Fur baby in remission but something is wrong. SCARED

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dirtybirdsoaps

dirtybirdsoaps

Member Since 2014
Ok, first off I want to say thank you again to this board and everyones help. Hidey has been in remission for 3 1/2 years. He's been happy and healthy, besides dental issues, the entire time….and causing trouble. Its amazing, he acts like a kitten again……till Sunday. Sunday night he only ate half his dinner, which is strange because Sunday nights they get tuna and he LOVES his tuna. Then before bed we have a routine where he gets a treat (a few pieces of freeze dried chicken) only ate half, then I usually help him eat his dinner….yes I spoon feed him (spoiled….plus missing teeth so he gives up easily) and he wouldn't touch it. In the morning he ate his dry food. They get 1 TBS of young again zero mature, then usually he'll go eat his wet food. Well he wouldn't touch it. Its been the same thing since Sunday but now he's only eating 1/2 of the TBS of kibble. I have gotten him to eat a little of those new fancy feast treats that are ONLY moist chicken or tuna but now he's turning away from that. He's drinking a LOT of water. I checked his BG the other day and it was 81. Since he went into remission he's usually between 55-80 so that doesn't worry me. I have a vet appointment tomorrow morning at 8:30 but I'm FREAKING out thinking its something like CKD. I worry about that because my vet mentioned his numbers were slightly elevated when he first went into remission but tests after that showed no evidence. He just turned 16. Yes I know I'm lucky we hit this age but all cards on the table I lost my father suddenly last August to liver cancer. Ive been a wreck all year and am having a hard time knowing that one year mark is just around the corner and now something is wrong with my baby. He threw up today and it was a bit foamy and clear, nothing else. Sunday night someone threw up twice but I don't know who since I have 3 cats. One time was clear, the other was vomit.

Ok I need to stop rambling…..basically Im trying to do research on foods, meds, options for common illnesses with cats this age and diabetic. I have this fear of going to the vet and her saying this is it. I currently feed them Young Again zero mature, and holistic select canned food. Its lower in carbs and phos.

Anyone have any cats with these symptoms…..lazy, drink lots of water, still urinating, walking ok just slower, not eating?

Im HOPING its his teeth. His gums are red, and he hasn't had a cleaning in 2 years. I know he should have went but 2 years ago a WAR broke out in my house with all 3 cats and had to keep them separated and reintroduce after a WEEK. This happened several times so I try to keep the house calm. I have prepped for the vet visit. I have 6 flyways going in my house, appointment is first thing so I can bring him home take him in my bedroom and have him lay on his blankets to get his smell back. Hopefully this works because I can't mentally handle those fights right now. I seriously mean it was like strays fighting. I thought they were going to kill each other. In the past when his teeth bothered him he didn't act like this though.

Anyways enough rambling. Thank you for listening and ANY advice you can give.
 
dirtybirdsoaps said:
Ok, first off I want to say thank you again to this board and everyones help. Hidey has been in remission for 3 1/2 years. He's been happy and healthy, besides dental issues, the entire time….and causing trouble. Its amazing, he acts like a kitten again……till Sunday. Sunday night he only ate half his dinner, which is strange because Sunday nights they get tuna and he LOVES his tuna. Then before bed we have a routine where he gets a treat (a few pieces of freeze dried chicken) only ate half, then I usually help him eat his dinner….yes I spoon feed him (spoiled….plus missing teeth so he gives up easily) and he wouldn't touch it. In the morning he ate his dry food. They get 1 TBS of young again zero mature, then usually he'll go eat his wet food. Well he wouldn't touch it. Its been the same thing since Sunday but now he's only eating 1/2 of the TBS of kibble. I have gotten him to eat a little of those new fancy feast treats that are ONLY moist chicken or tuna but now he's turning away from that. He's drinking a LOT of water. I checked his BG the other day and it was 81. Since he went into remission he's usually between 55-80 so that doesn't worry me. I have a vet appointment tomorrow morning at 8:30 but I'm FREAKING out thinking its something like CKD. I worry about that because my vet mentioned his numbers were slightly elevated when he first went into remission but tests after that showed no evidence. He just turned 16. Yes I know I'm lucky we hit this age but all cards on the table I lost my father suddenly last August to liver cancer. Ive been a wreck all year and am having a hard time knowing that one year mark is just around the corner and now something is wrong with my baby. He threw up today and it was a bit foamy and clear, nothing else. Sunday night someone threw up twice but I don't know who since I have 3 cats. One time was clear, the other was vomit.

