Remission???

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rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
do you know what to do if he were to go low? Do you have a high carb gravy food and / or honey/syrup to add to his food to boost his bg ?

do you have the instructions of how to treat a hypo printed out? Everyone should have that since you never know when there might be a power outage or computer failure.
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Yes we have honey and maple syrup on hand. I do know to rub it in his gums correct?
 
we actually add a drop or two to the food. Rub it on gums if they won't eat. You can also rub it on their anus if in a real emergency and they are unconscious in which case you are rubbing that constantly all the way to the emergency room.

after giving it in the food, test again in 30 minutes to make sure it's rising numbers and keep rechecking.
post for help.... this is the time to use our 911.
you keep checking until numbers are above 70 without having to give honey and food. we call that a pajama party. I'm going to check back tonite.
 
rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
how to treat hypo's

if you don't have this printed, here 's the info.
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ThanksOK
rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
we actually add a drop or two to the food. Rub it on gums if they won't eat. You can also rub it on their anus if in a real emergency and they are unconscious in which case you are rubbing that constantly all the way to the emergency room.

after giving it in the food, test again in 30 minutes to make sure it's rising numbers and keep rechecking.
post for help.... this is the time to use our 911.
you keep checking until numbers are above 70 without having to give honey and food. we call that a pajama party. I'm going to check back tonite.
Click to expand...
OK Thank you
 
Good catch on that 52 today. I am glad you were testing. He was safe, but on the edge.

I'd like to correct some of what was said above. For cats on larger doses, and in this case that means over 5 units, changes should be by 0.5 units. That would make Tank's new dose 6.5 units in the morning.

Has Tank always been that large? How is his appetite? There are some secondary conditions cats can get that cause diabetes. Some of them can result in larger doses required. My Neko had two of those "high dose" conditions, one called acromegaly (benign pituitary tumour sending out excess growth hormone) and the other called IAA or insulin auto antibodies.
 
Wendy&Neko said:
Good catch on that 52 today. I am glad you were testing. He was safe, but on the edge.

I'd like to correct some of what was said above. For cats on larger doses, and in this case that means over 5 units, changes should be by 0.5 units. That would make Tank's new dose 6.5 units in the morning.

Has Tank always been that large? How is his appetite? There are some secondary conditions cats can get that cause diabetes. Some of them can result in larger doses required. My Neko had two of those "high dose" conditions, one called acromegaly (benign pituitary tumour sending out excess growth hormone) and the other called IAA or insulin auto antibodies.
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Oh thank you. Tank was a animal shelter rescue. We know nothing about his history other than his previous owner passed away. We assume it was an elderly person and maybe a male because he is definitely drawn toward me over my wife. He has always been 25 pounds. Even after starting the low carb canned food a month ago his weight hasnt changed. We did have a diabetic cat 3 years ago that was very brittle. He was all over the place could not get regulated and went and crashed bad on us. A trip to the emergency vet and he had to be put down. We just have not been informed well enough by our vet I don't think. He led us to believe all we had to do was a curve every couple weeks, make dose adjustments with spot checks here and there in hopes he regulates and possibly goes into remission. So far from the truth!
 
well that's good. He's not still going up. That +6 may be very helpful. So he's clearing the bounce in good pace.

So many vets just don't push the testing. They are very conditioned to the ones who won't try, won't go the extra mile. I think that speaks volumes of how many cats that develop medical conditions aren't treated.
It's got to be hard to be a dr wanting to preserve life and having clients who choose not to. And they have to comply.

I won't make it to your +6 but I will check to see how it went tomorrow.

It sounds like your vet is most experienced with dog diabetics. That's how you treat canines, spot checks and regulation.
Dogs have no chance of remission where as cats do.

For Tank to get to remission, his dose would be earning decreases and he'd be heading back towards not needing insulin. He's got a ways to go for that but it is always a possibility.
 
rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
well that's good. He's not still going up. That +6 may be very helpful. So he's clearing the bounce in good pace.

So many vets just don't push the testing. They are very conditioned to the ones who won't try, won't go the extra mile. I think that speaks volumes of how many cats that develop medical conditions aren't treated.
It's got to be hard to be a dr wanting to preserve life and having clients who choose not to. And they have to comply.

I won't make it to your +6 but I will check to see how it went tomorrow.

It sounds like your vet is most experienced with dog diabetics. That's how you treat canines, spot checks and regulation.
Dogs have no chance of remission where as cats do.

