AM and PM.

 

[JCL]

Are you in the US? If so, I would be very surprised if you cannot find at least some of the foods even at a grocery or department store. A lot of people here buy the low carb Fancy Feast options or even Friskies. Sheba is another option. Some of the other brands are usually only at pet stores or online through Chewy, Amazon or other online retailers. I can get Weruva locally, but I found the best price at hollywoodfeed.com, and I have the food auto-shipped to me. (The food I get is not really a low-cost option though.) I feed one small can per meal divided between my two cats, four meals a day. Mia is 12lbs and Willow is somewhere between 5.5 and 6lbs. (I also add a little shredded home-cooked chicken breast and bone broth to each meal.)

There are lots of possibilities to explain the PMPS. Are you able to take away access to food two hours before the pre-shot test? If not, since he still had access to dry food, he could have eaten some, and that would raise his glucose. It is also possible his glucose went lower than he is used to during the day, and he 'bounced' from it. That can happen even if they do not go too low, just lower than they are used to. Do not think you are going to understand or be able to explain every test result. Glucose levels fluctuate a lot. Consistency is important though, so it will be best when you get to the point that you are consistently feeding only low-carb food, and whenever possible, giving the same dose for AM and PM.

Ok, this may sound unbelievable to you, but I never knew independent pet stores existed until after I looked at Weruva's site and saw where their foods were located in my area. I don't know why but I never thought of looking them up and probably never paid attention to those I passed by all the time. I'm just shaking my head at myself right now because typing it out really makes it sound so ridiculous lol According to most of the instructions for the canned foods, I've estimated that Pumba will need 2 cans per meal because he weighs around 14 lbs. Though it's mostly 3 oz cans I've read about. Are you also using 3 oz cans for feeding each time?

Unfortunately I get home around 5 and Pumba needs his PMPS at 7 so I can't really bare to starve him since he'd only have his small amount of dry food for 9-10 hours. I could do so during the weekends though. Would it be alright to have 2 different feeding schedules for the weekdays and weekend?

 

[Idjit's mom]

There are ways to work around you not being available to feed Pumba because you are at work. I know it's difficult at first financially with getting insulin, supplies, food etc. We opted to get a battery operated timed feeder for Idjit to help with night feedings Cat Mate C20 2 Bowl Pet Feeder With Ice Pack. https://smile.amazon.com/gp/product/B0002YHUPC/ref=oh_aui_detailpage_o04_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
It's relatively inexpensive at Amazon, about $30. It has two dishes, each can be set to open at different times. I used a frozen food cube at first, until the ice pack was frozen and usable. I have read that some people set out a small portion of canned food in a dish for consumption sooner, and then a frozen food cube for later. I hope this helps.

 

[FurBabiesMama]

Ok, this may sound unbelievable to you, but I never knew independent pet stores existed

You didn't have to tell on yourself.

According to most of the instructions for the canned foods, I've estimated that Pumba will need 2 cans per meal because he weighs around 14 lbs. Though it's mostly 3 oz cans I've read about. Are you also using 3 oz cans for feeding each time?

Unfortunately I get home around 5 and Pumba needs his PMPS at 7 so I can't really bare to starve him since he'd only have his small amount of dry food for 9-10 hours. I could do so during the weekends though. Would it be alright to have 2 different feeding schedules for the weekdays and weekend?

I have seen a few different formulas for how many calories a cat should have, but 20 calories per pound of ideal body weight appears to be about right for an average indoor cat.

I do use the 3.2 oz cans.

I find that cats learn and like routine. That, plus the fact that consistency helps when managing blood sugar, would make me not want to have different feeding schedules on the weekdays vs weekends. You do not want Pumba to have any food two hours prior to his PMPS, so really, he should not be fed between 5 and 7pm. If you had an automatic feeder scheduled to open for him mid-day, he would have access to food all afternoon. You could take up any leftovers when you get home at 5pm then feed him again after the PMPS at 7pm. He could eat on those leftovers throughout the evening. You could even set the auto feeder up to feed him a little more during the night so that he does not wake you up crying for food.

The bottom line is that there are ways to allow a cat to free-feed on wet food pretty much all day (the exception being during the 2 hours before your pre-shot tests).

