Gill & George
Very Active Member
I think its to do with the quality of the protein, if you look at the list of ingredients that might shed some light.
Sorry I've never used it and the formulation in the us is likely different to UK
? 2/20 Chase-New with SLGS-AMPS 237, +1 163, +2 78, +3 155, +11.25 144 human meter, +1 157, +2.25 155
- Thread starter Sandi & Chase in AZ
- Start date
- Status
Sorry I've never used it and the formulation in the us is likely different to UK
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
I don't know that he wasn't going low. I suspect that maybe he has been all along.
Doodles & Karen
Very Active Member
We usually don't take back to back reductions because of the depot which is why @Marje and Gracie is recommending you hold the dose. Given your situation with working, being new and changes with Chase I recommend you do reduce the dose tonight to .1u. Worse case you have to go back up in dose which is not the end of the world. Safety first.Wait.... what?Marje said that since I only just took him down to .25 that I shouldn't change anything right away. I'm so, so confused.
See the second bullet point below in the SLGS sticky.
Hold the dose for at least a week:
- Unless your cat won’t eat or you suspect hypoglycemia
- Unless your kitty falls below 90 mg/dL (5 mmol/L). If kitty falls below 90 mg/dL (5 mmol/L) decrease the dose by 0.25 unit immediately
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
79 BG 20 minutes after good portion of HC. Putting down more.
Doodles & Karen
Very Active Member
Ok breath, he's safe. You're doing good and sure Chase is liking the extra food . Check again in 30 min. Might even add a little LC to the HC this way it helps keep him surfing
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
I haven't been able to do this quick enough. At AMPS he was 237, at +1 he was 163, at +2 he dropped to 78. With mixing up more HC food, I didn't get a test in until +3, and he is still only at 79. He has had almost all of 1/2 day worth of food, plus extra HC. Gravy at 2 different times and blended up food 2 times. I know that his number is safe, so I guess I will just have to leave out HC food. I MUST get to work. If I lose my job I can't take care of Chase at all.
Gill & George
Very Active Member
It is confusing and it may be an issue in which some of us disagree, so you may need to make an informed choice.Marje said that since I only just took him down to .25 that I shouldn't change anything right away. I'm so, so confused.
Because Lantus is a depot insulin, this means that part of the dose gets to work straight away and another part is stored and slow released, the size of the depot (stored slow release) is directly related to the size of the dose, the larger the dose the larger the depot. Every time you change a dose the depot has to adjust, so if you take the dose up it takes up to 6 cycles for the depot to refill and for you to see the full effect of the dose. If you take the dose down it takes 6 cycles to for the depot to reduce and for you to see the full effect of the reduction.
So because you only just took the dose down, this mornings cycle is likely influenced by the depot of the 0.5u you shot yesterday.
So usually we don't take back to back reductions, because if we get to ahead of ourselves with the reductions it can back fire and yes though we can take the dose back up sometimes it can back fire and we have seen instances of having to go way back up the dosing ladder before we start to see the nicer numbers again.
Ideally to get the best chance of remission, we would like to see him flatten out, and have his ss looking mostly green. (or Green/blue as you are doing slgs), continuing with insulin support for as long as it is safe to do so.
There's some time yet before you have to make that decision, so first things first and lets get this kitties numbers up.
78 is safe, but would like to seem him up higher.
If he doesn't like the HC food, how about adding honey/syrup to his ff if he likes that and eats it with gusto.
That will make his usual food HC. A couple of teaspoons of honey, or a good dollop (don't want to get to scientific on you
)Just mix it right in with his FF
ETA Just to be clear I was following on from previous post where I said to leave a whole tin out and so adding a teaspoon to a whole tin and mixing it in. Too much honey can make a kitty sick.
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Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
Oh... ok. I see what you're saying. Its very difficult to see that amount of insulin. Will this be 1/2 of the .25?
Gill & George
Very Active Member
Leave him a lot of food down, it doesn't matter if he overeats for a day. It's important to keep him safe.He has had almost all of 1/2 day worth of food, plus extra HC. Gravy at 2 different times and blended up food 2 times. I know that his number is safe, so I guess I will just have to leave out HC food. I MUST get to work. If I lose my job I can't take care of Chase at all.
If he is more likely to eat the FF do mix that in with honey, it will carb him up nicely.
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
Oh... he likes ALL of the food. I'm lucky, that way. When he was first diagnosed I did have to resort to baby food, just to get him to eat. But since he's been on insulin for a while, his appetite is back to the way it always has been. Food is this guy's best friend. LOL. I'm a close 2nd, though..It is confusing and it may be an issue in which some of us disagree, so you may need to make an informed choice.
