? Help please. Guessed at food & dose. Hope it works right.

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Darnell & Sprocket (GA)

Darnell & Sprocket (GA)

Member Since 2015
Very odd day.
Normal dose lately is 2.87u. I swear i gave that but reliom syrige lines are not always straight
What do i do??? Carb? Then dose??
He is mostly carb sensitive. He usually goes up with 4 carb.



268 at amps. 609am
116 at +4.1 at 1052am
Gave 2oz of 4 carb
97 at 1208pm
Gave 1.3oz of 5 carb
74 at 213pm
Gave 1.85oz of 7 carb
121 at 401pm
Pmps/614pm 133
What can i do for carb and dose as he is going up so slow and idk why???
 
It sounds like you shot. Regardless of the syringe and it's markings, do NOT give more insulin. If you haven't shot and you think the markings on the syringe are off, use a different syringe.

It may help to either make up a sample syringe that you can measure against or get a pair of digital calipers. This can help you to make sure you are dosing consistently.

Can you please update your SS? I was looking at your SS and was assuming it was current. It's very hard to look at numbers in your condo and on the SS and then offer input.
 
Sienne and Gabby (GA) said:
It sounds like you shot. Regardless of the syringe and it's markings, do NOT give more insulin. If you haven't shot and you think the markings on the syringe are off, use a different syringe.

It may help to either make up a sample syringe that you can measure against or get a pair of digital calipers. This can help you to make sure you are dosing consistently.

Can you please update your SS? I was looking at your SS and was assuming it was current. It's very hard to look at numbers in your condo and on the SS and then offer input.
Click to expand...

I havent had time today to update.
I gave all his bgs today.
He normally doesnt do this at all.
I only have relion syringes. Gonna order caliper.
What do i do now? He is going up so slow. He never does that
 
I posted. Ok i had to shoot something.
Today was very odd!! He has never dropped like today especially when I am feeding him like this.
Thats why I posted. I need help. This is why i need someone to follow him. I cant type explanations while I am trying to feed him n do all the meds at same time.
Something is weird. I have been given mostly 2.87u for awhile and it looked like 2.87u but his body acted like the dose was much higher.
I gave his buprenex at 225pm which usually raises him.
He is rising but so slow.
I am worried.
I have tested to so much today.
I know he will bounce but he usually does it by now.
I gave 2.75u, i think. It looked like it. After giving 2oz of 6 carb.
I hope it works cause I dont know how much more he will eat. He has had 9.75oz so far and he still has 2 normal meals left.

Bg numbers are good but not when its because he is oddly dropping then barely going back up so its kinda wrong to just look at the bgs.
Shoot low to stay low. Doesnt work with him. Did it the other night and he bounced almost 200 pts on 2 hrs
So this is why, again I say,
I need regular help.
 
Squeaky and KT (GA) said:
All I see is a cat that's beginning to feel a bit better, his body is using the insulin a bit better and you've got a nice small extended cycle happening. He may start zooming up in a bit but for now, enjoy the nice numbers for him!
Click to expand...

Ya but that doesnt help me as to what dose of insulin I give. He has been so unpredictable in the last 2 months that its getting dangerous
Its not all about bg's if they are not safe because something odd is going on
 
Darnell & Sprocket said:
Ya but that doesnt help me as to what dose of insulin I give. He has been so unpredictable in the last 2 months that its getting dangerous
Its not all about bg's if they are not safe because something odd is going on
Click to expand...
Chris answered your dosing question above. Great numbers today!
 
JanetNJ said:
Chris answered your dosing question above. Great numbers today!
Click to expand...

No, not exactly!! Not great numbers if he isnt safe!.
Ugg. This is why i need regular help.
I havent done normal dosing in 2 months because medicine with sugar has been making bg's wacky. Sugar in meds is not good. Its hard to get bg down. Then it drops too fast. Thats not safe.
I am so stressed.
Its not normal drop and he is rising very slow also not normal either.
 
First, your AM +9 should be blue not yellow on your SS.