Ok I need to stop rambling…..basically Im trying to do research on foods, meds, options for common illnesses with cats this age and diabetic. I have this fear of going to the vet and her saying this is it. I currently feed them Young Again zero mature, and holistic select canned food. Its lower in carbs and phos.

Anyone have any cats with these symptoms…..lazy, drink lots of water, still urinating, walking ok just slower, not eating?

Im HOPING its his teeth. His gums are red, and he hasn't had a cleaning in 2 years. I know he should have went but 2 years ago a WAR broke out in my house with all 3 cats and had to keep them separated and reintroduce after a WEEK. This happened several times so I try to keep the house calm. I have prepped for the vet visit. I have 6 flyways going in my house, appointment is first thing so I can bring him home take him in my bedroom and have him lay on his blankets to get his smell back. Hopefully this works because I can't mentally handle those fights right now. I seriously mean it was like strays fighting. I thought they were going to kill each other. In the past when his teeth bothered him he didn't act like this though.

Anyways enough rambling. Thank you for listening and ANY advice you can give.
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No use panicking.... He's still eating, just not a lot.... When the lab results come in post them.

If it IS ckd there are many treatments that can prolong the advancement of it.

Could also be teeth or infection.


Let us know when you find out.
 
Sending prayers for you and your baby. I lost a beloved kitty to CKD because I foolishly trusted his vet who, without even doing any tests, told me he couldn't be treated and should be euthanized. If only I knew then what I know now, he would still be with me today. CKD is treatable! Please take heart, even if it is CKD there are paths open to you and your kitty to extend his life!

My condolences on the loss of your father. I lost my husband to liver cancer, I know what an awful disease it is. :bighug::bighug::bighug:
 
Squalliesmom said:
Sending prayers for you and your baby. I lost a beloved kitty to CKD because I foolishly trusted his vet who, without even doing any tests, told me he couldn't be treated and should be euthanized. If only I knew then what I know now, he would still be with me today. CKD is treatable! Please take heart, even if it is CKD there are paths open to you and your kitty to extend his life!

My condolences on the loss of your father. I lost my husband to liver cancer, I know what an awful disease it is. :bighug::bighug::bighug:
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Thank you for the comfort with both my problems. It is confirmed it is CKD. High end of stage 2,possibly early 3. He is getting IV fluids now. I have to pick hi up at about 4:30 unless they think he needs to stay overnight. Now I need to find a diet to work for both diseases.

As tot he liver cancer,OMG awful is an understatement. All cancer sucks but it was so sudden. He was sick,hospitals kept saying it was just a stomach ache until about 3 weeks later when they diagnosed him. He fought for a month after, it was the worse month of my life. He wouldn't stay in the hospital so the month was at his house, hospice was NO help. They let him run out of meds, didnt help with any of our concerns or issues. Me and my step mom winged it, but worst of all no one told us how GRUSOME it would get. I had such bad PTSD afterwards.
 
dirtybirdsoaps said:
Thank you for the comfort with both my problems. It is confirmed it is CKD. High end of stage 2,possibly early 3. He is getting IV fluids now. I have to pick hi up at about 4:30 unless they think he needs to stay overnight. Now I need to find a diet to work for both diseases.

As tot he liver cancer,OMG awful is an understatement. All cancer sucks but it was so sudden. He was sick,hospitals kept saying it was just a stomach ache until about 3 weeks later when they diagnosed him. He fought for a month after, it was the worse month of my life. He wouldn't stay in the hospital so the month was at his house, hospice was NO help. They let him run out of meds, didnt help with any of our concerns or issues. Me and my step mom winged it, but worst of all no one told us how GRUSOME it would get. I had such bad PTSD afterwards.
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Oh no... Sorry it's ckd. If you can post the labs we r might be able to suggest stuff.

Is good they have him on iv... That often helps to quickly bring down the creatnine, bun, and even phosphorus. He will feel much better afterwards.


There is a super helpful group in apart of on Facebook called Cats with Chronic Renal Failure. You should join.
 
Update: It is CKD. Stage 2,maybe 3.hard to tell at the moment because he does have a bladder infection as well. He is at the vet getting IV fluids. Vet has already talked about giving sub Q at home, an appetite stimulant, and a phos blocker(I'm assuming an antibiotic as well for the infection)
Any tips on a low carb food that is good for CKD cats as well? He's been in remission for so long, I'd like to keep it that way but will do whatever is necessary.
Currently he is on holistic select:

Chicken liver & lamb
Protein: 11.51%
Carbs: 1.21%
Phos: 0.34%

Chicken Pate
Protein: 11.94%
Carbs: 0.74%
Phos:0.29%

Turkey Pate
Protein: 12.58%
Carbs: 0.71%
Phos:0.31%

I have no clue what to look for. I'm trying to research as fast as I can. My vet said she was pretty sure only the special labeled food (science diet,royal canine etc) were ok but I'm pretty sure that's not the case.
 