Because Lantus is a depot insulin, this means that part of the dose gets to work straight away and another part is stored and slow released, the size of the depot (stored slow release) is directly related to the size of the dose, the larger the dose the larger the depot. Every time you change a dose the depot has to adjust, so if you take the dose up it takes up to 6 cycles for the depot to refill and for you to see the full effect of the dose. If you take the dose down it takes 6 cycles to for the depot to reduce and for you to see the full effect of the reduction.
So because you only just took the dose down, this mornings cycle is likely influenced by the depot of the 0.5u you shot yesterday.
So usually we don't take back to back reductions, because if we get to ahead of ourselves with the reductions it can back fire and yes though we can take the dose back up sometimes it can back fire and we have seen instances of having to go way back up the dosing ladder before we start to see the nicer numbers again.
Ideally to get the best chance of remission, we would like to see him flatten out, and have his ss looking mostly green. (or Green/blue as you are doing slgs), continuing with insulin support for as long as it is safe to do so.
There's some time yet before you have to make that decision, so first things first and lets get this kitties numbers up.
78 is safe, but would like to seem him up higher.
If he doesn't like the HC food, how about adding honey/syrup to his ff if he likes that and eats it with gusto.
That will make his usual food HC. A couple of teaspoons of honey, or a good dollop (don't want to get to scientific on you
Just mix it right in with his FF
Gill & George
Very Active Member
Its a blessing to have a kitty that you know will eat when you are dealing with dropping numbers, BFG is like that, I think I come a close second to his food too.LOLOh... he likes ALL of the food. I'm lucky, that way. When he was first diagnosed I did have to resort to baby food, just to get him to eat. But since he's been on insulin for a while, his appetite is back to the way it always has been. Food is this guy's best friend. LOL. I'm a close 2nd, though..
Doodles & Karen
Very Active Member
Is that 79 on the AT meter or
Yes, I is not an easy dose to measure but it's less that the .25 you shot this morning. Most important is that you are as consistent as possible. The picture is there to give you a guide.
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
I am still using the Alpha Trak, so the 79 is on the Alpha Trak. I will begin using the human meter this evening. In that instance, going below 50 is the new low?
Is the new dose you are recommending half of what the .25 is? I have new syringes that have the smaller increments and .25 is even difficult to get on the mark. Oh wow.
Doodles & Karen
Very Active Member
With SLGS you take reductions below 90 regardless. Too low is below 50 on a human meter.
Yes, the .1u dose is smaller than the .25u dose. Do the best you can....that's what we all do. The .1u dose, the plunger is just at the bottom of the zero line as the picture I gave you shows.
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
I'm so sorry. I have a hard time seeing something so small on my laptop, which is all I have at home. I will pull it up at work and try to do a print out. Thank you for all of your help. I wasn't trying to get a "better" answer about the dose. It's just that I can't see the picture that well. I appreciate all of the support and time you've taken.
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
It is confusing and it may be an issue in which some of us disagree, so you may need to make an informed choice.
Because Lantus is a depot insulin, this means that part of the dose gets to work straight away and another part is stored and slow released, the size of the depot (stored slow release) is directly related to the size of the dose, the larger the dose the larger the depot. Every time you change a dose the depot has to adjust, so if you take the dose up it takes up to 6 cycles for the depot to refill and for you to see the full effect of the dose. If you take the dose down it takes 6 cycles to for the depot to reduce and for you to see the full effect of the reduction.
So because you only just took the dose down, this mornings cycle is likely influenced by the depot of the 0.5u you shot yesterday.
So usually we don't take back to back reductions, because if we get to ahead of ourselves with the reductions it can back fire and yes though we can take the dose back up sometimes it can back fire and we have seen instances of having to go way back up the dosing ladder before we start to see the nicer numbers again.
Ideally to get the best chance of remission, we would like to see him flatten out, and have his ss looking mostly green. (or Green/blue as you are doing slgs), continuing with insulin support for as long as it is safe to do so.
There's some time yet before you have to make that decision, so first things first and lets get this kitties numbers up.
78 is safe, but would like to seem him up higher.
If he doesn't like the HC food, how about adding honey/syrup to his ff if he likes that and eats it with gusto.