You are getting regular help. If you post, people offer what they can. Chris gave you her thoughts. You hadn't refreshed your browser. You didn't respond to Chris' suggestion. You should know when reductions are earned. It's also extremely difficult to offer competent help if your SS isn't up to date. It's not that hard to enter the test data. All of the other information is more for you than us. If you need quick help, please have the numbers on your SS. We look for trends based on the color coding.

I'm not sure how many ways or how many people have to point this out but one-on-one help isn't available nor is it condoned. I don't mean to be difficult but you need to respect the way the board works. No one is going to be your personal trainer. If you keep asking for things we can't provide, people are likely to stop responding because it appears you're not listening.

You were concerned that you didn't have anyone responding within 15 min of your posting yet other times you are upset because too many people respond. Case in point -- people had responded to your post within 21 minutes. None of us trawls the board every second unless we are monitoring what might be a life threatening emergency. People want to eat dinner, have their own cats to care for, have families, need to unwind, etc. I know you feel that Sprocket is complicated. There are more cats here who are complicated than are straightforward. Frankly, there are cats that are far more complicated than Sprocket and who have been in life threatening situations at least as often as your cat or who are on far more medications. Because this is YOUR cat the situation always seems more complex or more upsetting to you.

Fast drops are not necessarily an issue. If you know how to manage dropping numbers with food, that's what you need to do. 268 to 97 by mid-cycle is not that big or fast of a drop. Numbers dropping from the 400s to the 40s is a fast drop. Please look at other SS so you have a better perspective on how a range of cats respond. Look at Gabby's SS. There's over 6 years of data there from a cat that knew how to dive.
 
Darnell & Sprocket said:
No, not exactly!! Not great numbers if he isnt safe!.
Ugg. This is why i need regular help.
I havent done normal dosing in 2 months because medicine with sugar has been making bg's wacky. Sugar in meds is not good. Its hard to get bg down. Then it drops too fast. Thats not safe.
I am so stressed.
Its not normal drop and he is rising very slow also not normal either.
Click to expand...
74 is a safe number and earned him a slight reduction. It's what you want to see. It's a good thing. I get he dropped a few hours after the shot, and you're not used to seeing it, but you're monitoring and can steer with food if need be so he's perfectly safe. Insulin needs change over time and you just adjust as you need to. If he's starting to drop faster, and lower, for a longer amount of time, then you reduce the dose a @Chris & China suggested. It's what you WANT to have happen. You want to eventually whittle the dose down. It's a good thing. There's no time on your spreadsheet where your cat looked to be in danger.
 
JanetNJ said:
74 is a safe number and earned him a slight reduction. It's what you want to see. It's a good thing. I get he dropped a few hours after the shot, and you're not used to seeing it, but you're monitoring and can steer with food if need be so he's perfectly safe. Insulin needs change over time and you just adjust as you need to. If he's starting to drop faster, and lower, for a longer amount of time, then you reduce the dose a @Chris & China suggested. It's what you WANT to have happen. You want to eventually whittle the dose down. It's a good thing. There's no time on your spreadsheet where your cat looked to be in danger.
Click to expand...

Its not what I want like this. He was not safe because he wasnt doing a normal fall. I am not trying to earn reductions anymore. He has been on medications with sugar for 2 months and it makes his bg go wacky. He is still having the issue as he is coming off these meds. And I am finding out today the syringes I use are off. The lines are not accurate anymore. The dose I gave yesterday appeared to be 2.87u but it acted like over 3 units and I think it was. So that makes the drop very unsafe. I am going to get a caliper.
 
Unfortunately there really is no such thing as a "normal" fall when dealing with diabetes - there are too many potential factors at play. Yes, we do see patterns and consistencies at times, but the fact that things can change quickly is exactly why we test the way we do - so we catch changes before they become a problem. Testing the way you do is what keeps Sprocket safe, even when you see him diverge from what you usually see him do.

If you are not trying to earn reductions any more, you do need to decide what your main objective with Sprocket's treatment is - keeping in mind that earning a reduction is something that you may not be in control of, because if Sprocket needs less insulin, he needs less insulin - his numbers will tell you that.

