Serious health concern high GL + vomitting liquid

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Photorecon said:
View attachment 20507


They love it. I tried to explained the particularities of cats food needed (carb, protein...). There was a blockage, his reply was
this is just fast food, body filler only good to get GL raising. STROP THAT RIGHT NOW, he told me...

Spec of these Fancy Feast Tender Liver and chicken Pâté looks beautiful to me. Protein is 11%, 5% fat and most important no weed, just meat....

Is this what you're feeding your cat with ?
Click to expand...

I am replying to @Photorecon who sent me a PM asking about food.

Lots of us feed Fancy Feast. It is perfectly acceptable and often something cats will eat when they turn their noses up at premium foods. Premium foods can be fine and low carb, but often you are paying for cranberries and sweet potatoes - foods cats don't eat in real life. Fancy feast has byproducts but I have always figured their food in the wild - mice- have byproducts too......

Stick with the pates. I add warm water and make a gravy as sometimes they don't like the pate texture at first.

You probably have gotten this warning before but be sure you are testing - in my cat, a change to wet food meant a drop of 100 points overnight.
 
Sue and Oliver (GA) said:
I am replying to @Photorecon who sent me a PM asking about food.

Lots of us feed Fancy Feast. It is perfectly acceptable and often something cats will eat when they turn their noses up at premium foods. Premium foods can be fine and low carb, but often you are paying for cranberries and sweet potatoes - foods cats don't eat in real life. Fancy feast has byproducts but I have always figured their food in the wild - mice- have byproducts too......

Stick with the pates. I add warm water and make a gravy as sometimes they don't like the pate texture at first.

You probably have gotten this warning before but be sure you are testing - in my cat, a change to wet food meant a drop of 100 points overnight.
Click to expand...

@Oliver :
Thanks for the answer on Fancy Feast, my thought was that this was junk food for cat. I'll give it a try and see. I could not
find the Classic version recommended but who knows, it might be the same think.

Also, I went to the link you posted on your reply (http://felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/protocol-for-prozinc-pzi.109077/)
and something very confusing is mentioned there :

''First small amounts of low carb food can be given to raise the blood glucose levels.''

This is quite confusing to me. My weapon to bring Small Kitty's GL down to normal level was feeding him
with low carb food like I've seen everywhere for diabetic cats diet on the internet. Purina DM (1.0 Carb level), that I use in
combination with ''low carb junk'' (because they (Small Kitty and Big Brother), seem to develop indifference to these after
a little while. Event that some time the mix doesn't seem to work. They jumped on Raw food for 3 days and are not
even looking at it now. The only thing the are not turning their nose on is Purina Dry Food DM (for diabetic) but
I try to give them very little as this is probably the origin of the entire problem. IAM Dry was their food for years.
When I tried to introduce wet it was not working at all.

So is my understanding of lower the carb food the better wrong ? Should I reverse and seek for high Carb ?
If you look at my spread sheet, you'll see that Small Kitty has been in the deadly zone quite a few times.

Thanks for the clarification.

Sébastien
 
I think that sentence was dealing with lowering numbers and possible hypos. If the number drops into low ranges (50 on a human meter/68 on a pet meter), the advice is to first give a little regular low carb food. The reasoning is that, until their pancreas is working again, any food brings them up a bit. Low carb will increase the levels less than high carb would. First try low carb to stop the drop into dangerous ranges. If that isn't enough, and the levels continue to drop, give a tablespoon of the gravy off high carb food (needed for your hypo kit) to see if that will raise the levels. If that doesn't work, then honey on the gums. The idea is to feed the drop with food, trying the lesser carb first so you aren't dealing with a sugar high after the hypo. Does that make sense?

Low carb lowers blood glucose levels more than higher carb food. Some cats are hyper sensitive and even a few percentage of carbs can make a difference. For some, the 8 - 10% carb range is fine. So the first advice for a diabetic cat is to change the food from 20-40% high carb food to 8-10% low carb food and the blood glucose levels should lower.

I think you are using Lantus? Be aware that the protocols for Lantus and ProZinc are very different, and specific to that insulin. The hypo info is generally the same except that hypos can last longer on Lantus.
 
@Chris & China

GOTCHA ! Went to Walmart this afternoon bought these Fancy Feast "Pate's". Small Kitty loves it.
He's eating like mad now. Hope there is no down effect with this kind of food, most importantly
fat. Big brother likes it as well but since Small Kitty's starvation he has been eating double and is
now becoming pretty big. Don't know if it's the increase in dose of insulin starting Friday but
GL has dropped and Small Kitty seems more like and healthy cat.

If you see the spreadsheet you'll see spikes, this is sometime, I think, because he's asking for food
between doses.

Can this scrabble results in my GL curve ? Should I stop feeding between doses ?


BTW, another cause I can see for the improvement is the fact that they've been inside since
Friday. I thought they were staying in the confinement of my neighbor's backyard but they're
not, I pretty sure. Someone is probably feeding them without any concern of the health condition.

I might buy a gps tracker for cats to know where they're going and propose the person to stop
feeding. I don't think it's good to keep both of them inside when they were used to go play outside
every single nights. Rain, thunder, ice, snow storm.. never stopped them. They would always take s
ome air and come back at 06.00h tight for food.

Don't want to end up having another diabetic cat because he's obese and or depress...

Thanks again for all your help.