That will make his usual food HC. A couple of teaspoons of honey, or a good dollop (don't want to get to scientific on you
Just mix it right in with his FF
Thank you SO much for posting all of this. It all helps me so much. I need to print so many thing so that I can easily read them at my leisure (LOL... yeah, what's that when you have a DB Kitty).. LOL. And then read them over and over and over again.
Doodles & Karen
Very Active Member
It's also in this sticky toward the bottom of the page
Syringe & Insulin Info
Syringe & Insulin Info
Veronica & Babu-chiri
Very Active Member
I have already done that. I didn't give him HC because I made a mistake choosing the container it's in. I did it because that's what I had done over the weekend.
I don't have a clue how people who work full time can stay online and get and use advice like this. I haven't even been able to get ready for work.
I actually do most of my reading and typing from my cel
Doodles & Karen
Very Active Member
What @Gill & George posted about the reductions and the depot above is very true. However if you are unable to test mid cycle every day I'm going with safety first and stand by taking the dose reduction. As Gill said, we will often times have different opinions. It's your responsibility @Sandi & Chase in AZ to read all the information and make the final decision.
To me it looks like Chase started bouncing last night after the greens yesterday and decided to clear the bounce this morning which is a very quick bounce clearing. Sometimes when a kitty starts "changing" and earning reductions they go down pretty quickly.
If you were home and able to monitor closely for the next few cycles my answer would agree to hold the dose and ride out the depot draining process. Since you are unable to do this and per the SLGS sticky, it's best to lower the dose. Just my opinion...you always hold the syringe.
To me it looks like Chase started bouncing last night after the greens yesterday and decided to clear the bounce this morning which is a very quick bounce clearing. Sometimes when a kitty starts "changing" and earning reductions they go down pretty quickly.
If you were home and able to monitor closely for the next few cycles my answer would agree to hold the dose and ride out the depot draining process. Since you are unable to do this and per the SLGS sticky, it's best to lower the dose. Just my opinion...you always hold the syringe.
Veronica & Babu-chiri
Very Active Member
I'm glad Chase is going up, I don't have enough experience on dosing and all of that but I do work full time and my beloved Babu is a diver ( he likes to go from really high numbers to really low numbers ) and a finicky eater which makes giving him HC or gravy ( believe it or not he sometimes do not wants gravy food ) a little bit hard (I really envy that you can leave food out and he would eat it on his own that will help him a lot), so I kind of get what you are going through just take a deep breath once in a while and I think that other than his insulin dose which has to be as consistent as you can, try not to worry so much about how much he eats at this point as long as he eats.
I know that 0.1 can be tricky (been there ) kind of find a point close to what the photo shows and just try to use that point as a reference so that is always the same point on every shoot and your dose is consistent (getting a calipher latter on may help with this weird doses but is not indispensable)
Be prepared to maybe skip a shoot once in a while, it sucks and his numbers get all over so I really really try not to, but sometimes I have no choice to keep him safe, I have also had get a tec from the vet to go to my home to shoot him because I was not going to be able to get back home on time, and my sister goes to my home some days when I think he may be needing some extra supervisión, meaning I need someone to give him food because he won't eat on his own (love her for that)
Anyway I'm not complaining or anything just wanted to let you know you are not alone in all of this, it's hard sometimes but you love Chase very much and I think you are doing a terrific job (lot better than I did at first ) and sending you lots and lots of
I know that 0.1 can be tricky (been there ) kind of find a point close to what the photo shows and just try to use that point as a reference so that is always the same point on every shoot and your dose is consistent (getting a calipher latter on may help with this weird doses but is not indispensable)
Be prepared to maybe skip a shoot once in a while, it sucks and his numbers get all over so I really really try not to, but sometimes I have no choice to keep him safe, I have also had get a tec from the vet to go to my home to shoot him because I was not going to be able to get back home on time, and my sister goes to my home some days when I think he may be needing some extra supervisión, meaning I need someone to give him food because he won't eat on his own (love her for that)
Anyway I'm not complaining or anything just wanted to let you know you are not alone in all of this, it's hard sometimes but you love Chase very much and I think you are doing a terrific job (lot better than I did at first ) and sending you lots and lots of
Bobbie And Bubba
Very Active Member
Yep, I have always used the protocol as a guideline and not an absolute. There have been times when I have given Bubba an "unearned" reduction ( he didn't drop below 50 on a human meter ) and I was glad that I did . And there have been times when I advised someone to do the same and others spoke up and disagreed but as Karen said, you make the final decision after you get different opinions as you hold the syringe.
Speaking of syringe, yes, those .10 are tough to read. I bought a pair of reading glasses that were a couple higher strengths that I normally use to help and use a magnifying glass.