Calipers will help with dosing consistency. I hope you are able to get them soon.
 
Darnell & Sprocket said:
I posted. Ok i had to shoot something.
Today was very odd!! He has never dropped like today especially when I am feeding him like this.
.
Click to expand...
Darnell & Sprocket said:
He has been on medications with sugar for 2 months and it makes his bg go wacky.
Click to expand...
Darnell, there are days when you do not HAVE TO SHOOT SOMETHING. It depends on the numbers, as you know, and sometimes they don't make sense. I could be upstairs all day and Noah is puking in the basement in private. At night he sits in his basket like nothing's wrong but something is and I have no idea what it is. We just start all over tomorrow. He's an old cat and that's life with cats.
Okay, meds with sugar??? Is this from you vet who knows Sprocket is diabetic or are they something else like a supplement? This is important.
 
Noah & me said:
Darnell, there are days when you do not HAVE TO SHOOT SOMETHING. It depends on the numbers, as you know, and sometimes they don't make sense. I could be upstairs all day and Noah is puking in the basement in private. At night he sits in his basket like nothing's wrong but something is and I have no idea what it is. We just start all over tomorrow. He's an old cat and that's life with cats.
Okay, meds with sugar??? Is this from you vet who knows Sprocket is diabetic or are they something else like a supplement? This is important.
Click to expand...

Ya. When I dont shoot he goes sky high by amps. He isnt staying in low numbers enough for him to not need insulin. I dont think he will ever get there. He has had too much happen with his organs. Even both specialist & my new vet dont think he will make remission but still trying for regulation.
Ya. A stupid local compounding company put stevia and sweetners in meds for diabetics then talked to me like I was a stupid child. I wish I had a video of that guy cause I would have a lawsuit from this psycho.
He needed the meds & I can only afford so many meds. I had to give it to him until I could get the sugar free meds. Then hurricane hit place we were gonna order from so change of plan. He got off those meds & tried a different med but even without sugar that med is still raising his glucose and making it do wacky ups n downs. Had to give uneven insulin dosea just to get him out if 400s n then 300s.
He comes off that med tonight so I hope he wont need it again. I think its 35-40 days with no flare up if cystitis.
Just one med to get fixed as its so bitter he makes the worst faces n gets foamy at mouth n drools n spits up. Had 2 flavor doses in it and is still bitter. Gonna have to try transdermal of that one. Its amitriptyline.

Its been a rough few months for him again. Hope calmness is coming soon.
 
Darnell & Sprocket said:
Had to give uneven insulin dosea
Click to expand...

Remember that with Lantus, consistency is key because of it being a depot insulin. Just because you shoot less because of a lower number doesn't mean that he will get the affects of a lower dose like one of the in and out insulins because the depot will be in effect.
 
Meridith and Zeke said:
Remember that with Lantus, consistency is key because of it being a depot insulin. Just because you shoot less because of a lower number doesn't mean that he will get the affects of a lower dose like one of the in and out insulins because the depot will be in effect.
Click to expand...
I had to shoot more to get him out of the 300s & 400s before. Sugar in meds dows wacky things on glucose. Bgs barely move except for up for days them drop one day. Its insane. No predictability at all. It was horrible. Now I give 3rd degree when I order any meds.
I hope he wont need these meds again. If so at least I will know what I can do to balance him some.
He is such a trooper.
 