For Tank to get to remission, his dose would be earning decreases and he'd be heading back towards not needing insulin. He's got a ways to go for that but it is always a possibility.
Click to expand...
OK thank you. The only reason we found out he was diabetic was his drinking, peeing and weight. He has terrible anxiety in the car so we asked to do these curves at home. He actually get physically sick and foams at the mouth and cries. He's such a nice cat. Doesnt even ever meow which is odd. Only time is when he's scared in the car. Now in the last month he's like night and day with the drinking and peeing. I think the canned food has helped a lot too. Thanks for your help. I will update at +6 here and on his spreadsheet.
 
when the numbers are high, lots of pee and drinking....
that's where he's not really getting the nutrition to his cells, it's just passing thru without any absorption which is why they will start losing weight if they stay that way for too long. Starving but eating like crazy.

As his numbers come down back to normal , the fluids get back to normal too.

Most cats aren't fond of the vet, or the car so he sounds pretty normal to me.
 
rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
when the numbers are high, lots of pee and drinking....
that's where he's not really getting the nutrition to his cells, it's just passing thru without any absorption which is why they will start losing weight if they stay that way for too long. Starving but eating like crazy.

As his numbers come down back to normal , the fluids get back to normal too.

Most cats aren't fond of the vet, or the car so he sounds pretty normal to me.
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We've had cats for 20 years. A few rescues and special needs kitties. Tank gets soooo upset to the point that he starts convulsing and sick. And its only a four block ride. I have to wonder if he thinks he's being taken back to animal shelter sometimes or something. If I can do anything to keep him stress free I'll try it first. He's a gentle chubby boy.
 
rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
well that's good. He's not still going up. That +6 may be very helpful. So he's clearing the bounce in good pace.

So many vets just don't push the testing. They are very conditioned to the ones who won't try, won't go the extra mile. I think that speaks volumes of how many cats that develop medical conditions aren't treated.
It's got to be hard to be a dr wanting to preserve life and having clients who choose not to. And they have to comply.

I won't make it to your +6 but I will check to see how it went tomorrow.

It sounds like your vet is most experienced with dog diabetics. That's how you treat canines, spot checks and regulation.
Dogs have no chance of remission where as cats do.

For Tank to get to remission, his dose would be earning decreases and he'd be heading back towards not needing insulin. He's got a ways to go for that but it is always a possibility.
Click to expand...
+6 was 279 Thank you
 
Looking at that +6, I would strongly recommend you get a test before you feed and shoot in the morning. It wouldn't surprise me if you are faced with a lower than usual preshot.

I agree with Wendy, and would recommend you take dose changes in 0.5u steps, while his dose is over 5units.

If he is lower than usual at preshot, stall don't feed and post up for urgent dosing advice.

On the lantus forum there are stickies on shooting and handling low numbers.
 
Ask your vet for some Cerenia, to use when you absolutely have to take him somewhere (like the vet). It's an anti-nausea med, and you give it two hours before the car ride. In my experience, it also helps calm them a little, too. Have you tried using Feliway spray? Spritzing it in the carrier can help with the anxiety. So does throwing a towel or something over the carrier so they can't see out.

Testing at home is the best way to manage FD, anyway, as most cats run high at the vet from anxiety, so the readings they get aren't accurate. If you haven't already done so, please read the stickies at the top of the Lantus & Levemir forum, and then start a new thread (we all them condos) there tomorrow. We'll help you all we can, but the more you learn, the better equipped you are to help Tank. You're off to a great start with home testing!

Here is a post we put together to help new members get comfortable using the Forum. It's kind of like an FAQ.

Take advantage of the knowledge and experience of the people on the Lantus & Levemir page. Ask lots of questions. We love to help!
 
Gill & George said:
Looking at that +6, I would strongly recommend you get a test before you feed and shoot in the morning. It wouldn't surprise me if you are faced with a lower than usual preshot.

I agree with Wendy, and would recommend you take dose changes in 0.5u steps, while his dose is over 5units.

If he is lower than usual at preshot, stall don't feed and post up for urgent dosing advice.

On the lantus forum there are stickies on shooting and handling low numbers.
Click to expand...
He was 279 again this am pre shot so I gave the 6 1/2 again. Will check at +4 is all I can do today. Thanks
 
Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey said:
Ask your vet for some Cerenia, to use when you absolutely have to take him somewhere (like the vet). It's an anti-nausea med, and you give it two hours before the car ride. In my experience, it also helps calm them a little, too. Have you tried using Feliway spray? Spritzing it in the carrier can help with the anxiety. So does throwing a towel or something over the carrier so they can't see out.

