? 3/26 phoebes amps 343 dosecrease 4.75 +2 267 +4 254 breath smelling fruity neg ketones checked 2x a

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Good luck with the dosecrease. Maybe some action today, the +2 was a big drop. Yesterday the same but she flatten out again. Fingers and Paws crossed for some progress to the blue floor today.
 
She's eating every 2 hours pretty much. Sometimes I can get it to 21/2 hours. But she won't lay down just keeps pacing back and forth to the dish and me. You would think she is exhausted. :(
 
Nan & Amber said:
I know it's only been a few days, but does she seem as if she's moving any better on the adequan?
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She has moments @Nan & Amber today she's walking wobbly. Checked ketones all good. She's been quiet, but it hot here (for me) so the ac is in, and hope I'm not making her to cold. We tried the cleaning last night but she was having none of it, if she's fighting and we are holding her down I don't want her to hurt herself. So I just gently wiped what I could. And called it quits. She's not been sleeping much.
 
Aw, poor Phoebe.

When I've had cats that needed help cleaning, but didn't want help cleaning, the only thing I've been able to do is just work on it a little at a time-- a swipe here, a swipe there, and just try to improve things as I could. You could also try the "kitty burrito" method, but in general I agree that having to hold a cat down for something like a cleaning is no bueno, especially with an older cat with mobility issues, if they can't be completely immobilized it seems like they will hurt themselves trying to escape. :(

Glad ketones are negative. One day at a time...
 
I don't like the sound of that... That sounds like a sign of ketones, but with the negative tests, it shouldn't be, right? I know that ketones can take a little while to show up in the urine, but that would be a very rapid progression to be able to smell them on the breath.

Not sure on this. Maybe someone else can weigh in-- I don't know that there are tons of people online this afternoon, but if you put a ? in the subject line, maybe a few with DKA experience will stop by.
 
Nan & Amber said:
I don't like the sound of that... That sounds like a sign of ketones, but with the negative tests, it shouldn't be, right? I know that ketones can take a little while to show up in the urine, but that would be a very rapid progression to be able to smell them on the breath.

Not sure on this. Maybe someone else can weigh in-- I don't know that there are tons of people online this afternoon, but if you put a ? in the subject line, maybe a few with DKA experience will stop by.
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I have a very sensitive nose dh says he smells fruity around mouth, I just cleaned it she was a champ. But her Salvia doesnt. She's acting ok otherwise and she let me wash her backend a little so yay!
 
That's good to hear, Tricia.

Gill, I'm still confused-- I always thought ketones showed up in blood first, then urine? I don't understand how they'd be in urine sooner.
 
Nan & Amber said:
That's good to hear, Tricia.

Gill, I'm still confused-- I always thought ketones showed up in blood first, then urine? I don't understand how they'd be in urine sooner.
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Nan you are correct. Ketones show up in the blood sooner. As they increase in the blood they will "spill over" into the urine. That is why people who have kitties that have had DKA and are more prone to reoccurence. will often use a blood ketone meter for testing in order to catch them faster
 
Gill & George said:
I meant they show up sooner in urine than in blood.
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Gill,l it's the opposite, ketones show up in blood right away and it can take up to 8 hours for them to show in the urine . Beside the meter being easier than trying to catch kitty in the LB, that is another one of their positive attributes that they can help beans with kitties with ketones know that they are present faster.
 
Bobbie And Bubba said:
Gill,l it's the opposite, ketones show up in blood right away and it can take up to 8 hours for them to show in the urine . Beside the meter being easier than trying to catch kitty in the LB, that is another one of their positive attributes that they can help beans with kitties with ketones know that they are present faster.
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No it's not Bobbie , though I know that some folk believe this but I think it's just one of those things that has been said and then repeated until it becomes true, Jill actually pointed this out to me a while back.


Here are couple of the links she gave me (I was on my tablet this morning, hadn't had my coffee yet, should have linked them in my earlier post, sorry.