I am so liking what I am seeing with Chase and I have a hunch that he could be getting off this stuff before you even learn his patterns and trends. Anti -jinx
Veronica & Babu-chiri
Very Active Member
So did I
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
Thank you so much. That is very sweet.I'm glad Chase is going up, I don't have enough experience on dosing and all of that but I do work full time and my beloved Babu is a diver ( he likes to go from really high numbers to really low numbers ) and a finicky eater which makes giving him HC or gravy ( believe it or not he sometimes do not wants gravy food ) a little bit hard (I really envy that you can leave food out and he would eat it on his own that will help him a lot), so I kind of get what you are going through just take a deep breath once in a while and I think that other than his insulin dose which has to be as consistent as you can, try not to worry so much about how much he eats at this point as long as he eats.
I know that 0.1 can be tricky (been there ) kind of find a point close to what the photo shows and just try to use that point as a reference so that is always the same point on every shoot and your dose is consistent (getting a calipher latter on may help with this weird doses but is not indispensable)
Be prepared to maybe skip a shoot once in a while, it sucks and his numbers get all over so I really really try not to, but sometimes I have no choice to keep him safe, I have also had get a tec from the vet to go to my home to shoot him because I was not going to be able to get back home on time, and my sister goes to my home some days when I think he may be needing some extra supervisión, meaning I need someone to give him food because he won't eat on his own (love her for that)
Anyway I'm not complaining or anything just wanted to let you know you are not alone in all of this, it's hard sometimes but you love Chase very much and I think you are doing a terrific job (lot better than I did at first ) and sending you lots and lots of
I don't have anyone who can even feed Chase, so it's all me. No friends in Tucson... no family. I will just keep doing the best that I can. Thank God for this board. I will have to try a new vet at some point, as I have fired the old one. The information I got was so horrible. My money is all but gone, so I'm not sure what I'll do at this point. I'm still supposed to buy a baby scale and a timed feeder. Then I need new brakes on my car because mine are unsafe. But if there is no money, there is no money. I will just have to take things a day at a time.
I have heard a few people say that they "suspect", from looking at Chase's numbers so far, that he end up going into remission. I don't understand that, as his numbers still get high even being on insulin. So if he wasn't on it at all... wouldn't his numbers keep getting high? Or is that where the consistent dose of insulin, over time, changes things? So much... SO MUCH to learn.
Thank you so much. That is very sweet.
I’m your friend in Tucson
In this group, even though we usually don’t get the wonderful opportunity to meet each other, we do become friends. It’s a great place!A couple things I want to clarify. First, in reference to back-to-back reductions, I was speaking “in general” and not pertaining to this specific dose.
Second, there are two sides to the current issue on the dose and I do think we should wait until a +10 or +11 test later today to decide.
- yes, he’s on SLGS and reductions are usually given below 90 and yes, it’s possible this is still depot from the 0.5u
- overall, his numbers don’t necessarily indicate he has too much insulin at the 0.25u dose but his early drops are taking him below 90 which is a concern with the fact that Sandi must get to work on time but keep him safe
- I am also seeing that he really responds to food especially HC. For those of us who have been around awhile, we absolutely know that our cat needs a reduction, even if they just had one, because we are fighting lower numbers all cycle even with higher carb foods. That isn’t happening here.
I think it is worth trying to feed him closer to a MC food at preshot and +1 to see if that will stop these steep +1/+2 dives and get him to flatten out which will allow Sandi to safely get the 0.25u in him. The longer he is in normal, healing numbers, the better for him. As you all may recall, when we have a cat almost ready to go into remission on a drop of insulin but the numbers are “quite there” yet, we usually suggest the caregiver (CG) feed a little bit higher carb food to achieve the same purpose.
Sandi...if he’s has gone up or surfed during the day so his preshot is about what it has been lately and not in normal numbers (~68-130 on AT and 50-120 on human meter), why don’t we try an experiment tonight? How about leaving the dose at 0.25u and mixing the MC food you have (which, as I remember is 12/13%) equally with the LC food you have so he gets about an 8-10% food at PS and +1? We can see how it affects the drop (although he doesn’t always drop at night). If he drops and it doesn’t affect it much but he doesn’t go below 90, we can try a little more MC in the morning or even straight MC at AMPS and +1. Depending on where he is at +1, you can leave MC or even HC catsicles out for him.