Hi Darnell, I did some digging for you. Please, any other members with experience in this feel free to jump in.
> SUGAR AND SUGAR SUBSTITUTES FOR YOUR CAT
These are the main culprits"
XYLITOL / all other names for this product have the word xylitolin them.
SACCHARIN (Sweet'N Low, Sugar Twin)
ASPARTAME (NutraSweet, Equal)
ACESULFAME potassium or ace-K (Sweet One, Swiss Sweet, Sunett), Sucralose, (Splenda)
This is the link for XYLITOL
https://www.google.ca/search?q=is+x...372...0i67k1j0i7i30k1j0i22i30k1.0._8nQN191_S0
According to the American Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals,
xylitol is toxic to animals. In cats it can prompt a sudden release of insulin, resulting in low blood sugar,
a condition known as hypoglycemia. Ultimately a cat that eats xylitol may end up with liver failure, resulting in death.
This is the link for STEVIA
https://www.google.ca/search?source....2874...0i131k1j0i7i30k1j0i13k1.0.KzrveJv_f3U
From Doctor Patty Kuhly of the Sunset Clinic in Miami.
"Dr. Kuhly says that cats can't taste sweet sweeteners as they lack the needed taste receptors in their mouth.
She says that, whether you think it's safe or not, you should never give a cat any type of sweetener.
Even with FDA approval that states "Pet Safe" cats can't taste sweet flavors anyway, it is more likely they're tasting something
something else in the food or medication".
*****************************************
Earlier you mentioned something about getting grief when you picked up your meds (maybe it was something else). Okay Darnell, YOU are the boss, YOU'RE paying for it and Sprocket is YOUR cat, end of story. All you have to do is ask what else is in these meds and specifically "Is there sugar or a sugar substitute in here?" If they say "I don't know" that's not an answer. If the say "Yes" make it clear to them Sprocket is diabetic. If they don't get it that is their problem and it's time to shop somewhere else.
*****************************************
I have not heard you say this in a while but you have said "The Board is not helping". There is no "board" the way you might think there is. If you buy a gigantic TV from Best Buy and have trouble with it there's a whole team of tech savvy people who are paid to help you. Here the board is just a few ordinary people with kids and cats and a pile of laundry. They are not always here. Have you noticed by now there is no advertising on the site and there was no membership fee? It's ALL done on donations and most of the replies you get are from ordinary people sitting at home. I donated $20 a long time ago, it should be $100 this year for all the free help I've received. And... Never contact the board about day to day medical problems. That is not why they're here, if they are here at all. They do care but there's only 6 or 8 of them and right now we have over 16,000 members!
*****************************************
This is the part where you might think I'm being mean, I'm not. If I or anyone else was mean we would just ignore you. Almost all the people that reply to you, and there's a lot of them, are doing it from the kindness of their hearts. We already have a diabetic cat, another with an UTI and yet another getting over a case of crystals. I hate to say this but you're not the only one.
*****************************************
Not being "Good" with computers. More than half the members are over 50 years old. Here's a few tips. I cannot work without a mouse, try one. (If you're left handed let me know) It's easier for me to curl up on the sofa with paper and a high-liter when I need to soak up details. In the first forum they will show you how to save thread to your computer. Or try what I do; open up a Word or Notepad file, left click and drag your mouse over the information you want, right click, then click on copy. Move to Word or Notepad and left click "Copy". Presto, just the parts that matter to you.
*****************************************
Now you really might hate me but give it a try. The titles for your threads are too long. Don't include Sprockets numbers in the title because anyone who reads your posts will see those numbers anyways on Sprockets spreadsheet. It's good to include the date (like you already do) and a new problem if there is one like "Sprocket's numbers are way down". Just be brief. We all know you and Sprocket by now and we all care for you.
*****************************************
You need day to day help. Me too! My wife is pretty much disabled, I have a serious brain injury. The help I get comes from my vet and the people here, that's what friends do. And they're still my friends even after I shoot my mouth off!
Okay everyone else, was that too much? Just one teensy tiny like would do it, not at the top of my game for a while now (Duh!)
 
Darnell & Sprocket said:
I had to shoot more to get him out of the 300s & 400s before.
Click to expand...

If this was an in and out insulin, that would be the case. But even if you shoot more, you're still working with the current doses depot so it isn't that increase that is helping as much as you think it is. I think the problem here is that it is time for maybe a dose increase. If I am remembering right on SLGS (I am TR), is that you do a curve weekly and go from there to decide on an increase. Look at the days that you have done a higher dose, then look a few days later, that is when you are seeing the blues pop in, that is the effect of that higher dose, not the immediate effect you were going for. Blues are awesome to have. Someone explained to me that if you stay on a dose too long, you run the chance of getting Glucose Toxicity.
 