Testing at home is the best way to manage FD, anyway, as most cats run high at the vet from anxiety, so the readings they get aren't accurate. If you haven't already done so, please read the stickies at the top of the Lantus & Levemir forum, and then start a new thread (we all them condos) there tomorrow. We'll help you all we can, but the more you learn, the better equipped you are to help Tank. You're off to a great start with home testing!

Here is a post we put together to help new members get comfortable using the Forum. It's kind of like an FAQ.

Take advantage of the knowledge and experience of the people on the Lantus & Levemir page. Ask lots of questions. We love to help!
Click to expand...
Its only 4 or 5 blocks away. He really freaks in a carrier so the last time I just held him in a blanket and he was a little better. But being able to do the curves at home has helped.
 
rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
well that's good. He's not still going up. That +6 may be very helpful. So he's clearing the bounce in good pace.

So many vets just don't push the testing. They are very conditioned to the ones who won't try, won't go the extra mile. I think that speaks volumes of how many cats that develop medical conditions aren't treated.
It's got to be hard to be a dr wanting to preserve life and having clients who choose not to. And they have to comply.

I won't make it to your +6 but I will check to see how it went tomorrow.

It sounds like your vet is most experienced with dog diabetics. That's how you treat canines, spot checks and regulation.
Dogs have no chance of remission where as cats do.

For Tank to get to remission, his dose would be earning decreases and he'd be heading back towards not needing insulin. He's got a ways to go for that but it is always a possibility.
Click to expand...
Good morning. I stayed up til 1am last night and did more checks. At +6 he was 279 and then 279 again preshot this morning so I gave 6 1/2 units. Dropped off my curve to the vet and obtained copies of past curves and entered them in the spread sheet now. A couple seem to be missing. Thank you!
 
now the thing to do is continue at this new dose for at least 5 more cycles.... and let's see what he does with it.
Keep testing randomly and try to catch lows.

you may want to go over to the lantus forum....
and your subject line would be 3/26 Tank amps 279 ...
add any tests to the subject line like +4 ~

if you have questions, you can add a question mark to the subject... that usually gets attention because everyone looks for that.
and you do that each day....
we'll keep watch ....


if you know how to link , you want to add this condo in your paragraph so anyone can link back and see what was said to you the day before.

if not, we'll tell you how to do that.


I feel good about him staying with the yellow... blue is just where we want him to target... and some high greens too....
 
rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
now the thing to do is continue at this new dose for at least 5 more cycles.... and let's see what he does with it.
Keep testing randomly and try to catch lows.

you may want to go over to the lantus forum....
and your subject line would be 3/26 Tank amps 279 ...
add any tests to the subject line like +4 ~

if you have questions, you can add a question mark to the subject... that usually gets attention because everyone looks for that.
and you do that each day....
we'll keep watch ....


if you know how to link , you want to add this condo in your paragraph so anyone can link back and see what was said to you the day before.

if not, we'll tell you how to do that.


I feel good about him staying with the yellow... blue is just where we want him to target... and some high greens too....
Click to expand...
Ok thank you for your attention. Still wautwaito hear back from vet also. I'll do that Lantus forum post when I get home tonight.
 
rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
now the thing to do is continue at this new dose for at least 5 more cycles.... and let's see what he does with it.
Keep testing randomly and try to catch lows.

you may want to go over to the lantus forum....
and your subject line would be 3/26 Tank amps 279 ...
add any tests to the subject line like +4 ~

if you have questions, you can add a question mark to the subject... that usually gets attention because everyone looks for that.
and you do that each day....
we'll keep watch ....


if you know how to link , you want to add this condo in your paragraph so anyone can link back and see what was said to you the day before.

if not, we'll tell you how to do that.


I feel good about him staying with the yellow... blue is just where we want him to target... and some high greens too....
Click to expand...
Vet replied back and said 6 should be his dose for now. But then doesn't want me to do a curve for a month with just periodic spot checks. I think you're correct that they treat feline diabetes more like canine.
 
Unfortunetely , this vet is in the norm. I'm guessing MOST vets tell the same thing. Most vets tell you NOT to check at home.
 
Sean & Rufus said:
Unfortunetely , this vet is in the norm. I'm guessing MOST vets tell the same thing. Most vets tell you NOT to check at home.
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Yes because thats $100 they lose each time. I really think some vets upsell. Hard to find an old school decent caring listening vet now days. I see him as a place to get Tank's Rx refilled.....ha ha ha.
 
just looking... that pink looks suspicious to me.... very likely a bounce from another green in the late night cycle....