This is just an option. Since you will be home tonight, even if he doesn’t drop at +1 and +2, if you feed as I have suggested and he shoots up, we know it might be worth a try tomorrow. But the bottom line is you hold the syringe and if dropping to 0.1u makes you feel safer about leaving him, then it is absolutely ok. We can always take the dose back up.
He’s definitely on a mission!!!
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
At w
At work and checking in. I will print this and read when I get home. I have all my notes on LC, MC, HC Fancy Feast foods at home and don't have much of the MC or HC. I guess I'll just swing by Petsmart on my way home and get more of the HC and more of the LC. I can mix them to make MC. I will be cutting it very close to time, but I won't have time at all this week. I will have to be at work every spare minute, and be home with home with him every "other" spare minute. LOLI’m your friend in Tucson
A couple things I want to clarify. First, in reference to back-to-back reductions, I was speaking “in general” and not pertaining to this specific dose.
Second, there are two sides to the current issue on the dose and I do think we should wait until a +10 or +11 test later today to decide.
What I’d like to see is if we can get him to flatten out before we decrease the dose (assuming he does not come back down a lot during today’s cycle). Gill alluded to this in her post #57 when she said:
- yes, he’s on SLGS and reductions are usually given below 90 and yes, it’s possible this is still depot from the 0.5u
- overall, his numbers don’t necessarily indicate he has too much insulin at the 0.25u dose but his early drops are taking him below 90 which is a concern with the fact that Sandi must get to work on time but keep him safe
- I am also seeing that he really responds to food especially HC. For those of us who have been around awhile, we absolutely know that our cat needs a reduction, even if they just had one, because we are fighting lower numbers all cycle even with higher carb foods. That isn’t happening here.
I think it is worth trying to feed him closer to a MC food at preshot and +1 to see if that will stop these steep +1/+2 dives and get him to flatten out which will allow Sandi to safely get the 0.25u in him. The longer he is in normal, healing numbers, the better for him. As you all may recall, when we have a cat almost ready to go into remission on a drop of insulin but the numbers are “quite there” yet, we usually suggest the caregiver (CG) feed a little bit higher carb food to achieve the same purpose.
Sandi...if he’s has gone up or surfed during the day so his preshot is about what it has been lately and not in normal numbers (~68-130 on AT and 50-120 on human meter), why don’t we try an experiment tonight? How about leaving the dose at 0.25u and mixing the MC food you have (which, as I remember is 12/13%) equally with the LC food you have so he gets about an 8-10% food at PS and +1? We can see how it affects the drop (although he doesn’t always drop at night). If he drops and it doesn’t affect it much but he doesn’t go below 90, we can try a little more MC in the morning or even straight MC at AMPS and +1. Depending on where he is at +1, you can leave MC or even HC catsicles out for him.
This is just an option. Since you will be home tonight, even if he doesn’t drop at +1 and +2, if you feed as I have suggested and he shoots up, we know it might be worth a try tomorrow. But the bottom line is you hold the syringe and if dropping to 0.1u makes you feel safer about leaving him, then it is absolutely ok. We can always take the dose back up.
He’s definitely on a mission!!!
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Tricia Cinco(GA) & Harvey
Very Active Member
Sandi, I did this for five years, and I still print stuff out so I can re-read it. It's great to have it, anyway, in case your laptop battery dies or the power goes out. Also, it's easier to find a piece of paper in a folder or binder than a post on a computer sometimes. Whatever works for you is the best way to do it.
You're doing awesome. Hang in there!
You're doing awesome. Hang in there!
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
I’m your friend in Tucson
A couple things I want to clarify. First, in reference to back-to-back reductions, I was speaking “in general” and not pertaining to this specific dose.
Second, there are two sides to the current issue on the dose and I do think we should wait until a +10 or +11 test later today to decide.
What I’d like to see is if we can get him to flatten out before we decrease the dose (assuming he does not come back down a lot during today’s cycle). Gill alluded to this in her post #57 when she said:
- yes, he’s on SLGS and reductions are usually given below 90 and yes, it’s possible this is still depot from the 0.5u
- overall, his numbers don’t necessarily indicate he has too much insulin at the 0.25u dose but his early drops are taking him below 90 which is a concern with the fact that Sandi must get to work on time but keep him safe
- I am also seeing that he really responds to food especially HC. For those of us who have been around awhile, we absolutely know that our cat needs a reduction, even if they just had one, because we are fighting lower numbers all cycle even with higher carb foods. That isn’t happening here.