Noah & me said:
Hi Darnell, I did some digging for you. Please, any other members with experience in this feel free to jump in.
> SUGAR AND SUGAR SUBSTITUTES FOR YOUR CAT
These are the main culprits"
XYLITOL / all other names for this product have the word xylitolin them.
SACCHARIN (Sweet'N Low, Sugar Twin)
ASPARTAME (NutraSweet, Equal)
ACESULFAME potassium or ace-K (Sweet One, Swiss Sweet, Sunett), Sucralose, (Splenda)
This is the link for XYLITOL
https://www.google.ca/search?q=is xylitol bad for cats&oq=is xylitol bad for cats&gs_l=psy-ab.3..0.24776.32731.0.33711.14.14.0.0.0.0.252.2411.0j13j1.14.0....0...1.1.64.psy-ab..0.14.2372...0i67k1j0i7i30k1j0i22i30k1.0._8nQN191_S0
According to the American Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals,
xylitol is toxic to animals. In cats it can prompt a sudden release of insulin, resulting in low blood sugar,
a condition known as hypoglycemia. Ultimately a cat that eats xylitol may end up with liver failure, resulting in death.
This is the link for STEVIA
https://www.google.ca/search?source=hp&q=is stevia bad for cats&oq=is stevia bad for cats&gs_l=psy-ab.3..0j0i22i30k1l3.3475.21698.0.22538.17.17.0.0.0.0.258.2885.0j16j1.17.0....0...1.1j2.64.psy-ab..0.17.2874...0i131k1j0i7i30k1j0i13k1.0.KzrveJv_f3U
From Doctor Patty Kuhly of the Sunset Clinic in Miami.
"Dr. Kuhly says that cats can't taste sweet sweeteners as they lack the needed taste receptors in their mouth.
She says that, whether you think it's safe or not, you should never give a cat any type of sweetener.
Even with FDA approval that states "Pet Safe" cats can't taste sweet flavors anyway, it is more likely they're tasting something
something else in the food or medication".
*****************************************
Earlier you mentioned something about getting grief when you picked up your meds (maybe it was something else). Okay Darnell, YOU are the boss, YOU'RE paying for it and Sprocket is YOUR cat, end of story. All you have to do is ask what else is in these meds and specifically "Is there sugar or a sugar substitute in here?" If they say "I don't know" that's not an answer. If the say "Yes" make it clear to them Sprocket is diabetic. If they don't get it that is their problem and it's time to shop somewhere else.
*****************************************
I have not heard you say this in a while but you have said "The Board is not helping". There is no "board" the way you might think there is. If you buy a gigantic TV from Best Buy and have trouble with it there's a whole team of tech savvy people who are paid to help you. Here the board is just a few ordinary people with kids and cats and a pile of laundry. They are not always here. Have you noticed by now there is no advertising on the site and there was no membership fee? It's ALL done on donations and most of the replies you get are from ordinary people sitting at home. I donated $20 a long time ago, it should be $100 this year for all the free help I've received. And... Never contact the board about day to day medical problems. That is not why they're here, if they are here at all. They do care but there's only 6 or 8 of them and right now we have over 16,000 members!
*****************************************
This is the part where you might think I'm being mean, I'm not. If I or anyone else was mean we would just ignore you. Almost all the people that reply to you, and there's a lot of them, are doing it from the kindness of their hearts. We already have a diabetic cat, another with an UTI and yet another getting over a case of crystals. I hate to say this but you're not the only one.
*****************************************
Not being "Good" with computers. More than half the members are over 50 years old. Here's a few tips. I cannot work without a mouse, try one. (If you're left handed let me know) It's easier for me to curl up on the sofa with paper and a high-liter when I need to soak up details. In the first forum they will show you how to save thread to your computer. Or try what I do; open up a Word or Notepad file, left click and drag your mouse over the information you want, right click, then click on copy. Move to Word or Notepad and left click "Copy". Presto, just the parts that matter to you.
*****************************************
Now you really might hate me but give it a try. The titles for your threads are too long. Don't include Sprockets numbers in the title because anyone who reads your posts will see those numbers anyways on Sprockets spreadsheet. It's good to include the date (like you already do) and a new problem if there is one like "Sprocket's numbers are way down". Just be brief. We all know you and Sprocket by now and we all care for you.
*****************************************
You need day to day help. Me too! My wife is pretty much disabled, I have a serious brain injury. The help I get comes from my vet and the people here, that's what friends do. And they're still my friends even after I shoot my mouth off!
Okay everyone else, was that too much? Just one teensy tiny like would do it, not at the top of my game for a while now (Duh!)
Click to expand...

