? Creamsicle's Spreadsheet confusing! Help!

[Caren and Creamsickle]

We are still confused by Creamsicle's spreadsheet and his fluctuating bg.
Just when I think I understand it or see a pattern, it changes.
Anyone can help me with this?

I test him often which is getting difficult for us and Creamie. Gave him a little break a couple of days last week. Vet says don't test so much but I feel we don't have him under control.

Any input would be greatly appreciated.

 

[Bobbie And Bubba]

It looks like Creamie is clearing the bounce caused from the 82 on the PM cycle of 5/19. This is the 5th cycle since then and we give it 6 for bounces to clear. I wouldn't be surprised if you see a green by tonight. He is looking good. Keep posting and keep asking questions.

Ignore your vet about now testing so much. In order to keep Creamie safe and to know how low the insulin is taking him, you need to test and get that data so you can increase if necessary or decrease if he gets to low. Most vets don't have kitties in their practice that have gone into remission because they don't know how to guide them to do so. My vet told me if I could keep Bubba under 200 and no more than 2 units of insulin a day that he would be doing well. That was not good enough for me, I wanted remission. Glad I ignored my vet and took the advice of the peeps here that have so much more experience with getting cats regulated and /or into remission.

 

[Sienne and Gabby (GA)]

I agree with Bobbi -- Creamsickle likes to bounce. It may help to keep in mind that bounces are hugely annoying but they are a normal part of the process.

A couple of thoughts...

Stick with one meter. Most people here uses a human meter for a few reasons. The dosing methods -- both TR and SLGS -- are written based on values from a human meter. Strips for a human meter are widely available (including nights, weekends, and holidays) vs for an AT where you have to have them on hand. The human meter strips are also much less expensive. Going between meters will also make you cross-eyed.

If you get a pre-shot number that is lower than you're comfortable with, you have three options -- stall (without feeding), shoot a reduced dose, or skip the shot. Doing more than one of these options in one cycle (e.g., stalling and shooting a reduced dose has double the effect on the depot. Ultimately, you want to be able to work your way down to shooting low numbers. Start thinking about what approximate number you'd be comfortable shooting.

Keep notes in the comments section of your spreadsheet if you aren't sticking with a dosing method. For example, I haven't a clue why you shot 1.0u at PMPS on 5/17. There may have been a great reason but if you're wanting help with interpreting your kitty's SS, it helps to have all of the information easily accessible and in one place.

While your kitty is bouncy, he's clearing the bounces pretty quickly. This means more work for you since there's no way to reliably guess when the bounce may break and numbers may go from red to blue or green. So far, Creamsickle is in very safe numbers. However, given the size of the drop, there's a good chance you'll see some bouncing given a drop of over 200 points by +5.

The best way I know of to try to flatten out the numbers is to do everything you can to prevent your kitty from earning a reduction. You want to maximize the amount of insulin while using food to prevent a reduction. This allows Creamsickle's body to get more accustomed to lower numbers vs panicking when he's in blues.

 

[Caren and Creamsickle]

I agree with Bobbi -- Creamsickle likes to bounce. It may help to keep in mind that bounces are hugely annoying but they are a normal part of the process.

A couple of thoughts...

Stick with one meter. Most people here uses a human meter for a few reasons. The dosing methods -- both TR and SLGS -- are written based on values from a human meter. Strips for a human meter are widely available (including nights, weekends, and holidays) vs for an AT where you have to have them on hand. The human meter strips are also much less expensive. Going between meters will also make you cross-eyed.

If you get a pre-shot number that is lower than you're comfortable with, you have three options -- stall (without feeding), shoot a reduced dose, or skip the shot. Doing more than one of these options in one cycle (e.g., stalling and shooting a reduced dose has double the effect on the depot. Ultimately, you want to be able to work your way down to shooting low numbers. Start thinking about what approximate number you'd be comfortable shooting.

Keep notes in the comments section of your spreadsheet if you aren't sticking with a dosing method. For example, I haven't a clue why you shot 1.0u at PMPS on 5/17. There may have been a great reason but if you're wanting help with interpreting your kitty's SS, it helps to have all of the information easily accessible and in one place.

While your kitty is bouncy, he's clearing the bounces pretty quickly. This means more work for you since there's no way to reliably guess when the bounce may break and numbers may go from red to blue or green. So far, Creamsickle is in very safe numbers. However, given the size of the drop, there's a good chance you'll see some bouncing given a drop of over 200 points by +5.

The best way I know of to try to flatten out the numbers is to do everything you can to prevent your kitty from earning a reduction. You want to maximize the amount of insulin while using food to prevent a reduction. This allows Creamsickle's body to get more accustomed to lower numbers vs panicking when he's in blues.

Thanks for that info. My concern is that he drops low sometimes and we're afraid he's going to go lower during the night or when we may not be home to test. In those cases we should give food so he doesn't go too low?

 

[Caren and Creamsickle]

It looks like Creamie is clearing the bounce caused from the 82 on the PM cycle of 5/19. This is the 5th cycle since then and we give it 6 for bounces to clear. I wouldn't be surprised if you see a green by tonight. He is looking good. Keep posting and keep asking questions.

Ignore your vet about now testing so much. In order to keep Creamie safe and to know how low the insulin is taking him, you need to test and get that data so you can increase if necessary or decrease if he gets to low. Most vets don't have kitties in their practice that have gone into remission because they don't know how to guide them to do so. My vet told me if I could keep Bubba under 200 and no more than 2 units of insulin a day that he would be doing well. That was not good enough for me, I wanted remission. Glad I ignored my vet and took the advice of the peeps here that have so much more experience with getting cats regulated and /or into remission.