I wanna say with doing sub q's at home my cat Zimmy stayed in stage 2 for two years before dying of some kind of stroke/hemmerage. His kidney disease barely progressed though.
 
dirtybirdsoaps said:
Update: It is CKD. Stage 2,maybe 3.hard to tell at the moment because he does have a bladder infection as well. He is at the vet getting IV fluids. Vet has already talked about giving sub Q at home, an appetite stimulant, and a phos blocker(I'm assuming an antibiotic as well for the infection)
Any tips on a low carb food that is good for CKD cats as well? He's been in remission for so long, I'd like to keep it that way but will do whatever is necessary.
Currently he is on holistic select:

Chicken liver & lamb
Protein: 11.51%
Carbs: 1.21%
Phos: 0.34%

Chicken Pate
Protein: 11.94%
Carbs: 0.74%
Phos:0.29%

Turkey Pate
Protein: 12.58%
Carbs: 0.71%
Phos:0.31%

I have no clue what to look for. I'm trying to research as fast as I can. My vet said she was pretty sure only the special labeled food (science diet,royal canine etc) were ok but I'm pretty sure that's not the case.
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Those foods are fine! You want to keep the phosphorus under about 0.8.

In telling you the sub q's made all the difference and since you are used to giving injections of will be no big deal. My Zimmy used to literally purr when it was sub q time because he felt so good after.
 
dirtybirdsoaps said:
Update: It is CKD. Stage 2,maybe 3.hard to tell at the moment because he does have a bladder infection as well. He is at the vet getting IV fluids. Vet has already talked about giving sub Q at home, an appetite stimulant, and a phos blocker(I'm assuming an antibiotic as well for the infection)
Any tips on a low carb food that is good for CKD cats as well? He's been in remission for so long, I'd like to keep it that way but will do whatever is necessary.
Currently he is on holistic select:

Chicken liver & lamb
Protein: 11.51%
Carbs: 1.21%
Phos: 0.34%

Chicken Pate
Protein: 11.94%
Carbs: 0.74%
Phos:0.29%

Turkey Pate
Protein: 12.58%
Carbs: 0.71%
Phos:0.31%

I have no clue what to look for. I'm trying to research as fast as I can. My vet said she was pretty sure only the special labeled food (science diet,royal canine etc) were ok but I'm pretty sure that's not the case.
Click to expand...
And if you use the phosphorus binder you can feed whatever food you want (that's low carb) because the binder is added. See what his phosphorus is though because if it's under 5 you may not need the binder yet.
 
Oops! Lab results
I have no clue how to attach the pic.

BUN 164 mg/dL
CREA 5.6 mg/dL
PHOS 11mg/dL

Those are the things for marked for me to pay attention to.Also on his blood work that were in the high range
AMYL 1756 U/L
TP 8.8 g/dL

Low
Potassium 3.5 mmol/L
Sodium 136 mmol/L

Urine sample showed two things that were low
LYMPHS 1.2510^9/l
MPV 10.0 fl
 
JanetNJ said:
Those foods are fine! You want to keep the phosphorus under about 0.8.

In telling you the sub q's made all the difference and since you are used to giving injections of will be no big deal. My Zimmy used to literally purr when it was sub q time because he felt so good after.
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What about the protein though? I new to this and scrambling for research like when I found out it was diabetes lol butI thought I want low protein & low phos?
 
There are a number of problems with a low protein diet. See http://www.felinecrf.org/nutritional_requirements.htm

Also, in regards to diabetes, the problem with a low protein diet is that the protein is replaced by carbs.

Your best bet is a regular high protein diet supplemented with a phosphorus binder. http://www.felinecrf.org/phosphorus_binders.htm
The binder I've seen in vet clinics is designed for dogs. It contains a sweetener and is mint flavoured. You should look instead at aluminum hydroxide powder available at thrivingpets.com. A lot of people have used it and have good experience with it.
 
dirtybirdsoaps said:
What about the protein though? I new to this and scrambling for research like when I found out it was diabetes lol butI thought I want low protein & low phos?
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I wouldn't worry about the protien, more concerned with the phosphorus. They will probably run another blood sample after the iv drip and hopefully everything will lower a bit. How much does your cat weigh?
 
