? Assistance with Vetsulin Needed - ? too high a dose

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MrWorfMen's Mom

MrWorfMen's Mom

Member Since 2015
Kako started a thread over in Welcome and to some of us non-Vetsulin users it looks like the dose of 3u currently being given is too high. She just contacted her vet and is now being told to increase the dose to 5u. I have asked her NOT to increase and that I was referring her situation over here to the Health board. Here is the link to her original post.

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/please-help.156777/#post-1661721
@Sue and Oliver (GA) @Critter M @Squalliesmom can you provide any advice here. I am trying to get Kako to set up a spreadsheet but she needs help now. Thanks so much. :)
 
MrWorfMen's Mom said:
Kako started a thread over in Welcome and to some of us non-Vetsulin users it looks like the dose of 3u currently being given is too high. She just contacted her vet and is now being told to increase the dose to 5u. I have asked her NOT to increase and that I was referring her situation over here to the Health board. Here is the link to her original post.

http://www.felinediabetes.com/FDMB/threads/please-help.156777/#post-1661721
@Sue and Oliver (GA) @Critter M @Squalliesmom can you provide any advice here. I am trying to get Kako to set up a spreadsheet but she needs help now. Thanks so much. :)
Click to expand...


Sue is not available for the time being.

I will tag @Elizabeth and Bertie she is familiar with Caninsulin (Vetsulin)
 
After just a quick read-through, I have to agree - I would not increase Tux's dose! Does she have a spreadsheet up and running yet?
 
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Thank you ladies.
Sorry, I am having hard time to understand how to use FDMB.
Is there a way to save this forum?

I rejected to give 5 unit Vetsulin.
And I completed the spreadsheet.

I am facing another difficulty.
I am using AlphaTRAK, and I am out of the test strips.
This is why: I went back to the vet office 6 days ago to purchase a bottle of strips. I paid for 100 strips but the vet had 25 to give. So I brought home 25 of them, and used up the last one this morning. The vet still don't have rest of strips. I was told to skip readings, it's totally fine.

Until I get more strips, or find a good vet, what is the best I can do?
-Stay in 3 units Vetsulin
-Lower to 2 units
-Lower to 2 units and change food from dry "Taste of the Wild" to low carb wet food

Please advice.
 
Hi Kako, It is possible to use Freestyle Lite human meter strips in the AT2 meter. Can you get to a local pharmacy or Walmart? If so, let us know and we'll give you some further details to use them to get as accurate as possible readings. It's really important that you be able to test Tux right now.
 
Kako said:
Thank you ladies.
Sorry, I am having hard time to understand how to use FDMB.
Is there a way to save this forum?

I rejected to give 5 unit Vetsulin.
And I completed the spreadsheet.

I am facing another difficulty.
I am using AlphaTRAK, and I am out of the test strips.
This is why: I went back to the vet office 6 days ago to purchase a bottle of strips. I paid for 100 strips but the vet had 25 to give. So I brought home 25 of them, and used up the last one this morning. The vet still don't have rest of strips. I was told to skip readings, it's totally fine.

Until I get more strips, or find a good vet, what is the best I can do?
-Stay in 3 units Vetsulin
-Lower to 2 units
-Lower to 2 units and change food from dry "Taste of the Wild" to low carb wet food

Please advice.
Click to expand...
In another post there is info for a vet referall for your Kako.
 
I will go to Walmart for the Free style human strips tonight.
While there, I want to purchase some food too. Recommendation on the food that Walmart have?

How can I find the post for recommended vets in my area?
 
Kako said:
I will go to Walmart for the Free style human strips tonight.
While there, I want to purchase some food too. Recommendation on the food that Walmart have?