"At low levels, ketones can be detected in the urine (ketonuria) before they are found in the blood (ketonemia/ketonaemia)[37]."
http://petdiabetes.wikia.com/wiki/Ketoacidosis

"In conditions associated with acidosis, urinary ketones are tested to assess the severity of acidosis and to monitor treatment response. Urine ketones appear before there is any significant increase in blood ketones;[2] therefore, urine ketone measurement is especially helpful in emergency situations" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketonuria

I wonder if the confusion on this matter has arisen from the fact that raised glucose levels are more accurately measured by blood readings and someone somewhere at some point has just extrapolated.
 
Gill & George said:
No it's not Bobbie , though I know that some folk believe this but I think it's just one of those things that has been said and then repeated until it becomes true, Jill actually pointed this out to me a while back.


Here are couple of the links she gave me (I was on my tablet this morning, hadn't had my coffee yet, should have linked them in my earlier post, sorry.

"At low levels, ketones can be detected in the urine (ketonuria) before they are found in the blood (ketonemia/ketonaemia)[37]."
http://petdiabetes.wikia.com/wiki/Ketoacidosis

"In conditions associated with acidosis, urinary ketones are tested to assess the severity of acidosis and to monitor treatment response. Urine ketones appear before there is any significant increase in blood ketones;[2] therefore, urine ketone measurement is especially helpful in emergency situations" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ketonuria

I wonder if the confusion on this matter has arisen from the fact that raised glucose levels are more accurately measured by blood readings and someone somewhere at some point has just extrapolated.
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That is sure interesting. When I was going through Ketones with Bubba I am sure that it was Jill that gave me all the info on how to interpret ketone meter reading and talked about them showing up in blood faster than urine.
 
"The ketones accumulate in the blood, eventually go to the kidneys and are released from the body through urine."

"
Reasons for ketone blood testing:

Accuracy – Certain medications can give false readings when testing with urine. Levadopa taken for Parkinson’s or Restless Leg Syndrome can cause a false negative result. Ace Inhibitors such as Lisinopril can cause false positives when using urine tests containing nitroprussides. Highly colored urine as when taking Pyridium (for painful urinary tract infections – turns urine purple) can cause a false reading as well as using a medication called Depakote. Urine can be inaccurate due to sitting in the bladder for an extended period or remaining in the ambient air for a long time. Urine concentration can cause inaccurate results. Menstrual blood in the sample will cause inaccuracy. Excess ascorbic acid or Vitamin C can cause a false positive result. Urine test strip reagents lose potency when exposed to air; bottles of strips open for 90 days can cause inaccurate results. Blood strips are individually wrapped in tin foil packaging."


This was written for human but I am sure the same principles apply with our kitties.
https://www.adwdiabetes.com/articles/why-test-ketones-blood-urine-more-accurate
 
Bobbie And Bubba said:
That is sure interesting. When I was going through Ketones with Bubba I am sure that it was Jill that gave me all the info on how to interpret ketone meter reading and talked about them showing up in blood faster than urine.
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I guess getting the blood readings with some of our more potty shy kitties is easier, so you can test more often.
 
In my notes here is something I saved written by Jill:


Testing for ketones with a meter rather than strips. Jill and Alex
6.6.16 on Anastastia thread.
Just a quick note about testing for ketones...
Using a blood ketone meter will give you current results.
Testing urine for ketones will provide you with a snap shot of what was happening in kitty's body hours ago... some say 4 - 5 hours ago.
 
One more a study:

"
CONCLUSIONS:
In hyperglycaemic patients in the Emergency Department, a good correlation was observed between urine ketones and capillary blood ketones for low values, but a poor correlation was observed for high values. Either test can therefore be used to exclude ketosis, but the capillary blood ketones test is more accurate to confirm ketoacidosis."

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/17320448




 
Bobbie And Bubba said:
Angela, so sorry for highjacking your thread but this is important information and we need to all be clear about it. @Jill & Alex (GA) can you help with this debate so we all know which is best, the urine test strips or the ketone blood meter. I don't want to be giving inaccurate information.
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No worries I am glad for the discussion, knowledge is power. And I want it all. :)
 
I use the Precision Xtra by Abbott. The meter is not too expensive, maybe 35 bucks on Amazon. The test strips are expensive! The cheapest place I found them are Universal Pharmacy in Canada.
 
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