Currently he is on holistic select:

Chicken liver & lamb
Protein: 45.53%
Carbs: 5.18%
Phos: 1.34%

Chicken Pate
Protein: 47.34%
Carbs: 2.93%
Phos:1.15%

Turkey Pate
Protein: 49.94%
Carbs: 2.82%
Phos:1.23%

I have no clue what to look for. I'm trying to research as fast as I can. My vet said she was pretty sure only the special labeled food (science diet,royal canine etc) were ok but I'm pretty sure that's not the case.

Added dry matter, just realized that was as fed
 
Red & Rover (GA) said:
There are a number of problems with a low protein diet. See http://www.felinecrf.org/nutritional_requirements.htm

Also, in regards to diabetes, the problem with a low protein diet is that the protein is replaced by carbs.

Your best bet is a regular high protein diet supplemented with a phosphorus binder. http://www.felinecrf.org/phosphorus_binders.htm
The binder I've seen in vet clinics is designed for dogs. It contains a sweetener and is mint flavoured. You should look instead at aluminum hydroxide powder available at thrivingpets.com. A lot of people have used it and have good experience with it.
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Yes def get aluminum hydroxide instead of whatever the vet gives you. You can even get it on amazon.
 
JanetNJ said:
I wouldn't worry about the protien, more concerned with the phosphorus. They will probably run another blood sample after the iv drip and hopefully everything will lower a bit. How much does your cat weigh?
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Last week he was 10lbs 9.4 oz, today he was 9 lbs6oz

I updated the values of the food, I realized I entered as fed,not dry matter
 
dirtybirdsoaps said:
Currently he is on holistic select:

Chicken liver & lamb
Protein: 45.53%
Carbs: 5.18%
Phos: 1.34%

Chicken Pate
Protein: 47.34%
Carbs: 2.93%
Phos:1.15%

Turkey Pate
Protein: 49.94%
Carbs: 2.82%
Phos:1.23%

I have no clue what to look for. I'm trying to research as fast as I can. My vet said she was pretty sure only the special labeled food (science diet,royal canine etc) were ok but I'm pretty sure that's not the case.

Added dry matter, just realized that was as fed
Click to expand...
You can give these foods but you must use the binder. They are too high in phosphorus.
 
JanetNJ said:
I wouldn't worry about the protien, more concerned with the phosphorus. They will probably run another blood sample after the iv drip and hopefully everything will lower a bit. How much does your cat weigh?
Click to expand...


Thank you.I will order now. Do you think I need to look for new food though. I updated the food %.I realized Iprovided the "as fed" values not "dry matter"
 
JanetNJ said:
Ok so your cat will need 100 ml of sub q's. He doesn't have any heart issues that you know of, right?
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Correct. Only issue she's ever had is his teeth and the diabetes. I am having a heck of a time looking at food charts lol.Im a mental wreck. I found a binder, also called my vet to see what they have there just to make sure they don't have what's suggested.
 
My ckd cat was not my diabetic cat... the weruva bff cans were good for both. I never needed the binder though because Zimmy's phosphorus was always under 5... So I kept it down with food alone.
But your cats is very high... Even with the lower phosphorus food you will want to use a binder, so I say feed him whatever he likes. The biggest concern with ckd cats is when they stop eating well and loose weight. So keep him happy and eating.
 
dirtybirdsoaps said:
Thank you for the comfort with both my problems. It is confirmed it is CKD. High end of stage 2,possibly early 3. He is getting IV fluids now. I have to pick hi up at about 4:30 unless they think he needs to stay overnight. Now I need to find a diet to work for both diseases.

As tot he liver cancer,OMG awful is an understatement. All cancer sucks but it was so sudden. He was sick,hospitals kept saying it was just a stomach ache until about 3 weeks later when they diagnosed him. He fought for a month after, it was the worse month of my life. He wouldn't stay in the hospital so the month was at his house, hospice was NO help. They let him run out of meds, didnt help with any of our concerns or issues. Me and my step mom winged it, but worst of all no one told us how GRUSOME it would get. I had such bad PTSD afterwards.
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I am in agreement with the suggestions for a high-protein, low-carb food with a phosphorus binder added to it. Tanya's site (felinecrf.org) is a wonderful help, I definitely suggest visiting there.

My husband had a gall bladder attack, that's when they diagnosed the cancer. He fought it for about 14 months; it was terrible. The last week the hospital sent him home from a week-long stay, supposedly with help from hospice, and they did nothing for us, either. I have nothing good to say about my local hospice. It was a nightmare. He was only 56. I can well understand your PTSD.
 
JanetNJ said:
Here's an aluminum hydroxide.