Reply******

Wow! Alot of info.
1st. I did see that info on the sugar substitutes. I said the same thing to this guy. I want to report him to the pharmacy board. When you ask for sugar free medicine for a diabetic you should not have to ask if they put sugar substitutes or sweetners to a pharmacist. They know this or should. I know many human diabetics that cant have sugar substitutes either. So its pathetic to have to ask that. No sugar means no sugar or substitutes to me. Plus I also read that they only found that xylitol us toxic to cats not long ago & its possible for them to say others will be too in future. It takes alot for them to announce it.
So no pharmacy for pet meds should be using sugar of any type for pets or sweetners especially when cat doesnt taste it anyway.
To me thats a duh!!!
This was my argument also.

When I say the board I say that because everyone on group always says to post on board. It gets frustrating to hear this so much especially when your freaking out & you just want quick opinions.
I know its all volunteer. I think most of those members are probably no longer around. I am appreciative to all the help i have received and have learned a great deal from posting. I had a person cause alot of issues before & I didnt report her but I think she caused more issues than I know about so therefore I am a little bitter about posting because i was getting ignored for awhile and I didnt do anything wrong. So now its hard for me to post.

I know I am not the only one with issues which is why I am back to posting.
Although many people always say the same thing....increase dose but when I do he drops alot and fast. Its like I have to feed him before he drops too much...it feels like a game with his glucuse and I must win. Its so scary.
I am creating another spreadsheet for my vets so the info is in order of it happening so to see what I am talking about easier. Its a tab next to my labs if you want to look. I am still filing it in.

As for the computers. My laptop is old and is not easy & super slow so I dont use it often. I have a kindle but the spreadsheet doesnt work on it so i use my cell mostly.
My cell is not easy too as I can copy n paste info but then i cant get it to my computer to get to print it. It just gets so frustrating. I have never had good luck with electronics.


I dont hate you at all. I am disabled too with many issues which is why alot is difficult. The memory issues can be the worst cause its just so frustrating especially when this little furry wonderful life is counting on you to figure it out.
I dont forget anyone whom has ever helped me in my life including all my helpers here. Especially the ones I drive nuts.
So i do appreciate all my helpers.
 
Darnell & Sprocket said:
I dont hate you at all. I am disabled too with many issues which is why alot is difficult. The memory issues can be the worst cause its just so frustrating especially when this little furry wonderful life is counting on you to figure it out.
I dont forget anyone whom has ever helped me in my life including all my helpers here. Especially the ones I drive nuts.
So i do appreciate all my helpers.
Click to expand...
Sorry Darnell, I didn't want you to hate what I was saying, nothing about hating you. Hate is a pretty strong word, nobody hates you.
If you sneak a peek at my profile I try to explain how a disability affects the way I look, everything I do or say. Standing at the counter asking for a what-cha-ma-call-it is frustrating so I just bring a list. When I came home from my adventures in neurology I sat next to one of our cats and could not remember his name so I know all about memory issues. The best therapy for me was reading, a dog that got me out of the house and knowing that when I came home someone who loved me would be there. You're allowed to make us nuts as long as we all get along. We all know you're frustrated but we know you didn't just give up either. Try not to let your emotions get in the way. I know that can be hard. :bighug: :banghead:
 
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