I think it is worth trying to feed him closer to a MC food at preshot and +1 to see if that will stop these steep +1/+2 dives and get him to flatten out which will allow Sandi to safely get the 0.25u in him. The longer he is in normal, healing numbers, the better for him. As you all may recall, when we have a cat almost ready to go into remission on a drop of insulin but the numbers are “quite there” yet, we usually suggest the caregiver (CG) feed a little bit higher carb food to achieve the same purpose.
Sandi...if he’s has gone up or surfed during the day so his preshot is about what it has been lately and not in normal numbers (~68-130 on AT and 50-120 on human meter), why don’t we try an experiment tonight? How about leaving the dose at 0.25u and mixing the MC food you have (which, as I remember is 12/13%) equally with the LC food you have so he gets about an 8-10% food at PS and +1? We can see how it affects the drop (although he doesn’t always drop at night). If he drops and it doesn’t affect it much but he doesn’t go below 90, we can try a little more MC in the morning or even straight MC at AMPS and +1. Depending on where he is at +1, you can leave MC or even HC catsicles out for him.
This is just an option. Since you will be home tonight, even if he doesn’t drop at +1 and +2, if you feed as I have suggested and he shoots up, we know it might be worth a try tomorrow. But the bottom line is you hold the syringe and if dropping to 0.1u makes you feel safer about leaving him, then it is absolutely ok. We can always take the dose back up.
He’s definitely on a mission!!!
I know you are my friend, Marje. You are my "new" friend. Other than that, I have no one here. It's kind of lonely for me.
Marje... I found the "How To Treat Hypos" easy enough and printed it, but I'm having a hard time finding the other 2... "Low Pre-Shot" and "Low Numbers" to print. They are probably right in front of me but I'm at work.
I looked and don't see them but I'm wading through a TON of documents. Can you direct me? Are those within a certain "Sticky"?
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
Nevermind... I found all 3 things we talked about as being the most important. They are now printed.I know you are my friend, Marje. You are my "new" friend. Other than that, I have no one here. It's kind of lonely for me.
Marje... I found the "How To Treat Hypos" easy enough and printed it, but I'm having a hard time finding the other 2... "Low Pre-Shot" and "Low Numbers" to print. They are probably right in front of me but I'm at work.
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
I’m your friend in Tucson
A couple things I want to clarify. First, in reference to back-to-back reductions, I was speaking “in general” and not pertaining to this specific dose.
Second, there are two sides to the current issue on the dose and I do think we should wait until a +10 or +11 test later today to decide.
What I’d like to see is if we can get him to flatten out before we decrease the dose (assuming he does not come back down a lot during today’s cycle). Gill alluded to this in her post #57 when she said:
- yes, he’s on SLGS and reductions are usually given below 90 and yes, it’s possible this is still depot from the 0.5u
- overall, his numbers don’t necessarily indicate he has too much insulin at the 0.25u dose but his early drops are taking him below 90 which is a concern with the fact that Sandi must get to work on time but keep him safe
- I am also seeing that he really responds to food especially HC. For those of us who have been around awhile, we absolutely know that our cat needs a reduction, even if they just had one, because we are fighting lower numbers all cycle even with higher carb foods. That isn’t happening here.
I think it is worth trying to feed him closer to a MC food at preshot and +1 to see if that will stop these steep +1/+2 dives and get him to flatten out which will allow Sandi to safely get the 0.25u in him. The longer he is in normal, healing numbers, the better for him. As you all may recall, when we have a cat almost ready to go into remission on a drop of insulin but the numbers are “quite there” yet, we usually suggest the caregiver (CG) feed a little bit higher carb food to achieve the same purpose.
Sandi...if he’s has gone up or surfed during the day so his preshot is about what it has been lately and not in normal numbers (~68-130 on AT and 50-120 on human meter), why don’t we try an experiment tonight? How about leaving the dose at 0.25u and mixing the MC food you have (which, as I remember is 12/13%) equally with the LC food you have so he gets about an 8-10% food at PS and +1? We can see how it affects the drop (although he doesn’t always drop at night). If he drops and it doesn’t affect it much but he doesn’t go below 90, we can try a little more MC in the morning or even straight MC at AMPS and +1. Depending on where he is at +1, you can leave MC or even HC catsicles out for him.
This is just an option. Since you will be home tonight, even if he doesn’t drop at +1 and +2, if you feed as I have suggested and he shoots up, we know it might be worth a try tomorrow. But the bottom line is you hold the syringe and if dropping to 0.1u makes you feel safer about leaving him, then it is absolutely ok. We can always take the dose back up.