My vet will be happy with anything under 200 but I feel that's still high. And how will we know if he's too low if we don't test. We only test on ear and his ears sometimes look so beat up. I feel bad.
Sometimes it's hard because we have to be home at those specific times to test and give shots.
Thanks for your help.

 

[Caren and Creamsickle]

Would you increase by .25 yet or wait longer. Every time I think we should increase he drops low!

 

[Bobbie And Bubba]

Have you tried Neosporin ointment with pain reliever? I used to put some on Bubba's ears when they started looking red and beat up. It really helped a lot and the pain reliever gave him some relief.

I would hold this dose through tonight to give the bounce the full 6 cycles to clear and see where he lands by tomorrow morning.

 

[Caren and Creamsickle]

I read and vet said that neosporin was not good for cats. I've been just using Vaseline, but that doesn't help too much and does nothing for pain.

 

[Bobbie And Bubba]

I read and vet said that neosporin was not good for cats. I've been just using Vaseline, but that doesn't help too much and does nothing for pain.[/QUOT
A lot of us here use it on our cat's pricked ears but , just a dab. I have read that using it on large wounds is not advisable for small pricks on the ears is not an issue. But, you have to be comfortable with using it.

 

[Caren and Creamsickle]

Oh ok that's good then. I will get the one with the pain reliever. Thanks!

 

[Caren and Creamsickle]

It looks like Creamie is clearing the bounce caused from the 82 on the PM cycle of 5/19. This is the 5th cycle since then and we give it 6 for bounces to clear. I wouldn't be surprised if you see a green by tonight. He is looking good. Keep posting and keep asking questions.

Ignore your vet about now testing so much. In order to keep Creamie safe and to know how low the insulin is taking him, you need to test and get that data so you can increase if necessary or decrease if he gets to low. Most vets don't have kitties in their practice that have gone into remission because they don't know how to guide them to do so. My vet told me if I could keep Bubba under 200 and no more than 2 units of insulin a day that he would be doing well. That was not good enough for me, I wanted remission. Glad I ignored my vet and took the advice of the peeps here that have so much more experience with getting cats regulated and /or into remission.

Well, I was hoping for a better number. His pmps is 246.Guess tomorrow morning I will increase dose.

 

[Bobbie And Bubba]

Well, I was hoping for a better number. His pmps is 246.Guess tomorrow morning I will increase dose.

Ha! You are all ready getting greedy for blues and greens! It happens to the best of us. Still, just look back over the SS and see how far he has come.

 

[rhiannon and shadow (GA)]

i would like to give you a possible scenario.....


on 5/19 pmps was 198.... then a mere 5 hours later, you've got a green 82.....
greens are no longer normal to Creamsicle.... so by morning when you tested next, he's bounced up to red...
he cleared the bounce fairly quickly right back down to the yellows..., then blues.... and then by next morning.....
right back up to red....


so here's the possibility , but only provable with data....

on his ss, getting greens triggers him to bounce to red..... and likely getting low greens triggers him to bounce to black....

I know it's hard to do.... I had the same difficulties....
but it would be so helpful to have a +9 or +10 in the pm cycle.... ever so often.... ( not nightly)
but maybe when he starts in a low yellow or even a blue.....
{you could use the glass of water trick so you get up for the bathroom and grab a test, run back to bed}

the spreadsheet is like a jigsaw puzzle.....
so it helps ever so often to get a piece in those unknown areas so you might get a glimpse of the big picture.

He might even show you something tonight.....

an increase will make it more apparent even sooner if he's working his way towards a reduction.....
that's why you could feed.... right before you go to bed when you know you aren't getting up at all for a later test.....
steer him upwards a little and help his numbers flatten out.

The good news is he's only traveling up and down 3 floors, instead of all of them .....
It's even more frustrating to see black and green constantly....

 

[Caren and Creamsickle]

Ha! You are all ready getting greedy for blues and greens! It happens to the best of us. Still, just look back over the SS and see how far he has come.

You're right but I am just trying to find a pattern... not easy!

 

[Caren and Creamsickle]

i would like to give you a possible scenario.....


on 5/19 pmps was 198.... then a mere 5 hours later, you've got a green 82.....
greens are no longer normal to Creamsicle.... so by morning when you tested next, he's bounced up to red...
he cleared the bounce fairly quickly right back down to the yellows..., then blues.... and then by next morning.....
right back up to red....


so here's the possibility , but only provable with data....

on his ss, getting greens triggers him to bounce to red..... and likely getting low greens triggers him to bounce to black....

I know it's hard to do.... I had the same difficulties....
but it would be so helpful to have a +9 or +10 in the pm cycle.... ever so often.... ( not nightly)
but maybe when he starts in a low yellow or even a blue.....
{you could use the glass of water trick so you get up for the bathroom and grab a test, run back to bed}

the spreadsheet is like a jigsaw puzzle.....
so it helps ever so often to get a piece in those unknown areas so you might get a glimpse of the big picture.

He might even show you something tonight.....

an increase will make it more apparent even sooner if he's working his way towards a reduction.....
that's why you could feed.... right before you go to bed when you know you aren't getting up at all for a later test.....
steer him upwards a little and help his numbers flatten out.

The good news is he's only traveling up and down 3 floors, instead of all of them .....
It's even more frustrating to see black and green constantly....

Thanks Rhiannon. What you say makes sense. I will try on the weekend to do a +9 and 10.

So if I have this right, I can increase his dose but if I think he's getting too low and he will bounce, give him food to keep him even. Is that what you mean??

 

[rhiannon and shadow (GA)]

Yes.
Sometimes , ( with emphasis) you can slow them down earning that decrease in dose and flatten out the cycle.

Just like human diabetics, frequent small meals are best for their pancreas, keeps their blood sugar more even......