Rx Vitamins Phos-Bind Powder, 200g/One Size https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00PT4ORD8/?tag=felinediabetesfdmb-20
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Added to my cart already :)

I found a few to try. I think we're going to try the wysong line again. They have a few he might eat. My cats LOVED the weruva but Hidey doesn't have several teeth and would gag on the shreds, which is funny because he would never touch pate until that started to happen.

I'm thinking we'll get the binder regardless and try:

Merrill limited ingredient duck
.80 phos, 30.40 protein, 5.54 carbs

NaturesLogic Beef
.58 phos,47.20 protein, 1.23 carbs

I'm also going to see if I can get him to eat one of these

Soulistic chicken glee pate & shreds
.83 phos, 48.23 protein, 5.05 carbs

Instinct venison
.91 phos, 50 protein,4.18 carbs

Instinct rabbit
.91 phos, 45 protein, 5.73 carbs

Whole earth farm duck recipepate
.80 phos, 40.80 protein, 5.27 carbs
 
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Squalliesmom said:
I am in agreement with the suggestions for a high-protein, low-carb food with a phosphorus binder added to it. Tanya's site (felinecrf.org) is a wonderful help, I definitely suggest visiting there.

My husband had a gall bladder attack, that's when they diagnosed the cancer. He fought it for about 14 months; it was terrible. The last week the hospital sent him home from a week-long stay, supposedly with help from hospice, and they did nothing for us, either. I have nothing good to say about my local hospice. It was a nightmare. He was only 56. I can well understand your PTSD.
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So sorry for your loss. My dad was 59.I kept reading how they say look for reviews for hospice. Who has time?! They didnt even think my father would make it a week when he was leaving the hospital. I honestly think he wouldn't have if he stayed there since he hated hospitals, but OMG was that a bad/hard month although I wouldn't have NOT been there.
 
Just read your post. I had a lovely calico many years ago who had CKD. At first giving the fluids can be stressful, but there are ways to calm the process down, so to speak.

Ask your vet about warming the fluids. A friend of mine used to do that with his 20+YO Siamese kitty and she actually started to look forward to her nightly sub-q. Lived to nearly 22.

I wish you and your baby well and send good thoughts to you both.
 
Hidey is home but VERY weak. I actually have to take him to the litter box and he'll just lay there and go. This morning was our first day at Sub-Q and it when surprisingly quick and easy. Since Hidey hasn't really eaten since Sunday I went to the store and bought a syringe to feed him. First time was a disaster probably only got about 1 tsp in him, second time not as bad but still a tsp, and about a half hour ago I managed about 3 tsp and he ate about 1-2tsp of tuna on his own. Afterwards he bathed his front paws and face for a minute. It's sad how excited I was to see him eat even a little but then BATHE even if it was just for a second. He hasn't bathed or did anything since he came home yesterday. I have him secluded in our bedroom away from my other 2 which crushes me because I have to go back and forth splitting my time so I don't neglect one and one of mine hisses at Hidey when he sees me take him to the litter box. My other, yuri, hasn't even acknowledged Hidey. I'm scared when he does because him and Hidey get into it BAD when they have those fights.
 
shelaghc said:
Just read your post. I had a lovely calico many years ago who had CKD. At first giving the fluids can be stressful, but there are ways to calm the process down, so to speak.

Ask your vet about warming the fluids. A friend of mine used to do that with his 20+YO Siamese kitty and she actually started to look forward to her nightly sub-q. Lived to nearly 22.

I wish you and your baby well and send good thoughts to you both.
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Yup. I was told by my vet to warm it a bit and makes it easier on him. I'm shocked it was so quick!
 
dirtybirdsoaps said:
Hidey is home but VERY weak. I actually have to take him to the litter box and he'll just lay there and go. This morning was our first day at Sub-Q and it when surprisingly quick and easy. Since Hidey hasn't really eaten since Sunday I went to the store and bought a syringe to feed him. First time was a disaster probably only got about 1 tsp in him, second time not as bad but still a tsp, and about a half hour ago I managed about 3 tsp and he ate about 1-2tsp of tuna on his own. Afterwards he bathed his front paws and face for a minute. It's sad how excited I was to see him eat even a little but then BATHE even if it was just for a second. He hasn't bathed or did anything since he came home yesterday. I have him secluded in our bedroom away from my other 2 which crushes me because I have to go back and forth splitting my time so I don't neglect one and one of mine hisses at Hidey when he sees me take him to the litter box. My other, yuri, hasn't even acknowledged Hidey. I'm scared when he does because him and Hidey get into it BAD when they have those fights.
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awe poor angel. It's so sad when they don't feel well.
 
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