How can I find the post for recommended vets in my area?
Click to expand...
I will send it to your inbox. top right of forum check there. will send you coupon links for food at walmart to
 
Nevermind here is vet info from @billysmom

I might have a vet referral for you. I just called a friend in Eugene that has a cat. Her cat is not diabetic but she loves her vet and has been going to her for about 20 years. The vet's name is Dr Samsell. She is the owner of the practice, Cat Care Limited on Willamette St. It's a cat only practice. You should call them and ask about their experience with feline diabetes, if they support home testing, what type of insulin they recommend, etc. I hope this helps!

coupons- you want fancy feast classics, sheba its patete or perfect portions
Fancy Feast- http://www.couponsherpa.com/grocery-coupons/manufacturer/fancy-feast/

Sheba perfect portions- http://www.sheba.com/Home

walmart coupons- http://www.walmart.com/store/2588/c...ontentZone10 | 2016-03-01 | 1 | LN-FC-Coupons
there is afancy feast one one there clip it and print it
 
Kako, You can pick up some Fancy Feast Classics (the pates) or Friskies at Walmart as they are good foods for Tux. I'm sorry but I'm in Canada so I don't know what else your Walmart might carry that is appropriate for Tux. Make sure the food is pate and not chunks or gravy as those are higher in carbs.

That said, I would advice against changing Tux's diet just yet. Let's see if we can figure out why his readings are so high first. Changing to a low carb diet will be needed but right now if the dose is too high, the food change could cause Tux to drop too low and cause the opposite problem to what you are currently seeing and even put him in danger. I know it's hard to be patient and you want to do the best for Tux ASAP, but patience is key here. One step at a time and we'll help you figure this out and get Tux on the road to better health. :)
 
Kako said:
I see. I will purchase some can food tonight, but I won't feed them to Tux until we figure out. :)
I am still thinking if I should lower dose to 2.
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Yes it would be best to stay with the same food until you get a good testing pattern set up. You need to know how Tux is handling the insulin now with the higher carb food so that you can figure out what sort of dosing would be best once you start to switch him to low carb canned food.
 
Kako, let's see what Tux's pre-shot test is before deciding on doses.

@Critter Mom any thoughts on Kako's proposal of dropping back to 2u taking pre-shot reading into consideration of course?.
 
Kako said:
Until I get more strips, or find a good vet, what is the best I can do?
-Stay in 3 units Vetsulin
-Lower to 2 units
-Lower to 2 units and change food from dry "Taste of the Wild" to low carb wet food
Click to expand...

- Test urine every day for ketones.
- Ask your vet about lowering the dose. Seek a second opinion if necessary.
- If you can't monitor both cycles every day, seriously consider stepping down the dose for a few days (subject to being clear of ketones).
- DO NOT ATTEMPT A TRANSITION TO LOW CARB FOOD UNTIL YOU SORT OUT THE DOSE.


Mogs
.
 
Kako said:
I am still thinking if I should lower dose to 2.
Click to expand...


Considering that the vet changed the dose from 1 unit to 3 units I would tend to agree with that. However I am not experienced with Caninsulin, but the dose seems too high and the vet upped it far too much in such a short time period. If you go to a lower dose you can always increase later as needed.

That is just my thoughts. Let's see if anyone else can offer their ideas.
 
MrWorfMen's Mom said:
@Critter Mom any thoughts on Kako's proposal of dropping back to 2u taking pre-shot reading into consideration of course?.
Click to expand...
Cross-posted.

Have posted here and also on Welcome thread (see link above).

If it were my cat and ketones weren't an issue I would be inclined to have a strong discussion with the vet about dropping the dose to 2 units. I'd also do whatever it took to start getting +2 and +3 tests in every cycle to see if there's an early nadir. A 2-unit increase from 1 to 3 units BID is, IMO, nuts. To further propose a jump from 3 units to 5 units is, IMO, positively unhinged.


Mogs
.
 
The vet strongly told me to increase to 5 units. After I gently disagreed couple times, she said I could stay with 3 units if I come back and purchase dry and wet food (DW? I don't remember) that are made for diabetic cats they sell. I asked if they are low carb, she said they are for diabetes.
No... she wouldn't agree to lower dose.
I will look for a good vet. I will call and ask the questions.
 
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Kako said:
The vet strongly told me to increase to 5 units. When I gently refused, she said I could stay with 3 units if I come back and purchase dry and wet food (DW? I don't remember) they have.
No... she wouldn't agree to lower dose.
I will look for a good vet. I will call and ask the questions.
Click to expand...


Your current vet is wrong on everything. Increasing to 5 units could very well put Tux into a hypo which could very well prove to be very expensive for you if not deadly for Tux. Prescription foods have nothing magical in them (other than a high price tag) And any vet that suggests dry food of any sort hasn;t kept up to date with veterinarian studies.

Definitely time for a new vet.
 