Sébastien
 
Well the food is lower in carbs so you need to keep doing the blood glucose tests and watch small kittys numbers to watch the dosing. Are both kittys diabetic?
Keeping them inside is a lot safer for them. not that you would want to try this but some people use harness and leash to take them out and then keep them indoor rest of time. http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/29/garden/training-a-cat-to-walk-on-a-leash.html
 

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It's actually better for her to have multiple small meals instead of just two big ones...it's less stressful on the pancreas.

The only time it's really important that she not have food is for the 2 hours before shot time....so that when you get the PS number, it's not influenced by food.

This is where good notes will help you. Some of us try to get all their food in before nadir since after nadir, the insulin is wearing off so adding carbs at that point can "slam the brakes" on the insulin....but some cats can eat all the way to +10 without having it cause any problems

The only way for you to know which works best for Small Kitty is to keep good notes and watch her numbers. You can either put when/what you feed over in the "Remarks" section or maybe put an * in the cells when you feed

Both your kitties will do better if they're kept indoors only (or only allowed out on a leash or in an enclosed space). If you're handy with a hammer and nails, you could consider building a "catio" with fencing to keep them in but allow them out for some fresh air. There are all kinds of plans on different designs for catios on the internet. Here's some pictures of some really nice ones!!

Cats that go outside risk all kinds of things....being attacked by other animals, getting hit by cars and getting into food they shouldn't be getting are only a few. Obesity can be controlled by how much they eat and "depression" can be cured by active play in the house

This is one of China's favorite toys called "Da Bird" and she'll run and jump and play until she can barely move!
 
Would you please go ahead and start a new thread? This one is getting pretty long.

Usually what we do is post a new thread every day with the date/cats name and the AMPS number in the subject line....as the day goes on, if we get other tests in, we "edit" the subject line and add the new test results (You can see examples of this all over the Lantus forum)

That way the people who scan the forum can see at a glance how each cat is doing and if they see something that concerns them, respond sooner.

Just put the link to the prior post in the body of the daily post...that way it's easy to go back and see what's been going on with Small Kitty
 
Photorecon said:
Went to Walmart this afternoon bought these Fancy Feast "Pate's". Small Kitty loves it. He's eating like mad now.
Click to expand...
I am so pleased for you both, Sébastien; it is such a relief when a cat who has been struggling to eat gets their appetite back! :)


Mogs
.
 
Lily-Fish said:
That cat looks like Lily
Click to expand...
You're right, always spiky at the morning but seems to be doing well now, after 4 months. Small Kitty as
only 3 months experience. Hope these black and red spots will go out of his spreadsheet one day.
At least he's eating all what comes under its nose.

Very happy, faithful.

S/bastien
 
Photorecon said:
@Chris & China

GOTCHA ! Went to Walmart this afternoon bought these Fancy Feast "Pate's". Small Kitty loves it.
He's eating like mad now. Hope there is no down effect with this kind of food, most importantly
fat. Big brother likes it as well but since Small Kitty's starvation he has been eating double and is
now becoming pretty big. Don't know if it's the increase in dose of insulin starting Friday but
GL has dropped and Small Kitty seems more like and healthy cat.

If you see the spreadsheet you'll see spikes, this is sometime, I think, because he's asking for food
between doses.

Can this scrabble results in my GL curve ? Should I stop feeding between doses ?


BTW, another cause I can see for the improvement is the fact that they've been inside since
Friday. I thought they were staying in the confinement of my neighbor's backyard but they're
not, I pretty sure. Someone is probably feeding them without any concern of the health condition.

I might buy a gps tracker for cats to know where they're going and propose the person to stop
feeding. I don't think it's good to keep both of them inside when they were used to go play outside
every single nights. Rain, thunder, ice, snow storm.. never stopped them. They would always take s
ome air and come back at 06.00h tight for food.

Don't want to end up having another diabetic cat because he's obese and or depress...

Thanks again for all your help.

Sébastien
Click to expand...

I also let my kiitties out. They love being outside! I love watching their joy as they roll around in the grass and run around in the sunshine.
My cat who was just diagnosed with diabetes doesn't go out as much as he did when he was younger. When he does go out, he just stays around the property, so I am not terribly concerned that he is being fed. I am considering getting him a little tag to put on his collar which says 'Diabetic: Don't Feed Me' or something to that effect.

I also tried to leash train them, but it is much more difficult to get cats to tolerate a harness and leash who already enjoy the unrestricted freedom of the outdoors.
 
This is a big concern to me, I feel I'm confining them when the are hungry to go out. I have 2 cats and
one has been peeing all around the house since confinement. I've build up a fence to prevent them from
going to far but Small Kitty (my diabetic cat) is able to cross the fence no matter what. Once I get
a gps tracking collar I'll see where they are going because seems they were less lazy when going out.
Big Brother (the non diabetic one) is getting bigger and bigger. I don't think they were being fed out
because one week in made no difference in number, but the risk is there

Hope I will find some sort of good compromise for both pleasure and safety.
 
This is what I bought for my kitty to go on her collar https://www.amazon.co.uk/Have-Diabe...d=1463335546&sr=8-4&keywords=diabetes+pet+tag It came with free engraving so I put my number, my vets number and 'microchipped' on it. I can't confine her to the house and she enjoys time outside but I wanted to be sure if someone found her unwell or injured they could ring me or the vet straight away. My experience of cats is that if they want to escape they will!
 
That's nice, quite evocative ! Problem might be who knows that diabetic cats need careful feeding.
Once I get the numbers right I'll let them go out, if summer can arrive this year... Sounds we're in
still in October, so cold. I leave the bedroom patio door open during the night with curtain closed
and I need to put 2 extra layers of blanket...

Hope summer will arrive with stable numbers for Small Kitty.
 
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