He’s definitely on a mission!!!
Marje... just to clarify... do you think I should feed him MC in the a.m. only and keep him on LC in p.m. since his numbers haven't been dropping after the p.m. shoot? Also, when I have to leave for work and I need to leave frozen food down, is it the LC or MC I should leave for later in the day, and only give him the MC in the a.m.?
I had linked them for you so you just needed to click on the link. Is that how you found them? Any time you see print in a light or dark blue in the condo, if you click on it, it takes you to the info we are referencing.I know you are my friend, Marje. You are my "new" friend. Other than that, I have no one here. It's kind of lonely for me.
Marje... I found the "How To Treat Hypos" easy enough and printed it, but I'm having a hard time finding the other 2... "Low Pre-Shot" and "Low Numbers" to print. They are probably right in front of me but I'm at work.
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
Oops. Sorry about that. No... I just searched and found them. I don't even see where you linked them in a post, but I don't need to search for that, now. I will "try" to remember for future reference. I have SO MUCH to read through. Thank you so much for ALL of your help.
Click on THIS LINK, post 105 on page 2.Oops. Sorry about that. No... I just searched and found them. I don't even see where you linked them in a post, but I don't need to search for that, now. I will "try" to remember for future reference. I have SO MUCH to read through. Thank you so much for ALL of your help.
I think that if you can, it would be worth trying tonight just so you can see if it works. He did drop at night on 2/17 and 2/18. If you can't also buy MC food, then you could mix a small amount of HC with LC but don't do half and half unless we find he needs that.
Insofar as when to leave what kind of carbs when you leave, it's one of those things you need to play by ear. It depends on where his BG is at AMPS and what direction it looks like it is headed when you get ready to leave. At that point, decide on whether to leave him MC or HC...or, if he's really high, leave LC.
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
Thanks, Marje. So far, at work, I've not had time to research MC food, so mixing some HC in with the LC will have to do, for now.
Bobbie And Bubba
Very Active Member
The MC foods in the Fancy Feast Line are the Roasted They are around 12%- 15% The label colors are very close in hue to the LC so be mindful of that and marking the carb count on top like you are doing is helpful.
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
Doh... you beat me to it. Thank you so, so much. That helps me right now, more than you know.
Bobbie And Bubba
Very Active Member
Yesterday, you had a couple containers of Meow Mix that were 12 and 13%. I’m pretty sure you marked them.
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
I will probably only get online tonight to post in Chase's SS. I've been looking at computer screens every day, all day, for over a week straight. I badly need to give my eyes a break. That being said, if he is in danger I will get online immediately and stay online for as long as I have to. I'm hoping and praying that he and I can both get a break, this evening.
I am going to stay home long enough tomorrow morning to get a +2 at the very least, if the +2 is low I will try to stay long enough to get a +3... or maybe even a +2.5. I already emailed my boss and let him know I would be late tomorrow. I do have some flexibility at work, and I am asking if I can work a temporary adjusted work schedule, just until I can be sure that Chase quits doing this dip every morning. Also, I am asking if I can work from home if he needs me there to take care of him. There is a good possibility that my work will do this for me because my position, while I am the only one who does it, does not require interacting with people face to face or on the phone, except in rare circumstances. This way, I can be a little more consistent with Chase's care. Fingers crossed.
Signing out for now. Must make sure I can get to Petsmart and then home in time to stay on schedule.
I am going to stay home long enough tomorrow morning to get a +2 at the very least, if the +2 is low I will try to stay long enough to get a +3... or maybe even a +2.5. I already emailed my boss and let him know I would be late tomorrow. I do have some flexibility at work, and I am asking if I can work a temporary adjusted work schedule, just until I can be sure that Chase quits doing this dip every morning. Also, I am asking if I can work from home if he needs me there to take care of him. There is a good possibility that my work will do this for me because my position, while I am the only one who does it, does not require interacting with people face to face or on the phone, except in rare circumstances. This way, I can be a little more consistent with Chase's care. Fingers crossed.
Signing out for now. Must make sure I can get to Petsmart and then home in time to stay on schedule.
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Bobbie And Bubba
Very Active Member
This is so true!!I’m your friend in Tucson
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
I only had one, Marje. This morning I tried giving him Meow Mix when his number was low and he didn't like it at all. I want to stick with FF. He is really like all of those, now.
Will you be on this evening, Marje, just in case he does something different than what we've been seeing? I'm hoping he tests close to the same as he usually does in the evening. Then I will give him the .25 u and feed him MC food. Right?