Would you be able to get some random tests in the night?
only 5 minutes of sleep deprivation..... :cat:
 
harleywulf said:
I have been. Should I have adjusted?
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It depends. If you decide to try the FDMB Lantus methods there are two dosing regimens: TR (Tight Regulation) and SLGS (Start Low Go Slow). If he gets any dry food you have to use SLGS. Go to the Lantus forum and have look at the yellow info sticky for each method.
 
Kris & Teasel said:
It depends. If you decide to try the FDMB Lantus methods there are two dosing regimens: TR (Tight Regulation) and SLGS (Start Low Go Slow). If he gets any dry food you have to use SLGS. Go to the Lantus forum and have look at the yellow info sticky for each method.
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Ok will do. He gets no dry food but we are in a situation where we have multiple people in the house administering injectioms but no one else is willing or wants to do bg testing except me.
 
harleywulf said:
Ok will do. He gets no dry food but we are in a situation where we have multiple people in the house administering injectioms but no one else is willing or wants to do bg testing except me.
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Do you have a system in place to ensure he isn’t accidentally double dosed? I ask because we’ve seen it happen here.
 
Kris & Teasel said:
Do you have a system in place to ensure he isn’t accidentally double dosed? I ask because we’ve seen it happen here.
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Yes. Someone other than me will only dose him if inInot around for his 7am or 7pm dose. It seems we have basically been doing the SLGS method from notes in the yellow sticky I read.
 
harleywulf said:
Yes. Someone other than me will only dose him if inInot around for his 7am or 7pm dose. It seems we have basically been doing the SLGS method from notes in the yellow sticky I read.
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In a nutshell that method has you holding a dose for about a week and then doing a curve. The curve data is used to making dosing decisions.
 
Kris & Teasel said:
In a nutshell that method has you holding a dose for about a week and then doing a curve. The curve data is used to making dosing decisions.
Click to expand...
That seems to be what wevew been doing except our vet has been only telling me to do a curve monthly which doesn't seem proper. After getting on this site and reading and getting other advise I was planning on doing weekly curves now with daily spot checks and adjusting accordingly. Thnx
 
it's just you need some random tests at night.... you are missing half the daily picture....
it's a lot like a jigsaw puzzle and some of us can see patterns ...

many cats tend to go lower at night ....

i myself had to start drinking water before bed because I could easily sleep thru my alarm.
If I had to get up, I had my testing equipment right with me and could grab a quick test.

Even just getting a +2 at night is helpful... because if it's a dramatic drop from the preshot test, it means you should make sure and test later in the night.
 
rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
it's just you need some random tests at night.... you are missing half the daily picture....
it's a lot like a jigsaw puzzle and some of us can see patterns ...

many cats tend to go lower at night ....

i myself had to start drinking water before bed because I could easily sleep thru my alarm.
If I had to get up, I had my testing equipment right with me and could grab a quick test.

Even just getting a +2 at night is helpful... because if it's a dramatic drop from the preshot test, it means you should make sure and test later in the night.
Click to expand...
Will do.
 
rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
it's just you need some random tests at night.... you are missing half the daily picture....
it's a lot like a jigsaw puzzle and some of us can see patterns ...

many cats tend to go lower at night ....

i myself had to start drinking water before bed because I could easily sleep thru my alarm.
If I had to get up, I had my testing equipment right with me and could grab a quick test.

Even just getting a +2 at night is helpful... because if it's a dramatic drop from the preshot test, it means you should make sure and test later in the night.
Click to expand...
Sermsas tho hes staying constantly yellow last several checks
 
Just an FYI: for reasons unknown it's been observed by many on FDMB that a long streak of yellows often comes before a drop in BG. Get a before bed test tonight to see if he's holding or dropping.
 
rhiannon and shadow (GA) said:
it's just you need some random tests at night.... you are missing half the daily picture....
it's a lot like a jigsaw puzzle and some of us can see patterns ...

many cats tend to go lower at night ....

i myself had to start drinking water before bed because I could easily sleep thru my alarm.
If I had to get up, I had my testing equipment right with me and could grab a quick test.

Even just getting a +2 at night is helpful... because if it's a dramatic drop from the preshot test, it means you should make sure and test later in the night.
Click to expand...
What do you make of all the yellow now? Should I wait a full week to bump him up? Still learning...
 
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