 

[JCL]

There are ways to work around you not being available to feed Pumba because you are at work. I know it's difficult at first financially with getting insulin, supplies, food etc. We opted to get a battery operated timed feeder for Idjit to help with night feedings Cat Mate C20 2 Bowl Pet Feeder With Ice Pack.
It's relatively inexpensive at Amazon, about $30. It has two dishes, each can be set to open at different times. I used a frozen food cube at first, until the ice pack was frozen and usable. I have read that some people set out a small portion of canned food in a dish for consumption sooner, and then a frozen food cube for later. I hope this helps.

I've seen people suggesting this way to feed wet food with the feeders but the thing is Pumba doesn't like his wet food cold, he won't touch it if it's not heated up after being taken out of the fridge or if it's been left out long enough that he thinks it's too cold. I'd buy a feeder if it meant he would do well with the cold wet food but I don't know if I can risk the money like that. Are there any kind of feeders or even any other mechanism that will keep food semi-warm?

 

[JCL]

You didn't have to tell on yourself.


I have seen a few different formulas for how many calories a cat should have, but 20 calories per pound of ideal body weight appears to be about right for an average indoor cat.

I do use the 3.2 oz cans.

I find that cats learn and like routine. That, plus the fact that consistency helps when managing blood sugar, would make me not want to have different feeding schedules on the weekdays vs weekends. You do not want Pumba to have any food two hours prior to his PMPS, so really, he should not be fed between 5 and 7pm. If you had an automatic feeder scheduled to open for him mid-day, he would have access to food all afternoon. You could take up any leftovers when you get home at 5pm then feed him again after the PMPS at 7pm. He could eat on those leftovers throughout the evening. You could even set the auto feeder up to feed him a little more during the night so that he does not wake you up crying for food.

The bottom line is that there are ways to allow a cat to free-feed on wet food pretty much all day (the exception being during the 2 hours before your pre-shot tests).

You can see my reply to Idjit above, as it addresses the same topic. I got a sample of Dr. Elsey's Clean Protein dry food today and was thinking I could substitute that as his noon to mid-afternoon meal. What do you think of that arrangement? It's certainly not ideal compared to a completely wet food diet but if I were to do that long term, do you think it could hinder Pumba's ability to go into remission?

 

[FurBabiesMama]

You can see my reply to Idjit above, as it addresses the same topic. I got a sample of Dr. Elsey's Clean Protein dry food today and was thinking I could substitute that as his noon to mid-afternoon meal. What do you think of that arrangement? It's certainly not ideal compared to a completely wet food diet but if I were to do that long term, do you think it could hinder Pumba's ability to go into remission?

I think I have pretty much already shared with you all of my thoughts/suggestions on this. Lower carb dry is better than higher carb dry as far as carb content is concerned. You said he is overweight, so be mindful of the total calories you are giving him in a day. As previously discussed, dry food is much higher in calories than the appropriate wet foods. Also, there are other things to consider with dry food: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...r-more-than-just-carbohydrate-content.175004/ Also, if he knows he is getting dry food every day, it seems to me that he will be less motivated to eat a good amount of his wet food.

You started this thread thinking you could not get him to eat wet at all yet you now have him eating some. If you really want to get him on 100% wet food, you can. (Maybe he will learn to eat his soupy food at room temperature or even a little cold if that is his only option during the day!) But, if that is not your goal, then fine. It is really completely up to you.

 

[JCL]

I think I have pretty much already shared with you all of my thoughts/suggestions on this. Lower carb dry is better than higher carb dry as far as carb content is concerned. You said he is overweight, so be mindful of the total calories you are giving him in a day. As previously discussed, dry food is much higher in calories than the appropriate wet foods. Also, there are other things to consider with dry food: http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/...r-more-than-just-carbohydrate-content.175004/ Also, if he knows he is getting dry food every day, it seems to me that he will be less motivated to eat a good amount of his wet food.

You started this thread thinking you could not get him to eat wet at all yet you now have him eating some. If you really want to get him on 100% wet food, you can. (Maybe he will learn to eat his soupy food at room temperature or even a little cold if that is his only option during the day!) But, if that is not your goal, then fine. It is really completely up to you.

It is certainly my goal to have Pumba switched to 100% wet food and I do think there's a strong possibility he will let me help him since he's been eating all of his blended food that's been given to him. I will do my best to try and give him the wet food with an automatic feeder and see how it works out.

I have run into a bit of a problem with the Weruva Tuna and Chicken Chuckles. I think because of its strong tuna smell, Pumba has began liking it less and less each time he eats it. He'll eat half that's given to him and won't eat the rest later on. It's a shame because it's one of the best foods for him I could find based on the food chart but it's the only food so far that he has had this reaction to so I think it won't be too hard getting him something else he likes.