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
Ok... so here's what I'm hoping to do. There's so much going on in my pea brain, so this helps me.
6:15 PMPS test and hope he's doing his "normal" thing
6:30 Shoot .25 units and feed 1/4 cup MC food
7:30 +1 test and if he's not LOW,
7:35 Feed the rest of the MC food. If he IS low, I will post and see. Probably give him some HC gravy like I have been, but only if he's done that swan dive thingy
8:30 +2 test and hope he's doing good
10:30 +3 test right before bed. If all is well, I am going to sleep until the alarm goes off at 6:00 tomorrow morning.
Tues A.M.
6:00 get up and get his stuff ready and make my cup of tea
6:15 AMPS test and hope he's doing his normal, but just in case something is off, this gives me 10 minutes to post and see if anyone is on. If all is ok,
6:30 Shoot .25 units and feed 1/4 cup MC food
7:30 +1 test and pray that he doesn't dive
8:30 +2 test and if he's ok, feed 1/4 cup MC food. If he dives, post and see. Will give some HC gravy like Ii have been.
9:30 +3 test and pray he's ok because I will need to go to work. If he's still low, I can leave out some MC or LC food
PM
Assess and see if dosing can stay the same or if it should be different.
Does that all sound ok?
6:15 PMPS test and hope he's doing his "normal" thing
6:30 Shoot .25 units and feed 1/4 cup MC food
7:30 +1 test and if he's not LOW,
7:35 Feed the rest of the MC food. If he IS low, I will post and see. Probably give him some HC gravy like I have been, but only if he's done that swan dive thingy
8:30 +2 test and hope he's doing good
10:30 +3 test right before bed. If all is well, I am going to sleep until the alarm goes off at 6:00 tomorrow morning.
Tues A.M.
6:00 get up and get his stuff ready and make my cup of tea
6:15 AMPS test and hope he's doing his normal, but just in case something is off, this gives me 10 minutes to post and see if anyone is on. If all is ok,
6:30 Shoot .25 units and feed 1/4 cup MC food
7:30 +1 test and pray that he doesn't dive
8:30 +2 test and if he's ok, feed 1/4 cup MC food. If he dives, post and see. Will give some HC gravy like Ii have been.
9:30 +3 test and pray he's ok because I will need to go to work. If he's still low, I can leave out some MC or LC food
PM
Assess and see if dosing can stay the same or if it should be different.
Does that all sound ok?
Yes I will be here. Thanks for the schedule. I will be watching.
As far as tomorrow, let's see what tonight brings with the dose and feeding. The schedule is fine but let's leave the dose open.
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
I have 144 on the human meter. What does that mean? It's the first time I've not used the Alpha Trak. I'm going to feed 1/4 cup MC food and shoot .25 u in 15 minutes unless I hear otherwise.
Just to let you know I'm standing by and see the 144 @+11.25. Thank you so much for posting that number is with the ReliOn meter.
If you are willing to give the food experiment a try, I think that is high enough to give the 0.25u and feed MC.
If you are willing to give the food experiment a try, I think that is high enough to give the 0.25u and feed MC.
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Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
Thank you. I just emailed you, too.
What does the 144 mean? Is that consistent with what he's been testing with the Alpha Trak meter? I will have to relearn the numbers. I hope you guys don't get sick of me asking.
Bobbie And Bubba
Very Active Member
@Marje and Gracie , correct me if I am wrong but, I would think that would still be a blue number on the AT2. Chase is not bouncing to the moon which is great. Good that you got a +11.25 but still get a PMPS before you shoot and post.
Sandi & Chase in AZ
Very Active Member
But I just tested and am about to shoot. Why would I poke him again?
That's only 15 minutes between testing and shooting. His ears are so bruised, as it is.Again... I'm not understanding. I'm just going to wait until +1 because that's what Marje and I agreed on... unless I'm wrong... again...
Yes, I got your PM but am responding here.Thank you. I just emailed you, too.
What does the 144 mean? Is that consistent with what he's been testing with the Alpha Trak meter? I will have to relearn the numbers. I hope you guys don't get sick of me asking.
If it's 15 minutes since testing and shooting, you don't need to test again.
Bobbie And Bubba
Very Active Member
Wasn't the 144 at +11.25? That would be 45 minutes to go till PMPS and the numbers can change in 45 minutes time. Are you back on schedule now?But I just tested and am about to shoot. Why would I poke him again?
Bobbie And Bubba
Very Active Member
I was going my this. Sorry for any confusion.
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