Well the vet is not holding that syringe now is she? My vet wanted me to go up to 15u because my Woody's BG was consistently over 200. Well, when the wonderful people here looked at his spreadsheet numbers they told me to half his dose. I did and then another, and another. He was HYPOING at every shot. The only thing keeping him from dying was the dry!!!! Long story short, he's in remission now with wet canned food.

DO NOT start changing his food until you can get a +2, +3 and +4 . You have to know how low this 3 u is taking Tux. Look at Woody's SS and notice how low he goes then how high, until we get his dose right.

Did tux have and infection at all when he was diagnosed?
 
I wonder if the secret protocol that vets have read is to feed prescription dry food and diagnose diabetes and just keep cat owners in a vicious cycle, and have a steady income. I see red every time I read about a vet telling an owner to feed prescription dry and then have their insulin at an high dose. :mad::mad::mad:

And, yes, I can be crude, my old vet just drove by my house driving a 2016 Ford 250 and if I wouldn't have found this forum I doubt that my kitties would have survived to now.

And, he and his wife drives past my house 6 times a day and neither one has called to check on my cats and the last day we saw them was February !!!! They don't even know they have gone into remission.
 
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Back from Walmart. A bottle of strips was $81. Sadly, after spending a lot of cash at the vet, I couldn't afford.
Can't do reading until the vet has the strips that I paid already. I got 6 cans of Friskies classic pate.
What's the best I can do for now?
 
Mum of two felines said:
Well the vet is not holding that syringe now is she? My vet wanted me to go up to 15u because my Woody's BG was consistently over 200. Well, when the wonderful people here looked at his spreadsheet numbers they told me to half his dose. I did and then another, and another. He was HYPOING at every shot. The only thing keeping him from dying was the dry!!!! Long story short, he's in remission now with wet canned food.

DO NOT start changing his food until you can get a +2, +3 and +4 . You have to know how low this 3 u is taking Tux. Look at Woody's SS and notice how low he goes then how high, until we get his dose right.

Did tux have and infection at all when he was diagnosed?
Click to expand...

15 units insulin!?!?!?!? I am so glad that Woody was saved here. :) Hoping Tux's dose may adjusted too.
Infection... the vet didn't say anything about that. Tux seems fine besides drinking a lot of water.
 
Kako said:
Back from Walmart. A bottle of strips was $81. Sadly, after spending a lot of cash at the vet, I couldn't afford.
Can't do reading until the vet has the strips that I paid already. [...] What's the best I can do for now?
Click to expand...

For safety I recommend you get a human meter that uses more reasonably-priced test strips. You could get a small quantity of strips to tide you over, and perhaps you may choose to stick with the human meter once you've tried it. The main thing is to be able to monitor Tux and keep him safe.

Walmart Relion meters are very popular with US members here and the strips cost much, much less than the Freestyle and Alphatrak strips.

Just looked at the latest prices on strips from Walmart's website:

Relion Confirm/Micro 100 strips: USD 35.88 (uses a very small blood sample)

Relion Prime 100 strips: USD 17.88 (needs a larger blood sample)

Both meters are under USD 15.00.

http://www.walmart.com/search/?query=relion

If you do go for a human meter then you'll need to check the readings against a cat-specific reference range for BG measurements done on human meters. We can give you all the information you need about this. (Note: when measuring BG on a human meter the numbers are typically lower than on an Alphatrak.)


Mogs
.
 
I don't have strength left to go back to Walmart. :( No reading.

Tux needs insulin injection at 8pm. I have 30 minutes to decide what to feed him.
Feed him dry Taste of the Wild, and give 3 units insulin. (stay)
or
Feed him dry taste of the Wild, and give him 2 units insulin.
or
Feed Friskies classic pate, and give him 3 units insulin.
 
DON'T change his food!!! You need to keep the carbs high at the moment until you can sort out his dose.


Mogs
.
 
Kako, can you call that vet referral that was posted earlier tomorrow? You should ask your current vet for a refund of your money since you didnt get the strips you paid for and you bought more tonight.
 
I would do 2u and feed regular food is Tux were my kitty.

Please get a human meter tomorrow so the members here can help with the dosing. They are experienced with the readings of human meters.

If you have amazon prime I order my 50 Free style lite strips from there for 32.00. The alphatrax I can get 50 for 52.00
 
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